Serbia V Republic of Ireland - Wednesday, 24th March 2021 - World Cup 2022 Qualifier

[Diggs246]

Yep travers has played premier league football and international football. I'd go with him

[CraftyToePoke]

I think games played is only one way of looking at it.

Another way to look at it is a football coming at you fast is a football coming at you fast whatever division that footballs point of origin was in and Travers tends to drop those footballs to an extent he blew his top flight audition and ended up in an outpost like Swindon. Bazunu tends not to drop the ones he should catch and although more are flying past him due to circumstances not fully under his control, he is acquitting himself better overall maybe ?

[Razors left peg]

Yep travers has played premier league football and international football. I'd go with him

He played a 2 or 3 Premier league games and if I remember rightly he was terrible in one game and let in 4. Any game I seen him in he looked shakey.

I just hope they look at both in training this week and go with who looks better, because their career records are much of a muchness

[pineapple stu]

Did Travers blow his top-flight audition? It's very rare for a 21-year-old to get a game in the PL these days. And rarer still for a 21-year-old keeper for obvious reasons. He made errors, sure (but did has Bazunu at a lower level).

But none of that really challenges my point that experience in training can be a factor too. And just to reiterate, I wouldn't be comfortable with any of our three keepers. I don't think there's much between them at the moment really

[Razors left peg]

I actually have the opposite view Stu, Im actually very excited about the 3 young keepers we have. None of they have massive experience but I think that Bazunu and Kelleher could be special and have shown they are capable of playing mens football. I dont believe that playing international football is too big a step for them.

[pineapple stu]

I think at least two of the four (if we include Kelleher) will be mainstays for us for the next decade or more. That's very positive.

The match is on Wednesday though. The guys' futures are irrelevant for now. It's the present I'm worried about

[Bielsa´s irish]

No as it happens I wouldnt have selected Westwood but thats not my question. Why are you talking about McCarthy when is injured

The manager said McCarthy was very important for his system etc, I know he is injured, on Coleman is he gonna play ? Didnt play in Slovakia I think

[Bielsa´s irish]

Look Bielsa if you're gonna WUM the place at least be consistent, you were on about McGrath & Scully a few days ago for this match :) become the best WUM you can be, live your best life etc :)

So now you're saying experience, yes ?

We need experience in a gk, I stand by my posts, I do want the youth but we need old gloves. On McGeady , he is the in form player, on those two better than some in the squad

[Bielsa´s irish]

I’d be truly amazed if Kenny ditches the 433.

He’ll do something daft like

Travers *

Doherty
Clarke *
Duffy
Stevens*

Browne
Hendrick
Brady

Robinson
Connolly *
Collins

I’d start the players with an asterix. I’d snap your hand off for a 1-1.

And Coleman?

[Razors left peg]

I think at least two of the four (if we include Kelleher) will be mainstays for us for the next decade or more. That's very positive.

The match is on Wednesday though. The guys' futures are irrelevant for now. It's the present I'm worried about

Its not ideal for Wednesday but sometimes guys have to be thrown in at the deep end and sink or swim. Im not particularly worried about it at all. The guy is a good keeper and has stepped up to every level thrown at him in his short career so far.

[pineapple stu]

Well someone's getting thrown in. But it's hard not to see it as a very worrying problem though. We've been competitive under Kenny because Randolph has done quite well. We need to keep things tight because we can't score. Throw in a green keeper and we're much weaker.

[Bielsa´s irish]

Guys I would have opted for experienced gloves like Doyle or McDermott I want the youth but up front, the question is the defensive system and how to protect Travers, or O'Hara. I dont believe the other guy will start. Iam afraid that he could play it openly, I would play very cagey with a 10 and two fast fwrds

[Bielsa´s irish]

Well someone's getting thrown in. But it's hard not to see it as a very worrying problem though. We've been competitive under Kenny because Randolph has done quite well. We need to keep things tight because we can't score. Throw in a green keeper and we're much weaker.

thats the scenario I agree

[Razors left peg]

Well someone's getting thrown in. But it's hard not to see it as a very worrying problem though. We've been competitive under Kenny because Randolph has done quite well. We need to keep things tight because we can't score. Throw in a green keeper and we're much weaker.

