UEFA Euro 2024 Qualifying Group B

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

5 wins 4 draws and 1 loss in that period at home. Away from home they drew with Spain and Belgium and beat Norway.

Since 2016, they’ve played in 3 nations league campaigns, 2 World Cup campaigns and a euros campaign and in that time 23 sides have tried to take 6 points from greece and only Italy in 2019 did it. Taking 6 points from Greece would be excellent.

You're a true Kennyite! Treating friendlies like competitive games. :D

Let's put some perspective on things. Greece have competed in League C of the Nation's League, they've played some very poor teams. For World Cup qualification, they came 3rd, 5 points behind Sweden and 9 points behind Spain. For Euro 2020 they came 3rd, 4 points behind Finland, 16 points behind Italy with a draw at home to Liechtenstein thrown in. So let's not hype up Greece too much.

Prior to Kenny, Ireland have only been beaten twice in groups home and away by the same team since 2004. No one said it would be easy to beat Greece twice but it would be placed in the good category. They're about the same level as Georgia. We expected to beat them home and away just a few years ago.

[elatedscum]

That’s pretty much the point though. On paper the Greeks, like ourselves are hard to beat and will be expecting third place like the last two groups. You’re saying anything less than 6 points is a failure and I’m saying that Spain, Sweden and 20 other teams in the last 3 years all failed to pick up 6 points there.

They’re not Georgia, Georgia have basically bounced between 4th and 5th seeds and have never qualified for anything and our record was 8 wins, 0 draws 0 losses against them until MON’s defensive masterclass. Greece have bounced between 2nd and 4th and having won the nations league group are going to be a third seed again. Georgia for example were the lowest of the 10 4th seeds when we had them last.

As for the” prior to Kenny” remark. Off the top of my head, it’s happen to Kenny once, two 1-0 losses to Finland during covid. It definitely happened to O’Neill, the 4-1 loss to Wales away and the 1-0 at home. It happened to Trap with Germany beating us 6-1 at home and probably 3-0 away from home. Happened to Kerr in the 2004 qualifying against the Swiss.

I want 6 points, I think we can get 6 points but it’s hard to predict from here exactly how good the Greeks are. I can see any scenario where we picked up 2, 3 or 4 points where I wouldn’t consider it a failure. If the Greeks look an excellent side and we go toe to toe with them and draw both games, you shrug and say fair enough. If we beat them at home and lose away but put in two quality performances, something similar. Those two are probably par for a Greek side that are largely similar to ourselves. If we take 4 points, you’d probably be happy, depending on the nature of the draw. If they look terrible and the game is there for us to win and we fail to, you don’t - but it’s a tough one to know at this stage considering their recent record suggests that it’s really hard to win home and away against the Greeks.

[tetsujin1979]

Also, we've never beaten Greece. Granted, we've only played them three times, but those games ended in one draw away and two home losses.

[seanfhear]

Also, we've never beaten Greece. Granted, we've only played them three times, but those games ended in one draw away and two home losses.
Remarkably few games when you consider how often that we have played some other teams.

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

That’s pretty much the point though. On paper the Greeks, like ourselves are hard to beat and will be expecting third place like the last two groups. You’re saying anything less than 6 points is a failure and I’m saying that Spain, Sweden and 20 other teams in the last 3 years all failed to pick up 6 points there.

They’re not Georgia, Georgia have basically bounced between 4th and 5th seeds and have never qualified for anything and our record was 8 wins, 0 draws 0 losses against them until MON’s defensive masterclass. Greece have bounced between 2nd and 4th and having won the nations league group are going to be a third seed again. Georgia for example were the lowest of the 10 4th seeds when we had them last.

As for the” prior to Kenny” remark. Off the top of my head, it’s happen to Kenny once, two 1-0 losses to Finland during covid. It definitely happened to O’Neill, the 4-1 loss to Wales away and the 1-0 at home. It happened to Trap with Germany beating us 6-1 at home and probably 3-0 away from home. Happened to Kerr in the 2004 qualifying against the Swiss.

