Spurs/Arsenal Champions League Spot?

[NeilMcD]

They probably need CL money to justify their high player expenditure on wages/transfers...am pleased for the Irish lads there(IF they get a game), otherwise forget it. & their record in Europe is embarassing...on a par with the average SPL club!;)


Tottenham Hotspur has announced a profit of £4.4m for the second half of 2005, up from £1m the year before.
Turnover for the period was £36.3m, 10% up on the same period in 2004.

Player sales boosted profits, helping to offset the club's early exit from the Carling Cup and the consequent £1m fall in gate receipts compared to 2004.

The north London team warned that losing to Leicester in the third round of the FA Cup last January would have an impact on its next set of figures.

It said it would continue its policy of investing in young talent.

"A lot of investment continues to be focused on academy recruits, with scouting taking place throughout the world looking for, and competing for, stars of the future," said chairman Daniel Levy.

According to the latest football rich list from consultants Deloitte, Tottenham Hotspur is the thirteenth richest club in Europe, and the only one not to have earned revenues from the continent's premier cup competition, the Champions League.

[NeilMcD]

So gonzo when are you refering to this terrible record that Spurs have in Europe. They have a terrible record in recent times of not getting to Europe would be more to the point.

[Karlos]

Great day for the Gooners! Another awesome display in a 5-0 defeat of Villa. Spurs fall apart and Bolton lose to the Mancs. Arsenal's goal difference could be worth a point at the end of the campaign! I'm a happy camper! :D

[NeilMcD]

To be honest Karlos this weekend was as expected. Arsenal win at home to the worst team in the Premiership on current form after Sunderland and possibly Birmingham.

I watched the highlights of the Spurs game and it was supposed to be Newcastles best performance of the season and sometimes you catch Newcastle at home when they are in that form. Saying that Robbie Keane hit the woodwork twice and Jenas missed an absolute sitter also so I am not sure Spurs fell apart.

Next weekend is big also as Spurs are at home to Man City another side on a bad run and Arsenal play Man Utd who are on great form, just like Arsenal. Utd seem to have the indian sign over Arsenal in the last few games between the teams (FA Cup Final excluding). So it could well be 5 points the gap also. I would still take a point at Highbury as a Spurs fan but its going to be interesting.

[DmanDmythDledge]

I thought at the start of season that Spurs would beat Arsenal to fourth place. For a while I thought I would be correct but Arsenal have picked up form at the right time. Big game this weekend against Man Utd- could make or break both team's season.

[crazyaxel]

blackburn to finsh 4th arsenal5th(and win the champions league!)and spurs finish 6th as long as we(arsenal)finish above spurs our season is a bit of a success already!

[NeilMcD]

Well Blackburn were lucky last night to get a draw as their equaliser was a clear foul. I think its honestly between Spurs and Arsenal to finish 4th and it will come down to the games against Man Utd that both have to play and the head to head match in Highbury towards the end of the month.

[NeilMcD]

Back at the training ground, Martin Jol offers his considered reaction to the 3-1 reverse up at Newcastle on Saturday...


IT IS ALWAYS difficult for a team when you make mistakes and concede three goals inside 30 minutes.

The goal we created was exactly what we had in mind ahead of the game, to get Aaron Lennon one on one high up the pitch and he did exactly what he had to do. But, if you don't play as a team and play as if you are playing a home game you expect to win, you can't take anything from from a game against a team like Newcastle and it was very disappointing.

I felt we let ourselves down, we didn't play as a team and - as I said - we made mistakes. If you look at the first goal, the second and also the third with the penalty from Edgar's challenge - they were all mistakes. You can't play in the way we did against Newcastle.

They have good players and are strong on the ball, but when they haven't got it they are vulnerable and we didn't take advantage of that.

You have to win your battles. I was confident before the match - even after Ledley had to pull out - and still thought we could do well. But we struggled in the first minute with four men behind the ball, we stopped running and didn't track back - didn't track Bowyer down - and conceded a goal.

In the second half we showed a different face. Down 3-1 and then playing with ten men for 30 minutes - we played better with ten and that typified the whole afternoon. I think the character we showed was okay in the second half, but the performance in the first half was not acceptable.