Randolph has done ok but hes been terrible with ball at his feet and maybe one of the younger guys with better feet will fit into Kennys system a bit better. I've been advocating for quite a while that even if everyone was fit that Id start Kelleher ahead of Randolph for that reason.

When Pep went to City one of 1st things he did was get rid of Hart because he was crap with ball at his feet. I think Kenny similarly needs to change from Randolph, especially when Randolph isnt even playing club football. Now of course that scenario has changed for this game but I think by throwing in Bazunu we might benefit from having a keeper that can pass the ball more effectively.

Incidentally, I would also get rid of Duffy for same reason. Id start with O'Shea and Clark. Duffy gets us into all sorts of trouble trying to pass the ball

[pineapple stu]

Agree with Randolph and the ball at his feet - see Helsinki if course.

But he's conceded what - 4 in 7 or something? Excluding England which was a silly game to play. He's played well, and we've needed him to play well. There's a lot more to goalkeeping than passing a ball.

I don't get the confidence in Bazunu; I think it's misplaced. I've seen it said Man City rate him very highly - I don't think that's the case; he's just another academy player for now. I've seen it said he's getting rave reviews; I haven't seen any. One Team of the Week award. A different Rochdale player got the division's Young PotM in January so it's not him plus ten incompetents in the team. And we know foot posters have a tendency to overestimate youth prospects. He's a promising player for sure, but that's no use right now.

I'm happy to remain pessimistic. I'll either be right, or pleasantly surprised. Win-win. :)

[Razors left peg]

Agree with Randolph and the ball at his feet - see Helsinki if course.

But he's conceded what - 4 in 7 or something? Excluding England which was a silly game to play. He's played well, and we've needed him to play well. There's a lot more to goalkeeping than passing a ball.

I don't get the confidence in Bazunu; I think it's misplaced. I've seen it said Man City rate him very highly - I don't think that's the case; he's just another academy player for now. I've seen it said he's getting rave reviews; I haven't seen any. One Team of the Week award. A different Rochdale player got the division's Young PotM in January so it's not him plus ten incompetents in the team. And we know foot posters have a tendency to overestimate youth prospects. He's a promising player for sure, but that's no use right now.

I'm happy to remain pessimistic. I'll either be right, or pleasantly surprised. Win-win. :)

On how highly Bazunu is rated I would say hes far from just another academy player. How many 18 year old keepers in Premiership youth teams are out on loan in English lower leagues. Usually that doesnt happen until they are older. To me it looks like they are grooming him from a very early age because they rate him so highly. He was voted Rochdale Fans player of the month recently I believe.

We'll get a look at him Im sure in the next week whether its Serbia or Qatar. Travers scares me much more than Bazunu for some reason

[Eirambler]

I'm happy to remain pessimistic. I'll either be right, or pleasantly surprised. Win-win. :)

That's basically my life motto.

Conor Grant actually seems to get more hype than Bazunu does from Rochdale fans, Bazunu makes some amazing saves and doesn't have too many howlers but I've seen a fair amount of criticism of his distribution and his command of his penalty area. On the plus side he'll have got about two season's worth of experience in the space of a season playing behind that Rochdale defence.

I would definitely pick Travers. He's a year or two ahead of Bazunu in terms of development and even though Bazunu may end up being the better keeper in the long term Travers is the safer option this week. It sounded like he was very solid at Swindon during his short spell there.

[Razors left peg]

Pessimism is the life motto of most Irish people ;)

[tommy_c12000]

I was hoping for Kelleher as he gives me confidence, despite some of the flaws that he’s working on which have been highlighted on here nicely.

I would go for Travers for now. But the poor guy has been pretty nervous each time he’s been offered a chance (his debut aside vs Spurs), a shame he was brought back from Swindon. Part of me would love to throw a 19 year old into the mix, but I think Bazunu is a bigger risk. His decision making remains my biggest concern, when to come for crosses/threw balls etc, but he’s an excellent shot stopper (but which keeper isn’t?!).

