Shane Duffy D Norwich b.1992

[Diggs246]

Correct! St Mirren and Bulgaria two terrible teams

[seanfhear]

Look at the state of that defending..
I don’t think St Mirren knew that Duffy had signed for Celtic yet ! !

[youngirish]

Look at the state of that defending..

Maybe a late stage career transition to a striker is in order. We can play him as the big target man upfront with Obafemi or Connolly feeding off him. Added bonus, we don't have to worry about his distribution from the back anymore.

[geysir]

he's (Lennon) shopping in the bargain aisle most of the time, it's EPL reserves and unknown punts from around Europe that are being brought in,
And isn't that where Shane Duffy comes into Celtic's picture? he's available to play for Celtic because he's not good enough to play for a bottom team in the EPL.
Even Ajer is a much better footballer than him, but Duffy in a sweeper type role adds the much needed grit to allow Celtic play (in theory) a 3 5 2.

Just how deluded are irish fans about the versatile football talents of some of our central defenders?
Gary Breen's delusion is that he thinks Duffy would be playing in the EPL, even though no team wants him.
Therefore Duffy, instead of benchwarming some EPL club, will pick all those bad habits that VVD supposedly did at Celtic, bad habits that Gary diligently noticed VVD did not have at Groningen.
Such a perfect talent at Groningen that no other Eredevisie club wanted him :rolleyes:. And then all of sudden after VVD exited Celtic, he cleaned up most of the accumulated bad Celtic habits after a few games in the EPL and became Southampton's player of the year in his first season there.
And to think some irish fans swallow that, hook line and sinker.

[elatedscum]

And isn't that where Shane Duffy comes into Celtic's picture? he's available to play for Celtic because he's not good enough to play for a bottom team in the EPL.
Even Ajer is a much better footballer than him, but Duffy in a sweeper type role adds the much needed grit to allow Celtic play (in theory) a 3 5 2.

Just how deluded are irish fans about the versatile football talents of some of our central defenders?
Gary Breen's delusion is that he thinks Duffy would be playing in the EPL, even though no team wants him.

West Ham wanted him and he had a choice as to where to go. Shane Duffy was available to Celtic because Duffy was a huge Celtic fan and more importantly, his father was a huge Celtic fan and with his death, it’s something Shane wanted to do.

[SkStu]

Maybe a late stage career transition to a striker is in order. We can play him as the big target man upfront with Obafemi or Connolly feeding off him. Added bonus, we don't have to worry about his distribution from the back anymore.

We've been crying out for a new Gary Doherty for years. Then it lands on your lap.

[youngirish]

We've been crying out for a new Gary Doherty for years. Then it lands on your lap.

Which modern International team worth their salt is not crying out for a new Gary Doherty?

[DeLorean]

Oh dear.

[Stuttgart88]

Joking aside, Germany had an absolutely rubbish 2018 WC, embarassingly bad. But count back how many easy headed chances they missed at key moments in key games, from 6-10 yards in front of goal (Gomez and Hummels key culprits I think). Had any of them gone in they'd have been game changers. We're not even talking about having a Klose or even Andy Carroll here. Doc would have done the job, no problem. Although my ability to recall football facts or opinions has diminished massively in recent years I am almost sure I commented at the time that despite Germany's apparent decline, there was nothing wrong that a good old fashioned 9 wouldn't have proved a short term fix for.

[DeLorean]

Duffy on speaking to Kenny about the move and Breen's comments - https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/soccer/arid-40050707.html

[youngirish]

Joking aside, Germany had an absolutely rubbish 2018 WC, embarassingly bad. But count back how many easy headed chances they missed at key moments in key games, from 6-10 yards in front of goal (Gomez and Hummels key culprits I think). Had any of them gone in they'd have been game changers. We're not even talking about having a Klose or even Andy Carroll here. Doc would have done the job, no problem. Although my ability to recall football facts or opinions has diminished massively in recent years I am almost sure I commented at the time that despite Germany's apparent decline, there was nothing wrong that a good old fashioned 9 wouldn't have proved a short term fix for.

I'm all for a big, strong target man up front. They cause chaos around the opposition's penalty box. However they have to be decent with the ball at their feet and be able to play a bit like Quinn and Crouch. Wasn't Doherty more in the Tony Cascarino, Carsten Jancker mould? I remember watching Cascarino in a World Cup qualifier at Lansdowne Road, prior to the 1990 World Cup and it seemed that every time the ball came to his feet he either knocked it out of play or fell over it.

