Serbia V Republic of Ireland - Wednesday, 24th March 2021 - World Cup 2022 Qualifier

[Snapshot]

Stephen Kenny should ring Mick and do what he says. Hey presto, a 0-0 draw. Great result.

[irishfan86]

I think a draw is viable and as mentioned above Serbia are no world beaters. The benefit of having a few youngsters trying to make a name for themselves is that one of them is eventually going to have that breakthrough game at international level.

We really haven’t seen a lot of Connolly yet but I think he can be a game changer at international level. Hope springs eternal!

[passinginterest]

Chances are we'll concede 0 or 1. Big question is can we score 1 or 2? There's plenty of evidence that we've created chances under Kenny and not taken them in his games to date, that hopefully has to change some time soon. The problem is, none of the strikers seem to be in great form and we're already running into injury issues again with some key players. A win is unlikely but not impossible, I think a draw is still quite likely.

[pineapple stu]

Chances are we'll concede 0 or 1.
Not if all our keepers are injured!

One positive of the last six months is that we've generally (England aside, and Serbia aren't England) kept things tight. But we could really do without a green keeper for these games. I think that's my biggest worry at the moment, even above that all our forwards are useless.

[tetsujin1979]

Serbia have announced the squad for their three games in March: https://fss.rs/selektor-dragan-stojkovic-izabrao-igrace-za-kvalifikacione-meceve-protiv-republike-irske-portugala-i-azerbejdzana/
Fortunately, it's been added to their wikipedia page in English: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serbia_national_football_team#Current_squad
Tadic(16) and Mitrovic(36) have the majority of their goals - nobody else has more than five

[pineapple stu]

Jovic has 5 in 11 games, and has 3 in 8 Bundesliga games since Jan.

I'd say he's better than anything we have too.

[tetsujin1979]

Jovic has 5 in 11 games, and has 3 in 8 Bundesliga games since Jan.

I'd say he's better than anything we have too.
Also three in his last three internationals - two against Russia, and the last minute equaliser against Scotland in the play off final

[Real ale Madrid]

Any issues with Travelling to Serbia?

[ColourfulPeanut]

Jovic has 5 in 11 games, and has 3 in 8 Bundesliga games since Jan.

I'd say he's better than anything we have too.
You mean to say the €60mil Real Madrid signing is better than a washed-up Shane Long, a 30 year old Championship journeyman and 20 year old who has a handful of senior starts? Big call that!

[pineapple stu]

Any issues with Travelling to Serbia?
In general, don't. Talking to a Serbian I know who was over there recently and the general public aren't taking covid all that seriously.

It's not on England's red list though, so clubs should be ok releasing their players for it.


You mean to say the €60mil Real Madrid signing is better than a washed-up Shane Long, a 30 year old Championship journeyman and 20 year old who has a handful of senior starts? Big call that!
You wouldn't believe it from reading this forum at times, but yeah, I'm going to go out there and say it.

The worst that happens is that Long proves me spectacularly wrong with a well-taken winner.

But we are not favourites for this game.

[elatedscum]

Thinking about team selection, there’s plenty of questions at this stage. I’m sure some will resolve themselves but for now:


Keeper: Randolph* or Kelleher*


I’d imagine both will probably be fit by game day, Randolph in particular has played for ireland while managing leg injuries in the past. In general, I wouldn’t like to throw a new keeper into the deep end but I think Kelleher has shown playing for Liverpool that his temperament is excellent.


Right back: Coleman or Doherty


Coleman is certainly the more in form but Doherty has been selected when fit. Obviously you could play one at left back at the expense of Stevens, that’s pretty unlikely, not knocking Enda but honestly, I could easily see Coleman or Doherty having a better game than Stevens there on a given day. They’ve both played well at club level at left back this season.


Centre-halves: Clark, Duffy, O’Shea, Long


Obviously Duffy looked dreadful in possession during the last window but he did make the single most important defensive contribution in our last match with the block on the Dimitrov open goal and he has been the most frequent goalscorer over the last few years. Kevin Long has been dependable for us but you’d imagine Clark and O’Shea would be ahead. Clark hasn’t really featured but he’s now a regular for Newcastle and is performing very well.


