Euro 2016

[DeLorean]

I get you, yeah Muller looks a shadow of his former self whatever's happened. That was kind of the point of my question though, in theory they shouldn't have regressed as much as they have in a goalscoring sense, in such a short space of time. Overall I think they can consider themselves fortunate* enough to have got a World Cup win out of this team. Even at their peak, I wouldn't have them anywhere near the level of recent French and Spanish teams that won multiple tournaments. They were the best team overall at the World Cup but I thought Argentina were better than them in the final itself.

*Fortunate probably the wrong word but I think they can feel satisfied with what they achieved as opposed to regretting not winning more. They still might, of course.


here is a positive rep then:)
cant beleive anyone would think that was a penalty, imagine if they had played Italy, ffs

The Schweinsteiger handball? It's not even debatable in my mind.

[OwlsFan]

Despite the brickbats the Germans are getting, you can't help but admire their passing and touch even in the most crowded areas. They just look so comfortable on the ball, including at the back (the 2nd goal aside). Whenever we try it, the pass is usually across the pitch for a few minutes until pressed and then it's back to the keeper for a hump up the pitch. They are light years ahead of us, and indeed the French, in that regard but there is more than one way to skin a cat. All the stroking the ball around is no good if you can't put the ball in the net. How Muller stayed on the pitch when he was playing even worse than Harry Kane was a mystery. They dominated Italy as well but couldn't score and only put 1 past us in 180 minutes. I wouldn't write them off by any means and once they get a goal scorer again, they'll be back.

I have worked out why the players (Ronaldo aside) and managers constantly look at the screen. It would appear to be narcissism but I reckon they're looking at the clock on the screen. Lowe is one of the worst offenders but I will put it down to time watching (mostly).

[AlanOB]

Analysis of the game, produced soon after the final whistle, here (https://tacticstruck2.com/2016/07/07/germany-0-2-france-dominant-deutsch-brought-low-by-tactical-errors/), if anyone fancies a read.

https://tacticstruck2.files.wordpress.com/2016/07/gfshapes.jpg?w=600

[davidatrb]

Well Klose is gone, and Muller is completely off form (no goals this tournament), so they've effectively lost him and his goals. What's happened to him is probably a key issue. But that's the 8 goals they scored in 2014 that they've simply lost without replacing this tournament.

It's a mystery.

Before the WC Finals they went on a run of 8 games scoring at least 3 goals per game including 3 and 6 against us in qualifying, 4 and 5 against Sweden, 3 against Austria. Then in the Finals 4 against Portugal and 7 against Brazil. That is one of the best goal scoring runs in the modern era - it didn't matter who they played, they opened them up time and time again. And then after the World Cup things changed and all of a sudden they were struggling to score against teams like us (once in two games) and Poland and now France, Italy and N. Ireland are keeping them to 1 goal or less.

It's like a light was turned off when they won the World Cup as if they had achieved what they wanted and didn't care anymore - Lahm, Mertesacker retiring prematurely and Klose gone. First game they lost 4-2 to Argentina in a friendly, then struggled to beat Scotland (2-1) and then lost 2-0 to Poland, and what people thought was a World Cup hangover just wasn't, it was the new norm.

In the build up to being crowned World Champions they scored 54 in 17 competitive games compared to 20 in 14 competitive games since.

I don't want their recent form to take away from their World Cup triumphs. I think that they were one of the best and most worthy Champions for a long time - they just blew away EVERYONE that they played.

[Stuttgart88]

I wonder have they just got so confident in their possession game that they have become even more tippy tappy, or perhaps the Bayern guys have changed slightly after Guardiola? And as always, when an attacking team raises the bar, others react eventually by defending better and adapting to the specific threat.

Lack of a good 9 definitely seems to have affected them. They're not getting the goals from midfield either.

In last WC their game with Portugal was very close until Pepe got sent off after viciously making no contact with Muller. And Brazil were a shambles. So maybe they weren't as free scoring as the numbers suggest.

I think they were a bit unlucky not to score last night. Had the shot that hit the woodwork on 80 mins gone in it'd have been a gripping finale.

