Irish Wolves and Opposition Irish

[Manc Irish Wolf]

Alright Chaps, saw that there was a few references to Doyle and Hunt and thought I'd condense opinions on yesterdays Irish players into one (Not sure, if this should have gone in Irish Abroad).

Wolves

Doyler - Absolute class. His movement and instant control were a joy to see and probably unseen down here since Robbie left. His continuous runs down the channels looking to pick holes in Hull's defence were a constant threat and his strength in holding up the ball worked well. Nothing that we don't know after his sterling performances for Ireland, however think that the rest of the footballing world will gradually wake up to this and wouldn't be surprised to see him eventually viewed as one of the buys of the summer. Unlucky to have a shot cleared off the line and a couple of communication breakdowns with Keogh, but am sure that this will come with time. Can't wait to see him link up with SEB - despite his prolific goals tally, still see him as a partnering striker due to his ability to create space and his all-round build up play - seriously think that partnership is as potentially as good as anything outside the top eight. No signs of injury or tiredness and should be bang on for Saturday.

Keogh - Good movement and braver in the challenge than in previous years. Had a couple of chances which he was unlucky with - however, we cannot afford to continually rue missed chances (the frustrating & worrying part of his game), so the clinical goalscoring side of his game will need to come if he is to keep his place up front. Still looks like he can easily cope at this level.

Ward/Foley - Out Injured - on yesterdays showing will be straight back in when fit.

Hull

Hunt - Played quality and had many fans questioning why we didn't go in for him. Always running and switching wings - didn't get too much of the ball as we were generally on top, however when he did his delivery was quality, including the inch perfect looping cross for their goal (although he should have been closed down). His corners were also an accurate threat - a good season could give us a bit more competition for the left wing.

Kilbane - Didn't even realise he was playing until 70 minutes in, so couldn't really tell you in all honesty. Playing in centre midfield and in consideration of the fact that we were all over them for large parts of the game after their early goal, wouldn't say that he played that well.

[youngirish]

Thanks for that Manc. Doyle looks a good buy. I noticed a few posters on the wolves messageboards questioning whether he was worth over 6 million when wolves initially put a bid in for him. Maybe now they'll realise that could be a very good bit of business on McCarthy's part.

Hopefully he'll grab a goal in the next game and then people outside Ireland might really start to take notice.

[shakermaker1982]

Doyle has got a good write up in most of today's papers and it's good to hear he is coming into form before the crunch game against Cyprus.

I don't know why Brown is playing Kilbane in the centre of midfield. Games just pass him by.

What did you think of Folan? The Hull fan who reviewed the game in the Observer only gave him a 4. Harsh?

[Manc Irish Wolf]

Doyle has got a good write up in most of today's papers and it's good to hear he is coming into form before the crunch game against Cyprus.

I don't know why Brown is playing Kilbane in the centre of midfield. Games just pass him by.

What did you think of Folan? The Hull fan who reviewed the game in the Observer only gave him a 4. Harsh?

Didn't even realise he was playing. To be fair, I think their goal was about their only effort on goal, as it was more of a midfield battle, so he didn't get much service. I'll pay a bit more attention to the opposition teamsheet next time rather than milking the most out of the pre-match festivities.

[OwlsFan]

Slightly off topic but you need to be beating the likes of Hull if you want to stay up.

Good news on Doyle. We'll need him for the upcoming game(s). Hope he stays fit.

[Hunty's Flatcap]

http://www.expressandstar.com/2009/09/12/wolves-eye-young-star/

Not the most informative article in the world but Deegan linked again never-the-less.

[SkStu]

Deegan will be a huge success when he leaves Ireland. I would wager that he will become an Irish international.

[NeilMcD]

Yeah I rate him highly but always hard to tell how someone will do when they leave home etc. More to football than ability.

[Razors left peg]

Deegan will be a huge success when he leaves Ireland. I would wager that he will become an Irish international.