Midfielders:


McCarthy*/Hendrick/Brady*/Molumby/Cullen/Knight/Hourihane/Browne/Arter*


Really hard to work this out, even in terms of who will make the squad. Byrne is out and Brady, McCarthy ana Arter are doubtful. McCarthy is probably the preferred holding midfielder. I’d have Cullen replacing him but Kenny hasn’t really used Cullen at all. Hourihane is the in-form player but his performances for ireland since the game at home to Georgia have been underwhelming. Hendrick’s performances have improved under Kenny but he’s still the most frustrating footballer we have right now, in terms of his decision making and needless giving away of the ball, especially because early in his career he showed the ability he had. Then you’ve got Browne, who has been ok and you’ve got the kids: Molumby and Knight - think you’re only gonna start one of those two. I probably feel that if Kenny had everyone available, he’d play McCarthy, Hendrick, Brady with Molumby the next man in.


Attackers:


R: Robinson/Horgan/O’Dowda/Brady
C: Long/Robinson/Connolly/Idah/Collins/Hogan
L: Connolly/Robinson/Curtis


Both Robinson and Connolly are probably best suited to playing wide left in an attacking 3. You could move one of them wide right or up top. Robinson seems the more likely as Connolly has never really played wide right and is more dominant right footed, equally Connolly playing up top is more likely to be physically outmuscled. Imagine you play, Robinson wide right, then you’re choosing from Long, Idah, Collins or Hogan up top. Personally I’d go for Long, as he’s somewhat in form and also the greatest nuisance but Kenny hasn't shown any faith in long. I like Idah and could see him being the regular sooner rather than later but I felt often during the last games that he looked a big overwhelmed and got a bit bullied by defenders. Obviously if you played Robinson or Connolly in the centre, you’d have a slot wide right. So far, I think he’s played Robinson, Brady, O’Dowda and Horgan there. The position probably needs more pace than Brady can offer, O’Dowda had a good first half in one of the games in the first window, Horgan has played well at times but also tired in second halves...


Unusual situation where not a single player of the eleven is a nailed on starter...

[elatedscum]

As for Serbia, Grujic is a better midfielder than anyone we have and he might not even play. He's tall (6'3) and good in the air, he can pass, he can shoot and he's not slow. The game can pass him by at times, but overall he's a very good player at a good age. Meanwhile, they've got another 6'3 centre-midfielder Milinkovic-Savic who is a more powerful lad and more of a dribbler, also a very technical player.
In terms of attacking players, Tadic, Jovic and Mitrovic are all very good, but Mitrovic can also have days were he's abysmal and misses sitters. Djuric and Kostic are also pretty tasty wingers. The keeper is playing for a relegation threatened La Liga team, so he clearly won't be dreadful. Hoping the defenders are big sluggish units. Decent chance they'll play 3 at the back i think...

[Diggs246]

Maybe we could be without all of our players

Ralph Hasenhuttl: International players will not leave if quarantine is needed (breakingnews.ie) (https://www.breakingnews.ie/sport/ralph-hasenhuttl-international-players-will-not-leave-if-quarantine-is-needed-1091245.html)

[pineapple stu]

Well, neither Serbia nor Ireland are on the English red list (https://www.gov.uk/guidance/transport-measures-to-protect-the-uk-from-variant-strains-of-covid-19#travel-bans-to-the-uk---banned-countries) at the moment, so it's not a concern for now.

[geysir]

Going by how that Chelsea team were set up against Liverpool, our new coach might well have a big positive impact. We are stuck with t he available players, but a weaker squad can make up any deficits with their preparations. It's possible to steal a march on another intl team, especially if they haven't prepared as thoroughly or haven't gelled as much together as a team. Our team need to prepare on the training pitch day in day out with many hours repetitively spent getting everything right as much as possible to the nth degree.
.

[Eirambler]

Was just trying to work out what the squad would be for starters, as it will probably be announced this week. I presume it will be kept to a fairly tight 25 or so players again. As far as I can think of the only player that would definitely be in there who is confirmed as out injured so far is Egan.

So possibly something like:

Randolph, Kelleher, Travers
Coleman, Doherty, Duffy, Clark, O'Shea, K. Long, Stevens
McCarthy, Cullen, Hendrick, Hourihane, Molumby, Knight, Browne, Brady
O'Dowda, Connolly, McClean, Idah, S. Long, Robinson, Collins.

That would mean no place for McGeady, who I'd like to see back involved based on current form, as well as Lenihan, Manning, Christie, Arter, Curtis, Harness, Horgan, Hogan, Maguire and Parrott.

I wouldn't put it past Kenny to do something a bit nonsensical like pick Arter instead of Cullen, even though Cullen should arguably be in the starting team on current form.

But it does seem like there's a core group of around 35 players at the moment so there will likely be some interesting omissions when the squad is announced.

We'll then probably have about 10 more call offs and the rest will get in by default at that stage anyway.