I want 6 points, I think we can get 6 points but it’s hard to predict from here exactly how good the Greeks are. I can see any scenario where we picked up 2, 3 or 4 points where I wouldn’t consider it a failure. If the Greeks look an excellent side and we go toe to toe with them and draw both games, you shrug and say fair enough. If we beat them at home and lose away but put in two quality performances, something similar. Those two are probably par for a Greek side that are largely similar to ourselves. If we take 4 points, you’d probably be happy, depending on the nature of the draw. If they look terrible and the game is there for us to win and we fail to, you don’t - but it’s a tough one to know at this stage considering their recent record suggests that it’s really hard to win home and away against the Greeks.

I didn't say anything less than 6 points would be a failure. They call that a straw man argument don't they? Arguing a point that was never made. I'm saying that they haven't played that many good teams. They've been in League C of the Nation's League. Northern Ireland and other poor teams. So not really that impressive when you think about it. As you point out, even Kenny has only done it once, that's saying something.

Georgia are only 8 positions behind Greece on the ELO rankings. They're very close to us under Kenny. They were in the same group for World Cup qualifying. When they played each other, it was a draw in Greece and 2 injury time goals won the game for Greece in Georgia. Georgia beat Sweden at home and Spain needed an injury time goal to beat them. They are very close in standard.

Yes, I said it's only happened to us twice since 2004. McCarthy was in charge for the first Switzerland game.

In 2022 qualifying, we had a really bad time against the 4th and 5th seed but that was under Kenny. Prior to that, everyone was outraged when McCarthy drew with Georgia as 4th seed. There were no prepared excuses like you're lining up for Kenny. Were you saying that Georgia were a good side so 4 points was acceptable? You were happy with that? In 2018 qualifying, we got 4 points against Wales and Austria, 2 teams better than Greece. So as I said, getting 6 points against a team similar in standard to Georgia must be the target and expected. If we do that it can be classified as good. 4 points can be described as average and below that described as poor. Like I've already said.

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

Also, we've never beaten Greece. Granted, we've only played them three times, but those games ended in one draw away and two home losses.

In fairness they were all friendlies as well and all a decade and 2 decades ago.

[Diggs246]

Greece are better then Georgia, but not by a whole lot

I know its not absolutely scientifiic, but check out the clubs their players are at, we shouldn’t fear them or the weather or covid or the bogyman

Greece national football team - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greece_national_football_team)

[JR89]

Greece are better then Georgia, but not by a whole lot

I know its not absolutely scientifiic, but check out the clubs their players are at, we shouldn’t fear them or the weather or covid or the bogyman

Greece national football team - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greece_national_football_team)

I'd be more weary of Georgia than Greece being honest. As a team Greece might be better but Georgia now have a genuine top class attacking talent Kvaratskhelia who could go on to be a world class player. A talent like that in attack can make the world of difference for teams.

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

Greece are better then Georgia, but not by a whole lot

I know its not absolutely scientifiic, but check out the clubs their players are at, we shouldn’t fear them or the weather or covid or the bogyman

Greece national football team - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greece_national_football_team)

Marginally better going on the last group they were in together.

They have a good few home based players. Their league isn't that strong these days. I think only one team in the Europa League and they didn't do well. But wait!

I think I spot a champions league player in their squad! Ah that's the final straw. We can't handle that, especially in the heat and they'll probably be speaking Greek as well. Let's just focus on Gibraltar, depending on how good they are we could get 3 or 4 points against them, maybe.

[elatedscum]

I'd be more weary of Georgia than Greece being honest. As a team Greece might be better but Georgia now have a genuine top class attacking talent Kvaratskhelia who could go on to be a world class player. A talent like that in attack can make the world of difference for teams.