[elatedscum]

Motherwell drawing with Colraine after 90 mins tonight. Speaks volumes about the SPL

[Eirambler]

Motherwell drawing with Colraine after 90 mins tonight. Speaks volumes about the SPL

And they're one of the better sides - finished third last season.

[Trequartista20]

They're struggling this season though.

[seanfhear]

Duffy was pretty bad in a very bad Celtic performance losing 2-0 to Rangers at Celtic Park.

I watched some of it. Duffy put some long balls out of play ~ at least 3 in the time I was looking at it. He also played the Rangers scorer onside by dropping back marginally too soon on a free kick. A bit unlucky (maybe ) on the second goal as he blocked it but it fell opportune for the scorer.

Very Very Very Poor from Celtic and Duffy was also very poor in the game.

[Bielsa´s irish]

Duffy was pretty bad in a very bad Celtic performance losing 2-0 to Rangers at Celtic Park.

I watched some of it. Duffy put some long balls out of play ~ at least 3 in the time I was looking at it. He also played the Rangers scorer onside by dropping back marginally too soon on a free kick. A bit unlucky (maybe ) on the second goal as he blocked it but it fell opportune for the scorer.

Very Very Very Poor from Celtic and Duffy was also very poor in the game.

2nd wsnt his fault at all,
Actually he blocked the sure goal, and the blonde dude next to him just stays there like an idiot, dont know his name is, but didnt help on the second ball. Lee oconnor should play for the celts

[Stuttgart88]

As full back? Jeremie Frimpong is a super player. He had his first poor game for Celtic in Saturday. The whole team were brutal.

[tetsujin1979]

Think Lennon was prioritising the Europa League game against Milan on Thursday. Celtic aren't in a bad position, four points behind Rangers with a game in hand, and that was the worst they've played this season, so they can only improve from that performance.

[Stuttgart88]

Hmm, not prioritrising an Old Firm game sounds a bit fanciful to me!

Duffy was poor no doubt, especially his long passing, but Celtic reminded me of Ireland a bit. Celtic CBs would have the ball and any of the accomplished ball users would run away.

[seanfhear]

Hmm, not prioritrising an Old Firm game sounds a bit fanciful to me!

Duffy was poor no doubt, especially his long passing, but Celtic reminded me of Ireland a bit. Celtic CBs would have the ball and any of the accomplished ball users would run away.Especially in the year of the Possible Magic 10 or anytime for that matter.

Celtic were bad ~ ~ I’d rechecking that team for a virus if they were a Stable of Horses ?

[DCWA]

Lennon was not prioritising the Milan game. He was without Edouard, Forrest and Christie (the latter two more important than the former) as well as a few others. He considered Ajeti and Griffiths not fit to start.

That being said it was an abysmal performance all round, not many Celtic fans will be surprised by that. Essentially every performance since the start of the new season has had major flaws (that is putting it politely) and this was coming.

Duffy was very poor, surprising as he has played in big games against much superior players than the Rangers front men and coped perfectly well so I wouldn’t be alarmed on an individual basis, it was part of an all round pathetically poor team performance which was the fault yet again of a very, very poor manager.

[Eirambler]

There's no way he sacrifices that game for Milan, absolutely no chance. For me Lennon was showing, once again, that he has no gameplan whatsoever beyond getting as many of his better players on the pitch as often as possible. To me it looked like once he couldn't pick his best 11 or close to it he had no idea what to do - his demeanour throughout the game was of someone who had given up on it as soon as the first goal went in.

He never rotates the team, partly because he doesn't have faith in the squad players but also because he doesn't know how to develop or improve them or fit them in to any kind of coherent game plan. Basically for him it's just a case of getting the 11 best players on the pitch week after week with the same two or three subs and hoping they can produce enough individual moments to win games and titles. He can get away with this when Celtic are unchallenged in the league, as they have been up to now, it was a similar story when he managed Hibs in the division below, they were miles better than everyone else that season so it was easy. However, with Hibs and also Bolton, he has shown that once he comes up against teams of similar abilities he cannot adapt - Bolton were relegated and he had Hibs, with the fourth biggest budget in the league that season down in eighth in the table by the time they removed him.

Basically there's no bigger picture here, he's just a crap manager.

[DCWA]

There's no way he sacrifices that game for Milan, absolutely no chance. For me Lennon was showing, once again, that he has no gameplan whatsoever beyond getting as many of his better players on the pitch as often as possible. To me it looked like once he couldn't pick his best 11 or close to it he had no idea what to do - his demeanour throughout the game was of someone who had given up on it as soon as the first goal went in.

