Norn Iron rubbish part 23452346526

[dodgycanadian]

We can no longer compete with the giants of European football. There is no way with the size of the ROI we can be putting our hopes of competing in major tournaments down to playoffs with the likes of France. We dont have the players. When O'Shea went off injured yesterday my first reaction was "**** Me, are we really that bad". Being able to draw on the likes of Johnny Evans, George McCartney, Chris Baird.. etc. We just arent deep enough. Smaller European nations have caught up in their development of players over the past 15 years. There are no easy ties in International football anymore. If we want to have better chances to compete in World Cups and European Championships Id say this is really our only option. I look at our current squad and I would say that after our next campaign we are fooked. We have no Robbie Keanes, Duffs, Givens, or even players of Dunne's caliber coming through.

I imagine this will get some reaction and would be very complicated but I would be for it except I couldnt have that blue nose pr1ck Kyle Lafferty in the squad!!!

What do you think.

[Acornvilla]

i think its a good idea and works for rugby but football people are too complicated for it to happen ain the near future anyway......

[RonnieB]

I think it is a load of **** to be honest.

[dodgycanadian]

Not to mention an all-Ireland league would be better for clubs. Could build a stronger league with only properly supported clubs.

[Den Perry]

We can no longer compete with the giants of European football. There is no way with the size of the ROI we can be putting our hopes of competing in major tournaments down to playoffs with the likes of France. We dont have the players. When O'Shea went off injured yesterday my first reaction was "**** Me, are we really that bad". Being able to draw on the likes of Johnny Evans, George McCartney, Chris Baird.. etc. We just arent deep enough. Smaller European nations have caught up in their development of players over the past 15 years. There are no easy ties in International football anymore. If we want to have better chances to compete in World Cups and European Championships Id say this is really our only option. I look at our current squad and I would say that after our next campaign we are fooked. We have no Robbie Keanes, Duffs, Givens, or even players of Dunne's caliber coming through.

I imagine this will get some reaction and would be very complicated but I would be for it except I couldnt have that blue nose pr1ck Kyle Lafferty in the squad!!!

What do you think.

well, i'm afraid you'd have to accept the blue noses as well mate

[Acornvilla]

I think it is a load of **** to be honest.
why so good sir? we have an example of it working in another sport? and theres no trouble there now is there?people are stupid hating just because they think there supposed too. or they hate for no particular reason at all. history shouldnt dictate the future? ah irish people.......

[Quadruple1928]

Not to mention an all-Ireland league would be better for clubs. Could build a stronger league with only properly supported clubs.


And what club do you support? Can you tell me why the IFA spilt in the first place, why we have the LOI? The Setanta cup has the crowds kicking the doors down doesn't it:rolleyes:. The IFA will not change an the FAI are pretty much the same, never happen.

The FAI do not produce their own players they let the English clubs do it for them. When the granny rule is extended to farcical levels next year it wont matter anyway.

[Acornvilla]

And what club do you support? Can you tell me why the IFA spilt in the first place, why we have the LOI? The Setanta cup has the crowds kicking the doors down doesn't it:rolleyes:

The FAI do not produce their own players they let the English clubs do it for them. When the granny rule is extended to farcical levels next year it wont matter anyway.
ah sure e may all just curl up and die so. feck this theres no hope left for us... i love irish optimism:rolleyes:

[Fixer82]

should indeed be done as should an All-Ireland league. Sure everything's cross border now. Another step to a united Ireland. Makes sense in every way. Would have loved to see Jonny Evans or someone of his ilk come on for O'Shea instead of McShane.
And you're right, there's no easy matches in football anymore. The days of going to albania and Latvia and winning 4-0 away are gone...MERGE!

Somehow though I think the FAI would be more forthcoming than the IFA

[peadar1987]

We can no longer compete with the giants of European football. There is no way with the size of the ROI we can be putting our hopes of competing in major tournaments down to playoffs with the likes of France.


So what did you call last night then?

[dodgycanadian]

The big ties in the Setanta Cup do. I remember seeing Pats and Linfield in a jam packed Richmond park that would rival any atmosphere in the Eastern-bloc! Im sorry but there are far too many clubs in Ireland to begin with. The standard of football (no matter what you say... is ****e).

