Spurs/Arsenal Champions League Spot?

[Stuttgart88]

My preference is for the CL winner to come out of the game tonight, leaves open a higher possibility of more Irish players in the CL group stage next season with Celtic and SpursWhat's the status with Celtic?

[Karlos]

Good aul Arsene, how quickly he forgets....
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/a/arsenal/4523051.stm

Interesting spin. No need for me to comment on this, anyone can google the other 501 Wenger comments on his thinking on Champions League football. Maybe you'll post them up too :)

.

[sligoman]

What a ball of ****e game that was last night. Arsenal are gonna get trounced by Barca in the final. Useless altogether. Over the two legs, Villareal deserved it because Arsenal were terrible in El Madrigal.

[Roadend]

Interesting spin. No need for me to comment on this, anyone can google the other 501 Wenger comments on his thinking on Champions League football. Maybe you'll post them up too :)

.
Spin? Arsene's words, though he's always had double standards.

[NeilMcD]

THe problem with being a manager is that you are asked to comment on so many things and the ability to search quotes from a manager will come back to haunt any manager. I think if all our quotes were taken on certain issues we would all be contradicting ourselves at some point or another. Sam Shepherd said the place to be is smack bang in the middle of a contradiction so in that case Wenger is where its at.


Poor game last night and Villareal deserved a goal on the run of play but their finishing was poor. Ironically enough they were rubbish for the last 20 mins I thought and the penalty came out of the blue. It wasnt a penalty either. I have to admit I cheered when it was given and shouted at the tv when it was saved. I am praying Barc get to the final and the final is a 5 goal thriller with Barca winning.

[NeilMcD]

Why Arsenal came good in Europe
By Paul Fletcher


So Arsenal will contest their first Champions League final at the Stade de France in Paris on 17 May.

It has been a triumphant and, for many, unexpected season of success in the competition for Arsene Wenger's team.

But has Arsenal's route to the final been more about the right breaks at the right time or Wenger's new Gunners coming good?



TEN CLEAN SHEETS
There is no doubt that 10 consecutive clean sheets is a key reason why Arsenal have reached the final.

Arsenal's goal has not been breached since Markus Rosenberg scored for Ajax on 27 September.

It is a Champions League record and Jens Lehmann must take his share of the credit.

The German's late penalty save at Villarreal on Tuesday preserved Arsenal's slender 1-0 aggregate lead - and Lehmann has been superb behind an inexperienced defence throughout the competition.


Lehmann was superb against Villarreal

Last season he was dropped by Arsene Wenger, who claimed he was not sure whether Lehmann or Manuel Almunia was his first choice goalkeeper.

This campaign there has been no doubt as to Lehamnn's status - with his form also leading Germany coach Jurgen Klinsmann to name him as his country's number one for the World Cup.

In the absence of Sol Campbell, Kolo Toure has also matured into the lynchpin at the centre of Arsenal's defence.

The Ivorian has been monumental in Europe, dominating forwards with his pace, strength and determination - and scoring the goal that beat Villarreal.

Mention must also be made of Brazilian midfielder Gilberto Silva.

He was superb in Villarreal on Tuesday and his defensive midfield displays have negated the loss of Partick Vieira - a considerable achievement.


THE YOUNG BREED
If Gilberto's performances mean that Vieira has not been missed as a defensive midfielder, then the same could be said of Cesc Fabregas with regard to Arsenal's creative capabilities.

The 18-year-old Spaniard might have found himself bullied at times in the Premiership but he has illuminated Europe.


Eboue has brought energy and verve to the Arsenal team

With his touch, vision and passing he has been the conduit through which Arsenal's attacking game has flowed.

He has outshone some of Europe's most highly-regarded midfield players, none more so than Vieira, his former midfield mentor.

Then there is the defence.

Arsenal have reached the final after playing most of the competition without Ashley Cole and Lauren - their first-choice full-backs.