Germany, Italy and Spain are all notable in this tournament for having no star forward. The top scoring Spaniard in La Liga was Aduriz, 35 years old and 12 goals.

I don't know: Argentina had an unreal forward line-up at the last WC and struggled for goals. Tevez, Higuain and Messi.

[DeLorean]

I don't want their recent form to take away from their World Cup triumphs. I think that they were one of the best and most worthy Champions for a long time - they just blew away EVERYONE that they played.

Let's not exaggerate, they had some big wins but they drew with Ghana in the group before narrowly beating USA 1-0. The were very fortunate to get over Algeria after extra time in the last 16. Another 1-0 win over France in a quarter final that had very few chances and another extra time win against Argentina in the final, who had the better chances on the night I think. Five of their seven games were extremely tight.

[DeLorean]

F.A. Cup final, Champions League final and now the Euro 2016 final. Some few weeks for this guy....

https://media.giphy.com/media/t3TGl4iNubaow/giphy.gif

[davidatrb]

Fair catch Del. I shouldn't have put it in caps as they didn't beat everyone. I just think that they were awesome.

I thought they deserved to win the WC2014, Argentina were unimpressive all tournament (only for some late goals from Messi they could have been out long before the final, and Messi was quite embarrassed in the end to have to accept player of the tournament because he wasn't) and Brazil were just awful in the end. And with Spain going home early. But it's not like they won by default, they had played well themselves.

Not just based on the Brazil result or the Portugal result - even if you discount those they still maintained 3+ goals per game over the campaign and that is something.

Think about it 9 goals on aggregate against us in WCQ (and not just us, they scored 9 on aggregate on Sweden too) and then 1 goal on aggregate against us in Euro Qualifying. Something has fundamentally changed in their attitude or performances in the past 2 years. There is something off. Its like night and day comparing pre WC to post WC. Like two different teams.

EDIT: by the way I remember Brady and Dunphy being non-plussed by their victory at the World Cup. And saying that they won't sustain it and come back and win the next major tournament again like Spain had. I just remember at the time thinking they couldn't be more wrong as they had just been on a scoring spree not seen before and a young squad coming into their prime years with Draxler 20, Muller 24, Kroos 24, Goetze 22, Schurle 23 at the time. So, yes. It's just my opinion not held by everyone particularly the experts. As far as they have fallen though, they still made the semi (also known as the real final) I guess.

[DeLorean]

The caps thing was no big deal, I took it out on reflection. :)

To be honest, I'd expect Germany to average three goals per match in most qualification campaigns. Knocking nine past both ourselves and Sweden was impressive but Sweden managed seven in return themselves and we were at a seriously low ebb. They're a very good side and I agree they were the best performing team at the World Cup, if not the final itself. I just wouldn't have them in the same bracket as some of the great sides. In that sense I'm glad they haven't added to their World Cup win as I think it might say more about the rest than anything else. Only really brilliant teams should be capable of winning multiple international tournaments, France were exceptional, Spain were exceptional, Germany just very good in my opinion. I think they've benefited from a general dip in standards, but that's not their fault.

[Stuttgart88]

Think about it 9 goals on aggregate against us in WCQ and then 1 goal on aggregate against us in Euro Qualifying. Something has fundamentally changed in their attitude or performances in the past 2 years. Duh, isn't it obvious? Westwood was in goals for 6, Randolph for zero. :)

[Stuttgart88]

The caps thing was no big deal, I took it out on reflection. :)

To be honest, I'd expect Germany to average three goals per match in most qualification campaigns. Knocking nine past both ourselves and Sweden was impressive but Sweden managed seven in return themselves and we were at a seriously low ebb. They're a very good side and I agree they were the best performing team at the World Cup, if not the final itself. I just wouldn't have them in the same bracket as some of the great sides. In that sense I'm glad they haven't added to their World Cup win as I think it might say more about the rest than anything else. Only really brilliant teams should be capable of winning multiple international tournaments, France were exceptional, Spain were exceptional, Germany just very good in my opinion. I think they've benefited from a general dip in standards, but that's not their fault.Agree entirely. I think only Lahm and Neuer are truly great players from their WC win, the rest just very good. OK, maybe Klose too in a way I don't really fathom. An international great but not a club great. Did Klose play throughout?