It looks like Travers will get the nod, so let’s get behind him. Hopefully it will help kickstart his club career

[backstothewall]

Well someone's getting thrown in. But it's hard not to see it as a very worrying problem though. We've been competitive under Kenny because Randolph has done quite well. We need to keep things tight because we can't score. Throw in a green keeper and we're much weaker.

Ordinarily i agree, but these are very particular circumstances.

I say go for it at this stage. Pick Bazuna.

Young lads at that age feel indestructible. You don't have to worry about nerves, over confidence is the problem. But without a crowd there he's less likely to end up taking the head staggers (nordie expression).

Nobody has any real experience. So just pick the best goalie. It's that simple.

[pineapple stu]

But is Bazunu the best keeper? Or the best prospect? There's a huge difference.

Young players - especially keepers - absolutely do feel nerves. Any keeper taking a step up needs to be able to grow into a match. If they make a good save early on, that's a great help. But if they make a mistake - even flapping at a cross or hesitancy like tommy suggests - that can quickly get on your mind. And he simply hasn't played or trained at this level, whereas Travers has at least.

(Source for that btw is (a) being a keeper and (b) interviewing a keeper who did play well when thrown in for a big match for my book)

[Razors left peg]

I would say the training at Man City at all levels is possibly better than Bournemouth 1st team training

[pineapple stu]

I don't think you've anything for that though. The Man City academy stronger than what was up until last year another Premier League side? It doesn't stand up logically. Man City in the EFL trophy beat two League Two sides and failed to beat two League One sides. They're clearly not Premier League strength, or even Championship strength (as Bournemouth are now)

[paul_oshea]

Agree with Randolph and the ball at his feet - see Helsinki if course.

But he's conceded what - 4 in 7 or something? Excluding England which was a silly game to play. He's played well, and we've needed him to play well. There's a lot more to goalkeeping than passing a ball.

I don't get the confidence in Bazunu; I think it's misplaced. I've seen it said Man City rate him very highly - I don't think that's the case; he's just another academy player for now. I've seen it said he's getting rave reviews; I haven't seen any. One Team of the Week award. A different Rochdale player got the division's Young PotM in January so it's not him plus ten incompetents in the team. And we know foot posters have a tendency to overestimate youth prospects. He's a promising player for sure, but that's no use right now.

I'm happy to remain pessimistic. I'll either be right, or pleasantly surprised. Win-win. :)

Very well said, some sense here. He's a business investment at present short and simple. Pick up a talked about young player, and more than likely never see any game time with City but sell him onto another club. There's giddiness at any and every corner, because people are desperate, when hopes all you've got.



On how highly Bazunu is rated I would say hes far from just another academy player. How many 18 year old keepers in Premiership youth teams are out on loan in English lower leagues. Usually that doesnt happen until they are older. To me it looks like they are grooming him from a very early age because they rate him so highly. He was voted Rochdale Fans player of the month recently I believe.

We'll get a look at him Im sure in the next week whether its Serbia or Qatar. Travers scares me much more than Bazunu for some reason

Only because you've seen and heard more of Travers. He's been more relevant cos hes been in the media for more bad than good and most recently its been more bad.
No one really pays any attention to the lower leagues.



That's basically my life motto.

Conor Grant actually seems to get more hype than Bazunu does from Rochdale fans, Bazunu makes some amazing saves and doesn't have too many howlers but I've seen a fair amount of criticism of his distribution and his command of his penalty area. On the plus side he'll have got about two season's worth of experience in the space of a season playing behind that Rochdale defence.

I would definitely pick Travers. He's a year or two ahead of Bazunu in terms of development and even though Bazunu may end up being the better keeper in the long term Travers is the safer option this week. It sounded like he was very solid at Swindon during his short spell there.

Its called managing expectations.

We can only hope that Travers games is the one where he isn't inconsistent and making clangers. Then replace him for the Lux game and Qatar is irrelevant, ride your luck : D

[tetsujin1979]

Paul, you're here long enough to know how the multi-quote feature works

[paul_oshea]

I am, I replied consecutively though, but it would be good if after posting you could then squash and merge into one post, is that possible?