Mathieu Flamini, 22, has proved to be an extremely capable left-back while Emmanuel Eboue, also 22 and brought to the club from Beveren in January 2005, has been sensational.

His incredible bursts forward have epitomised the energy and enthusiasm of Arsenal's campaign.

Central defender Phillipe Senderos was heavily criticised earlier in the season after struggling to cope with the physicality of Chelsea's Didier Drogba.

But Wenger stuck with the 22-year-old Swiss international and his loyalty has been rewarded with a series of consistent displays in Europe.

Wenger would never have chosen to go through the latter stages of the competition without so many first-choice defenders.

But the quality of the younger players at the club speaks for itself and Wenger must take credit not only for their purchase but guiding them through through to the final.


THE RIGHT DRAW
Arsenal defeated Real Madrid, Juventus and Villarreal in the knockout stages of the competition.

Real might be one of the giants of the game but they are a pale shadow of the team that defeated Manchester United in a thrilling Champions League quarter-final in 2003.

They have not picked up any silverware since they won the Spanish league that same year and looked liked an ageing team when compared against the verve and spirit of Wenger's young side.


Arsenal brought Real Madrid to their knees

Juventus went into their tie with the Gunners as runaway leaders of Serie A and have still only lost one match this season in the Italian league.

But Fabio Capello's team are, like Real, a team with several players on the wrong side of 30.

Over the last two months Juve have run out of steam, having lost two and drawn seven of their last nine fixtures.

Their seemingly insurmoutable lead at the top of Serie A is now just three points.

Villarreal, though impressive in the competition this year, are about as modest a side as one could hope to play in a Champions League semi-final.

The draw for the group stage was kind as well, pitting Arsenal against Ajax, Sparta Prague and FC Thun.

Wenger said on Tuesday evening that Arsenal have deservedly reached the final - and only the foolish would argue with him - but they could certainly have done a lot worse with the luck of the draw.


IT'S THEIR TURN
Up until now Arsenal have been a disappointment in the Champions League, with a quarter-final finish in 2004 their best finish prior to this season.


Wenger has guided his side to the final

But a team as good as Arsenal, managed by such a capable coach as Wenger, are bound to come good eventually.

Many did not think it would be this year - and Arsenal's inexperience has certainly been a handicap in the Premiership.

Wenger's team have been found wanting physically at times in the league, particularly away from home, but the more refined conditions of the Champions League have allowed Arsenal to develop and prosper.

Combine with that the odd lucky break that every team needs to win a cup competition - Raul hitting the post at Highbury perhaps, or Riquelme failing from the penalty spot - and it might just be that Arsenal's name is on the cup.

[NeilMcD]

What's the status with Celtic?


My understanding is that Celtic will have to pre qualify if Arsenal win the Champions League. If Barca or Milan win it they will go automatically in to the Final. So any Irish support should support the winners of tonights game in the Final in Paris.

Mc Geady
Reid
Kelly
Keane

could all be playing Champions League football next season if Arsenal do not win the final.

[geysir]

My understanding is that Celtic will have to pre qualify if Arsenal win the Champions League. If Barca or Milan win it they will go automatically in to the Final. So any Irish support should support the winners of tonights game in the Final in Paris.
Mc Geady
Reid
Kelly
Keane
could all be playing Champions League football next season if Arsenal do not win the final.
Exactly Neil, put like that its simply our patriotic duty to support the winners of tonights game.

[Stuttgart88]

Will Reid & Kelly still be at Spurs next year?

McGeady's glaring miss in Bratislava cost Celtic a place in this year's CL. Remember?

[NeilMcD]

I think it was losing 5-0 that cost them to be honest. Blaming it all on Mc Geady is harsh.

Not sure about Reid and Kelly but I think there is more chance of Irish involvment at Spurs rather than at Arsenal.

[Stuttgart88]

I think it was losing 5-0 that cost them to be honest. Blaming it all on Mc Geady is harsh.
Of course it is, but don't you remember? It was a total SITTER. Even a 5-1 defeat would have been enough in hindsight and losing 2-1 or 3-1 or whatever would have been far more likely.