[DeLorean]

His first start was in the quarter finals and he kept his place then, only bits ad pieces before that.

[DeLorean]

Forgot about Marco Reus actually, not exactly the number 9 they need but definitely could have made a difference.

[DeLorean]

I quite like Ronaldo. He is vain, cocky and petulant but I kind of think that if you are supremely gifted, with model good looks (actually I think he looks a bit odd - especially his plucked eyebrows) and a body we'd all kill for, I think it's good that he's brash about it. His behaviour wouldn't suit an Irishman but he's Latin and I think that makes a difference.

I enjoyed this (http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/international/ken-early-vanity-is-no-barrier-to-cristiano-ronaldo-s-popularity-1.2715775#utm_sguid=117404,728b6ed1-e351-f14a-2855-d4e8f6c8f482) from Ken Early.

[osarusan]

Final hasn't exactly caught fire yet. Flowing at times, but no real chances.

Awful shame for Ronaldo. He loves attention so much I half-wondered if he was manufacturing some 'played through the pain' story, but then he went off.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Just me or does Renato Sanches "look" dangerous every time he has the ball but never really does anything with it? Bit like Anderson at United.

Pity Sissoko didn't score. Would have been one of the great team goals; Pogba, Griezmann, Payet and Giroud all involved.

Can't see where a Portuguese goal is going to come from. Adrien Silva had ample chance to pop a shot off in plenty of space but he neglected to do it.

If you told me Quaresma would appear in a European Championships final in 2016 I would have laughed, but then Helder Postiga and Hugo Almeida have played up front for this Portuguese side in recent years; which goes some way to explaining their current dearth of strikers.

Pity about Ronaldo going off, purely for the fact that he is the best player on the pitch. Portugal look toothless without him.

Sissoko probably the best player on the pitch followed by Griezmann. Payet and Giroud have looked alright, Payet always looks like conjuring something. Much ado about nothing re: Renato. I like the look of Cedric Soares.

[osarusan]

ok this game is crap.

[Stuttgart88]

Nah, I'm enjoying it, I'm putting myself (a) in the shoes of both sets of fans as if it was us playing and (b) in my own shoes having played a really tight Liam Hyland Cup Final in 1996 :)

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Eder doing well simply by virtue of being a presence in the air, winning frees and slowing things down. William Carvalho has been a silent destroyer. Joao Moutinho's introduction has also changed things, he has more about him than Adrien.

Has Martial been banging Deschamps wife or something? As good as Coman is, Martial is just what they need to take that extra step.

Gignac has been just as unrefined as Giroud. Griezmann fairly fading out.

Penalties looked like Portugal's best bet a long-time ago. France may regret not taking advantage in that 20 minute spell when they had Portugal rocked.

Credit to Fonte and Pepe in particular though, they have handled (almost) everything thrown at them.

[pineapple stu]

Suitable way to end the worst tournament in years.

Once again, the favourites in a match go down with a relative whimper. Croatia, England, Germany, Spain, now France - all knocked out relatively unexpectedly and tamely when predicted to win (maybe could take Spain out of that list)

Portugal win the tournament having only beaten Wales - just like the English. But fair dues; they were the last ones standing when everyone else had choked. In a tournament with no great teams - barely any memorable matches even - a mundane side that could only win one of six matches seems like suitable champions.

[AlanOB]

Portugal 1-0 France: Santos’ structured Selecao sneak it from fatigued French (https://tacticstruck2.com/2016/07/11/portugal-1-0-france-santos-structured-selecao-sneak-it-from-fatigued-french/)https://tacticstruck2.files.wordpress.com/2016/07/pfshapes.jpg?w=430

[TheBoss]

Suitable way to end the worst tournament in years.