We played without Ledley against West Brom away when Kanu scored two goals and Leicester in the FA Cup where we conceded three goals - which is very rare for us. You can't say we are not confident when Ledley is not there, but he is certainly an important player. The worry for me is that we concede more goals when he is not playing and that is not a good thing for a squad.

It is something we have to work on in the future, but we have to grab points now even if Ledley is not available. We are capable of doing that if we cut out the little mistakes.

We did have a couple of chances at 3-1 down which could have made a big difference, Robbie Keane hit the bar just before half-time and then Jermaine Jenas had a big chance in the second half. If one of those had gone in then Newcastle could have got a little nervous.

We got better, but we should have started like that. If you start like we did you will lose points.

[Kingdom]

My boss (who knows s.f.a. about soccer) predicted that Blackburn would finish 4th nearly 3 months ago, just as they were starting that run they went on. I think they were 9 th in the table at the time. I remember thinking "stick to the West Cork football muttonhead and the leave the proper leagues to those who know better". Must admit that tail is well and truly between the legs now!

[NeilMcD]

Ahh you should not feel so bad as I dont think they will finish 4th and they dropped points at home on Monday night and were quite lucky in the end.

[Karlos]

What another great night for Arsenal Football Club tonight in Italy.

Many of these players have been slated all season long & have once again proved the Manager doesn't do things just for the sake of it, there's a plan coming to fruitition in the league and in Europe. Boys are becoming Men.

The defence missing three full international and experienced defnders has manged to avoid conceeding a goal aginst the mighty Real Madrid & Juventus in knockout competition. After 10 minutes of tonights game they had beaten Ajax's ten year standing goals conceeded record and after 90 had added a second record by beating Milan's consequtive games record. It never looked in doubt. :)

The tactically inept Wenger has come up trumps once again in Europe and for the third consequtive time in an away game in the tactically superior land of Italian Football. They might not win the Cup and it won't matter a jot if they secure 4th place in the league anyway but this team and it's manager has proved they are a force to be reckoned with in European Football regardless of whatever happens from here on in.

I've maintained all along (and you can check my posts) that despite the sale of Vieira, despite the number of points behind Spurs, despite the poor performances, despite the alleged sale of Henry, one fact still remains..........................Arsene Knows......;)

[CollegeTillIDie]

The current edition of 4-4-2 (or should that be Four Four Two ?)has an interesting article on the origins of the rivalry between the two clubs, how Arsenal moved to Highbury in the first place, and the origins of the phrase sick as a parrot.
Well worth a purchase Spurs and Gooner fans.

[OwlsFan]

I've maintained all along (and you can check my posts) that despite the sale of Vieira, despite the number of points behind Spurs, despite the poor performances, despite the alleged sale of Henry, one fact still remains..........................Arsene Knows......;)

Why did he give Bergkamp an extension to this contract this season if Wenger is omnicient :p ? Do you have a list of his appearances and goals this season ?

A semi-final defeat and it will be forgotten. Who, other than Leeds' fans, remember their run and where did it get O'Leary. No, Arsenal must go all the way to support your sainthood application for Wenger :D

[Stuttgart88]

The current edition of 4-4-2 (or should that be Four Four Two ?)has an interesting article on the origins of the rivalry between the two clubs, how Arsenal moved to Highbury in the first place, and the origins of the phrase sick as a parrot.
Well worth a purchase Spurs and Gooner fans.

Any chnace of a summary?


Fever Pitch also has a very good comment on the rivarly. From what I remember, there used never be any great intensity to it, but in 1987 when Spurs were 2-0 up at half-time in the League Cup semi-final second leg, the PA announcer announced ticket details for the final! Arsenal needed no further motivation and went through. From that point on the relationship really deteriorated I think and it's quite bitter now.

[NeilMcD]

I thought Arsenal were poor last night and I though Juventus were even worse. I must say Giles Summary of the game was spot on. Arsenal for some reason went down to Juventus level last night.

Also Karlos is the Champions League the same trophy that for the last 2 years you have been saying is not as important as the league which is the true worth of a team. If that is the case Arsenal struggling to finish ahead of n average Spurs side does not say much for them. Surely last season was a better season for them as they finished 2nd in the league.

Also as Owls fan points out Arsenal could go out in the semi final and finished 5th in the league and the 2 wins over Juventus and Real Madrid will count for nothing at the end of it.