He never rotates the team, partly because he doesn't have faith in the squad players but also because he doesn't know how to develop or improve them or fit them in to any kind of coherent game plan. Basically for him it's just a case of getting the 11 best players on the pitch week after week with the same two or three subs and hoping they can produce enough individual moments to win games and titles. He can get away with this when Celtic are unchallenged in the league, as they have been up to now, it was a similar story when he managed Hibs in the division below, they were miles better than everyone else that season so it was easy. However, with Hibs and also Bolton, he has shown that once he comes up against teams of similar abilities he cannot adapt - Bolton were relegated and he had Hibs, with the fourth biggest budget in the league that season down in eighth in the table by the time they removed him.

Basically there's no bigger picture here, he's just a crap manager.


I think that is all absolutely spot on.

[Charlie Darwin]

Lennon's teams are at their best against superior teams. Rangers are not that. Wouldn't be surprised if they got a better result out of Milan than Rangers.

[seanfhear]

There's no way he sacrifices that game for Milan, absolutely no chance. For me Lennon was showing, once again, that he has no gameplan whatsoever beyond getting as many of his better players on the pitch as often as possible. To me it looked like once he couldn't pick his best 11 or close to it he had no idea what to do - his demeanour throughout the game was of someone who had given up on it as soon as the first goal went in.

He never rotates the team, partly because he doesn't have faith in the squad players but also because he doesn't know how to develop or improve them or fit them in to any kind of coherent game plan. Basically for him it's just a case of getting the 11 best players on the pitch week after week with the same two or three subs and hoping they can produce enough individual moments to win games and titles. He can get away with this when Celtic are unchallenged in the league, as they have been up to now, it was a similar story when he managed Hibs in the division below, they were miles better than everyone else that season so it was easy. However, with Hibs and also Bolton, he has shown that once he comes up against teams of similar abilities he cannot adapt - Bolton were relegated and he had Hibs, with the fourth biggest budget in the league that season down in eighth in the table by the time they removed him.

Basically there's no bigger picture here, he's just a crap manager.
You’d think these managers that are not the best tacticians would always have an eye out for the best coaches. Some fellas are happy being coaches and don’t want to be manager so you’d think that Lennon would get good / great coaches around him , ones that don’t want to be managers.

[Eirambler]

There certainly have been rumours that Damien Duff was doing a lot of the heavy lifting on the coaching side and his loss has been felt at the club.

[seanfhear]

There certainly have been rumours that Damien Duff was doing a lot of the heavy lifting on the coaching side and his loss has been felt at the club.
When you think of it after the leaving Celtic, the only offer Lennon got, was to go to a fairly bonkers Bolton Club. So its not as if many Clubs were thinking that Neil Lennon fella is a Great Manager.

Was Martin O’ Neill the same manager without John Robertson ? Results would say ~ no way. Some of these fellas need good coaches / tacticians around them and they and the clubs they are working for should bite the bullet and accept that.

Roy Keane needed good coaches and tacticians around him. Even from his punditry alone you can tell he is no tactical genius !

[paul_oshea]

There's no way he sacrifices that game for Milan, absolutely no chance. For me Lennon was showing, once again, that he has no gameplan whatsoever beyond getting as many of his better players on the pitch as often as possible. To me it looked like once he couldn't pick his best 11 or close to it he had no idea what to do - his demeanour throughout the game was of someone who had given up on it as soon as the first goal went in.
.

Sorry for hijacking this thread but I remember watching united under ferguson in Europe and trying to say the same to people and no one seeing what i was saying, but this last sentence was often the case, take for example the Barca game at wembley. He didnt change it up when it was clear things were not going well and just looked like a man who had given up before it had properly got started.

[Stuttgart88]

Lennon's body language was just dreadful on Saturday.

[EAFC_rdfl]

Sorry for hijacking this thread but I remember watching united under ferguson in Europe and trying to say the same to people and no one seeing what i was saying, but this last sentence was often the case, take for example the Barca game at wembley. He didnt change it up when it was clear things were not going well and just looked like a man who had given up before it had properly got started.