Would normally agree about supporting the Irish angle but I'm an Arsenal fan. Generally I like to see Robbie do well, even if it is against Arsenal though.

Somehow I doubt Geysir is being as patriotic as he sounds. If Arsenal were playing the devil's own select XI I suspect he'd support the latter :)

[sligoman]

Mc Geady
Reid
Kelly
Keane

could all be playing Champions League football next season if Arsenal do not win the final.You forgot the other Keane;).(that's presuming he stays on for another season)

[Stuttgart88]

I couldn't stop watching Ken Doherty at the snooker, gripping stuffCurrently 10-9 up I think. I saw him in Ranelagh a few years ago in a silver BMW with the personalised reg "K 4 KEN". Classy.

[NeilMcD]

I didnt forget Roy Keane. He is not an Irish International so he would not have been relevant to my point.

[geysir]

Somehow I doubt Geysir is being as patriotic as he sounds. If Arsenal were playing the devil's own select XI I suspect he'd support the latter :)
Firstly one Awsenal fan questions my objectivity then another questions my patriotism. There is a common denomenator there somewhere, I'll get back to you when I figure it out.

[jebus]

Exactly Neil, put like that its simply our patriotic duty to support the winners of tonights game.


And since when do I, as an Irishman, have to give my support to a team that,

a) comes from Scotland
b) I don't support
and, most importantly
c) are sh!t

:confused:

[geysir]

Thats some twist of logic there Jebus
Barcelona from Scotland? I thought they were Portugese.

[Karlos]

What a ball of ****e game that was last night. Arsenal are gonna get trounced by Barca in the final. Useless altogether. Over the two legs, Villareal deserved it because Arsenal were terrible in El Madrigal.


This is great stuff! Neutality at it's very best! :) :D

I hope it all goes to plan for ya Sligoman or it could be a very long summer!

Can't remember who it was but someone made a similar bold statement on Arsenal getting trounced in the FA Cup Final last year! They were right but the pot was still going to North London! more of the same, please!

50/50 game, Barcelona are a good team but way over hyped at times imo. It's there for the winning for both. Plenty for Arsenal to exploit on tonight's viewing of Barca in my opinion.

Great to see two footballing sides who play the game with an air of grace and a spirit of fair play go head to head!! hee hee! :)

[sligoman]

Great to see two footballing sides who play the game with an air of grace and a spirit of fair play go head to head!! hee hee! :)Yeah, Arsenal certianly played like that last night alright:rolleyes:.

[Karlos]

Spin? Arsene's words, though he's always had double standards.

Maybe I'm missing your point here if that's what the one liner below is? Where is the double standard? :confused:



Good aul Arsene, how quickly he forgets....

How quickly he forgets what? There's nothing in those quotes that he hasn't been saying for years now. Where has he said anything different? What has he forgotten?

"Normally they should not have played in this cup. They are lucky to be in it because of the advantage this country has in having four qualifying places. Most countries have only three."

Of course it should be noted that Arsenal are in this year's final becuase they finished 2nd last year but even Wenger will tell you (if you google hard enough) that 2nd place really shouldn't be in it either.


"The European Cup has been a complete cup competition - like Millwall reaching the FA Cup final - and maybe we will have Coventry in next year's final,"

There's no doubting the cup competition nature of the Champions League. At the moment Arsenal aren't even in the top 4 teams in their country. Arsenal are Coventry in that example above as where Liverpool last year. We are lucky to be in the final this year. The rules are crazy.

"In the championship you have to be consistent and that is a real reflection of your consistency in a season."

Never a truer word spoken. I've no doubt Arsene would be happy with a Champions League win but he'll be sincerely disappointed over the league form. You shouldn't have the chance to win the Champions League without winning your league, which as we witnessed year after year is a very different proposition than saying you have no chance of winning the champions league without winning the league.