[Stuttgart88]

Maybe I'm viewing things purely from my personal perspective, but as an Arsenal fan I felt comfortable & relaxed throughout last night's game & thought it was a job extremely well done. Banging in a few goals & entertaining was never the objective. I thought it was an extremely well executed closing out of a potentially tricky game.

Villareal will be a very different propsition alright.

[NeilMcD]

Banging in a few goals and entertaining may not be the objective but I would have though keeping the ball better than they did and being a bit more positive than they were and defending a bit better at the back would have been.

[Karlos]

Also Karlos is the Champions League the same trophy that for the last 2 years you have been saying is not as important as the league which is the true worth of a team. If that is the case Arsenal struggling to finish ahead of n average Spurs side does not say much for them. Surely last season was a better season for them as they finished 2nd in the league.

Also as Owls fan points out Arsenal could go out in the semi final and finished 5th in the league and the 2 wins over Juventus and Real Madrid will count for nothing at the end of it.

Neill, do I really have to repeat my stance on the Champions League again? You know the answer to that so please show me where my stance has changed.

I've maintained from Day One that Wenger has had a plan for this team. I've maintained that this team is good enough to win games. I've maintained that Wenger isn't tactically inept.


You can all say it will mean nothing if they don't win the CL or finish fifth but everything has been proved to me that this is a team with a future regardless of what happens now. Unlike Leeds, we haven't spent the world on a team just to make the Champions League. A season without CHampions LEague Football would not see Arsenal relegated. Our youth is showing great potential despite being written off by everyone.

I've never lost faith in Wenger. When following my club becomes only about winning lads, then I'll hang up my boots. :)

[Stuttgart88]

I can't actually remember what Karlos' view on the CL is, but I think there's something a bit off when a team actually wins it without having been champions in recent memory. Liverpool for example, even though I cheered for them last year.

As an Arsenal fan, I'd normally prefer to win the league but having won the league recently more times than I ever dreamt of as a kid, I'd now prefer to win the CL just to have done it. If Arsenal were still in contention in the league this year I'd still favour the CL.

Did I ever lose faith in Wenger? Probably. I've frequently been very critical and I reckon not without just cause, but time and time again he gets things right. There've been loads of duds over the years, but the sheer quality of Eboue, as an example, just confirms how good his judgment is. They've achieved nothing yet but to be playing the type of football they've been playing recently while clearly in transition bodes very well for the future. 8 weeks ago I couldn't imagine this team would be playing so well.

[Karlos]

That is one of my thoughts Stuttgart, I do believe there should be only one team in the champions league each year, the Champions.

My other view is that the League must the priority number one at all times. Sure I'd love to win the Champions League (as much as I love winning every cup), it would be a great night and all but winning the league is far more important to me and in my opinion more important for the stability of the club. The Champions League this season has served as a good training ground for our younger players and has helped instill confidence something I'm sure this Arsenal team has and hopefully will take into the league.

As an aside, I don't however think it's a co-incidence that Arsenal's run in Europe has come at a time when the club where out of their domestic cups. In every season we have faced such problems with that. It's been made easier this time without having to face the likes of what we faced in one week in 2004 - Utd in FA Cup Semi Final, Chelsea in C.L quarter final & Liverpool in an important League game. Just my own personal opinion on it.

[NeilMcD]

Good point there Karlos, I do think that Arsenal dont have any cup commitments is helping them in the Champions League Also I do think this Arsenal team is more suited to the Champions League style of football. Have to say Arsenal were fantastic a week ago and I really enjoyed that performance. I hope they beat Villareal but I do hope Barca win it. Wenger is a manager I admire as he always wants his teams to play great football and he likes to develop young players too and is willing to give them time even if the performances or results are not there. He is quite unusual in that he does not have the win a all costs mentality.

[Stuttgart88]

With MUFC this week & two CL semis sandwiching a crucial grudge match against Spurs, do you think this fixture list is a hindrance or a benefit to Arsenal?

My instinct is to think that it's a disadvantage, but on reflection all the great Arsenal bursts of form under Wenger have included several key games on the trot. For example, in 2001/2 when they won 12(?) games in a row to fend off United & Liverpool. I actually think these tough upcoming games will keep them focused and will actually help them.