[tetsujin1979]

you can edit the posts into one, I've done it for you

[paul_oshea]

https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2021/0322/1205501-why-serbia-could-be-like-a-box-of-chocolates/

18.02 is another comparison to British football. Don't fear any individual, no real individual quality, but perform as a team. The normal backhanded compliments. Serbs believe they are better. I wonder why all these Eastern(South) Europeans think this about us given the English leagues would be seen as strong.

Didn't realise Stojkovic has only 2 training sessions before this game, theyve still got the bang in the back of the head from the Scots, from an opponent viewpoint, there's never a better time to be playing them, he cant have had that much influence on them negatively or positively in that short space of time.

Sadly its also the worst possible time for us, but hopefully we can grab a draw.

*The box of chocolates was funny, very true about the Serbs.

[DeLorean]

Travers is nearly 22, Bazunu has just turned 19. That in itself is a big difference for a game of this magnitude, and the (main) reason I'd have preferred Kelleher to Bazunu also, despite feeling his current position at Liverpool is more a result of somebody else's poor form, rather than being originally merited by his own. He could just as easily be the one out on loan if Adrian was a fraction of the back up keeper Liverpool would have expected him to be. But he's done well in some high level games, as has Travers, Bazunu simply hasn't yet.

I'm not sure I could put forward any argument for Bazunu being the better choice right now, outside of the fact that he's the one playing regular football. And to be fair we're all guessing as to how well he's actually doing. He's received some positive comments and won that player of the month award, but unless you're actually watching Rochdale regularly it's a vastly underdeveloped opinion. At least we've seen the majority of what Kelleher and Travers have produced, good and bad.

I went Travers > Kelleher too simply because he appears to have the greater physical presence, Kelleher still seems very childlike. Splitting hairs though probably.

[pineapple stu]

Could I add in the obvious extra observation that Travers gives us an additional goalscoring threat? :ball:

Let's be honest, we need everything we can get.

[John83]

Could I add in the obvious extra observation that Travers gives us an additional goalscoring threat? :ball:

Let's be honest, we need everything we can get.
How so? Hoes he have a magnificent hoof of a goal kick in him?

[pineapple stu]

Only goalkeeper I know who had a goal-per-game ratio of 1 in senior football


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUh9ucFoYv4

[seanfhear]

Only goalkeeper I know who had a goal-per-game ratio of 1 in senior football


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUh9ucFoYv4
But he only scores tap ins !

I think we can safely say that if Big Jack was picking the team ~ who would get the nod !

[tetsujin1979]

The reaction of the player in blue on the edge of the centre circle at 0:06 is priceless

[Diggs246]

The reaction of the player in blue on the edge of the centre circle at 0:06 is priceless

Brilliant!

[Razors left peg]

My team for tomorrow...

------------------Bazunu-------------
Coleman---O'Shea---Clarke----Stevens
------------------Cullen------------------
------Knight---------------Browne-------
Hendrick---------------------------Brady
----------------Connolly-----------------

I dont love that team but theres a goal threat from midfield with Browne and Knight. Pace up top with Connolly, and Brady and Hendrick can make a 5 in midfield to keep it tight out of possession.

[nigel-harps1954]

For what it's worth, just to correct P.Stu, Bazunu was training with the first team at Man City prior to his loan move.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/gavin-bazunu-working-with-pep-guardiola-andederson-was-amazing-i-was-like-a-sponge-cz3dx3kk6

It's a toss up for me. Travers probably has the edge in terms of experience, despite not playing regularly.

Bazunu looks a great prospect, but that's what he is at the minute, a prospect. It's probably the toughest decision SK will have ahead of the game, but I would imagine Travers will get the nod.

[irishfan86]

Kenny has confirmed Travers will start in goal tomorrow (Source: the42 citing a news conference).

[Razors left peg]

Kenny has confirmed Travers will start in goal tomorrow (Source: the42 citing a news conference).