Maybe you can elaborate on what exactly Wenger has supposed to have forgotten? :)

[Karlos]

Yeah, Arsenal certianly played like that last night alright

you must have missed the smiley and the schoolgirl giggle.......!!


I was actually going to let you away with that golden nugget you had in your last post - What was it again, oh yeah, Villareal should have gone through, despite not being able to hit a barn door with a banjo while playing out of their skins and all the while still creating fewer chances than Arsenal did in the first leg where Villareal sat back, defended and feigned the odd injury :p


Over the two legs, Villareal deserved it because Arsenal were terrible in El Madrigal.

Villareal deserved it because over two legs Arsenal were terrible in one of them! Classic! :D

You'd wanna watch Geysir doesn't try to get you to find 10 journo's to agree with that assessment of the one leg, two legged tie!!! (I'm pulling yer leg Geysir! :) ) Excuse the pun!

[NeilMcD]

I think its going to be a great final and I would have Barcelona as the slight favourites as I think they have more attacking options and they have a footballing genius on their side. Although Henry is not too far behind. Going to be a good game I feel and hopefully Barca for Spurs sake win it. But one could hardly argue if Arsenal go and win it.

[Roadend]

If they keep Ronaldinho quiet, they'll win, as accoring to Drunkphy, Barca are an average side without him.

[geysir]

It was an intense game with plenty of good and sublime football.
We even had Milan toying with the total football concept with the pace and skill of Jaap Stam lashing down the right wing. It was a sight to behold.
But the real shock was Deco staying on his feet unless clattered.

"Barcelona ordinary without Ronaldinho?". I would say they are less extraordinary. Dunphy has these pathetic self promoting, condescending, transparant, wet dream football fantasies. It looks to me that the 2 best teams are there in the final.

[OwlsFan]

If they keep Ronaldinho quiet, they'll win, as accoring to Drunkphy, Barca are an average side without him.

Takes a football genius to make a comment like that ok. If both sides play to their potential, Barcelona should win comfortably. Clear leaders in the Spanish League vs 5th in the Premiership. However, very rarely do both teams play their best. Wenger is aware that Barca on their day will tbeat his team. Therefore he'll continue the defensive formation with Henry ploughing a lone furrow up front and relying on some magic from him. I am not expecting a classic.

Dumpy claims he says all along that Barca won't win it. Ergo Barca to win it.

[klein4]

have to agree with jdfan there. both teams were ver conservative when there was a lot at stake in the semi final second legs and you would expect them to do likewise in final. barcelona are fairly overhyped as well and think milan deserved to bring tie to extra time at least. good to see stam running amok down the wing after ronnie whelan said milan should exploit that weakness only for him to be laughed at by some of the self proclaimed all knowing ones on here... :)

[Roadend]

Takes a football genius to make a comment like that ok. If both sides play to their potential, Barcelona should win comfortably. Clear leaders in the Spanish League vs 5th in the Premiership. However, very rarely do both teams play their best. Wenger is aware that Barca on their day will tbeat his team. Therefore he'll continue the defensive formation with Henry ploughing a lone furrow up front and relying on some magic from him. I am not expecting a classic.

Dumpy claims he says all along that Barca won't win it. Ergo Barca to win it.
I must say though, my heartiest laugh of the night was when Giles said of Et'o,"He'll be a good player, him"

[NeilMcD]

Well said Klein, I supported Whelan on that comments a few weeks ago and it was confirmed last night. If your right back is willing to take a gamble and choose his moments you can certainly exploit the fact that the Ronaldinhio does not track back half as good as Giuly does.

[geysir]

and it was confirmed last night. If your right back is willing to take a gamble and choose his moments you can certainly exploit the fact that the Ronaldinhio does not track back half as good as Giuly does.
I don't see where it was confirmed last night. Milan made an attempt to exploit a gap with Stam getting forward at RB. Stam got in one very good cross.
Barca were not threatened on their left and Milan then tried the other option they had with Cafu coming on midway 2nd half. I thought Stam did quite well in the middle.
Ronaldinho doesn't track back but makes himself available and invariably the ball out of defense gets to him.