It must be a real pain in the ass to be head and shoulders above all of these inept football people

[paul_oshea]

It must be a real pain in the ass to be head and shoulders above all of these inept football people

Actually never saw it like that, but you've made a valid point - for which i liked it. I thought perhaps i hadnt articulated my point well enough. :lightbulb:

[tetsujin1979]

I, for one, wake every day happy in the knowledge that I am in the presence of the one person who saw things were not going well for Manchester United in the Champions League against Barcelona at Wembley. The game where United were never in front, Barcelona took the lead in under half an hour, had 2/3 of the possession in the first half, and had more shots on target in the first half than their opponents had in the whole game.
What insight.

[seanfhear]

I, for one, wake every day happy in the knowledge that I am in the presence of the one person who saw things were not going well for Manchester United in the Champions League against Barcelona at Wembley. The game where United were never in front, Barcelona took the lead in under half an hour, had 2/3 of the possession in the first half, and had more shots on target in the first half than their opponents had in the whole game.
What insight.Have you ever considered football management ?

[DCWA]

For all the talk on here about Ireland being best suited to a back 3 it is clear that Duffy, our stand in captain and essentially guaranteed starter really, really struggles with it.

He was poor throughout tonight and I believe he is absolutely knackered but he did improve massively second half when Celtic changed to a back 4.

It may put paid to the talk that our players are perfectly suited to it, this may be the case only on paper.

[DCWA]

The main positive() for me over the 5 games consistently was how we looked defensively bar a couple of stupid mistakes here or there which I don't think are symptoms of the system.
So I want to see them against a strong top tier footballing side. I don't think it matters who we play at this stage scoring is going to be an issue for us, so let's test ourselves against a proper nation. If ireland come out without conceding against England it will be seen as a good result and a positive for Kenny.

That's forgetting about the whole base and logistical sense it makes from a non-footballing side too due to covid. I do feel Kenny probably didn't want England at this early point though.

Wrong thread perhaps?

[Stuttgart88]

For all the talk on here about Ireland being best suited to a back 3 it is clear that Duffy, our stand in captain and essentially guaranteed starter really, really struggles with it.

He was poor throughout tonight and I believe he is absolutely knackered but he did improve massively second half when Celtic changed to a back 4.

It may put paid to the talk that our players are perfectly suited to it, this may be the case only on paper.Ditto, was thinking exactly the same last night.

I think McGregor did Duffy no favours for the second goal tbf, he clearly got in Duffy's way, but Duffy was caught unaware for the late sucker punch. But individual incidents aside, Duffy just looked more comfortable in the second half.

If I may digress to a broader Celtic duiscussion, I wonder will last night be a bit of a turning point / Eureka moment. Reverting to 4 at the back and including a creative player like Rogic in an advanced position seems to suit the team much better. Of course this may mean Duffy drops out if Julien returns. Anyway, Celtic really need to make a statement at Aberdeen this weekend.

[DCWA]

Yeah McGregor was well intentioned but got in his way prevented Duffy getting across to possibly make the block.

You would think Lennon has to see now that it must be a back 4. He only has 3 genuine centre backs anyway can’t flog them so hard over a long campaign that they play every game. Duffy could do with some rotation so I wouldn’t have concerns about Jullien returning.

[Fixer82]

A back 3/5 of O'Shea, Duffy and Egan with Stevens and Doherty as wing backs is very appealing. Requires a lot of running back from Doherty in particular though who I don't think is very used to that.

[DCWA]

I think a back 3/5 has to have Duffy dropped he looks so so uncomfortable with it that even at club level with every day training on it I can’t see it ever working for him never mind for the national team. I must say I think it looks the part on paper but that it just won’t work I also don’t think we have the midfielders to carry the system but that irrelevant to this discussion, what is clear as day is that it does not work for Shane Duffy he is like a fish out of water as part of a 3.

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

I think a back 3/5 has to have Duffy dropped he looks so so uncomfortable with it that even at club level with every day training on it I can’t see it ever working for him never mind for the national team. I must say I think it looks the part on paper but that it just won’t work I also don’t think we have the midfielders to carry the system but that irrelevant to this discussion, what is clear as day is that it does not work for Shane Duffy he is like a fish out of water as part of a 3.

Maybe he doesn't suit the centre of a back 3. Egan plays that role week in week out. Duffy may be more comfortable on the right. He didn't look too comfortable in a back 4 with Ireland against weak enough opposition in Kenny's first few games. He was exposed late on last night when Celtic had 4 at the back. It could be a case that Duffy can be a bit loose no matter what formation he's in and needs more midfield protection. I don't think we can be certain one way or the other at the moment.