Id agree with that, very good player

[irishfan86]

Who would you compare Deegan to? I only watched a couple of the European games, but I thought he was in the mould of a Darren Fletcher...a real athlete who could run forever and has decent quality on the ball.

I'll place the disclaimer on this that I've been drinking and only seen the guy place twice on ****ty web-streams.

I eagerly await a Dunphyesque reply: "he's a fullback, IF86!"

[SkStu]

tough tackling and driving runs from midfield, decent shot, good goal scorer and strong as an ox. Honestly, he reminds me of Roy Keane.

[Irish_Praha]

tough tackling and driving runs from midfield, decent shot, good goal scorer and strong as an ox. Honestly, he reminds me of Roy Keane.

OhOh, hope you haven't cursed him now!

[NeilMcD]

Yeah I think the Darren Fletcher comparison is fair. Not as tall or gangly as fletcher though

[Manc Irish Wolf]

Appears that McCarthy has been casting the net across the Irish sea again.

Anyone know much about this lad? Aaron McCarey from Monaghan - must be good if he's keeping in nets for the first team at 17?

http://www.wolves.co.uk/page/News/0,,10307~1807944,00.html

Wolves vs Sunderland on Sky on Sunday with a few Irish players on show for anyone who's interested.

[SkStu]

Appears that McCarthy has been casting the net across the Irish sea again.

Anyone know much about this lad? Aaron McCarey from Monaghan - must be good if he's keeping in nets for the first team at 17?

http://www.wolves.co.uk/page/News/0,,10307~1807944,00.html

Wolves vs Sunderland on Sky on Sunday with a few Irish players on show for anyone who's interested.

thread about McCarey in the LOI forum MIW.

[SkStu]

Doyle scores a nice goal from a rebound from an indirect free kick on the 6 yard line. Can only be described as a brilliant game though the referee has been shocking.

Doyle is a class act, at the heart of everything positive from Wolves.

Reid has shown a few nice touches for Sunderland but has been quiet overall.

[amaccann]

Say what you like about McCarty the manager, but you can't argue with his loyalty towards fellow Irish players; their quality can be a bit variable (but aren't all transfers?), but he shows genuine desire to pick up bargains.

Course it might all change with the new transfer rules ...

[EastTerracer]

5-2 to Sunderland was a bit flattering to be honest but the defending by both teams was suicidal at times. Wolves should have been ahead at half-time: Sunderland got a penalty that wasn't while Wolves were denied one that should have been.

Second half was chaotic but Wolves did well to get back level at 2-2 and then the mental defending started. Happy with Doyle and Keogh. Andy Reid had a better last 20 minutes.

[Stuttgart88]

Mancienne was eaten alive in the air by Jones for the third (or 4th?) goal. Unluckly deflection for the 5th. I think he may be a bit raw yet for the job facing Wolves & he looks physically slight. Wolves were the better team until Sunderland got the third. Even after their 4th Wolves could have scored a couple. I'd like to have seen Doyle stay on while that big beanpole came on. He was causing havoc and Doyle might have got on the end of something, whereas SEB had to play himself into the game.

Only sdaw second half. Was Wolves' Serbian midfielder playing? Didn't notice him.

Reid played some lovely passes, especially when the game was spread open.

[OwlsFan]

Strangely enough none of the "experts" or managers picked up on the fact that the Sunderland goalie should have been sent off when he deliberately handled a ball from a backpass to stop it going in to the goal. If that had been a defender on the line, it would have been a straight red!

Reid was the only one who could pick out a pass but he ran up a few blind alleys on occasions.

[irishfan86]

Strangely enough none of the "experts" or managers picked up on the fact that the Sunderland goalie should have been sent off when he deliberately handled a ball from a backpass to stop it going in to the goal. If that had been a defender on the line, it would have been a straight red!

Reid was the only one who could pick out a pass but he ran up a few blind alleys on occasions.