Once again, the favourites in a match go down with a relative whimper. Croatia, England, Germany, Spain, now France - all knocked out relatively unexpectedly and tamely when predicted to win (maybe could take Spain out of that list)

Portugal win the tournament having only beaten Wales - just like the English. But fair dues; they were the last ones standing when everyone else had choked. In a tournament with no great teams - barely any memorable matches even - a mundane side that could only win one of six matches seems like suitable champions.

I would agree with that. It was a disappointing tournament probably because it was increased to 24 teams and with their being not many great teams as it is, it just increased the number of average teams just happy to be there. Also knowing that 3rd place in the group stage could have been enough to qualify, many teams were happy to sit back and a get a draw in at least 1 (if not 2) of their group games.

Just thinking about my team of the tournament. I really struggled to think about it, not many stand out performances.

4-3-3

GK: Rui Patricio [POR]

RB: Joshua Kimmich [GER]
CB: Ashley Williams [WAL]
CB: Leonardo Bonucci [ITA]
LB: Raphael Guerreiro [POR]

RM: Dmitri Payet [FRA]
CM: Toni Kroos[GER]
LM: Kamil Grosicki [POL]

RF: Cristiano Ronaldo [POR]
CF: Antoine Griezmann [FRA]
LF: Gareth Bale [WAL]

[jbyrne]

I enjoy every tournament greatly and this was no different. as sure as night follows day commentators feel obliged to state that it wasn't a great tournament. Cant remember the last time there was a consensus that the tournament just past was anything other than ordinary. therefore not sure what these people are measuring the standard against

[Stuttgart88]

I'm not sure the enlargement issue explains the lack of quality and lack of rip-roaring attacking football. There was jeopardy aplenty in the last 16 with several good teams pitched against each other. Almost all of the k/o games were tight cagey affairs. I think it mainly reflects relative evenness across the continent, a game that has yet to fully adapt to the post tika taka era perhaps, a game where the tactical pendulum has swung back in favour of defensive systems, as well as a lack of standout forwards. The tactical pendulum never stops swinging. WC 2010 was cagey, Euro 2012 was open and attacking, probably WC 2014 too, now Euro 2016 was cagey.

Obviously I'm biased but I think overall the enlargement brought in some much needed colour and gaiety and I think it made the year-long qualification process more interesting. The 1st seeds qualify by way of procession these days (ok, Dutch exception) and the prospect of even 3rd place being good enough gave Iceland, NI and Wales a real target to aim at right at the start, and gave Scotland and ourselves something to scrap for throughout.

The "4 best 3rd place" route was inelegant but overall the last 16 was a fair reflection and from that point on it became a tough tournament. It's not Albania's or our fault that Poland, Spain, Croatia, England etc. didn't make progress.

And in an era when the big countries and the big clubs are getting even richer, UEFA is right to open the door somehow to the rest.

As far as I'm concerned these finals aren't just elite competitions, they're also festivals of football that allow people from all over the continent to socialise and engage in benign nationalism (with a couple of countries who sadly don't buy into the "benign" bit) and UEFA 2016 was a qualified success all round. The Icelandic thunderclap will probably quickly deteriorate into the modern era Mexican Wave, but it was great and made all of Europe happy for a while.

[pineapple stu]

Yeah, I agree on not blaming the 24-team Euros. I thought it was great to see the smaller teams on the big stage (even if most didn't actually need the extension to qualify of course)

Hungary qualified through the play-offs - they were one of the more entertaining teams, and I don't think it was their fault Portugal were so poor.

Look at the top scorers in qualifying - Lewandowski got 13, Zlatan got 11, Muller got 9. Combined goals in the finals - 1. Hardly the fault of the third placed teams. (Griezmann, strangely, had never scored a competitive goal for France before this tournament)

I think we've touched on the main issues here already - lack of any real strikers, lack of any flair players who can run with the ball, and what Stutts notes as a pendulum swing towards cagey football - and I hope that is all it is!

I wonder can you add excessive coaching of players to that list? It seems at times like we've been watching two teams of technically excellent midfielders ultimately lacking in that creative spark to split a defence or wallop home a ball in the box.

