View Full Version : Dave Rogers Sacked
If Dave Rogers had been celebrating post match after clinching the title (or Europa League qualification) then I doubt if there would have been a major problem either.
He wasn't, and there is!
So it wasn't the mooning that was the problem then but the fact that he got himself stupidly sent off?
Does that mean every player who gets himself stupidly sent off will now be sacked?
Also I doubt getting stupidly sent off is a legal sacking offense.
You can't have it both ways, you either sacked him because mooning is completely unacceptable(whenever it is) or you didnt.
Ezeikial
26/05/2009, 8:38 PM
So it wasn't the mooning that was the problem then but the fact that he got himself stupidly sent off?
Does that mean every player who gets himself stupidly sent off will now be sacked?
Also I doubt getting stupidly sent off is a legal sacking offense.
You can't have it both ways, you either sacked him because mooning is completely unacceptable(whenever it is) or you didnt.
I want to break this to you gently...........I didn't sack him
I want to break this to you gently...........I didn't sack him
No, your club did, and you've bee defending that decision.
I can hardly ask you board, given they didnt even speak to the person involved, let alone anyone else.
p.s. Im aware that in dublin and surrounding areas it may be confusing but 'you' is actually also a plural......
I want to break this to you gently...........I didn't sack him
Ooooh.. the first crack in the Dundalk propaganda machine!
Incidentally.. I still think they were justified due to the outrageous stupidity and unprofessionalism of the act.
John83
26/05/2009, 8:55 PM
p.s. Im aware that in dublin and surrounding areas it may be confusing but 'you' is actually also a plural......
There once was a thread on the UCD forum where various of us used the plurals youse, ye, yez and y'all (having noticed a pattern, I was taking the ****) in consecutive posts. Poor Schumi was less than pleased.
Your previous post asks people here to defend Dundalk's theoretically inconsistent behaviour in a theoretical situation. I find this mildly ridiculous.
Your previous post asks people here to defend Dundalk's theoretically inconsistent behaviour in a theoretical situation. I find this mildly ridiculous.
No. It challenges a claim made by a Dundalk fan that things would have been different had it been a different game, which makes his other claims about Dundalk being in the right completely seem contradictory.
Ezeikial
26/05/2009, 9:03 PM
No, your club did, and you've bee defending that decision.
I can hardly ask you board, given they didnt even speak to the person involved, let alone anyone else.
p.s. Im aware that in dublin and surrounding areas it may be confusing but 'you' is actually also a plural......
I know there is a lot going on for you/ye/yous at the moment, and will try to ignore your patronising tone.
You appear to have confused me with another poster when you say that I've been "defending" the clubs decision -
For what it is worth, I think that the sacking is harsh and an extreme reaction to the unacceptable levels of indiscipline that have been tolerated up to now. In that sense Dave Rogers is unfortunate, but is the author of his own misfortune.
You appear to have confused me with another poster when you say that I've been "defending" the clubs decision -
Apologies, I did have you confused with another poster about defending him
However the original point still stands. Did the club sack him for the mooning(gross misconduct) or for getting sent of in an important game?
The distinction will probably be important in court, especially if the club holds the same attitude that he wouldn't have been sacked had it been another time.
I don't think Dundalk have much chance in this one.
Ezeikial
26/05/2009, 9:24 PM
No. It challenges a claim made by a Dundalk fan that things would have been different had it been a different game, which makes his other claims about Dundalk being in the right completely seem contradictory.
I don't want to get into semantics with you, but what I suggested was that there was quite a different context in Robbie Blake situation versus Dave Rogers.
One, a post-match celebration in the euphoric aftermath of clinching promotion. The other, a gesture towards visiting supportors in the middle of a crucial match, which put his team down to 10 men.
Perhaps you can't grasp the fundamental difference in context, and how the first may only offend good taste or the prudish, while the other resonates with supporters in an entirely different way
Ezeikial
26/05/2009, 9:32 PM
Apologies, I did have you confused with another poster about defending him
However the original point still stands. Did the club sack him for the mooning(gross misconduct) or for getting sent of in an important game?
The distinction will probably be important in court, especially if the club holds the same attitude that he wouldn't have been sacked had it been another time.
I don't think Dundalk have much chance in this one.
Gross Misconduct
Following an emergency meeting of the Dundalk FC Board of Management the club have issued the following statement:
Following an incident during the Dundalk v St Patrick's Athletic match in Oriel Park on Friday night, Dave Rogers has been dismissed, with immediate effect, due to gross misconduct. The club will not tolerate this type of behaviour from any member of our squad.