I don't know the letter of the law on this one, but in any match I've played, it's always been an indirect free kick where the ball is handled, and that's the only penalty.

Now if a goalkeeper handles the ball outside of his box, THEN it's a red.

Maybe an actual referee or someone who knows the rules better can clear things up?

[Eirambler]

Strangely enough none of the "experts" or managers picked up on the fact that the Sunderland goalie should have been sent off when he deliberately handled a ball from a backpass to stop it going in to the goal. If that had been a defender on the line, it would have been a straight red!

Reid was the only one who could pick out a pass but he ran up a few blind alleys on occasions.

That's because it is not a sending off offence when it comes to the goalie from a backpass and he handles it - theres a clause in the rule book that makes it different from other situations. It was covered on 5 live after the game.

[tetsujin1979]

Strangely enough none of the "experts" or managers picked up on the fact that the Sunderland goalie should have been sent off when he deliberately handled a ball from a backpass to stop it going in to the goal. If that had been a defender on the line, it would have been a straight red!It's an interesting anomaly alright, if he had caught it, would it have just been a back pass?
Say Robinson had picked up Gary Neville's OG against Croatia, instead of kicking it, would it have been a red card? It was a fairly innocuous pass, but on target, so a definite goal. Richardson's "pass" at the weekend was a better shot than he took for the rest of the game!

[Stuttgart88]

I was wondering the same but Graham Poll pointed out that there is a specific guideline to implementing the rule in this instance, and no card was the correct decision.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Thought this was a thread going to be about the Roma ultras group....

[topia]

Strangely enough none of the "experts" or managers picked up on the fact that the Sunderland goalie should have been sent off when he deliberately handled a ball from a backpass to stop it going in to the goal. If that had been a defender on the line, it would have been a straight red!

Reid was the only one who could pick out a pass but he ran up a few blind alleys on occasions.


intercepting a backpass is deemed as a different offence to deliberate handball and is not a red card offence

[Cymro]

Mancienne was eaten alive in the air by Jones for the third (or 4th?) goal. Unluckly deflection for the 5th. I think he may be a bit raw yet for the job facing Wolves & he looks physically slight. Wolves were the better team until Sunderland got the third. Even after their 4th Wolves could have scored a couple. I'd like to have seen Doyle stay on while that big beanpole came on. He was causing havoc and Doyle might have got on the end of something, whereas SEB had to play himself into the game.

Only sdaw second half. Was Wolves' Serbian midfielder playing? Didn't notice him.

Reid played some lovely passes, especially when the game was spread open.

I watched the game in full (well, bar the first 7 minutes or so). Scoreline was very harsh on Wolves who might feel they deserved a draw. Mancienne had a poor game all round and looked in trouble every time the ball was sent his way. I recall him playing for England's u-21s a few times and actually thought he did OK at that level so maybe he'll improve with time as he fills out a bit.

'That big beanpole', I presume you mean Maierhofer? To be honest I thought the decision to sub both Wolves strikers at that point was odd, I'd have gone 4-3-3 at that point. Of the two strikers, I thought Keogh had a better all-round game than Doyle although Doyle got the goal from the indirect free kick.

[SkStu]

i thought Doyle and Keogh were both superb actually. Dolye was all over the pitch and caused the Sunderland defence huge problems. Keogh and him have a good understanding built up already - maybe from their time together in the Irish squad.

[Stuttgart88]

'That big beanpole', I presume you mean Maierhofer? That's him - couldn't remember his name.

[OwlsFan]

intercepting a backpass is deemed as a different offence to deliberate handball and is not a red card offence

That may be so but there is no logic in the ruling. He stopped the ball from going in to the net by committing a foul. Must be a red card for any sort of consistency.

[geysir]

Stopping the ball going into the net? how would a ref know that? The ball could have been going wide or hit the post.