[tetsujin1979]

I can't see him picking Arter, he hasn't played for Forest since early January

[Olé Olé]

Is McClean not ruled out? And Hodgson doesn't reckon James McCarthy will make it: https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/soccer/arid-40239371.html

[Olé Olé]

Hendrick, Clark and O'Shea all starting in the first game of the day today. I would have O'Shea and Clark at the back against Serbia in the absence of Egan. It will be interesting to see whether Kenny prevails with Duffy and which of this pair he plays with him. They are surely ahead of Long (and definitely Lenihan) in the queue given their game time.

[tetsujin1979]

Friendly against Qatar switched to Hungary, where they are based for their games in March, with the return game to take place in October, hopefully in front of fans - https://www.fai.ie/ireland/news/fai-and-qatar-agree-to-reverse-friendly-fixtures

(thread renamed to cover all three games, will spin dedicated threads for each fixture out after each game is completed)

[elatedscum]

See Coleman isn’t in the squad for Everton tonight and hasn’t been recently since the derby. Guess it’s an injury...

[ColourfulPeanut]

Randolph and Kelleher still AWOL from squads this weekend too. Worrying!

[elatedscum]

I can't see him picking Arter, he hasn't played for Forest since early January

He's injured, wasn't included in their 25 man squad - but they left a place, so he can be added once he's fit... Currently Brady, Arter, McCarthy and Byrne are all injured in midfield, so if there was another injury and Arter was the first to regain fitness, you could easily see him in the squad

[tetsujin1979]

There was a few stories in January that he was told he's free to leave Forest as well

[seanfhear]

There was a few stories in January that he was told he's free to leave Forest as well
Was that from the Sheriff ?

[irishfan86]

He's injured, wasn't included in their 25 man squad - but they left a place, so he can be added once he's fit... Currently Brady, Arter, McCarthy and Byrne are all injured in midfield, so if there was another injury and Arter was the first to regain fitness, you could easily see him in the squad

Brady came on as a sub for last 30 min or so for Burnley at the weekend unless something has happened since.

[Snapshot]

With our shortage of quality, Matt Doherty and Seamus Coleman (both being fully fit) must start against Serbia. Please, no one-or-the-other nonsense. Likewise, Ciaran Clark. All three are proven EPL players, experienced internationals and well capable of Kenny's possession style. We desperately need something from this game - a bad defeat and we're almost dead in the water after one game. It would be absurd to start with any of the above on the bench.

[John83]

I completely disagree. We have a very capable Premiership left back in Stevens, and several good options at centre half. That either Doherty or Coleman playing out of position is better than any of those is far from clear. Neither of them has shown they're an option in midfield. I'd also question the idea that a critical qualifier is the best spot to go experimenting. There's an argument to be made, sure, but "absurd" is itself quite absurd.

[CraftyToePoke]

Link - https://www.facebook.com/eireguide


A fortnight to go until the Republic of Ireland's World Cup qualifying campaign kicks off in Belgrade against Serbia. Oddly enough Stephen Kenny will not name his squad until Thursday, March 18th - 6 days before the game. We've asked the FAI for the reasoning behind this. Serbia announced their squad last week.


Surely the reasoning is obvious and simple enough, SK hoping some of his players will play some games at some point.

[SkStu]

We are not playing 433 attractively or effectively. I dont know that we have the players to play the roles needed and we seem to operate better with a clearly defined #10 in the team. The more i look at things over the last year the more convinced i am the 352 is a better overall system for us. I know it wont happen (by March or perhaps ever under Kenny) but i do think it merits a deeper discussion.

While i know not all the players in this example are available, this is an example of how it could look and there are clear replacements for each position. I have McGeady in there to basically be the #10 - a bit of a free role. He is in lethal form at the moment and could be worthy of a call up. But it could equally be another combination of two of the players called out earlier in the thread.

-------------------------Randolph

----------- O'Shea-------Egan-------Clark

Coleman----------------------------------------Stevens

-------------Molumby-------------------- Cullen
------------------------ Hendrick -----------------------

-------------------McGeady--------Long

[Snapshot]

I completely disagree. We have a very capable Premiership left back in Stevens, and several good options at centre half. That either Doherty or Coleman playing out of position is better than any of those is far from clear. Neither of them has shown they're an option in midfield. I'd also question the idea that a critical qualifier is the best spot to go experimenting. There's an argument to be made, sure, but "absurd" is itself quite absurd.
Who's saying anything about dropping Stevens or playing Coleman or Doherty at CB?

Several good CB options? Realistically we have two - Clark and O'Shea. Duffy is very droppable - Kenny axed Coleman for less.