Yeah Kvaratskhelia is really really special - that's a fair enough shout. In terms of Greece, Mavropanos and Tsimikas are very good. Beyond that, there's not much there. But they'd probably look at us and just pick out Matt Doherty in the same way. Like who knows how Douvikas compares to our strikers, he's scored 11 goals in 19 games in the dutch league this season. Hard to know how he matches up to Obafemi, Parrott, Ferguson and Idah

[Yard of Pace]

Remarkably few games when you consider how often that we have played some other teams.

Or,
As to be expected when you consider how remarkably often we've played some other teams.....??

:confused:

[seanfhear]

Or,
As to be expected when you consider how remarkably often we've played some other teams.....??

:confused:
You know it makes sense.

[paul_oshea]

BS has done some good analysis And building up here. I'd disagree about the midfielders, ferizaj is too slow to make it at the top level

https://twitter.com/htomufc/status/1623055360151142406?s=48&t=Zh9SzCAHHuNzlaua0jE3QQ

[ifk101]

It depends on the definition of top level but not making it at the top level doesn't necessarily exclude him from becoming a (good) senior international.

[elatedscum]

if he ends up being a faster version of thiago alcantara, i'd take that

[Kingdom]

Dan McD has a nice article on Ireland's striking options in todays Indo,

[Olé Olé]

Dan McD has a nice article on Ireland's striking options in todays Indo,

He did a 14 man ranking did he? Any chance you'd let us know the ranking please?

[tetsujin1979]

This is the order he put them in
1. Evan Ferguson(Brighton)
2. Michael Obafemi (Burnley)
3. Troy Parrott (Preston)
4. Chiedozie Ogbene (Rotherham)
5. Adam Idah (Norwich)
6. Callum Robinson (Cardiff)
7. Scott Hogan (Birmingham)
8. Aaron Connolly (Hull City)
9 Will Keane (Wigan)
10. Georgie Kelly (Rotherham)
11. Sean Maguire (Coventry)
12. Tom Cannon (Preston)
13. Shane Long (Reading)
14. Sinclair Armstrong (QPR)

[SkStu]

Start for Sinclair Armstrong today.

[JR89]

This is the order he put them in
1. Evan Ferguson(Brighton)
2. Michael Obafemi (Burnley)
3. Troy Parrott (Preston)
4. Chiedozie Ogbene (Rotherham)
5. Adam Idah (Norwich)
6. Callum Robinson (Cardiff)
7. Scott Hogan (Birmingham)
8. Aaron Connolly (Hull City)
9 Will Keane (Wigan)
10. Georgie Kelly (Rotherham)
11. Sean Maguire (Coventry)
12. Tom Cannon (Preston)
13. Shane Long (Reading)
14. Sinclair Armstrong (QPR)

Would agree with that 1 and 2 as my long term pairing for Ireland. Think both players would complement each other as Obafemi isn't your plays on the shoulders of defenders type striker and can be a creater as well as a finisher.

[Olé Olé]

This is the order he put them in
1. Evan Ferguson(Brighton)
2. Michael Obafemi (Burnley)
3. Troy Parrott (Preston)
4. Chiedozie Ogbene (Rotherham)
5. Adam Idah (Norwich)
6. Callum Robinson (Cardiff)
7. Scott Hogan (Birmingham)
8. Aaron Connolly (Hull City)
9 Will Keane (Wigan)
10. Georgie Kelly (Rotherham)
11. Sean Maguire (Coventry)
12. Tom Cannon (Preston)
13. Shane Long (Reading)
14. Sinclair Armstrong (QPR)
Thank you.

I agree with 1 and 2 as well but think it's much more of a toss up between 3, 4 and 5. And Robinson is a little more versatile so can gain preference for games from a 6th rank. Realistically if Connolly goes on a run for the rest of the season then 3-6 will be looking over their shoulders but it is the same for everyone. Someone needs to stick their head above the parapet like Ferguson emphatically has.

[tetsujin1979]

Dutch squad was announced on Friday to face France and Gibraltar
1636684348073156612
Since then Frenkie de Jong and Steven Bergwijn have been ruled out, Joey Veerman and Donyell Malen have been called into the squad

[pineapple stu]

I see Noppert is injured - means he keeps his record of all his senior caps being at the World Cup.