[Karlos]

Why did he give Bergkamp an extension to this contract this season if Wenger is omnicient :p ? Do you have a list of his appearances and goals this season ?


I promised myself I'd come back to this Owlsfan.

I'm sure you can dig the stats yourself mate but it's common knowledge he's scored 2 goals this year compared to 8 last year, of course you do know that's with 16 more starts last season than this, don't you!! ;)

There's a few reasons why Bergkamp is still an Arsenal player. For starters, he is the most experienced member of a squad with an average age of 21 ish. If I had the time, I could pull a mountain of quotes from the likes of Robin Van Persie, Cesc Fabregas, Jose Reyes, Manu Adebayor, Theo Walcott, and even our very own Anthony Stokes, on how the influence & guidence of Dennis Bergkamp is greatly improving their game as well as just being able to train with him. Dennis' attitude & committment is second to none and is a great role model for younger players.

With such a leader in Patrick Vieira walking out the door it was imperative to keep some experience in the squad. Dennis is on reduced wages so he's not hurting the club financially. In fact one walk around Finsbury Park on a Match Day and you'll see Arsenal are probably making money due to the number of Bergkamp shirts you'll see. Had Wenger played Dennis weekly I would have a problem, but that hasn't been the case. Dennis & Wenger are both aware of his decline due to age & both more importantly are also aware of what he brings to the team, to training and to the younger players.

One could possibly argue it was Bergkamp's last minute goal at home to Thun that ignited Arsenal's Champions League run this year, saving Arsenal from an embarassing home result. It was Kolo Toure who mentioned that night in particular ina recent interview.

As always, I await with great excitement your reasoning as to why having Denis Bergkamp at the Club playing a bit part role is the sign of bad managerial skills of Arsene Wenger! :D

[Karlos]

With MUFC this week & two CL semis sandwiching a crucial grudge match against Spurs, do you think this fixture list is a hindrance or a benefit to Arsenal?


In this instance I think it is a help as both competitions provide the same result - qualification for Champions League. Every game is as important as the next.

The problem in the past has come from having to juggle the team based on what is considered more important..e.g. Alliadierre starting the FA Cup Semi Final in place of Henry.

[renovater]

the gunners are back to there best heading for champions final just a small matter villareal beat Man u saturday while the wheels are falling off the spurs band wagon best they will end up is 5th spot, by no means a disgrace or a bad season:)

[NeilMcD]

Sorry how are the wheels falling off the spurs band wagon then. One loss away to Newcastle while getting a man sent off is hardly wheels falling off the bandwagon. I expect 3 points at home to City and Man Utd are well capable of beating an Arsenal side that have travelled back from Turin while Man Utd are fresh. So the gap could be 5 points again. I said it before its going to come down to the game at Highbury, with winner takes all and draw leaving it to the last day.

Just to show you what a stupid comment it is about the wheels falling off the spurs bandwagon ism spurs have won 4 of their last 8 games and drew 2 of them. The 2 that they lost were a last minute winner away to chelsea where Chelsea are unbeaten at home and away with ten men to Newcastle. So I dont see how the wheels are falling off the spurs band wagon.

[Karlos]

I think the weekend went more or less as I thought it might. Spurs made very hard work of a poor City side in my opinion but will be happy with coming away with the win. Keano's in fine form at the moment, great to see.

I felt Arsenal ran out of gas after 60 minutes against United today. I thought we deserved to be 1-0 up early on with the shots on goal created and all round play we had in the first 20 minutes but I wasn't surprised at all to see United take it up a gear in the second half and our recent big performances certainly looked to have taken their toll. Overall, United deserved the win in the end so credit where it's due. :ball:

As a little aside, it is ironic however to think that both Mourniho & Fergie had accused Arsenal of getting an easy ride with fixtures after Champions League games less than 9 months ago (not that it's ever mentioned now). It was of course proved as being nonsence at the time but if ever they needed confirmation of it it's been in recent months with games against Newcastle (a), Man United (a), Liverpool (h) and Blackburn (a) following directly after European games, not to mention the crunch game against Spurs coming up just over 60 hours after a Champions League Semi Final in a few weeks. It's been far from easy in that sence. :)

The results this weekend don't actually change the scenario too much - if Arsenal win all their games they will secure 4th spot. I'm still confident that they will but it is going to be a roller coaster finish

[Stuttgart88]

I was torn again on Saturday. Disappointed Spurs won but delighted to see Robbie play so well.