The club will not be making any further comment on this issue at this time.
http://dundalkfc.com/news/090523_statement.asp
This is the only public statement to date. I doubt very much if the clubs position will be that it would have acted differently if it were "another time" Do you?????
But like I already said I do not think that consequences would have been the same if, like Robbie Blake.....(opps we've already been there)
Celdrog
27/05/2009, 12:03 AM
Ezekial, using your logic means that Fabio should have been sacked for stupidly getting sent off.
Rogers dropping his togs is either acceptable or not. You're basically saying that on a different occasion your board would not have sacked him for doing what he did.:eek: Tell that to the PFAI
I'm getting dizzy reading your posts, there are so many circles you are talking in. You are so deep in the hole that digging yourself a little bit deeper will see you surface in Australia.
Nice to have a pop at the Drogs as well, when it happens yourselves, we'll give you some advice.
And Micls - its actually yiz up here :D
Réiteoir
27/05/2009, 1:23 AM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-492107/Over-moon-ing-A-brief-history-cheeky-goal-celebration.html
None of these players got immediately sacked without notification - just fines and (in some rare cases) 1 or 2 game suspensions by the FA.
I don't want to get into semantics with you,
The ironing is delicious...
Black and White
27/05/2009, 7:45 AM
Oh so its ok for kids to see all the scumbag dundalk fans causing hassel after the matches home and away,lets be honest he showed a bit of his jocks end of ,its a money saving job by dundalk
I distinctly remmebr two weeks ago in Utd park we had to be taken across the pitch and let out the home side as aload of scummers went up the road where the away fans entre and exit and wouldnt move!Wana expalin that side of the scumbag element disabledrog or are ye still gloating that ye are little saints up DOWN there in that dump.
old git
27/05/2009, 8:31 AM
Did he whip his slogan-emblazoned sporty y-fronts down to reveal the crack of his arse? Was he flashing said arsehole at opposition fans? Was he sent off for doing so (was he even booked)? Have Burnley had four sendings off in their last four games? Were Burnley promoted to the League of Ireland? If the answer is yes to any of the above, I can see how your post is relative to Dave Rogers' sacking.
so what is your issue with dave rogers then .. is it because he showed a bit of his arse cheeks :confused: or do you not like the man.. so how is blake mooning not relative to rogers mooning and i only answered a post were the question asked does this happen in other domestic leagues.. it has happened numerous times in the uk :D
BohDiddley
27/05/2009, 8:40 AM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-492107/Over-moon-ing-A-brief-history-cheeky-goal-celebration.html
None of these players got immediately sacked without notification - just fines and (in some rare cases) 1 or 2 game suspensions by the FA.
Good find.
I don't think Dundalk stand a chance on this one. Sure, it was offensive (though not offensive enough to stop MNS showing it three times, and once in slow motion). A hefty suspension and fine would have sent out the message adequately. A straight sacking for a single indiscretion is at best bloody-minded, at worst opportunistic.
Has Rogers got a young family? What else is he going to do?
Shouldn't he have thought about that before doing something so outrageously stupid?
Has Rogers got a young family? What else is he going to do?
Presumably keep his pants on
What about the children at the game ? Was it right for them to witness this ? I think it sends out a clear message to the rest of the squad and I support the decision.
Besides, didnt pats sack a player last year for being too fat !
They did but lost the case in the long run;)
it was settled out of court. He got €60k in the end
eelmonster
27/05/2009, 10:24 AM
so what is your issue with dave rogers then .. is it because he showed a bit of his arse cheeks :confused: or do you not like the man.. so how is blake mooning not relative to rogers mooning and i only answered a post were the question asked does this happen in other domestic leagues.. it has happened numerous times in the uk :D
As it happens, I was a huge fan of Rogers, he was without doubt one of our best players this season. Okay, he's a badgekisser, but unlike most other journeymen badgekissers who've played at Dundalk, he always gave 100%. My initial response when I heard Rogers was sacked -- on the back of our seventh red card this season (and Mickey Collins hasn't played a game yet [!]) -- was that he deserved to be fired for his stupidity alone. But I don't think he would have been sacked had he mooned and been booked; he probably would have been fined and perhaps suspended. And for that reason, I don't think he should have been sacked. I can see why the board was quick to act (even if I don't agree with the severity of the punishment), given our disciplinary record this season and the likely ridicule and condemmnation the club would have faced in the press (and elsewhere) this week had they not dealt with Rogers' actions sufficiently, unfortunately that has backfired. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
The circumstances of Blake's (half) and Rogers' (full) mooning were completely different, that was my point.
it was settled out of court. He got €60k in the end
Yes so Pats lost.
thischarmingman
27/05/2009, 10:49 AM
I love the fact that one of the main points made on MNS was that young kids might have seen it.