Fact of the matter is Scotland supports a 4-tier league with a population of about 5.5 million. If you were to even have a 10 team top tier league you could get rid of all these Mickey Mouse clubs who get 100 fans a week and drive support towards bigger clubs. Ireland's total population rests around 4.5 million.

[dodgycanadian]

So what did you call last night then?

Im sorry but that was our first away win against a team of that stature in recent history. Listen the campaigns speak for themselves. We have been at 1 major tournament in 15 years

[MariborKev]

Im sorry but that was our first away win against a team of that stature in recent history. Listen the campaigns speak for themselves. We have been at 1 major tournament in 15 years


I can point to plenty of larger countries who have been to less.

[Quadruple1928]

The big ties in the Setanta Cup do. I remember seeing Pats and Linfield in a jam packed Richmond park that would rival any atmosphere in the Eastern-bloc! Im sorry but there are far too many clubs in Ireland to begin with. The standard of football (no matter what you say... is ****e).

Fact of the matter is Scotland supports a 4-tier league with a population of about 5.5 million. If you were to even have a 10 team top tier league you could get rid of all these Mickey Mouse clubs who get 100 fans a week and drive support towards bigger clubs. Ireland's total population rests around 4.5 million.

That's not true the att was less than what they get for league games from what i remember. Also you say the standard is bad yet you use Scotland as some sort of model:owhat was the score the last time a team from the LOI played a team from the SPL?

[jebus]

So what will we do with those Rangers and Linfield (to name but a few) fans who you don't seem to like?

Tell them thanks but no thanks when they come down to Dublin?

Actually where would we play? Dublin would be the obvious answer but I'm sure a lot of said fans wouldn't it taken away from Belfast

Too complicated for football basically, we don't have the maturity of rugby for it to work

[SkStu]

merging the FAI and the IFA guarantees what exactly? A wider pool of players? The FAI needs to develop football in this jurisdiction. Looking up family trees of irish sounding, british trained lads is not developing football.

Keep our players at home as long as possible with highly technical and tactical training. That would be a good starting point.

And bluenose? That pretty effin ignorant for someone who wants to merge with a predominantly "bluenose" association.

[Acornvilla]

So what will we do with those Rangers and Linfield (to name but a few) fans who you don't seem to like?

Tell them thanks but no thanks when they come down to Dublin?

Actually where would we play? Dublin would be the obvious answer but I'm sure a lot of said fans wouldn't it taken away from Belfast

Too complicated for football basically, we don't have the maturity of rugby for it to work
well why cant we start to grow the f**k up!?

[MariborKev]

well why cant we start to grow the f**k up!?

Cause we have plenty of neanderthals.

Like the pair of leprechauns I had to get to cop on when they starting making monkey noises at Diarra last night.

[Quadruple1928]

Cause we have plenty of neanderthals.

Like the pair of leprechauns I had to get to cop on when they starting making monkey noises at Diarra last night.

Were they shamrock rovers fans;)

[The Fly]

We can no longer compete with the giants of European football. There is no way with the size of the ROI we can be putting our hopes of competing in major tournaments down to playoffs with the likes of France. We dont have the players. When O'Shea went off injured yesterday my first reaction was "**** Me, are we really that bad". Being able to draw on the likes of Johnny Evans, George McCartney, Chris Baird.. etc. We just arent deep enough. Smaller European nations have caught up in their development of players over the past 15 years. There are no easy ties in International football anymore. If we want to have better chances to compete in World Cups and European Championships Id say this is really our only option. I look at our current squad and I would say that after our next campaign we are fooked. We have no Robbie Keanes, Duffs, Givens, or even players of Dunne's caliber coming through.

I imagine this will get some reaction and would be very complicated but I would be for it except I couldnt have that blue nose pr1ck Kyle Lafferty in the squad!!!

What do you think.

This isn't going to happen anytime soon.

Why? - Simply because the vast majority of the Northern Ireland support would be against it, for obvious reasons.