I'm quite philosphical. Would love to see Arsenal pip Spurs but winning the CL has to be the priority for Arsenal this year. Last year I was slagging Liverpool as their "ambition" was to come 4th instead of 5th. Either way that's a pretty poor performance for a club of that stature and I'd say the same applies to Arsenal, mitigated perhaps by being in transition. For a club like Arsenal qualifying for the CL can not be seen as success in its own right. Of course it matters financially but as a fan I prefer to see proper success, a big day out and a trophy to play for. Even the Carling Cup.

[NeilMcD]

Spurs were all over Man City and should have beaten them by a lot more if it was not for the saves of David James. Keane again was top class. Spurs got nervous towards the end as they failed to finish City off. I think Spurs have to take something from the Man Utd game at home and beat Everton away next week. I will be at that game so looking forward to it. Bolton are gone from the race and Blackburn look flat also having dropped 4 points in their last 2 games against Wigan and Portsmouth. Some much for renovators comments that the wheels have fallen off the Spurs bandwagon, they have been shown up for the ignorant comments which they were.

Said it all along that it will be between Spurs and Arsenal for the 4th spot and it will come down to who wins at Highbury but a draw may suit Spurs.

Play up Pompey on Wednesday night.

[NeilMcD]

Fourth is not all it's cracked up to be
Andrew Fifield




On the Premiership: There can only be one Premiership champion, but for a clutch of clubs bobbing beneath the league's high-water mark, fourth has become the new first.

Big deal, perhaps. Few outside north London and Blackburn give two hoots about the race to qualify for the Champions League, a tournament which, though great fun for those involved, seems rather tasteless to those viewing from afar. It is football's equivalent of bling jewellery: an ostentatious, gaudy status symbol which clubs use to dazzle and demean their peers.


It has also become something of a misnomer. The era when only the cream of a domestic league were granted the glittering reward of European football has long gone. Now, the Champions League is semi-skimmed: Liverpool, the holders, qualified despite finishing 30 points behind the 2004 Premiership winners Arsenal, while only one of this season's semi-finalists - Barcelona - is a true "champion". Milan and Arsenal were runners-up in Serie A and the Premiership last season, while Villarreal stumbled home fourth in La Liga.

Nevertheless, the Champions League is still the VIP club where everyone wants a place on the guest list. The financial rewards are well known. Clubs who enjoy a run towards the latter stages can expect to see their coffers swelled by around €40 million; but, tempting as that sounds, the cost of missing out can be just as great.

Just ask Everton. At the start of the season, Goodison Park was giddy at the prospect of Europe's greatest names swaggering into town, their place at the top table booked by a richly deserved fourth-placed finish last May. Not even the other lot's triumph in Istanbul and a tricky-sounding qualifying round draw against Villarreal could poop the party.

Then it all went horribly wrong. Before their Premiership campaign had even begun, Manuel Pelligrini's team had shoved Everton to the brink of elimination with a 2-1 first-leg win; two weeks later, Diego Forlan and referee Pierluigi Collina combined to send them toppling into despair.

For David Moyes, the Champions League turned into the cruellest hoax imaginable. Everton had neither enjoyed the glory of hosting illustrious visitors, nor the much-vaunted financial rewards. Bill Kenwright, the chairman, claimed to have made a loss on his Champions League adventure.

But the financial cost was nothing compared to the psychological damage inflicted on Moyes' players. Everton, their minds befuddled and morale bruised, lost seven of their first eight Premiership matches, sank without trace in their Uefa Cup meeting with Dinamo Bucharest, and are only now beginning to piece their season back together.

Their travails should serve as a warning. As Everton discovered, the feat of finishing fourth can only be truly celebrated three months later when an irksome qualifier has been negotiated, and when sides as accomplished as Villarreal block the path, that can hardly be taken for granted. Everton were especially unlucky. The Spaniards will joust with Arsenal for a place in the Stade de France final later this month, their polished performances belying their status as back-door qualifiers.