Then they go and replay it several time, at 8pm, during a show where young kids might easily be watching.
Dodge
27/05/2009, 11:06 AM
Yes so Pats lost.
No, that was about 15 weeks wages, and we got rid of the fat fool
So, Pats won
No, that was about 15 weeks wages, and we got rid of the fat fool
So, Pats won
Good man;)
seand
27/05/2009, 11:36 AM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-492107/Over-moon-ing-A-brief-history-cheeky-goal-celebration.html
None of these players got immediately sacked without notification - just fines and (in some rare cases) 1 or 2 game suspensions by the FA.
These cases are not comparable. None of these players got themselves sent off. Now obviously getting yourself sent off stupidly is not a sacking offence, or Declan O'Brien could go for kicking the ball away twice in 5 minutes a couple of weeks ago, but it could and should be a disciplinary issue.
Celdrogs says "You're basically saying that on a different occasion your board would not have sacked him for doing what he did." Yes, of course the occasion is relevant. The fact that Rogers' actions may well have affected Dundalk's league position at the end of the season is surely a relevant criterion when determined gross misconduct. In non-football terms he has damaged his employers image (no mean feat this season) and he has potentially done immense financial damage to his employer (if Dundalk go down).
This is the only public statement to date. I doubt very much if the clubs position will be that it would have acted differently if it were "another time" Do you?????
I have no idea, I dont know much about your club or board. But you obviously do think things would be different, and if you are right then your board are on shaky ground.
Ezeikial
27/05/2009, 1:36 PM
Rogers dropping his togs is either acceptable or not. You're basically saying that on a different occasion your board would not have sacked him for doing what he did.:eek: Tell that to the PFAI
I don't know what the board would do in a different hypothetical situation.
But I doubt if he would have been sacked if it was a post match "celebration" after clinching promotion, league title etc. My personal view is that "dropping his togs" is unacceptable, but the consequences (especially for his team and club) of doing it in the middle of a vital match verus post match celebration are obviously very different.
Ezekial, using your logic means that Fabio should have been sacked for stupidly getting sent off.
I would certainly be in favour of him being fined for his indiscipline. Similarly standard clubs fines for bookings for dissent are entirely appropriate (as at Galway under Ian Foster?)
If such a regime had been installed by the manager at the start of the season, Dundalk's record of indiscipline would surely have been very different this season
Ezeikial
27/05/2009, 1:39 PM
I have no idea, I dont know much about your club or board. But you obviously do think things would be different, and if you are right then your board are on shaky ground.
micls - I doubt if my views or observations will be in any way relevant in Arbitration or Unfair Dismissals hearing!
Ezeikial
27/05/2009, 1:52 PM
Nice to have a pop at the Drogs as well, when it happens yourselves, we'll give you some advice.
if you guys are availble for dispensing financial advise maybe you should set up an organisation for it; suggest that you call it Drogheda Financial Advice & Rectitude Consultants & Examiners or Drog F.A.R.C.E.
John83
27/05/2009, 1:53 PM
if you guys are availble for dispensing financial advise maybe you should set up an organisation for it; suggest that you call it Drogheda Financial Advice & Rectitude Colsultants & Examiners or Drog F.A.R.C.E.
Been saving that one up, have you?
Saving in the LOI? That would be a new one!
SPEND, BABY!
Ezeikial
27/05/2009, 6:13 PM
Dave Rogers:
"No-one from the club has ever sought my version of events, given me an opportunity to state my case or even had the courtesy to personally inform me of my dismissal."
Disgraceful if true.
...Instant Dismissal without telling the bloke first, possible burning at the stake or stoning
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-492107/Over-moon-ing-A-brief-history-cheeky-goal-celebration.html
None of these players got immediately sacked without notification
Gerry Matthews, Dundalk FC owner and CEO has flatly rejected Dave Rogers' claim that he was not informed personally of his dismissal. From this weeks Dundalk Democrat:
Speaking to the Dundalk Democrat on Tuesday, Matthews said that the club had followed the correct procedure in dismissing Rogers and that they stood by their decision 100%.
