Republic of Ireland V Denmark - Tue, 14 November 2017 World Cup 2018 Play Off 2nd Leg

[mark12345]

Disagree, we played Spain and Italia, the two eventual finalists and Croatia who got to the later stages too.

All strong sides, add this to the equation, Shay, Richie, Josh were all carrying injuries.

That said we did as best we could, let’s not forget what Mr Trapattoni took over and how he got us back on track.

The current players just aren’t good enough,as is ONeill, spent force same.


In Trap we trust.

Nothin for nothin lads, but it is sort of pointless rehashing the whys and wherefores of whether we were better or worse in this game or not, five years ago. Can you both look to the future and come up with some sort of way forward for the international team? I think everyone on here should be thinking for solutions tonight.

[Comic Book Guy]

As Riff Raff said , I too am in 50s and I have never experienced such a disaster. This felt even worse than Henry's handball. I have mentioned on here somewhere that we may need to experience short term failure to ensure long term progress. Here's hoping that the FAI start to look at a strategic plan rather than just hoping it will just happen

Likewise, The Germany loss (1-6) in 2012 was something I could handle as they were brimming with world class players, I would say something if Denmark were a world class side oozing with talent but they're not aside from Eriksen. But they could pass and move and do the basics well, after the 3rd went in I knew it would be a rout. All of our failings were viciously exposed tonight. Heart and passion only get you so far.
If the FAI want to look at a strategic plan I would recommend that they head north to Iceland and look what they are doing, but I won't hold my breath. We'll just plod along with you know who at the top of the pile.

[gastric]

Likewise, The Germany loss (1-6) in 2012 was something I could handle as they were brimming with world class players, I would say something if Denmark were a world class side oozing with talent but they're not aside from Eriksen. But they could pass and move and do the basics well, after the 3rd went in I knew it would be a rout. All of our failings were viciously exposed tonight. Heart and passion only get you so far.
If the FAI want to look at a strategic plan I would recommend that they head north to Iceland and look what they are doing, but I won't hold my breath. We'll just plod along with you know who at the top of the pile.

And that's why Delaney frustrates me so much. Too busy protecting his position, not leading and repeated claims that the debt will be paid by 2020. Personally, I would rather the debt paid by 2100 if it meant money was spent on better coaching. As Mark said rather than pussy footing around dissenting groups, just cut ties with them.

[SwanVsDalton]

We can't take the holy ground here on matters like that.
We have a genuine scumbag in our team who is constantly trying to injure opponents. Its not even subtle anymore. Allen.v Wales Paulsen tonight. Bentnder tonight. Sisco tonight. Thats not.leadership its cowardice. The sooner someone breaks him up and he can see how reckless he's been, the better.

A genuine scumbag? 4realz? I think I disagree with you on pretty much all of those challenges being designed to injure opponents btw although I concede I only saw them in real time (and I was more punch drunk than attentive as things went on).

[SwanVsDalton]

This team are tightrope walkers and not necessarily good ones - when they make it all the way to the other side, they look heroic. When they fall off, they look idiotic.

So many feelings on tonight but for some reason I can't stop thinking about those half-time subs and our consistent inability to implement any kind of plan B.

No-one may like plan A but we can surely all agree that it basically comes down to not conceding and nicking a goal.

Against Wales at home, we needed a plan B. Didn't have it.

Against Serbia at home, we need a plan B. Didn't have it.

Before tonight, it wouldn't have taken a genius to work out there was a realistic chance we would go in at half-time one goal behind and needing two. So O'Neill responds by taking off two workhorse, combative midfielders for two passers who can't tackle butter.

Now, I appreciate the gamble inherent in this move. But how can we move from one tactical extreme (compact shape, defensive mentality, physical intensity) to another (passers, players looking for space, possession and interplay)? How does that make sense? Who was going to win the ball for us to play with it? Hendrick, who looked gassed after 30 minutes? Brady playing (please for the last time ever) in deep central midfield?

I almost think O'Neill saw us own the ball for 10 minutes before half-time and thought Denmark would sit back and let us have it...