[Stuttgart88]

I wonder can you add excessive coaching of players to that list? It seems at times like we've been watching two teams of technically excellent midfielders ultimately lacking in that creative spark to split a defence or wallop home a ball in the box.Yep, I think that might be true. I think part of the reason for even matches is that players are now technically good but maybe lacking a bit of street grit. Maybe we're now well into the "academy era". Who knows?

[OwlsFan]

I enjoy every tournament greatly and this was no different. as sure as night follows day commentators feel obliged to state that it wasn't a great tournament. Cant remember the last time there was a consensus that the tournament just past was anything other than ordinary. therefore not sure what these people are measuring the standard against

To be fair, I think they mostly agreed that the last World Cup was good?

I enjoyed this tournament although because I was in France I didn't see a large number of games. I did see the one where there wasn't a shot on target for 118 minutes but Wales and Iceland doing well gave the tournament a lift. The wife is glad it's over though but luckily we have two TVs, one strategically placed in the kitchen ;)

Last night was really enjoyable. It's a poor French side when Sissoko is your best player on the night. His usual trade mark was a back pass but has obviously received instructions from the manager to go at the opposition which he did reasonably well. I hoped that the shot for the incorrect handball decision would go in but there was some consolation that they scored soon thereafter.

Interesting to see Ronaldo on the touchline barking out instructions. I thought only the manager was allowed in that zone but may be he was the manager !!

I always got the feeling that the French thought that with beating Germany, the job had been done. Big mistake there because the Portuguese had been though nuts throughout the tournament and the loss of Ronaldo made them even harder to break down if less potent up front. When my friends in the Panel tipped the French to go through in extra time, there could only be one winner :)

Nice to see an underdog win and the happy clappy French crowd with their free tricolours, and many of whom did not wear colours, go home devastated. Now they know how we felt courtesy of one Thierry Henry.

[pineapple stu]

Now they know how we felt courtesy of one Thierry Henry.
We were saying watching it last night it would have been hilarious if Portugal had scored the winner from that free-kick given for the Portuguese handball.

You wouldn't mind, but there was a black player and a white player going for the ball - very easy to see which arm had handled.

Ronaldo as manager was great craic too.

[DeLorean]

I really enjoyed it as it was edge of the seat stuff even if defences were on top. It seemed clear enough from the midway point in the first half that one goal would probably settle it, so there was a real tension with any ball dropping around the box. I wouldn't be too hard on France, if that Gignac chance goes in off the post the 'experts' would be saying how they found a way to win despite not being at their best.

I think Jim Beglin got it right when he said that it's very hard to produce two big games in a row so close together, and the Germany match would have taken a lot out of them emotionally and physically. Griezmann's header was guilt edged as well, if they had got their noses in front they may have been able to pick Portugal off on the break and possibly won with a bit to spare.

It's all about Portugal though, what a gutsy bunch they have been defensively since conceding three to Hungary, and they even showed some balls in other ways in that game. The winning in ninety minutes stats that are being thrown at them are a bit silly I think, they only needed penalties in one of their four knock-out games, they won the rest by outscoring the opposition, so what if it took extra time? Hardly a stick to beat them with, more a tribute to their stubbornness, grit and even quality and composure when it counted most in tough, high pressure matches.

The lopsided draw didn't really pan out that uneven in the end either, beating Croatia, Poland and Wales was almost as big an ask as beating Ireland, Iceland and Germany as well, Germany obviously the stand-out side but home advantage should be factored in too.

The Boss - surely Pepe deserves a spot on that team of the tournament? I'd probably have him a close second to Griezmann for the player of the tournament award to be honest, and certainly the best defender.


Yeah, I agree on not blaming the 24-team Euros. I thought it was great to see the smaller teams on the big stage (even if most didn't actually need the extension to qualify of course)

Dunphy corrected Giles last night actually when talking about this. Giles was saying the expansion was great for the likes of Wales and Iceland but Dunphy said that they would have qualified anyway under the old format. Both finished second in their group though which would have only been enough to secure a playoff spot previously.