Negotiating the preliminary stages promises to be no easier next season. High-calibre teams such as Fiorentina, SV Hamburg, Valencia and Marseille could all be lying in wait, although that is unlikely to dampen the joy of whoever emulates Everton and snatches fourth place.

Blackburn would dearly love the opportunity to exorcise the memories of their last Champions League excursion, which ended in embarrassing failure, but it is in London that the need is most pressing.

Arsenal's membership of the G14 group of elite clubs is based more on reputation than performance, but making this season's run to the semi-finals a regular occurrence would presumably help their vice-chairman, David Dein, look his fellow bigwigs in the eye at meetings.

There is also the small matter of the club's new €500 million stadium, which was not built to host the likes of Apoel Nicosia or PAOK Salonika.

No wonder Arsene Wenger has admitted that his priority is West Bromwich Albion on Saturday rather than Villarreal, especially in the wake of their defeat at Manchester United yesterday.

Tottenham currently have the reputation as the smallest big club in the land, but that could change if they hold their nerve over the coming weeks. Martin Jol has been downplaying his side's chances all season but, with games running out, it is they who hold the killer hand.

The north London derby a week on Saturday promises to make or break the hopes of both. But even for the winner, elation should be tempered by caution. As Everton know only too well, it takes just one twist of fate to reduce dreams to rubble.

[NeilMcD]

Great result last night for Pompey and in turn Spurs. Arsenal missed some very easy chances and probably should have won the game. I think Henry was lucky not to get a yellow card or maybe a red for a reckless tacke. One thing that I have admired about Henry over the last 2 years is his sporting attitude and he does play the game with a smile on his face. Last night he looked rattled at times as was giving out to the ref and to fellow players which is unlike him. His goal was top class though. Just wondering what brough on this narky display from Henry. I think he was annoyed at the attitude of some of his fellow players most notably Reyes who was a disgrace in my view.

So much for Renovator saying that the wheels have fallen off the Spurs bandwagon as Bolton, Blackburn and Arsenal all continue to drop points while Spurs won on Saturday. I think if Spurs beat Everton on Saturday and dont get beat by Man Utd they would have to be then favourites for the 4th Spot.

[NeilMcD]

the gunners are back to there best heading for champions final just a small matter villareal beat Man u saturday while the wheels are falling off the spurs band wagon best they will end up is 5th spot, by no means a disgrace or a bad season:)


How stupid does this post now look.

[Stuttgart88]

What's the gap now? 4 pts with same number if games?

If so it's still just about in the balance. I didn't see the game but I do sometimes wonder just how hungry Reyes is. I assume that's what you're alluding to.

I don't think it was true that the wheels had come off Spurs' wagon, though I do think their form dipped a few weeks ago & they've been making heavy weather of some matches, such as Wigan, WBA etc.

It's a very interesting contest, though I'm not sure supporters of neither team are that bothered about it. If I was a neutral I'd be delighted for Robbie to have the opportunity to play in the CL. If they had European commitments Jol may have to use his squad more extensively and that'd be good news for Reid & Kelly. But I'm not neutral!

How bad were Adebayor's misses?

Should Arsenal have had a penalty?

[eirebhoy]

I'll be cheering on Spurs for the 4th spot but I'll give them little chance of getting it. Arsenal have as easy a run in as you could get, Spurs have it really tough (Bolton at home probably being the easiest of the 5 which says it all).

[NeilMcD]

Spurs are 4 points ahead with 5 games to go. In the last 2 years Spurs have only lost to Chelsea at home and no other club in the league. 3 of their last 5 games are at home and the final 2 are at home. Bolton and West Ham are Spurs last 2 games. Bolton are terrible away from home and will probably have the Uefa Cup Spotted by that stage and West Ham could be preparing for an FA Cup Final last day of the season. Either way I am pretty confident that Spurs will get 6 points from those 2 games.


Now this weekend is huge. Spurs are playing Everton away and Man Utd at home. I feel if they beat Everton and do not lose to Man Utd at home they will get the Champions League Spot. It should also be remembered that Arsenal are playing Spurs straight after the Semi Final next week. I feel this gives Spurs a huge advantage as Arsenal have shown on Sunday that they are tired coming back from the European nights.