[Kingdom]

He did a 14 man ranking did he? Any chance you'd let us know the ranking please?

Sorry, I didn't see this post request, but it was replicated anyway.

List has probably changed in the past month:

1. Evan Ferguson(Brighton)
2. Michael Obafemi (Burnley)
3. Troy Parrott (Preston)
4. Chiedozie Ogbene (Rotherham)
5. Adam Idah (Norwich)
6. Callum Robinson (Cardiff)
7. Scott Hogan (Birmingham)
8. Tom Cannon (Preston)
9. Aaron Connolly (Hull City)
10. Will Keane (Wigan)
11. Georgie Kelly (Rotherham)
12. Sean Maguire (Coventry)
13. Shane Long (Reading)
14. Sinclair Armstrong (QPR)

[Razors left peg]

My personal preference for the list would be....

1. Ferguson
2. Obafemi
3. Idah
4. Parrott
5. Connolly
6. Cannon
7. Ogbene
8. Robinson
9. Hogan
10. Keane
11. Armstrong
12. Kelly
13. Maguire
14. Long

If all were fit and available

[LurcherLover]

Idah shouldn't be anywhere near the top 10.

[Bungle]

Apologies, I know it's probably already been discussed, but what teams do we need to keep an eye out for in other groups, should we come third in our group, to get a playoff?

[elatedscum]

doesn't matter if we come 3rd or 5th.

to qualify for a league B playoff, we need 6 of israel, bosnia, serbia, scotland, finland, ukraine, iceland, norway and slovenia to qualify.

if that doesn't happen, we have a chance to be in a league A playoff. if 5 of 6 qualified above, we'd be first in the queue to move to A, if 4 of 6, we'd be second in the queue, etc. (so we need at least 2 of the above to qualify directly to have any chance).

so depending on what place we are in that queue, we need between 13 and 16 of the league A teams to qualify. those teams are: netherlands, croatia, spain, italy, denmark, portugal, belgium, hungary, switzerland, poland, france, austria, czech republic, england, wales


Another way of looking at it is:
we're ranked 25th of teams going for qualification - there are 20 automatic places - and 8 playoff places - so 4 teams ahead of us are guaranteed to be in the playoffs, we need to make sure no more than 3 teams behind us qualify directly (Romania, Montenegro, Sweden, Greece, Turkey, Georgia, Bulgaria, Slovakia, Macedonia, Niron etc.)

[tetsujin1979]

Five players out of the Dutch squad with a virus
1638829928509521921

[Razors left peg]

Five players out of the Dutch squad with a virus
1638829928509521921

With any luck there'll be a few others in squad carrying it and pass it on to the French on Friday

[paul_oshea]

With any luck there'll be a few others in squad carrying it and pass it on to the French on Friday

The french do like a bit of kissing.

[Bungle]

doesn't matter if we come 3rd or 5th.

to qualify for a league B playoff, we need 6 of israel, bosnia, serbia, scotland, finland, ukraine, iceland, norway and slovenia to qualify.

if that doesn't happen, we have a chance to be in a league A playoff. if 5 of 6 qualified above, we'd be first in the queue to move to A, if 4 of 6, we'd be second in the queue, etc. (so we need at least 2 of the above to qualify directly to have any chance).

so depending on what place we are in that queue, we need between 13 and 16 of the league A teams to qualify. those teams are: netherlands, croatia, spain, italy, denmark, portugal, belgium, hungary, switzerland, poland, france, austria, czech republic, england, wales


Another way of looking at it is:
we're ranked 25th of teams going for qualification - there are 20 automatic places - and 8 playoff places - so 4 teams ahead of us are guaranteed to be in the playoffs, we need to make sure no more than 3 teams behind us qualify directly (Romania, Montenegro, Sweden, Greece, Turkey, Georgia, Bulgaria, Slovakia, Macedonia, Niron etc.)

Thanks for that. Good to keep an eye on!