But I think I know what has you flapping like a bat in a belfry. Here goes - Doherty is very capable of playing (and scoring) from midfield or wing back in 442 or 352. He'd definitely be better than Cullen, Browne, Molumby or Curtis et al in such a crucial game. That's not experimenting - it's setting out your team to suit your best players.

[pineapple stu]

Changing your formation really is experimenting.

[Eminence Grise]

Who's saying anything about dropping Stevens or playing Coleman or Doherty at CB?

Several good CB options? Realistically we have two - Clark and O'Shea. Duffy is very droppable - Kenny axed Coleman for less.

But I think I know what has you flapping like a big blouse. Here goes - Doherty is very capable of playing (and scoring) from midfield or wing back in 442 or 352. He'd definitely be better than Cullen, Browne, Molumby or Curtis et al in such a crucial game. That's not experimenting - it's setting out your team to suit your best players.

Stats on games and goals please.

If playing a wide player centrally isn't the very definition of experimenting, how do you frame it?

[Eminence Grise]

We are not playing 433 attractively or effectively. I dont know that we have the players to play the roles needed and we seem to operate better with a clearly defined #10 in the team. The more i look at things over the last year the more convinced i am the 352 is a better overall system for us. I know it wont happen (by March or perhaps ever under Kenny) but i do think it merits a deeper discussion.

While i know not all the players in this example are available, this is an example of how it could look and there are clear replacements for each position. I have McGeady in there to basically be the #10 - a bit of a free role. He is in lethal form at the moment and could be worthy of a call up. But it could equally be another combination of two of the players called out earlier in the thread.

-------------------------Randolph

----------- O'Shea-------Egan-------Clark

Coleman----------------------------------------Stevens

-------------Molumby-------------------- Cullen
------------------------ Hendrick -----------------------

-------------------McGeady--------Long

No harm having the talk. I'd go Doherty for Coleman, and if you go with a free(ish) 10, are you running the risk of slipping into a 5-4-1? McGeady's best days (few enough, imo) are behind him at this level. Still, I'll grant you that he could offer more than our default setting of a targetman and little lad upfront.

[kennedmc]

I thought Egan is out injured?
And playing Molumby ahead of Browne, while Molumby can't even get his game ahead of him at club level and is far less experienced? This is a competitive (Forget friendlies which are no real indicator) game against a good Serbian side - Molumby is not ready for this yet especially in such a crucial position where mistakes are punished. There's only 4 years age between him and Browne anyway so Browne is till a younish player himself - just far more experience.

I'd go 4-5-1 (Assuming all below are fit
------------------Randolplh----------------------
Coleman----------Clark------O'Shea-----------------------=Stevens

------Brady---------Browne-----McCarthy(Cullen)----Hendrick
--------------------Hourihane----------------------

-------------------Connolly------------------------------------

- 5 in midfield helps reduce space and keep it tight with Hourihane central - advanced midfield role
- the real width is actually coming from the full backs with Brady / Hendrick slightly narrow so hopefully we can create some overlaps
- deliberately playing BRady on right (Hendrick on left) so Brady can cut inside and do some damage with left peg etc.
- Hourihane gets nod as he is in very good goal scoring form and can shoot from distance
- Connolly pace upfront will give them something to worry about
- Bring on Knight with 20 to go to replace Hourihane. Great energy levels and seems to have an eye for goal
- playing Oshea is a bit of a risk but not sure who else there is

If we play a 433 in this game I think we'll get killed - especially with our current squad

[zero]

kenny appears to not really rate cullen at all for whatever reason - molumby and knight look to be ahead of him. i expect him to make a point of sticking to his principles.

Randolph
Doherty Clark Duffy Stevens
Molumby Hendrick Hourihane
Connolly Idah Brady

not sure about clark from the above as it feels like he's not a kenny player. he'll hardly go with parrott given his lack of success in senior football to date - though i wouldn't rule it out.

brady might drop back a line to get horgan involved, leaving one of hourihane or molumby on the bench.

[SkStu]

I thought Egan is out injured?
And playing Molumby ahead of Browne, while Molumby can't even get his game ahead of him at club level and is far less experienced?

If that was regarding my post, sorry I wasn’t suggesting they should start in the upcoming games just an illustration in support of a 352.

And I agree that we can’t just implement a change in formation without some friendlies to try it in.

EG - generally I just think a floating 10 would suit us. It mightn’t be McGeady as it is definitely debatable whether he could still do a job for us at an international level (he’s playing really well atm though). With McGoldrick out of the reckoning it’s not really easy to see who’d naturally fit in that role out of what’s left (Parrott?). If you played a more traditional two up top though, your wing backs would need to be given a greater license to get forward aggressively.