At a guess the logic comes from, that in the box the goalie was allowed to handle the ball under all circumstances before the back pass rule was introduced.
The point of the rule was to cut out all that negative play of passing back to the goalie.
In that, it has succeeded.
Is there a logical argument to making the punishment stricter should the goalie handle the ball?

[Stuttgart88]

I think Geysir is right. The purpose is to stop the negativity of persistent back passing & timewasting. Job done. The resulting indirect fandling a backpass is more than sufficient punishment.

A red card for something that only warrants an indirect free would be daft!

[OwlsFan]

Stopping the ball going into the net? how would a ref know that? The ball could have been going wide or hit the post.


He'd have to make a judgement like most things he has to make a judgement on. This one was obviously going in to the goal.

My argument is the principle is the same. Defender handles on the line to stop a ball going in: red card. Goalkeeper illegally handles the ball to stop the ball going in: no card at all. Daft!!

[Stuttgart88]

Not really, because a goalkeeper is usually legally able to handle the ball in the box, it's only illegal to cut out timewasting / negativity. If anything a goalkeeper handling the ball from a backpass actually spices things up a bit, which makes the rule work.

I see your point but the nuance is easy enough to see in my opinion.

[geysir]

If a nuance is easy to see, is it still a nuance?

[Stuttgart88]

Once it's been identified, I'd say yes.

[Manc Irish Wolf]

Thought I'd send an update after a vital 3 points down the Molineux on Saturday and in particular to highlight how well Stephen Ward is playing at the moment.

Having started the season brilliantly, his loss through injury was a bigger blow than anticipated and totally lost us our drive down the left flank. He changed the game against Birmingham with his hunger, drive and relentless running down the line and was absolutely exceptional on Saturday with three last minute bone crunching tackles which were timed to perfection in the box. In an era when the motivation and desire of players are regularly questioned, this Kid is an absolute breath of fresh air and is becoming universally loved by the fans for his regular 100% committed fighting performances. He is intelligent, passes the ball well, gets up the line and now knows how to defend - and is fast becoming the embodiment of a modern full back like Cole and Evra (both of whom also started out as Strikers). After moving there last year, I was worried that his lack of defensive experience could find him found out, but now am absolutely convinced that he is the natural successor to Killer and am really excited about the prospect of him and Coleman bombing down the flanks in the campaigns to come - a great feat for the League of Ireland also. Just so you don't think I'm watching him through green tinted glasses, I've attached a recent thread from a Wolves forum showing the appreciation.

http://www.molineuxmix.co.uk/vb/showthread.php?t=46079

With regards to the other players, Doyle is playing absolutely immense at the moment. He barely wasted a ball yesterday, his control was brilliant and his running with the ball appears to be improving with every game. He's unfortunately not getting the breaks in terms of chances at goal (which are few and far between), however Ebanks Blake is paling into insignificance next to him at the moment and I wouldn't be surprised to see him playing up front on his own against Spurs and Man U in our next two away games.

Keogh has been on the bench to accommodate SEB for the last couple of games, but many fans want him to be recalled as his intelligent movement, runs into the corners and link-up play was creating a lot more space and helped bring the midfield into the game more. Also his non-stop running would definitely offer us more than SEB at the minute who is simply waiting for the ball to arrive at him. I would personally love to see him moved on to the right of a 5 man midfield next week to come inside and support Doyle, who seems to play better with him.

Foley is still not fully fit and has been on the bench for the last couple of games. The majority of fans want him straight back in. Would love to see him playing to see how he gets on. Potential questionmarks over his lack of height, but he was our player of the season last year and I am confident he will acquit himself well.

Mick is back in favour after the three points with the players off to Dublin after the game for their Christmas Party. After a mid-season break in Wexford it's quality to hear that the players are back over to Ireland and is obviously an indication of the influence that the Irish Players are having at the club.