[NeilMcD]

It was confirmed in that serveral times throughout the game it was an avenue which Milan used. It could be clearly seen last night that Giuly tracks back a lot more than Ronaldhinhio does. This is not a criticism of him but just a reallity. If I was the manager I would be quite happy with it as his threat going forward is so good. However if I was the manage of the opposition I would still try to exploit it. When you are playing a team like Barcelona such small things can be vital and I am sure Wenger will have noted it. I thought it was unfair at the time to slag Ronnie Whelan over his in my view insightful comment.

[geysir]

I wasn't disaggreeing about Giuly's role, he is an excellent player, only disaggreeing about the amount of any real positive outcome Milan made from the forays on the right side with Stam.
I could imagine that many have tried in the Spanish league.
Will Messi be available for the final?

[CollegeTillIDie]

Given how both Arsenal and Barcelona performed in the second legs of their respective Semi-finals, am I alone in fearing that the Final is going to be crap?

[sligoman]

am I alone in fearing that the Final is going to be crap?For Arsenal yes, for Barca, no. It's gonna be a very one sided game imo.

btw, Spurs bet Bolton today, with Keano getting player of the season award after it:).

[thejollyrodger]

can spurs win their last game ?? it will be close but i expect barca to win against the arsenal

[Karlos]

For Arsenal yes, for Barca, no. It's gonna be a very one sided game imo. I see you don't even want to address the possibility that Arsenal might actually jam a win!!. Positive thinking and all that jazz! God only knows why it's stiking the fear of his good self into you! :D



btw, Spurs bet Bolton today, with Keano getting player of the season award after it.

Wonder what odds Sam actually gave Martin on Barca winning the Final....brave man imo, as I hear Martin has a reputation for playing underhand & not paying up!! :D :)

[geysir]

I thought there was going to be another one of those ironic moments, in the 2nd half of the Spurs Bolton game, when Murphy went down injured and lost the ball at the same time. Then Bolton went on a threatening attack and if they had scored ??
I thought it was fair play. Murphy was injured bad enough, it was self inflicted and play moved on.

[NeilMcD]

Good News for Spurs.

The Club is delighted to announce that our Captain, Ledley King, has signed a new, improved four-year deal.


Commenting on the contract extension, a smiling Martin Jol said: "Ledley is without doubt one of the most impressive and talented players not just in this country, but in Europe. We know that so many other Clubs would love to lure him from us so we are really pleased he has agreed a new deal.

"We often tease him that he has blue and white blood - he came to this Club as a local youngster 11 years ago and we have been privileged to have seen him develop with us and represent this Club for seven years. Loyalty is a rare commodity. Ledley is an outstanding role model for our youngsters. We have never taken his commitment to this Club for granted and we always seek to reward our best players with improved contracts."

Ledley added: "I am thoroughly enjoying my football at Tottenham. It has been a terrific season, one of the best ever whilst I have been at the Club. We are a Club with a very bright future and I am looking forward to playing a part in that."

Named Captain after Jamie Redknapp’s departure in January 2005, Ledley has made 204 appearances in all competitions since his debut against Liverpool at Anfield in May 1999. Now an England regular, he has 16 full caps to his name.

[OwlsFan]

Given how both Arsenal and Barcelona performed in the second legs of their respective Semi-finals, am I alone in fearing that the Final is going to be crap?

No. You'll hear a lot about the attacking game Arsenal play but once again Henry will be left up front on his own by Wenger hoping to hit Barca on the break. I don't criticise the tactic but it's not the attacking football which we'll hear from the pundits. Henry may weave some magic but Arsenal will play a defensive game - they can't afford to do otherwise really against Barca.