I'm definitely a fan of the extra teams given the fact that it's such a tall order for middle of road European teams to qualify for the World Cup. In fact, I think I'd be in favour of expanding it further to 32. It should provide the added bonus of evening out the unfair fixture scheduling and the uncertainty that surrounds the third place spots.

There are enough decent teams in Europe to make it work. For example, if the Netherlands, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Montenegro, Norway, Denmark, Slovenia, Scotland and Serbia were added to this years lot I don't think the tournament would suffer too greatly, and it would add to the festival of football vibe that Stutts mentioned, and that has probably been the real success story of this tournament, along with Portugal.

[pineapple stu]

I think 32 is too many to be honest. I think the Euros needs teams like Norway, Holland, Scotland, etc, to be at home watching. The qualifying tournament has to mean something.

Remember with the UEFA Nations League now, there's a way for the Div 4 winners to qualify - so you could well have someone like Luxembourg, the Faroes or Kazakhstan qualifying. I think that, and the incentive provided by the achievements of Albania, Iceland and the North, is enough of a door for the lower countries in Europe.

[DeLorean]

Qualifying wouldn't be that much different though I don't think, getting rid of the playoffs for the third placed sides would free up half the extra spots for a start.

I don't necessarily disagree with you overall though, definitely a consideration, but it's just a bit messy and uneven the way it is.

[Stuttgart88]

Did Iceland not win their qualifying group?

[sadloserkid]

I think Jim Beglin got it right

There's something about that statement that just looks wrong! :)

[Real ale Madrid]

Did Iceland not win their qualifying group?

No they qualified with 2 games to spare and took their foot off the pedal to allow Czech's take top spot.

[pineapple stu]

Qualifying wouldn't be that much different though I don't think, getting rid of the playoffs for the third placed sides would free up half the extra spots for a start.

I don't necessarily disagree with you overall though, definitely a consideration, but it's just a bit messy and uneven the way it is.
It's more that there would be very little drama to hold interest. Big countries would have a series of friendlies essentially. Even Holland probably would have qualified. There'd be too many dead games involving the larger nations, which wouldn't be helpful.

Agree 24 teams has its problems, but I think it's still better than 32.

[DeLorean]

It's rare that there's much drama involving the big teams anyway I think, they usually top the group with a bit to spare. Germany even had the luxury of being able to drop seven points against ourselves and Poland without ever being in any real danger of not qualifying. The Dutch demise is a pretty unusual situation I think, more the exception than the norm. So basically little or nothing would change with regards the top teams but I can see the concern in trying to maintain some quality control for the tournament itself.

[bennocelt]

Thought it was a rubbish tournament, really struggled to watch some of the games near the end, maybe i am getting old or what, but wasn't enjoyable at all at times.
Think Pepe was player of the tournament, and Wales the most enjoyable team to watch, though I did enjoy Portugal winning, and Ronnie.

[DeLorean]

UEFA team of the tournament (http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuro/news/newsid=2389933.html)


The team (4-2-3-1): Rui Patrício (Portugal); Joshua Kimmich (Germany), Jérôme Boateng (Germany), Pepe (Portugal), RaphaëlGuerreiro (Portugal); Toni Kroos (Germany), Joe Allen (Wales); Antoine Griezmann (France), Aaron Ramsey (Wales), Dimitri Payet (France); Cristiano Ronaldo (Portugal).

Poor Bale can feel pretty hard done by given his contribution to the Welsh campaign, even allowing for the fact that qualification isn't taken into account.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Wouldn't put Boateng, Payet or Ronaldo in there to be honest.

Enjoyed the game last night, not a great technical contest, but full of tension. Impressed that Portugal didn't fall to pieces after Ronaldo went off, really feared for them, but they stepped up to the challenge big time, players like Pepe, Santo and Quarsma especially. And Eder's goal, brilliantly taken, putting it to the side Lloris didn't expect but having enough power in it to make up the extreme distance.