I don't buy the game was over after 45 minutes, although we had dug ourselves a nice comfy hole. I just wish we had an idea of how to respond to the foreseeable situation we found ourselves in.

Was a bit surprised with the first 45, just expected us to wrap up and wait for the second half to go for a goal. Instead it was more like Serbia - thrash and metal, physicality, bite, pressure. At least we went for it, but, as ever, needed so much more composure. The problem with revving these players up is they're all the more likely to overheat.

[tricky_colour]

It was always going to be a difficult without an away goal, they were happy to draw at how because they knew they would outscore us
in a non-defensive game.

On their day they are a very good side, Poland topped their group yet they beat them by 4 goals, they same margin they beat us, yet Poland are going to the World Cup!

I think they will do very well in Russia.

[The Fly]

This team are tightrope walkers and not necessarily good ones - when they make it all the way to the other side, they look heroic. When they fall off, they look idiotic.


That's the best description of this side that I've read yet. Bravo Sir!

[Closed Account 2]

On their day they are a very good side, Poland topped their group yet they beat them by 4 goals, they same margin they beat us, yet Poland are going to the World Cup!

I think they will do very well in Russia.

I'm not so sure. I think if a team is set up well against them and denies Eriksen space then you do nullify a big portion of their attacking game. I think Serbia and arguably Wales are more dynamic than them.

In Euro 2016 they finished third behind Portugal (understandable) and Albania and then lost to Sweden in the playoffs. For Wc 2014 they finished as the worst runners-up, behind Italy. Very slack results cost them points, they drew twice with Bulgaria and lost 4-0 at home to Armenia.

[ccfcman]

Well as bad as losing 6-1 at home to Germany is, I think tonight is worse. The Germans had world class players everywhere, Denmark aren't a million miles above us in terms of quality.

What gives you that impression? They played us off the park. Blew through defense and persistently forced mistakes, having run rings around midfield the forced the manager to implode tactically and isolated our impotent attack.

[Closed Account 2]

What gives you that impression? They played us off the park. Blew through defense and persistently forced mistakes, having run rings around midfield the forced the manager to implode tactically and isolated our impotent attack.

I think much of last night was down to ourselves and especially the tactics. Denmark were good but we gave them so much space. If you contrast it with the first leg, where we pretty much nullified them, then you have to ask the question did we collapse (tactically) or did they somehow find a whole new level of playing.

We've faced teams who have been significantly more technically good than Denmark in the last 3-4 years (Serbia, France, Germany, Bosnia, Conte's Italy, Belgium) and have never been as badly exposed (although Belgium was close). To me it's a bit of a misnomer to say the opposition was so technically superior they just blew us off the park, and to imply we never really had a chance.

[ifk101]

Hendrick and Brady are at the age where they should be key players for us. And there are not. Whether this is down to the manager, the individual or a combination of both they are underperforming and it is frustrating to see last night's game pass them by.

I don't know how Christie stayed on the field after half-time.

[Fixer82]

Denmark are a decent side . I thought Sisto was excellent in both games and they showed a good understanding of each other.

O’Neill’s substitutions baffled me. I would’ve taken Ward off and put Brady in LB. Christie off and Meyler in RB. Then stuck Hoolahan and Long in. Our two full backs both made mistakes that led to Danish goals.

It makes no sense to take off our captain who was doing fine and has a calming influence over the team. Hendrick did nothing in th match and, even though, Arter was nutmegged by Sisto, Harry offered more energy.

Disappointing. It was a big gamble by O’Neill that failed miserably.
I’m not calling for his head though like most people. The team will have a little bit of developing to do now I feel with Hoolahan, O’Shea and possibly Walters, Whelan and Ward retiring.

[Real ale Madrid]

I don't know how Christie stayed on the field after half-time.

If he just stood at the post instead of kicking the ball into the net who knows how this conversation would be going. I can't for the life of me figure out why his body is positioned the way it is. The worst goal we've ever conceded.

[brine3]

We also need to stop taking the Denis O'Brien money.

The other small countries show that you don't need to pay 1.5 million a year to a coach to get success. You just need a plan.