I just have a hard time seeing what advantages our current approach to 433 gives us.

[SkStu]

Out of what is available for Qatar game (if Kenny were to want to experiment with formation)...

---------------------------Randolph-----------------------

------------O'Shea---------Duffy---------Clark-----------

Coleman-----------------------------------------Stevens

-------------Molumby------------------Cullen------------

--------------------------Hendrick------------------------

-------------------Connolly--------Long------------------

or

---------------------------Kelleher------------------------

------------O'Shea---------Long----------Clark----------

Doherty------------------------------------------Stevens

-------------McCarthy------------------Knight------------

--------------------------Hourihane-----------------------

-------------------Connolly--------Idah------------------

or any combination of the above based on the final squad...

[Razors left peg]

We are not playing 433 attractively or effectively. I dont know that we have the players to play the roles needed and we seem to operate better with a clearly defined #10 in the team. The more i look at things over the last year the more convinced i am the 352 is a better overall system for us. I know it wont happen (by March or perhaps ever under Kenny) but i do think it merits a deeper discussion.

While i know not all the players in this example are available, this is an example of how it could look and there are clear replacements for each position. I have McGeady in there to basically be the #10 - a bit of a free role. He is in lethal form at the moment and could be worthy of a call up. But it could equally be another combination of two of the players called out earlier in the thread.

-------------------------Randolph

----------- O'Shea-------Egan-------Clark

Coleman----------------------------------------Stevens

-------------Molumby-------------------- Cullen
------------------------ Hendrick -----------------------

-------------------McGeady--------Long

McGeady is not a bad shout actually. Not sure Id start him but he could add a bit of creativity to the squad.

[kennedmc]

Kenny said before (As Ireland manager) on Off The Ball ( I think) that he isn't fixed to 433 and will be flexible. I don't think we have a good enough midfield 3 to play that system yet / or who are well enough suited to it. It takes alot of energy - look at Liverpool - most effective with Henderson, Wijnaldum and Fabinhno in there.

Plus professional players can handle different systems. I just feel for Serbia we need to keep it tight - we can still try and pass the ball though :)

[geysir]

As it stands now Connolly is our future and McGeady is past his promise, at least as a starting player.

[Razors left peg]

As it stands now Connolly is our future and McGeady is past his promise, at least as a starting player.

Id agree, but they are not necessarily comparable players I think. Id look at McGeady as a 10 these days. Would have his as a bench option to give us something a bit different if needed. To be fair Id never have thought of him until SkStu posted that

[geysir]

Changing your formation really is experimenting.

It's a tactical adjustment to the circumstance of the task ahead, vis a vis the opposition.
I doubt there's a successful one formation size which suits all irish games. But whatever change be made, it should be practised on the training ground to the nth degree, until everybody understands their role.

[DCWA]

Kenny said before (As Ireland manager) on Off The Ball ( I think) that he isn't fixed to 433 and will be flexible.

I don’t believe that to be true despite him saying it. He regularly went 4-4-2 during first spell at Derry but never since and definitely won’t go there with Ireland imo therefore we will grt 433/451 from Kenny. I would say always, he may surprise but it would certainly be a surprise.

[Snapshot]

Stats on games and goals please.

If playing a wide player centrally isn't the very definition of experimenting, how do you frame it?

8 games, 1 goal, 7 dismal performances.

[Snapshot]

Changing your formation really is experimenting.
So the past eight games have been an experiment?

[Eminence Grise]

8 games, 1 goal, 7 dismal performances.

60 posts, three months, one dismal performer.

Please supply stats on right back Matt Doherty's goal scoring performances from central midfield to back up your assertion that he's better than in that position than our central midfielders.

It's not a complicated request. No deflection, no wumming, no self-righteous guff in response, please. Just stats. Put up or shut up.

[pineapple stu]

So the past eight games have been an experiment?
The past 8 games have been a new manager putting in place his way of playing.

If he were to change that now, it would be an experiment.

[Snapshot]

60 posts, three months, one dismal performer.

Please supply stats on right back Matt Doherty's goal scoring performances from central midfield to back up your assertion that he's better than in that position than our central midfielders.

It's not a complicated request. No deflection, no wumming, no self-righteous guff in response, please. Just stats. Put up or shut up.
It's an opinion on a football forum - surprisingly enough about a footballer. Do you supply stats for every opinion you offer on a footballer, team or manager? If I accused you of the above (emboldened), I'd probably be red-carded - but, hey, feel free.

[pineapple stu]

It's an opinion that's entitled to be challenged in fairness.

You know, cos it's a discussion forum, why shouldn't we discuss it? It's what we're here for after all.