Mons?

[sadloserkid]

Just because you know people's real names don't use them it makes you look like a complete d!ck.

Good to see Monaghan trying to keep the club going, the are a proper football club not like some of the franchises we had like Fingal, Kildare, Galway, Dublin City etc where it was LOI or nothing.

Sure her expert investigatory skills turned up one wrong name anyway (ironic given her own surname). And while I came to loathe GUFC over time I think it's inaccurate and unfair to label them a franchise.


Limerick fans are a bitter/morbid bunch, ye of any group seem happy when clubs go out of business.

Ye of the multiple carnations ffs.

I hate it when teams fold, no matter who they are.

What are you blathering about? Not only is Sean South not a Limerick fan but he also praised Monaghan as a real football club in his post. If you can find three Limerick fans who express no sympathy to Monaghan in this thread you're a wizard. Clearly you're holding a bit of a grudge yourself.

Also, a carnation is a flower and I also hate it when teams go bust. It reflects poorly on the league as a hole, including the teams that are left behind to struggle on.

[Spudulika]

Can anyone clarify what exactly was the cause of this? Monaghan had they thought was a nailed-on sponsor but it fell through and they couldn't find a replacement?

Ask Longford - that is all.

[Charlie Darwin]

It reflects poorly on the league as a hole
Never a truer word typoed.

[BonnieShels]

Cos as holes go...

[gael353]

Sure her expert investigatory skills turned up one wrong name anyway (ironic given her own surname).

Indeed. My real name is Ollie

[Dodge]

Can anyone clarify what exactly was the cause of this? Monaghan had they thought was a nailed-on sponsor but it fell through and they couldn't find a replacement?

Its never just one thing though

Bad planning, budgeting for money that wasn't guaranteed, spending on players. Throw in apathy from local area and a growing sense of doom from those working hard and its all bound to add up. Magicme's line about 'nursing a patient' was pretty telling.

[Spudulika]

Do you know what I can't get, and this has been mentioned I know, is that surely they could have muddled through, asking players to take cuts etc. I know the manager would sell his kids before he did that, but at the same time, surely something could have been done. Twitter has been alive with all sorts of comments, but really it boils down to what I think most sensible posts have pointed out:
a combo platter of poor planning, apathy, fear and lack of communication.

[Johnnie C]

Got a text in Poznan yesterday with the bad news. Feel sad for the loyal supporters they did have. Will the club re-emerge in the Ulster Senior League ?

[Longfordian]

Ask Longford - that is all.

What have Longford got to do with Monaghan's demise exactly?

[Spudulika]

What have Longford got to do with Monaghan's demise exactly?


It was reference to El Rod's magical beans trick with Longford many moons ago.

[Dunny]

Any news on this other club having a meeting today then?

[Longfordian]

It was reference to El Rod's magical beans trick with Longford many moons ago.

I see. Yes, Roddy and the brothers McMullen. I enjoyed tracking their progress as they attempted to "buy in" to one club after another then got very promptly fecked out of the one club that let them in.

[Terry]

Are they still playing?

Galway United (from what Im hearing) have been given a place in the u19 league for the coming season. I haven't heard anything about a senior team yet, but (and again this is just street talk) there will be an announcement of a friendly in the coming weeks too.

[Mad Moose]

As the demise of clubs go this was one I didn't see because I wasn't aware of any difficulties. I thought it might happen with Roddy in charge and did automatically assume Roddy was behind this in terms of financial demands to get players in. I heard him talk about getting players in after the defeat to St Pats (i think) at Gortakeegan before the break. I haven't posted on the demise of any other club in the last few years, bar Derry City of course, because in a sense they meant nothing to me. Monaghan United was in my eyes a tidy club, well run, living within its means and on the up in terms of development. A club I liked and admired. I wish them luck in the future in the USL and I can see a return to the League of Ireland in no time at all. Another very sad League of Ireland story.

[Spudulika]

I see. Yes, Roddy and the brothers McMullen. I enjoyed tracking their progress as they attempted to "buy in" to one club after another then got very promptly fecked out of the one club that let them in.