As for the opposition, I definitely think we should approach Gary Cahill again as he'd be a great addition to our squad. He looked a very imposing figure and was quality at the back for them. Think Andy O'Brien was playing as well (don't generally pay too much attention to the opposition) but didn't really notice him if he was and he is yesterdays news anyway.

[irishfan86]

Great report as usual MIW. I was impressed with Ward as well, and definitely want to see him tried at left-back in friendlies with a view to starting there for us eventually.

Andy O'Brien did play, but not very well. The commentators were all over him, and said he was doing everything wrong. I think they were a bit harsh, but it was certainly a poor performance.

[an_ceannaire]

See MOTD 2 last night?
Seems Mick has lost the fans :(

[twoenz]

See MOTD 2 last night?
Seems Mick has lost the fans :(



There was a guy on 606 last weekend giving it loads about how much Mick was frustrating the fans: the main thing that they wanted was Keogh back in the team instead of SEB.

It was a good result the other day, otherwise they were looking at freefall over Christmas.

[irishfan86]

Mick received heavy criticism for playing Keogh last season, and now he's receiving heavy criticism for leaving him out. Wolves supporters are some of the most fickle in England. McCarthy is a good manager, let him get on with things.

[Murfinator]

Keogh is a clever player who I think could adapt to the premiership, he impressed a lot of people early in the season with his performances.

I think SEB is the typical direct, no nonsense kind of striker that'll tear weaker defences to pieces far better than someone like Keogh would but his lack of guile makes it easy for any defence worth their salt to contain him. A bit like David Connoly!

[irishfan86]

Yeah I'd agree with that Murf. 1 on 1 with the keeper you'd take SEB every time, but in a tight game or a counter-attacking situation I'd favour Keogh's work-rate and guile.

At the same time SEB played a big part in getting Wolves to the Premier League and Mick will be loathe to drop him, which I can respect.

[Colbert Report]

Wolves are going to be in tough to stay up thsi season. I've watched their last two matches in their entirety (away to Liverpool and home to Manchester City). They were played off the park over the last thirty minutes of both matches. Doesn't look like a good move for Kevin Doyle, one of our better players. The others, like Foley, Ward, and Keogh are marginal players at best and likely won't ever have any meaningful impact at the international level anyway. They're a bit of a joke at this level - they just don't have the stamina to run with the pack over the last twenty-thirty minutes of matches. Relegation is a certainty.

[Colbert Report]

I just watched Manchester City string together no less than forty-two straight passes. The commentator referred to it as "embarassing". Humiliating is more like it. What a terrible team. It is too bad that so many of our players are stuck at this club.

[Razors left peg]

I just watched Manchester City string together no less than forty-two straight passes. The commentator referred to it as "embarassing". Humiliating is more like it. What a terrible team. It is too bad that so many of our players are stuck at this club.

Wolves played very well until the 2nd goal went in

[Colbert Report]

Wolves played very well until the 2nd goal went in

Yeah, they usually play well until the 60 minute mark or so. Then they tire and get eaten alive in the last half an hour of matches.

[drummerboy]

Yeah, they usually play well until the 60 minute mark or so. Then they tire and get eaten alive in the last half an hour of matches.

Rubbish. They won three of their last five games before this one.

[Magicme]

Will be interesting to see how quickly Aaron McCarey gets thrown into the mix over there. He is already sitting in the seats behind the bench and wearing a suit and being very much part of the first team set up even though he doesnt officially become a wolves player until a few weeks from now.

[noddy102]

I just watched Manchester City string together no less than forty-two straight passes. The commentator referred to it as "embarassing". Humiliating is more like it. What a terrible team. It is too bad that so many of our players are stuck at this club.

You're "embarassing" to this forum.

McCarthy has the team playing some decent football, and both Doyle and Foley looked very effective last night.

The fact they were up against a team with far superior individuals who are now playing as a team with the introduction of Mancini, made it very difficult for Wolves to compete last night. Yet they were right in the game, until Mancini shaked things up bringing on Garrido to tighten things up for City.