However, lets imagine it did happen. There would then have to be a new anthem, and the flag flown would have to be that of the new almalgamated association. Our national flag wouldn't represent the team as there would a sizeable proportion of the squad who would not identify with it. In this eventuality, in my view, there would be a sizeable proportion of own support against it.
So, in conclusion, it's a no-goer for now.

[backstothewall]

As a northerner, I would love to see this happen. I would also love to see Belfast Celtic resurected for the first season of the new league.

I also think a majority of people in Northern Ireland would like to see this happen. It would offer a new start for the game in general, and it would offer a new start for the clubs in a new league.

But how would you do it? There are 9 clubs who would obviously have to be in the top flight, 10 if BC came back.

- But would we want to put clubs in Waterford and/or Limerick given their population and potential?

- Would only the top division by 32 county, or would there be a second division for the likes of Cliftonville, Longford, Portadown and Dundalk?

- If you had 2 divisions would there be promotion and relegation initially, or would that have to be suspended for a few years to get the clubs operation on a stable financial footing?

- How would the frankly terrible facilities be improved? Realistically we would probably need 8 Tallaght stadiums in a very short time.

- How would TV work? Would we take the money from the satellite channels, or would it be better to do a deal with TV3/UTV to capture the public's imagination

- Summer or Winter?

- What day would the matches be played? Friday night and be open to competition with Rugby? Saturday and try to compete with the EPL? Saturday evening and try to keep people out of the pubs? Sunday and go up against GAA?

- How would it be made sexy? Should be bring in household names at the end of their careers from accross the water? Or a few lesser known South Americans who can entertain on the pitch?

- What about the differences in tax rates? As far as I am aware the northern clubs would be at a serious financial disadvantage given the different tax systems in place.

I'm the biggest fan in the world of this idea, but rather than just kicking about the principal, I reckon people should try to start answering those questions. I am sure they can be answered.

[stiffler]

I think the merging of the LOI and the IL is the 1st logical step. This needs to be done to secure the future of the game at grassroots level on this island.

[EalingGreen]

From the Derry City thread:

1) The vast majority of Derry fans on here and, as far as I can see, on derrycitychat, want the culb to remain in the League of Ireland. Let's not have page after page on how they could reform in the Irish League.

1a) The vast majority of NI fans on here and, as far as I can see, on Our Wee Country, want their team to remain independent. Let's not have page after page on how they could voluntarily and avoidably vote themselves out of existence in an All-Ireland team.

2) Either a new Derry can play in the League of Ireland, or they can't. It's factual, and no amount of discussion, hypothesising, querying, investigating, precedentising or whatever will actually change that. So let's leave that issue aside too.

2b) Either an All-Ireland football team will be formed or it won't. It's dependent on there being an All-Ireland first, and no amount of discussion, hypothesising, querying, investigating, precedentising or whatever will actually change that. So let's leave that aside too.

[SkStu]

I think the merging of the LOI and the IL is the 1st logical step. This needs to be done to secure the future of the game at grassroots level on this island.

how?? Im really struggling here...

[osarusan]

Guys, if you want to talk about All-Ireland leagues and so on, there are about 5,000 threads on the issue in the LOI section.

[John83]

We can no longer compete with the giants of European football...
You seem to think there was once a time when finishing second in our group and being very competitive in the playoff with one of the top sides in Europe would have been considered a poor result. This isn't right.

Threads on merging with the north (league or international team) crop up from time to time. They generally produce posts one one of two themes: desirable but impractical or undesirable and impractical.


What do you think.
I think Henry's brought the crazies out of the woodwork.

[backstothewall]

Guys, if you want to talk about All-Ireland leagues and so on, there are about 5,000 threads on the issue in the LOI section.

Thats only one part of a conversation about merging the football associations, and national teams. Its just as relevent here. especially as the lack of a competative league is one of the major factors holding back our national team.

When nations like Serbia need depth for their national team, they can look to their own domestic game. I know not everyone will agree, but League of Ireland players whilst many might have talent, aren't good enough for the international game. Serbia has clubs like Red Star where young players get battle hardened against experinced internationals, and in front of big crowds, in tough European games. For the improvements the LOI has made, it still is no where near that standard, nor is it likely to get there whilst it is such a financial mess.