Sorry for being obtuse on it - just in case I got anyone in trouble. I only heard, right after the Longford "approach" and who was involved and was shocked. Of course Rodovski claimed he knew nothing of the dodgy deeds of his partners and certainly slated Longford, I can only imagine what he's saying about Mons now.

Tweet last evening - how many clubs has Roddy bankrupted or sent bust (or nearly). At last count it's clubs in 4 countries he's put into bother.

[Charlie Darwin]

Arguably, a club hiring Roddy Collins is indicative of the sort of mindset that would drive a club to destruction regardless.

[Spudulika]

Arguably, a club hiring Roddy Collins is indicative of the sort of mindset that would drive a club to destruction regardless.

Worse, they had TWO Roddy Collins on board!

[geezer]

Are they still playing?


yes GUST completed the u19 season , are organised for u19s commencing in september hopefully, GUST have a completely revamped coaching regime an outcome of the open forums held in december and january in the Claddagh hall its set up now and drawing widespread support throughout the city and county powered on initially by North Galway and spread now right across the city and county clubs affiliated to the Galway district league and Galway clubs who participate in the Roscommon District league.
GUST are hoping to announce a friendly and the re launch of the u19 before end of june. GUST are and have been all winter visible on the streets of Galway every weekend with an information stand on shop street and Eyre Sq Centre.
Galway United Legends team will play against Aston Villa Legends in the Chick Deacy memorial friendly on the 18th of august to rename Terryland and GUST are running the matchday operations
Bi weekly meetings have been consistently attended by large crews over the winter and numbers continue to swell
Lots of work to do, but GUST most definitely havent gone away

im sick to my stomach over mons, can just imagine whats going on behind the scenes, as one man on shop street described on saturday about United its like a death in the family. I wouldnt wish it on anyone. I offer my sincere sympathy to those affected.

A huge review of the costs associated with fines, participation, cost of licensing, referees & insurance has to be looked at now by the league urgently.

[Spudulika]

Just chatting now watching the England game, surrounded by Ukranians who are not happy (which makes it difficult for me to be pleased that England are heading through). One lad reminded me of the KHL (Kontinental Hockey League) and it's rule that clubs have to put up 30% of the salary (coaches, players and staff) into an escrow (if that's the right word) account before they're permitted into the league. This is paid out at the end of the season I believe. I'll check with a friend in RT who deals with the KHL and try get the rule/law in english. It's interesting though I doubt it'd work in the LOI.

[Charlie Darwin]

I can't imagine any LOI side would have access to that much cash up front.

[Dunny]

Apart from Lim€rick.

[Mr A]

There has been no indication of what happens next season? For example- Is there now an extra promotion slot in the first this season?

[bluewhitearmy]

Galway United (from what Im hearing) have been given a place in the u19 league for the coming season. I haven't heard anything about a senior team yet, but (and again this is just street talk) there will be an announcement of a friendly in the coming weeks too.


yes GUST completed the u19 season , are organised for u19s commencing in september hopefully, GUST have a completely revamped coaching regime an outcome of the open forums held in december and january in the Claddagh hall its set up now and drawing widespread support throughout the city and county powered on initially by North Galway and spread now right across the city and county clubs affiliated to the Galway district league and Galway clubs who participate in the Roscommon District league.
GUST are hoping to announce a friendly and the re launch of the u19 before end of june. GUST are and have been all winter visible on the streets of Galway every weekend with an information stand on shop street and Eyre Sq Centre.
Galway United Legends team will play against Aston Villa Legends in the Chick Deacy memorial friendly on the 18th of august to rename Terryland and GUST are running the matchday operations
Bi weekly meetings have been consistently attended by large crews over the winter and numbers continue to swell
Lots of work to do, but GUST most definitely havent gone away

im sick to my stomach over mons, can just imagine whats going on behind the scenes, as one man on shop street described on saturday about United its like a death in the family. I wouldnt wish it on anyone. I offer my sincere sympathy to those affected.

A huge review of the costs associated with fines, participation, cost of licensing, referees & insurance has to be looked at now by the league urgently.

Fair play to GUST for keeping them going i had thought they were gone at the end of last season. Must take a massive effort to keep them going with out a senior team.