Its going pretty much as I said from the start that it will come down to the game at Highbury but the 4 point gap means that Arsenal will probably have to win the game were a draw would suit Spurs.


Finally I am still not sure where Spurs form has dipped this season. Spurs have been consistantly getting about 6 points from every 9. Spurs have not had a great run or a bad patch it has been a few wins and a draw and a defeat from every five games or so.

As I said earlier Spurs only defeats recently were to Chelsea away (last minute goal) and Newcastle away when they went to ten men and faced Newcastles best performance of the season. Even saying that Robbie scored and hit the bar twice and Jenas missed a sitter.

[NeilMcD]

What's the gap now? 4 pts with same number if games?

If so it's still just about in the balance. I didn't see the game but I do sometimes wonder just how hungry Reyes is. I assume that's what you're alluding to.

How bad were Adebayor's misses?

Should Arsenal have had a penalty?


Reyes passing was terrible and he showed little effort. Henry was getting pretty angry with him over it and rightly so but I have never seen that side of Henry before.

Adebayor missed at least 2 sitters one with his head the other a simple tap in that he should have scored. I felt Pompey played well and hassled Arsenal and probably just about deserved a point for their effort but Arsenal did have 2 clear cut chance.

I dont think Arsenal should have had a penalty, the tackle got neither ball or man as far as I could see.

[Stuttgart88]

I thought Spurs' form dipped, though they still got results. They relied on a late goalie error to beat WBA. They should (or at least could) have lost to Wigan. They were lucky to beat Blackburn. So I think it's fair to say their form dipped - i.e., their standard of performance declined - a few weeks ago, no?

You're very sensitive these days Neil :)

[NeilMcD]

Just pointing out the facts

[NeilMcD]

I thought Spurs' form dipped, though they still got results. They relied on a late goalie error to beat WBA. They should (or at least could) have lost to Wigan. They were lucky to beat Blackburn. So I think it's fair to say their form dipped - i.e., their standard of performance declined - a few weeks ago, no?

You're very sensitive these days Neil :)


Also if Chelsea or Man Utd or Liverpool win games when they are playing badly its a sign of a good side. However if Spurs do it , people say there form has dipped or the wheels have fallen off the Spurs bandwagon. As I said earlier Spurs have been consistant this season in that they have got abotu 5 or 6 points out of every 9. That has not changed all season whether they have played well or not.

Arsenal have 2 away games left 1 against Sunderland and the other against Man City. IF they drop points there that could be it.

[Stuttgart88]

Just pointing out the facts
Me too. I genuinely think that Spurs' performance standards dropped a few weeks back & they picked up points that weren't fully merited (I'd be surprised if you didn't agree), though judging by the Man City game they seem to be well back on track. Only for James they'd have won by a hatful.

[NeilMcD]

I agree they were lucky but to be honest if Spurs are **** for the rest of the season and still qualify for the Champions League I would not give a ****. Its all about results at this point in time.

[Stuttgart88]

Absolutely. I doubt any Swiss fans are complaining that they dropped points and decent leads to Israel, struggled to beat Cyprus & Faroes etc. They're going to Germany, we're not. Results, not performances...

[eirebhoy]

Spurs are 4 points ahead with 5 games to go. In the last 2 years Spurs have only lost to Chelsea at home and no other club in the league. 3 of their last 5 games are at home and the final 2 are at home. Bolton and West Ham are Spurs last 2 games. Bolton are terrible away from home and will probably have the Uefa Cup Spotted by that stage and West Ham could be preparing for an FA Cup Final last day of the season. Either way I am pretty confident that Spurs will get 6 points from those 2 games.

If Spurs had 3 more home games I'd have them as favourites but they only have 2, they play West Ham away. Bolton haven't been doing well away from home recently but they are a tough team to beat. In saying that, I expect Spurs to beat them. It is the only match of the 5 I expect Spurs to win though. They haven't beaten Man Utd in their last 9 league games. If they were playing West Ham at home I'd have said Spurs were favourites for 4th but the fact that it's the last day of the season in Upton Park I think it'll be tough.