Kenny out, obviously doesnt know what hes doing :cool:

[DeLorean]

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/12020/12254492/seamus-coleman-i-cant-explain-how-much-ive-missed-playing-for-republic-of-ireland


Kenny said: "Kieran O'Hara coming through the U21 team has been in the senior squad under Mick McCarthy before me for two years, is familiar with everyone and has made his debut; Mark Travers has been in the international squad, come through the international teams and has played, albeit only one and a half games, with Ireland before.

"Gavin is a younger one who has just now come up from the U21s and he's a very exciting prospect and has a great future ahead of him.

"I do take it on board that the players are inexperienced, I do take that on board, but we have faith in them as goalkeepers.

Mark will play and we have every faith in him."

[seanfhear]

Ya gotta have Faith.

[Razors left peg]

I always tend to get over confident as the game gets closer, I talk myself into thinking we are not bad. In the spirit of that I think we will get at least a draw tomorrow.

In pretty much the only game that Kenny had most of his squad available and he was able to prepare without a load of last minute withdrawals we were good against Slovakia. Considering it was his 1st game I was very impressed and if we had taken any of the multiple chances that we created we would have deservedly won the game. The games after that we a total sh1t show with players in and out of squad so Im giving Kenny a pass.

Serbia are very inconsistent. They were in the last play offs for a reason and the fact that Scotland went there and got a result shows we shouldnt fear them.

Im going for a 1-1 with Connolly getting his 1st international goal.

[Razors left peg]

Its very noticeable how little traffic is going through this forum in the build up to a new campaign kicking off. Its obviously a sign of the apathy that has built up along with the disappointment of how little the young players have developed this season. Kenny needs a good start tomorrow to try get a buzz going again.

[pineapple stu]

Is it? I would have thought a 25-page thread on the games already was quite decent for here.

Though I do remember the days when there'd also be a 20-page thread of people planning to go to the games :)

[Razors left peg]

Is it? I would have thought a 25-page thread on the games already was quite decent for here.

Though I do remember the days when there'd also be a 20-page thread of people planning to go to the games :)

Kinda more thinking today and yesterday really. Always seemed before that there was a lot more chatter the days before the game

[CraftyToePoke]

Its very noticeable how little traffic is going through this forum in the build up to a new campaign kicking off. Its obviously a sign of the apathy that has built up along with the disappointment of how little the young players have developed this season. Kenny needs a good start tomorrow to try get a buzz going again.

There is a lot of apprehension about tomorrow I think, a lot of people waiting to say I told you so, and the pro SK crew are too busy keeping everything crossed while praying silently he catches a break so they don't have to listen to it. I have this 1-1 inkling myself too because we are due a goal and they have Portugal after us, at home on Saturday so they will have to come out and try to win it tomorrow so maybe more pressure on them in certain ways. There is also that nagging fear of a good hiding tomorrow which isn't usually in the mix.

[DeLorean]

In the spirit of Crosby, my head says 3-0 Serbia, my heart says 3-1 Serbia.

[pineapple stu]

There is also that nagging fear of a good hiding tomorrow which isn't usually in the mix.
That's what I feel too. The keeper issue is one factor - we're missing three keepers and that's not good with a small panel like ours. And we've no forwards. No keepers and no forwards is never a good mix.

I also think back to how lucky we were last time in Belgrade (the 2-2) and wonder if we can get away with that.

And there's the possibility that Serbia are going to be very motivated by their Euro 2020 defeat against Scotland; they might see us as similar opposition and try to prove a point. Though maybe that point was proved in the 5-0 win over Russia a week after losing to Scotland.

So I just feel there's a lot of factors building up against us at the moment.

I hadn't realised Serbia played Panama and the Dominican Republic away last month though; two 0-0 draws. Weird games to play. Don't know what to make of those, but they're not good results on the face of it.

Edit - actually, it was almost entirely a reserve team. Still weird games, but now not great that they've a second string that can draw away against qualifiers for the last World Cup!

[Razors left peg]

I think the goal keeper issue could be framed that its exciting to have young prospects ready to step in, IF we didnt have such an issue scoring goals.

The lack of an exciting striker is killing us in real terms on the pitch but also in the hype of getting the public interested.

[pineapple stu]

Yeah, that's probably fair.

No goalkeepers and no forwards means our team is likely ****e.