[bluewhitearmy]

There has been no indication of what happens next season? For example- Is there now an extra promotion slot in the first this season?

Last in the prem now plays the winner of the 1st division play off. No-one comes straight down.

[geezer]

Fair play to GUST for keeping them going i had thought they were gone at the end of last season. Must take a massive effort to keep them going with out a senior team.


www.galwaysoccer.com for more info and blogs, set up voluntarily by a staff member of the local Post Office & member of GUST, its selling lotto, kit, maroon army and gust memberships across the world to Galwegians abroad daily. Mons fans are going to feel a tirade of emotions in next few months horrible horrible time for them

[total hoofball]

Good lord, I love the sense of perspective we all have. th, 8 clubs "crashing out of the league" - "calamity", are you writing for the Indo?

It's so easy to blame the FAI for this, like they allow clubs overspend, or let owners/gm's/ceo's play games with figures. The strictures are in place in Ireland as in most other leagues and for crying out loud can't it be clearly said that the clubs are at fault? It wasn't the FAI that forced Ollie to take loans from all comers. Or for Fingal to depend on one main source of income, or even on Derry to have twice the fun with contracts. The league is ignored because it suits too many to have it that way. It suits the LOI "fans" because they feel special. It suits the clubs because they can get away with all sorts. It suits the FAI because they can keep the good times rolling at the top table. JD's salary shouldn't be the issue, or this constant and teeth grindingly bitchy "best fans in the world" comment pouring from posts. Fans are fans, supporters are supporters. Fans come and go, supporters stay. Rovers hung on because they'd a large group of supporters to see them through, Limerick chopped and changed but a core of supporters still stuck it out. Monaghan have a loyal, solid core of support, they just didn't grow it enough and attract the "fans". But they'll be back. It's not anyo one group's fault, it's just business.
Har Har

Stating the fact that one-third of the league's clubs crashing out in less than 5 years is a calamity is a bloody understatement on my part actually. Someone else needs a sense of perspective if they think this latest episode under the FAI's watch is 'just business'.

Look, the FAI's Licensing System is meant to regulate clubs from financial mismanagement and budgetary errors that could put a club's future at risk. Monaghan for the first time in 26 years screwed up badly, no argument about that and I never said the clubs play no fault in this. The whole point of the Licensing System is to preempt situations like this happening. It's the FAI's job to filter out the overspending and dodgy figures before it causes damage, if they told Monaghan to get real with their numbers in the winter they would still be in the LOI. If they can't spot the basics of clubs making sudden & wild budgetary assumptions on sponsorship, attendances and fundraising then the FAI have no business running a pub league let alone a national league. No isolated incidents here, 8 clubs crrrrrashing out, Bohs/Drogheda hung on, and Dundalk are the latest who have been 'unlucky' to slip through the oh so rigorous FAI forensics.... **** right it is easy to blame the FAI for this epidemic of clubs failing because their failure of a Licensing System is facilitating clubs fancy figures, unrealistic budgeting and subsequent deaths.

Oh. Feel special/JD's salary/teeth grindingly bitchy/ wiffle waffle. Yeah, I am a special LOI fan, I am a superior fan than the 'best fans in the world' and I am really jealous of JD's modest & well-earned 430k salary. How can anyone stating the obvious be anything else.

[adamd164]

So based on the FAI statement I'm guessing the cup draw will now have 'bye' as one of the possible draws?

[Martinho II]

So based on the FAI statement I'm guessing the cup draw will now have 'bye' as one of the possible draws?correct adam!

[BonnieShels]

I can't imagine any LOI side would have access to that much cash up front.

An LOI club will have 30% of something? not necessarily the amount of cash in the KHL.

[Charlie Darwin]

30% of the wage bill? That'd be 5-6 home gate receipts. Given the trouble a number of teams are having coping with 3-4 weeks without a home fixture, I'd say that'd be a near impossible proposition for all but Limerick and perhaps Shamrock Rovers. Clubs just don't have access to those resources.

[BonnieShels]

Ah 30%, 20% etc. Sure didn't Limerick HAVE to do it this season.

I'm dying for this to come out in the wash.

Any news on the Bray/Dundalk/AN OTHER FC meeting tonight?