The 4 point gap isn't that big as Arsenal have to still play Spurs. With Arsenal being at home I'd say it's most likely a 1 point difference with 4 games to play. Arsenal have West Brom (h), Sunderland (a), Wigan (h). That's 9 points in the bag. :)

[NeilMcD]

Fair enough, sloppy by me there I thought Spurs were at home on the last day. West Ham were rubbish against Chelsea and I think there season in the league is over and they are looking at the Cup now. If they get to the final the game on the last day they will be holding back against Spurs in order to be fit for the final. Either way I expect to win that game. I think the game at Highbury is a 50/50 match especially as Karlos has said Arsenal have to play on Wednesday night and then play early on Saturday morning at 12.45. Spurs will be fully rested there. Also Spurs dont have to win that game or win the Utd game. 2 draws from both those games will do if they win the other games. The fact is the points game is 4 and you cant just say its effectively 1 as Spurs are ahead of Arsenal in the table so its a bit of an insult to the Spurs team to right them off in a game as big as that. You may feel Arsenal are going to win but its no way a home banker.

[eirebhoy]

Arsenal coming 4th could be the difference between Celtic getting into Pot 2 or Pot 3 in next season's Champions League so I'm certainly up for Spurs to get 4th (also for Keane's sake). I feel if Arsenal beat Spurs they'll get 4th and I can't see anything other than an Arsenal win. Maybe you're right and the CL will weaken Arsenal's challenge but they don't have to travel further than their training camp between the Villarreal match and the Spurs match so I can't see them being that tired. When was the last time Arsenal failed to beat Spurs at home though? Just checked.. 1998.

I'm not too confident.

[NeilMcD]

I personally think the game will be a draw which means that Arsenal will have to gain the 4 points in the 4 other games. After last night I am quitely confident that Spurs can do it. One thing is for sure. Tottingham day will not be until the last day of the season what ever happens.

[NeilMcD]

Arsenal coming 4th could be the difference between Celtic getting into Pot 2 or Pot 3 in next season's Champions League so I'm certainly up for Spurs to get 4th (also for Keane's sake). I feel if Arsenal beat Spurs they'll get 4th and I can't see anything other than an Arsenal win. Maybe you're right and the CL will weaken Arsenal's challenge but they don't have to travel further than their training camp between the Villarreal match and the Spurs match so I can't see them being that tired. When was the last time Arsenal failed to beat Spurs at home though? Just checked.. 1998.

I'm not too confident.

Am I right in thinking that if Arsenal win the Champions League then Celtic have to pre qualify for the Champions League but if Barca win it they dont.

[NeilMcD]

I just worked out that if Spurs

Win against Everton Bolton and West Ham and lose to Man Utd and draw with Arsenal no matter what Arsenal do Spurs have 4th place. But Arsenal would probably win the Champions League if that happened.

[Karlos]

Tottingham day will not be until the last day of the season what ever happens.

Ah Saint Tottingham's day - one of my favourite days of the year - has been coming as early as february in recent times!! :)

I didn't actually see the game last night - those damn time zones often mess up my midweek viewing. my first reaction when I saw the team was - play a carling cup team and we'll get a carling cup result. Probably a very simplistic view but that was my gut feeling and so it transpired. By all accounts Arsenal missed a bag full of chances but I can't really talk about the performance with any certainty.


Still think it's all to play for, however I do believe like Neil, that Spurs will be flying if they come out with maximum points at the weekend. Two very difficult games for them it should be said though. If they were to slip at Goodison and Arsenal win - it would make the game with United very edgy & even more difficult.

Spurs could very well be going into the North London Derby knowing a loss could put them two points behind - it really could all change that quickly.

Personally I'd settle for two draws and an Arsenal win against West Brom knowing then that a win against Spurs would put us ahead with our considerable goal difference. I think only the very foolish would write off either teams chances as long as they are in touching distance. :)

[Karlos]

I just worked out that if Spurs

Win against Everton Bolton and West Ham and lose to Man Utd and draw with Arsenal no matter what Arsenal do Spurs have 4th place. But Arsenal would probably win the Champions League if that happened.

Very true Neil but to show how close this all is, if you were to just swap the United & Arsenal Results, Spurs would be fcuked despite collecting the same number of points.......(if Arsenal won their other games of course :) ).

Still too tight to call at the moment - less than 48 hours ago, Arsenal had a similar scenario with their games but one draw messed it up. I'll be amazed if the possibilities don't swing back & forth over the next few games. :)