"The first thing I want to set straight is that Dave Rogers was contacted by his manager to inform him of his dismissal, so there is a fundamental flaw already in his statement"
Dalymountrower
27/05/2009, 9:18 PM
Gerry Matthews, Dundalk FC owner and CEO has flatly rejected Dave Rogers' claim that he was not informed personally of his dismissal. From this weeks Dundalk Democrat:
Who wrote the press release, CORI? Of course he has been officially told of his dismissal now, its the fact that due process wasn`t followed, (allegedly, )that will ensure a pay day for the unlovable Merseyside Mooner
Réiteoir
28/05/2009, 12:50 AM
It'll be good practise for them when they have to go through the same process in court when they get rid of Connor in about 4 years
seand
28/05/2009, 10:32 AM
It'll be good practise for them when they have to go through the same process in court when they get rid of Connor in about 4 years
4 years? FOUR YEARS?! We'll be playing games with 8 men in the Dundalk Summer League if he's still in charge at that stage! :(
Ezeikial
28/05/2009, 10:36 AM
....when they get rid of Connor in about 4 years
I think you have completely lost it!
future tabloid heading after Rogers wins his case (probably sun, always have the best ones)
Rogers over the moon!
future tabloid heading after Rogers wins his case (probably sun, always have the best ones)
Rogers over the moon!
And if he loses it'll just read
"@rsehole"
Louth4sam
28/05/2009, 8:58 PM
Rogers gets bum deal?
"Footballer at Rock Bottom Despite Rearguard Action"
..or how about
"Stupid Scouse Tosser"
Rogers: "Behaviour was a flash in the pan(ts)"
Réiteoir
29/05/2009, 4:43 AM
I think you have completely lost it!
Wow - what a superb and well-reasoned addition to this debate - I take my imaginary hat off to you sir for such an outstanding well-made point
Ezeikial
09/06/2009, 11:52 AM
Looks like Dave Rogers may be joining Jim Brown at Lisburn Distillery (Lisburn manager Jim Brown was Technical Advisor at Oriel Park earlier this season before his recent appointment at Lisburn Distillery)
http://blue.srv2.com/~lisburn/news%202009-2010.html#dunstj
Also hoping to join Lisburn Distillery is Liverpool-born defender Dave Rogers. Dave is no stranger to football on these shores, having won three League of Ireland titles with Shelbourne. He has also played in the Football League, Scotland and Holland.He hopes to join the Whites’ from Dundalk and when released his clearance is expected to be processed in July once the League of Ireland transfer window opens.
stamullendrog
09/06/2009, 7:47 PM
if you guys are availble for dispensing financial advise maybe you should set up an organisation for it; suggest that you call it Drogheda Financial Advice & Rectitude Consultants & Examiners or Drog F.A.R.C.E.
did you have to lie down in a dark room with the excitement of thinking up that gem:eek:
Black and White
09/06/2009, 9:45 PM
Word coming out of Oriel Park is that Stephen McGuinness wrote to every 1 of the Dundalk 1st team squad asking them to write to him and confirm that they are dissilushioned with the treatment of Rogers and that they are not happy with the current set up at Oriel park, he didnt get one response as according to a very good inside source, Rogers and another un-nmaed player are causing disruption at times during training sessions. McGuinness is a cheeky c!@t and deserves a slap, he has got it in for Dundalk FC ever since he took over that job of his and is always looking for an excuse to milk money out of us.
eelmonster
09/06/2009, 10:00 PM
did you have to lie down in a dark room with the excitement of thinking up that gem:eek:
Sitting in a shady corner of that darkened room waiting for him think that up would be more entertaining than watching Drawda.
Dodge
09/06/2009, 10:01 PM
McGuinness does not have it in for Dundalk. He works for his members.
nearly as aparanoid as the Corkies who think he has it in for them too
Black and White
09/06/2009, 10:14 PM
McGuinness does not have it in for Dundalk. He works for his members.
nearly as aparanoid as the Corkies who think he has it in for them too
What did he do for Keane when ye sacked him for being too fat?nothing cause he loves his beloved "Dublin" clubs.
By the way, if Rogers joins Lisburn he gets squat from Dundalk FC as he is waiving his right to fight this out and get full loss of earnings, similar to what Fabio did before he joined us, he waited and waited until he milked "Drawda" dry! Rogers is very close to joining Lisburn accorinding to them so something suggests that he believes he doesnt stand much of a case.
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