And that is the impact all this has on the national team. Serbia won their group with ease, finishing well clear of France. We just lost a playoff to them.

[Brian Boru]

Not yet. 1. We can compete with the bigger nations and so can they (recently beat Spain and England!). 2. The soccer fans of the North are too hostile towards us currently. Remember Windsor park in 1994. I wouldn't fancy getting attacked by the guy sitting next to me with a Union Jack. 3. Would we sing the Sash my Father Wore and alternate it with The Fields if Athenry. 4. I couldn't listen to Ireland's Call in Landsdowne.

Maybe in 20 years.

[Maroon 7]

We can no longer compete with the giants of European football. There is no way with the size of the ROI we can be putting our hopes of competing in major tournaments down to playoffs with the likes of France. We dont have the players. When O'Shea went off injured yesterday my first reaction was "**** Me, are we really that bad". Being able to draw on the likes of Johnny Evans, George McCartney, Chris Baird.. etc. We just arent deep enough. Smaller European nations have caught up in their development of players over the past 15 years. There are no easy ties in International football anymore. If we want to have better chances to compete in World Cups and European Championships Id say this is really our only option. I look at our current squad and I would say that after our next campaign we are fooked. We have no Robbie Keanes, Duffs, Givens, or even players of Dunne's caliber coming through.

I imagine this will get some reaction and would be very complicated but I would be for it except I couldnt have that blue nose pr1ck Kyle Lafferty in the squad!!!

What do you think.

Nice idea in theory but I doubt it's going to happen when they are celebrating last night's result over on OWC like David Healy himself had scored a last minute winner in the World Cup final. There is far too much bitterness towards all things southern amongst other things up there for it to work so it's all a moot point really. Never mind that the respective blazers are not going to want their foreign junkets cut in half. Better off concentrating on what we have available and working with it.

Plus shíte he may be but the likes of Kyle Lafferty would have as much right to play as anyone else. Bluenose or not.

[rebelarmyexile]

I imagine this will get some reaction and would be very complicated but I would be for it except I couldnt have that blue nose pr1ck Kyle Lafferty in the squad!!!

What do you think.

I am afraid it will never happen until bigoted mindsets like yours no longer exist North or South.

[Gather round]

What do you think

Go away and stop stirring.


i think its a good idea...but football people are too complicated for it to happen ain the near future anyway......

There's nothing complicated about it. We don't want to merge with your football team. And even if we did you wouldn't have a big enough player base to compete consistently with the biggest countries.


Somehow though I think the FAI would be more forthcoming than the IFA

Go away and stop stirring. Somehow I think the FAI now- just as in the 1920s- would be quite happy to remain separate from the IFA. Not least because you don't need to merge anything to get players from Northern Ireland, Scotland and England into your squad.


I also think a majority of people in Northern Ireland would like to see this happen

Got any evidence for this? A clear majority of people in Northern Ireland aren't interested in football at all, many others don't follow the local game, many of those who do won't see much advantage in leaving a fourth-rate league in which they're competitive for a third-rate (and on current evidence arguably even worse-run) one in which they might not be.


fans of the North are too hostile towards us currently. Remember Windsor park in 1994. I wouldn't fancy getting attacked by the guy sitting next to me with a Union Jack

We'll always be hostile to any suggestion that we abandon our team to merge with another. 1994 isn't 'currently', if that's what you're suggesting above. I'm fairly sure no one at the World Cup qualifier attacked anyone with a union jack.

[dodgycanadian]

Sorry my apologies when I mentioned Lafferty he would be 'the' type of player against it. He is a radical N.I. supporter who breathes loyalist. I more or less meant I would hate having players who were against the idea. Though I wasnt the best with my words.

Living in Canada I obviously forget some of the important issues in regard to the IP and LOI. Obviously the idea sounds great but would require massive upheaval not only in football terms but politically.

Henry has definitely brought out the madness in everyone I think.

[The Fly]

Nice idea in theory but I doubt it's going to happen when they are celebrating last night's result over on OWC like David Healy himself had scored a last minute winner in the World Cup final. There is far too much bitterness towards all things southern amongst other things up there for it to work so it's all a moot point really. Never mind that the respective blazers are not going to want their foreign junkets cut in half. Better off concentrating on what we have available and working with it.