[NeilMcD]

I see Sky Sports in their wisdom are showing Man Utd V Charlton and Arsenal V Wigan. What a disgrace. The Spurs game is the most important game of the last day as if Spurs win there then Arsenals result against Wigan counts for nothing. Obviously they are just picking 2 of the best supported clubs.

[Clifford]

I see Sky Sports in their wisdom are showing Man Utd V Charlton and Arsenal V Wigan. What a disgrace.


Got to agree with you, if I was a Spurs fan on the threshold of CL football I'd be going bananas with the bas*ards. Last night's coverage of the Arsenal game was a disgrace, Andy "brutal" Grey temporarily swapped his undying love for man u to Arsenal, hanging on every move or itch made by Henry etc. It was sickening. (So did Graham Poll to be honest, but that's another story). I hope West Ham players genuinely weigh up the options on Sunday and let Spurs get whatever result they need as the "rest" may as well become as corrupt as the "big" ones in order for a bit of fairness.

Good luck Spurts, it will be a victory for all things good.

[NeilMcD]

To be fair I think Andy Gray is pretty fair on Sky Sports coverage as he does not have favourites despite playing for Everton Villa and Wolves in England. However in European matches he is totally biased in favour of the British side.

[NeilMcD]

I do think that maybe Sky wanted Arsenal to win last night to at least have something to show on the last day. If Arsenal had of lost last night there would have been nothing to play for on the last day.

[OwlsFan]

To be fair I think Andy Gray is pretty fair on Sky Sports coverage

Fair to everyone except the referee. He spends the whole game finding fault with decisions. I would pay anything (under Euro 10) to watch him try and referee a professional game with cameras replaying his every decision.

Odds must be on Arsenal to clinch the 4th place now with the only bonus being West Ham are in a cup final and perhaps won't be putting in the tackles. Hopefully Spurs with their Irish contingent will do it.

[NeilMcD]

I think Spurs have to be favourites. They should win against West Ham and no matter what Arsenal do then Spurs have 4th spot. West Ham will be resting players for the Cup Final as Pardew has said it and Spurs are getting the results at the moment whether they are playing well or not.

[OwlsFan]

Spurs away - Arsenal at home. Advantage Arsenal but then they have to watch their injuries as well.

[NeilMcD]

I would agree if they were level but spurs are a point ahead. Advantage spurs in that instance in my view. Better to have points in the bag. Spurs will win and so will Arsenal in my view. Pardew has said he will play a 2nd team.

[NeilMcD]

Sorry how can you sneak something when you have been there since December. If Arsenal finish 4th it will be them that is sneaking it. Howerver If they do finishe 4th they will deserve. it.

[Donegalcelt]

It's stupid showing United v Charlton and Arsenal V Wigan. Sky should show either United and Liverpool games or, preferably the Arsenal and Spurs games. Last year they got it totally wrong too showing Fulham hammering Norwich 6-0 and Southampton chasing around after United when the Palace and West Brom games were the one's worth watching. I know it's a bit pot luck but it makes no sense. What are RTE showing? Spurs?

[Clifford]

To be fair I think Andy Gray is pretty fair on Sky Sports coverage as he does not have favourites despite playing for Everton Villa and Wolves in England.

It was all going so well I was all for agreeing with ya. Can't see where he was fair last night, or on any man u or luckpool game. But hey ho there you go. It's all about opinions eh?

[Karlos]

Surpised nobody has mentioned that it's also the last ever game at a stadium that has had 93 consequtive top flight seasons in the league. A sad end of an old football stadium that has seen some great football and provided great memories from the chapman days right through the chippy brady days to the unbeaten team of 2004.

Nostalgia maybe but if it was the last game ever at Old Trafford or Anfield there'd be war if it wasn't on tv and rightly so in my opinion. There's very few real remnants of the good old days of footie and it will be sad to see one of the longest standing one going. I for one would want to see that and not just becuase it's Arsenal - I'd have the same feelings towards other great symbols of world football.

Only surprised Sky never said from day one that this game would be live. Should have been slated for coverage at the start of the season in my opinion. :)