[Bungle]

Slovenia won so good start.

[tetsujin1979]

Live text updates for the other qualifiers in our group
France - Netherlands: https://www.uefa.com/european-qualifiers/match/2036292--france-vs-netherlands/
Gibraltar - Greece: https://www.uefa.com/european-qualifiers/match/2036293--gibraltar-vs-greece/

France game is on Virgin Media as well

This is the French side, can expect to see some of them start on Monday night
1639332962792505360

[TonyD]

Live text updates for the other qualifiers in our group
France - Netherlands: https://www.uefa.com/european-qualifiers/match/2036292--france-vs-netherlands/
Gibraltar - Greece: https://www.uefa.com/european-qualifiers/match/2036293--gibraltar-vs-greece/

France game is on Virgin Media as well

Watching VM now. Brian Kerr gets a lot of flak over his accent, but what the fluck is with the accent on Ian Harte ? Jesus.

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

Lads, this is brilliant. Exactly what we want. France to destroy Holland twice. Gives us a chance. Especially with a draw to France on Monday! Let them get their scoring out of the way tonight.

[paul_oshea]

I think Kerr is just jealous Kenny's been given a fairly easy time of it and he didn't. And he's also afraid Kenny might do better than him and his monopoly on the LOI all knowing will be gone

France could easily get 5 or 6 tonight if they don't take their foot off the pedal

[CraftyToePoke]

Watching VM now. Brian Kerr gets a lot of flak over his accent, but what the fluck is with the accent on Ian Harte ? Jesus.

He sounds like his accent was put together by a committee who couldn't agree on a thing and eventually all fell out with each other & just gave up.

[SkStu]

Lads, this is brilliant. Exactly what we want. France to destroy Holland twice. Gives us a chance. Especially with a draw to France on Monday! Let them get their scoring out of the way tonight.

It scares the bejaysus out of me to be honest!

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

It scares the bejaysus out of me to be honest!

There's nothing to be scared of from Holland anyway? Top 2 go through. Holland aren't great. This should be encouraging. Try to knick a draw on Monday but even if we lose, this group is on.

[Insidetherock]

Thanks for that. Good to keep an eye on!

Not 8 play off places to play for.. 7

The winners of Group D in the Nations League, Estonia, will go into the A path play off if they don't qualify directly.. so there will most likely be 3 at most play off places in A, and 4 in B..

[Razors left peg]

There's nothing to be scared of from Holland anyway? Top 2 go through. Holland aren't great. This should be encouraging. Try to knick a draw on Monday but even if we lose, this group is on.
The Dutch are also missing a load of players because of a virus so this may not be a real indicator of what they are. DeJong for example could kill us in midfield

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

The Dutch are also missing a load of players because of a virus so this may not be a real indicator of what they are. DeJong for example could kill us in midfield

They're missing a couple of starters and De Jong is injured. Not saying it'll be easy but they are definitely beatable. This result tonight helps and if France can beat them away.

[Razors left peg]

There's no doubt that if we are to qualify Holland are the target, Greece will think the same

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

There's no doubt that if we are to qualify Holland are the target, Greece will think the same

Yes, Greece could take points off Holland. This group is not the write off many suggested.

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

4-0 thrashing. Perfect start really. France will be arrogant on Monday but it will be a full house in Lansdowne. I really think we have a chance of getting a draw at least.

[backstothewall]

Hopefully they got that whole World Cup Final business out of their system tonight and have a serious drop in intensity between now and Monday.

[paul_oshea]

Brian Kerr asked about Seamus Coleman's injury on virgin media, and instead launches into Kenny's management
1639349254715224064

What's wrong here? All he said that was directly at Kenny was about him wanting experience(players) in the team and he doesn't believe "the manager" does. I think most of what he said was fair and objective.

[Insidetherock]

Think we'll have a long running view on potential play off places as this campaign goes on.