Plus shíte he may be but the likes of Kyle Lafferty would have as much right to play as anyone else. Bluenose or not.

Just to let the good people on foot.ie know, there are many members on OWC who believe that people from Northern Ireland who support the Republic of Ireland in international football, of which I am one, are bigots. They believe that I and countless others do so, not because it is simply the natural course, but due to political beliefs.

I simply explain that I support the team, that represents the nation, of which I am a citizen. Therefore my national team.
Thankfully, many accept that and regretfully, many don't.

I'll not bore you with the various issues surrounding player eligibility, Darron Gibson and so on. All, have been the subject of seemingly never-ending, yet still active threads.

To anyone who is curious about any of these themes, pay the site a visit. It may be an eye-opener for you and at the very least, an education.
As an introduction, this OWC link to our match may work - http://ourweecountry.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=27674

(We are also routinely called, in jest of course :rolleyes:, Mexicans, beggars, tarmaccers etc.......etc.......)


Welcome to Northern Ireland!

[Riddickcule]

And while you're at it, lets unify the country aswell.

[Acornvilla]

i like watchinh N.I win? whats wrong with me? am i the only normal person or the only wierdo because i'm not hate filled against anyone? (there are exceptions)

[Fixer82]

why can't we be like the rugby and pool our strongest players from this island together?
in fact, correct me if I'm wrong, but is soccer the only sport in this country that's divided between north and south?

Madness

ps I can't see Lafferty going for it, no

[Acornvilla]

why can't we be like the rugby and pool our strongest players from this island together?
in fact, correct me if I'm wrong, but is soccer the only sport in this country that's divided between north and south?

Madness

ps I can't see Lafferty going for it, no
would lafferty get in the squad that is the question? ah...... whats with all the older generations and fecking up my world!!:confused:

[Riddickcule]

But footballs the hooligans sport is'nt it?

So it can't happen, its a gentlemens game played by hooligans.
Whilst rugby, is a hooligans game played by gentlemen...

[Gather round]

I'll not bore you with the various issues surrounding player eligibility, Darron Gibson and so on. All, have been the subject of seemingly never-ending, yet still active threads.

To anyone who is curious about any of these themes, pay the site a visit.

I feel your pain, Fly. A lot of the discussion on OWC is over the top. That said, the various issues you mention are covered as nauseam here as well. With monotonous regularity, threads start here all basically saying the same thing: 'let's merge with NI even though their team's rubbish and the fans tend to knucke drag'. We get hacked off with it, like.

Most of the NI fans I know wanted France to win the play-off, although many (including me) will be more relieved than anything else. The thought of the Belfast media getting a collective hard-on for the six months leading up to the finals would have been a right pain. Let's be honest, it's hardly different from the anti-England sentiment in the South, and similarly Scotland and Wales.

[IsMiseSean]

I would love to see us merge... I'd have no problem with it, but sadly it will never happen. Too many bigots/thugs in both our fans ranks

[Gather round]

JG- the main reason it'll never happen is because basically 100% of our fans, by definition, and many of whom are not at all bigoted, don't want to give up their team. If you (plural) keep calling for this to happen, you are either unable to grasp this simple reality, or just stirring for the sake of it.

[IsMiseSean]

JG- the main reason it'll never happen is because basically 100% of our fans, by definition, and many of whom are not at all bigoted, don't want to give up their team. If you (plural) keep calling for this to happen, you are either unable to grasp this simple reality, or just stirring for the sake of it.

I suppose its the no surrender mentality you have up there.
From my point of view I'd love to see an All Ireland Team just like I'd like to see the Island united.
Many NI fans want a seperate country and a seperate team which I try to understand
History will never allow this to happen, the reason it works in Rugby is probably because its been that way from the beginning

If I look at it in the context of England fans/FA wanting to unite the British Isle's into one team... I'd never go for that :eek::eek:

I can always hope though :rolleyes:

[Gather round]

I suppose its the no surrender mentality you have up there

So just stirring then, as I thought.