[DCWA]

Maybe he doesn't suit the centre of a back 3. Egan plays that role week in week out. Duffy may be more comfortable on the right. He didn't look too comfortable in a back 4 with Ireland against weak enough opposition in Kenny's first few games. He was exposed late on last night when Celtic had 4 at the back. It could be a case that Duffy can be a bit loose no matter what formation he's in and needs more midfield protection. I don't think we can be certain one way or the other at the moment.

Can’t disagree with most of that. I am willing to write off the late 3rd last night as simply chasing the game. Of course there are other variable that could’ve been the reason for his struggles, Matt Doherty or Seamus Coleman would certainly offer more protection that Jeremie Frimpong and Scott Brown who would be the primary midfielder protector is past it (although I don’t think Ireland have anyone greatly suited to this either).

So I admit there are no certainties but my strong feeling is that it just won’t work for him.

[geysir]

My 2c+ opinion is apart from Welsh's and Duffy's deficiencies, that back 3 were also exposed because Celtic (like us) were weak in midfield.
Ntcham was wandering about, then decidely not bothering to run with the first goalscorer Krunic, who ran through an acre of space and got between the 2 CHs to head the first goal. Brown was a passenger rather than the midfield enforcer, as soon he was replaced things improved further.
I think we have the same but different midfield deficiencies which mitigate against us using the 3 at the back, 2 will do with a more solid cm

[geysir]

Ironic, that despite the high pitched whiny wailings from some deluded, other self appointed experts of the game, about Duffy's loan move north to Celtic, that due to the lower standard of the EPL he would become a glue trap for sloppy mistakes, which would become part and parcel of his game, therefore Ireland would suffer even greater ignominy in future.

News flash to those people, Duffy ain't even up the SPL standard of defending, some 99.99% of Celtic fans would probably swap him for Rafael Schidt.
Personally I wouldn't, but I can understand if people in their current state of deep despair would opine that even Schidt's defensive air wafted a bit cleaner.

[Bielsa´s irish]

Can’t disagree with most of that. I am willing to write off the late 3rd last night as simply chasing the game. Of course there are other variable that could’ve been the reason for his struggles, Matt Doherty or Seamus Coleman would certainly offer more protection that Jeremie Frimpong and Scott Brown who would be the primary midfielder protector is past it (although I don’t think Ireland have anyone greatly suited to this either).

So I admit there are no certainties but my strong feeling is that it just won’t work for him.

agree in a back 3 on the right or left of the sweeper Egan

[youngirish]

Ironic, that despite the high pitched whiny wailings from some deluded, other self appointed experts of the game, about Duffy's loan move north to Celtic, that due to the lower standard of the EPL he would become a glue trap for sloppy mistakes, which would become part and parcel of his game, therefore Ireland would suffer even greater ignominy in future.

News flash to those people, Duffy ain't even up the SPL standard of defending, some 99.99% of Celtic fans would probably swap him for Rafael Schidt.
Personally I wouldn't, but I can understand if people in their current state of deep despair would opine that even Schidt's defensive air wafted a bit cleaner.

Yet he has made a decent career for himself playing for teams at either the top end of the Championship or lower reaches of the Premiership. Even ignoring the Premiership most of the teams he would have faced in the Championship would have better strikers than the majority of teams in the SPL. The top teams I would argue would have better strikers than any in the SPL.

Maybe he has just gone to the dogs over the last year or so.

[paul_oshea]

Ironic, that despite the high pitched whiny wailings from some deluded, other self appointed experts of the game, about Duffy's loan move north to Celtic, that due to the lower standard of the EPL he would become a glue trap for sloppy mistakes, which would become part and parcel of his game, therefore Ireland would suffer even greater ignominy in future.




You've become very introspective during lockdown

[jbyrne]

News flash to those people, Duffy ain't even up the SPL standard of defending, some 99.99% of Celtic fans would probably swap him for Rafael Schidt.

wow.. not even 10 apearances into his celtic career yet they have written him off. his first few appearances were very decent even chipping in with a couple of goals.

duffy has nothing to prove to such fans after performing very well for us over the years facing far better than the spl has to offer. its a poor celtic team he has joined with dreadful organisation and shape

[seanfhear]

Why did Celtic bring back Neil Lennon from football management death ? ?

[CraftyToePoke]

Why did Celtic bring back Neil Lennon from football management death ? ?

Same reason we brought MickMack back ? The faraway fuzzy glow of past glories seanfhear :)

[seanfhear]

Same reason we brought MickMack back ? The faraway fuzzy glow of past glories seanfhear :)
Aaaarrrgghhh !