There are 7 potential places available that we can get into (8 in the very unlikely event that Estonia come out of the group with Belgium, Austria and Sweden)


We really really need the "seeded teams" to perform and get out of their groups to give us a decent shot at a minimum play off spot

The ones I'd watch out for, who I would see struggle to qualify directly would be

A. Scotland or Norway - Spain will definitely qualify, so one of these two, likely to miss out.. I reckon Scotland

C. Ukraine - England and Italy have to be favourites

D. Wales - could struggle post Bale, possibly losing out to Turkey

E. Unlikely anyone will get past Czech Republic and Poland

F. Belgium will qualify.. we really need Austria to keep out Sweden (who are bringing back Ibra at 41)

G. Need Serbia and Hungary to hold off Montenegro

H. Really need Finland or Slovenia to hold off Northern Ireland for second in this group behind Denmark. Both Finland and Slovenia would get play off places before us, so can't hope for the lads up North to qualify

I. This is a pox ball of a group.. Israel finished in no. 1 spot in Path B, because the Russians were booted out, and they fell on their feet getting an Iceland team on the slide and a poor enough Albanian team.. but you wouldn't put your house on them holding off Romania or even Kosovo.. we hope that they will

J. Iceland are falling like a stone in terms of chances to qualify.. but because they finished ahead of us in that 3 team group, they'll be entitled to a play off place ahead of us.. (this is very unfair, but is what it is)

Which means.. in my opinion, in the worst case scenario..

Group A teams that will struggle to qualify..

Wales
Austria


B teams that will struggle

Scotland/Norway
Ukraine
Israel
Iceland
Slovenia/Finland

As Estonia have to go from D to A..

Theres potentially only 1 space in the A play offs with Austria, Wales, Estonia,

It looks like 5 teams in B may not qualify, meaning there'll be a full path B, and 1 extra.. who would then go into Path A..

By my reckoning..

Our qualification chances could now hinge of Austria or Wales qualifying.. and Northern Ireland not qualifying

[liamoo11]

Think we'll have a long running view on potential play off places as this campaign goes on.

There are 7 potential places available that we can get into (8 in the very unlikely event that Estonia come out of the group with Belgium, Austria and Sweden)


We really really need the "seeded teams" to perform and get out of their groups to give us a decent shot at a minimum play off spot

The ones I'd watch out for, who I would see struggle to qualify directly would be

A. Scotland or Norway - Spain will definitely qualify, so one of these two, likely to miss out.. I reckon Scotland

C. Ukraine - England and Italy have to be favourites

D. Wales - could struggle post Bale, possibly losing out to Turkey

E. Unlikely anyone will get past Czech Republic and Poland

F. Belgium will qualify.. we really need Austria to keep out Sweden (who are bringing back Ibra at 41)

G. Need Serbia and Hungary to hold off Montenegro

H. Really need Finland or Slovenia to hold off Northern Ireland for second in this group behind Denmark. Both Finland and Slovenia would get play off places before us, so can't hope for the lads up North to qualify

I. This is a pox ball of a group.. Israel finished in no. 1 spot in Path B, because the Russians were booted out, and they fell on their feet getting an Iceland team on the slide and a poor enough Albanian team.. but you wouldn't put your house on them holding off Romania or even Kosovo.. we hope that they will

J. Iceland are falling like a stone in terms of chances to qualify.. but because they finished ahead of us in that 3 team group, they'll be entitled to a play off place ahead of us.. (this is very unfair, but is what it is)

Which means.. in my opinion, in the worst case scenario..

Group A teams that will struggle to qualify..

Wales
Austria


B teams that will struggle

Scotland/Norway
Ukraine
Israel
Iceland
Slovenia/Finland

As Estonia have to go from D to A..

Theres potentially only 1 space in the A play offs with Austria, Wales, Estonia,

It looks like 5 teams in B may not qualify, meaning there'll be a full path B, and 1 extra.. who would then go into Path A..

By my reckoning..

Our qualification chances could now hinge of Austria or Wales qualifying.. and Northern Ireland not qualifying

Thank you very informative