[Charlie Darwin]

I hear Limerick have decided to dial back their bitterness budget by 20%.

[BonnieShels]

I hear Limerick have decided to dial back their bitterness budget by 20%.

*insert generic joke about Sligo and toilets*

[Lim till i die]

Ah 30%, 20% etc. Sure didn't Limerick HAVE to do it this season.

Try 100%


I hear Limerick have decided to dial back their bitterness budget by 20%.

As, you can see, even this (what other clubs would consider significant) reduction hasn't bothered us in the slightest due to our filthy, dirty, rotten, rich, status:

http://img844.imageshack.us/img844/1348/20120620031234.jpg




Sean South is possibly my favourite poster on foot.ie aswell. That's not the first time he has had Galway fans screeching at him assuming he's a Limerick fan. :)

[Spudulika]

Update on the KHL, the new clubs who are coming in this season have to front up half the cash for wages - lodged in an escrow (that was what the guy said) account. It'd be tight for any LOI club though it basically means you have your main sponsor in early, have sold x number of pre-season tickets and have no outstanding debts from the previous year. The biggest advantage for most KHL clubs is that they get part of their funding from the city/region and/or a local government interest - CSKA/CKA = Army etc. LOI clubs, as far as I know, have to put up a bond or for sure have to front up the registration fee. So this (I suppose) substitutes what the KHL ask for in a sense. The KHL model is borrowed from Russian soccer (again it's a city/region/business guarantee) - so for example when Sochi went bust those owed were paid off from a share of what was in some sort of pre-season kitty. It's been a year so I don't remember exactly.

If Limerick had to front up the cash, and did, I am sure all other clubs can do the same if they're serious. If your wage budget is 200k then even lodging 40k in advance of the season (if the club is well managed) is not beyond the realm of possibility. This is where supporters come in.

[Macy]

It's so easy to blame the FAI for this, like they allow clubs overspend, or let owners/gm's/ceo's play games with figures.
They run the licencing system. The evidence so far appears you can have the licence refused for the colour ink you use for the form, but put any old optimistic nonsense in the actual budget figures, and you get handed a premier licence. And there's no proper oversight as the season goes on. Yes you can, and should, blame the clubs. However, the FAI Licencing is supposed to be the system that protects clubs from themselves. Mons should never have budgeted for sponsorship without it being in the bag, and the FAI should never have issued a licence for the clubs based on a budget that included sponsorship that wasn't certain.

Still disgusted at Mons pulling the plug half way through the season though - that is unforgivable for me.

[marinobohs]

So based on the FAI statement I'm guessing the cup draw will now have 'bye' as one of the possible draws?

Except Monaghan - bye bye ?

[Spudulika]

They run the licencing system. The evidence so far appears you can have the licence refused for the colour ink you use for the form, but put any old optimistic nonsense in the actual budget figures, and you get handed a premier licence. And there's no proper oversight as the season goes on. Yes you can, and should, blame the clubs. However, the FAI Licencing is supposed to be the system that protects clubs from themselves. Mons should never have budgeted for sponsorship without it being in the bag, and the FAI should never have issued a licence for the clubs based on a budget that included sponsorship that wasn't certain.

Still disgusted at Mons pulling the plug half way through the season though - that is unforgivable for me.

Macy I'm in agreement that licencing is flawed insofar as that it allows for clubs to estimate. This was the premise for Galway going gaga back in 2008 (I think) and for Dundalk this season, even for Mons. I agree also that Mons shouldn't have budgeted for sponsorship without something being signed. If they left it as 0000 then at least they'd have had to live within their means. So what does the FAI do? Only have actual figures which would mean that apart from 1 or 2 clubs nobody else would have a hope. I'd live with that if it meant that all clubs got their houses in order. If a club budgeted for next to nothing in order to get their licence, then they could ramp up the work once cash came in and it's all above board. But how many will go for that?