From my point of view I'd love to see an All Ireland Team

You already have this, effectively. Your team last night included players from Northern Ireland, Scotland and England. You can choose from a much larger playing pool than those who have grown up in the country. Fair enough, but that doesn't seem to be sufficient; you want me NOT to have a team to support. You've clearly failed to understand this basic point.


History will never allow this to happen

This is just empty cliche, isn't it? It probably won't happen because the people most likely to be disadvantaged don't want it to happen!

[topia]

We can no longer compete with the giants of European football. There is no way with the size of the ROI we can be putting our hopes of competing in major tournaments down to playoffs with the likes of France. We dont have the players. When O'Shea went off injured yesterday my first reaction was "**** Me, are we really that bad". Being able to draw on the likes of Johnny Evans, George McCartney, Chris Baird.. etc. We just arent deep enough. Smaller European nations have caught up in their development of players over the past 15 years. There are no easy ties in International football anymore. If we want to have better chances to compete in World Cups and European Championships Id say this is really our only option. I look at our current squad and I would say that after our next campaign we are fooked. We have no Robbie Keanes, Duffs, Givens, or even players of Dunne's caliber coming through.

I imagine this will get some reaction and would be very complicated but I would be for it except I couldnt have that blue nose pr1ck Kyle Lafferty in the squad!!!

What do you think.


Wont happen, cant happen i watched one of the italian games in a pub in belfast, NI and the Republic were playing on the same night the games were on opposite wall and the two sets of fans were standing back to back, all was grand i thought except a lad i know who was in the NI half showed me videos on his mobile just the other day. The NI match finished 1st and he had videos of that side of the pub singing sectarian songs towards the other halfat the tops of their voices...luckily at the time it wasnt heard in the other half of the pub as the noise was so great there. i honestly didnt realise it had happened and didnt believe it until i saw the videos. I dont think that sounds like a set of fans who are ready to unite.

[-lamb-]

barring the obvious neighbourly rivalry, most NI fans don't have a problem with ROI or it's fans....the ones from the ROI that is.
i think many feel aggrieved with ROI fans from NI who choose not to support NI, and then, ironically, use the lessened representation from the catholic side of the country as a stick to beat the NI setup with. if it peeves them off so much then i'd tell them to go to the matches, support the team thats there for them and make it back into one that all people can happily get behind. just don't not go then say it's one sided.
my father went to NI matches for years with catholic friends in pre-troubles days and was greatly saddened to see a whole generation lost who should have been supporting players from their own neighbourhoods playing for NI.
i know there are still catholic fans going to NI games, despite views to the contrary.
its not the fans from the ROI that irk a lot of people so much, but the ROI fans who live in NI but have turned their back on what should be their team, the team who all the way through had a good representation from their own community. throw into the mix the relatively recent "poaching" of the already small pool of potential NI players and you can probably see why the NI fans' attitude is somewhat touchy.
if gerry and martin can acknowledge a NI in the UK and sit in local power then maybe its time more people from catholic areas came and supported their own local players in similar numbers their forefathers did in pre-troubles days. (and yes, i know that was never the case for a small number of areas of the country but it was the case for a lot more areas than it is now and that is disappointing...possibly more younger people who might have been super GAA fans in older times now opt for football as their main sport and maybe that shows...who knows exactly.)
the NI team is there for all the people of NI. it's a pity some shirk the team that's trying to represent all of the people for a team elsewhere purely on the view that "that's their team, not mine". it IS your team, IF you want it to be.
its a tangled mess of sport, opinions and politics when really it is essentially meant to be about cheering on the players from your own local area.
maybe that's a utopian view, but it's the way it should probably be.

[Acornvilla]

N.I is just too complicated for my brain at this time in the morning..

[antrimgreen]

They fear change, 1 Island = 1 Team and our prospects for qualification would be much greater. ;)

[gustavo]

I think if we're merging with anyone it should be England , We''d be quids in then

[ifk101]

I'd be totally against any merger with the IFA. And, at the end of the day, FIFA/UEFA recent clarification on the eligibility rules means there's no reason to merge. What's theirs is ours, so to speak. :D

[dodgycanadian]

Then again we dont want to end up like Belgium, look what different factions within a nation has done to that team.