France should have won it of course - that Greizmann header, all he had to do was even direct it slightly instead of just letting it hit his head - but glad Portugal took it. I've grown to dislike France more and more as the tournament's gone on, with their over-reliance on Greizmann, awful striking options, typical hosts luck with officials and jeering fans, and in terms of actual quality, they peaked in the semi (rather like Portugal actually). I'm happy a team like Portugal that has produced so many star players over the years now has something to show for it, even if it was with one of their not so great sides. But who could have thought, after they collapsed in 2014, they would turn around and win this?

As for the tournament as a whole, it had its problems. I'm not a fan of the 24 team format, as I've said already, but it wasn't the sole issue by any stretch. Just a lot of teams and a lot of games where no-one wanted to risk losing by playing aggressively upfront. Maybe 2014 was an aberration. There were a few top class matches and some great goals, but I think the modern game with its incredibly lengthy seasons - how many games has Ronaldo played in the last 12 months? - just isn't conducive to international players performing to their best in the summer (it'll actually be interesting to see what happens in that regard with the winter World Cup).

[OwlsFan]

There were some great moths at the final though.

[pineapple stu]

I think the modern game with its incredibly lengthy seasons - how many games has Ronaldo played in the last 12 months? - just isn't conducive to international players performing to their best in the summer
Is the modern season really incredibly lengthy?

Liverpool reguarly played 60+ games a season throughout the 80s - when you didn't have the level of squad rotation as you do now, and when all tournaments were taken fairly seriously (no playing the reserves in the League Cup). In the five seasons between 1981/82 and 1985/86, Alan Hansen played more than 60 club matches four times. Ronaldo has never played more than 55 club matches in a season.

There's more international matches now than before, and more silly foreign pre-season matches, but I don't think the current football season is really any longer for the top teams than before.

[BonnieShels]

Thought it was a rubbish tournament, really struggled to watch some of the games near the end, maybe i am getting old or what, but wasn't enjoyable at all at times.
Think Pepe was player of the tournament, and Wales the most enjoyable team to watch, though I did enjoy Portugal winning, and Ronnie.

CAn't say that it was rubbish as South Africa 2010 will be hard to top. But I have to agree with almost all of what you said after.

Pepe was outstanding and (as hard as it is to like the effer) himself and Fonte deserve so much credit for stepping up when Ronnie went off.

I have I say watching Ronaldo running around geeing up the players like a man possessed was brilliant. And they say the passion has gone from Intl football. Delighted for him to have won it and for France to have lost it (for similar reasons to DeL above).

There were a lot of moments that I will remember from this tournament. It was no 08 or 06 but no where near the bottom of the pile.

[DeLorean]

Is the modern season really incredibly lengthy?

Liverpool reguarly played 60+ games a season throughout the 80s - when you didn't have the level of squad rotation as you do now, and when all tournaments were taken fairly seriously (no playing the reserves in the League Cup). In the five seasons between 1981/82 and 1985/86, Alan Hansen played more than 60 club matches four times. Ronaldo has never played more than 55 club matches in a season.

There's more international matches now than before, and more silly foreign pre-season matches, but I don't think the current football season is really any longer for the top teams than before.

Good point. Not to mention the crappy pitches taking their toll on the body and lack of information with regards preparation and recovery, drinking culture, etc. It's odd that they used Ronaldo as a focal point for the conversation on RTÉ seeing as he's probably the fittest man alive and isn't really showing any signs of decline. He has been somewhat limited since his injury late in the season but that's not a result of burnout, just a result of picking up a knock.

[Stuttgart88]

Cascarino was in The Times today saying that footballer's athleticism and fitness today versus his era is a potential factor in why games have been so tight, with nobody fading the the end. Many of the more prominent players in the euros were athletes first and foremost. The "5 second" rule deployed by the likes of Barcelona must be energy sapping requiring extreme fitness (or maybe there's another explanation :( ).

So maybe the game is less physical in terms of kicks and knocks and maybe pitches are better (Lille, ahem) but I think the demands on players is arguably greater now than in the 80s.

[NeverFeltBetter]

That would be my assessment, but based purely on my own viewing of football and not hard fact.