[Hairy Bowsie]

"Low lie, the crooks of Abbotstown
Where once you bought cans for green clad clowns.
Another club gone to the wall, while you’re in Poland having a ball,
Oh the hypocrisy of the crooks of Abbotstown"

That should be sang at every LoI ground in the country, this weekend

[Macy]

Macy I'm in agreement that licencing is flawed insofar as that it allows for clubs to estimate. This was the premise for Galway going gaga back in 2008 (I think) and for Dundalk this season, even for Mons. I agree also that Mons shouldn't have budgeted for sponsorship without something being signed. If they left it as 0000 then at least they'd have had to live within their means. So what does the FAI do? Only have actual figures which would mean that apart from 1 or 2 clubs nobody else would have a hope. I'd live with that if it meant that all clubs got their houses in order. If a club budgeted for next to nothing in order to get their licence, then they could ramp up the work once cash came in and it's all above board. But how many will go for that?
Things like attendance can be estimated and be checked for being realistic. Even if they haven't published them, the FAI have supposedly been collecting them the last few years. After that, things like main sponsorship shouldn't be done on estimates - certainly not to the extent a club is relying on a certain amount which may or may not materialise to get through the bloody season.

[Spudulika]

Agreed on main sponsorships, that's codology of the highest order. Gates, season tickets etc can be estimated, a poor run can lead to poor gates, but agree, depending on a sponsor to get through a season is madness.

[Sam_Heggy]

In all seriousness, how much can clubs really get from a main sponsor anymore?

€10,000? €20,000? €50,000?

It's not as if companies see the LOI as a huge chance for marketing to a wide audience. I'd guess only Rovers have a chance of getting any sort of substantial sponsorship and even with that, how many weeks wages would it cover? Not many I'd guess.

[Spudulika]

Sam, can I say from here in Russia. The only non-government main sponsors are putting in low-low 6figure sums for club in the Premier. 1 very prominent 1st Division club is getting $45,000 for the season from a private company, this is a club which will average multiples of what most Irish clubs get through the turnstile and be on tv weekly.

[marinobohs]

Agreed on main sponsorships, that's codology of the highest order. Gates, season tickets etc can be estimated, a poor run can lead to poor gates, but agree, depending on a sponsor to get through a season is madness.

All budgeting is to a large extent estimation but it can be broken down and justified

- sponsors/commitments already agreed versus expectation

- crowds/ merchandise expectation (and basis on which the figure was arrived at)

- Rent (Income or expenditure) and whether this is actual or estimated (basis for estimation)

Unless there was a 90% chance of a sponsor coming on board very soon after it should have no basis for inclusion in a budget projection. Similarly figures should not be accepted without a real chance of achievement. Anyone in Prem Div (with the exception of possibly Shams and promoted sides) that predicted increased or even steady gates (on previous season) in current financial envoirnment should have been questioned about how this was achievable.


Difficult to allow for unexpected (contracted sponsor collapse etc) but in the current climate it is better to err on the side of caution.

[Dodge]

From what I'm lead to believe Monaghan 'budgeted' for far more in Sponsorship than Pats bring in, and Nissan is a nice sponsor for Pats to have

[Quayman]

Mons obviously had a gentleman's agreement with somebody but it ended up going tits up.

Its a shame to see this happening year on year. Since teh FAI took over the running of the league its been nothing but money problems galore. This licencing committee is obviously not qualified enough. Take last season for example, Galway didnt get a licence and then where allowed compete in the Premier Division.

[sullanefc]

From what I'm lead to believe Monaghan 'budgeted' for far more in Sponsorship than Pats bring in, and Nissan is a nice sponsor for Pats to have

Ridiculous if true. And as marinobohs said, clubs should be erring on the side of caution.

[markc1184]

Can anyone tell me how much registration fees were before the FAI took charge of the league? Have they always been around €19000?

[El-Pietro]

In all seriousness, how much can clubs really get from a main sponsor anymore?

€10,000? €20,000? €50,000?

It's not as if companies see the LOI as a huge chance for marketing to a wide audience. I'd guess only Rovers have a chance of getting any sort of substantial sponsorship and even with that, how many weeks wages would it cover? Not many I'd guess.

The Clonakilty Pudding deal is the highest in Cork Citys history - at least the highest we'll actually receive after the non paid Nissan deal

[Sean South]

Cork Citys
Citys*
(*All three clubs from Cork that have used the name City)