[backstothewall]

Usual. Usual Stuff.

Afraid of that next step - Mentally not strong enough.

As true now as it was 8 years ago

[osarusan]

Once they went behind in the tie, they stepped things up with real purpose and as an organised unit.

Once we went behind, we collapsed tactically and mentally. It was difficult to watch, really.

[ifk101]

If he just stood at the post instead of kicking the ball into the net who knows how this conversation would be going. I can't for the life of me figure out why his body is positioned the way it is. The worst goal we've ever conceded.

Had actually forgotten about his input for that goal. But we lefted a 2on1 situation from the corner kick to start ...

[Stuttgart88]

In the last 10 years the only times the Danes have scored more than 4 have been against Malta and lichtensteinIn fairness this season they scored 4 against Poland.

[Olé Olé]

In fairness this season they scored 4 against Poland.

Winning by 4 goals in the process- like last night. Flawed fact.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Have calmed down a bit. Football is fine margins. We take one of those two chances when we were one nil up, or if Christie sorts his feet out, it could have been a different story. There was a snowball effect leading to the haplessness of the second half: that dumb equalizer, the poor tracking back for the second, the Danes playing with the pressure off, having to chase the game, the crowd quietening (like they always do when it goes wrong), players sniping at each other. We needed to score quick in the second half, but didn't, and the Danes were allowed to play at their ease and take the chances when they came. After the third most of the squad gave up, and everything that was teetering already collapsed.

Think the Germany game was worse personally, just because I think we played worse for longer in that game, while here it was really after the third that headless chickens reigned, on the pitch and off it. That's not to say that it isn't as bad as it looks. It's really, really bad.

Randolph - At fault for any of the goals? Don't think so, a couple of brilliant saves early that'll be forgotten now. I hope he doesn't get a stigma from this, like other keepers have in similar circumstances. He looked so furious after the third.

Christie - Disastrious. At fault for first two goals in a huge way.
Duffy - Tried I suppose. Only defender who looked bothered in the last ten minutes.
Clark - Struggled, can't pick out anything major he did wrong that I wouldn't lay at the feet of their whole defence. Was giving out to other players I noticed.
Ward - Oof, not as bad as Christie but fell out of the game after error leading to the second. Stupid mistake for fourth.

Meyler/Arter - Outplayed for large parts, but Ireland were a better team when they were on.

McClean - He does try doesn't he? That first half chance will haunt him, and they should have kept trying that avenue. Fell out of the game with rest of midfield in the second.
Brady - Has regressed a bit. Deliveries poor, link-up play vanished after 30 minutes.
Hendrick - He played apparently? Can't remember a single thing he did.

Murphy - Isolated, ineffectual. The usual.

Hoolohan - Threw himself around a bit, but he's not a miracle worker.
McGeady - Pointless to bring him on. Failed to beat his man with his first possession, passenger after that.
Long - Real "Might as well" feel to him being sent on in place of Clark. Another terrible miss, that'll continue to do his confidence a world of bad.

MON - Awful. No effective Plan B when we went behind. Last sub reminiscent of previous managers in reaction to setbacks. When it goes wrong under him, it really goes wrong.

[Stuttgart88]

As Riff Raff said , I too am in 50s and I have never experienced such a disaster. This felt even worse than Henry's handball. I have mentioned on here somewhere that we may need to experience short term failure to ensure long term progress. Here's hoping that the FAI start to look at a strategic plan rather than just hoping it will just happen
I felt livid after the Henry thing. I just feel frustrated and a bit sad today. I’m glad there was no feeling of “so near yet so far”. I watched the last hour of that game with very little tension as I felt the game was up. We showed nothing at home to Austria, Wales and Serbia to suggest that we had anything other than a bit more huff and puff to try and turn things around. We were also brutal at home to Georgia too, let’s not forget.

I’ve been sceptical about O’Neill from very early on. I think he wasted his first year. His enormous squad announcements are daft. There is no visible strategy or philosophy other than be tight and nick a goal. I have had to reconsider though when results like Vienna and Cardiff came along but even still I was highly sceptical of all the ex-players singing his praises in the press. All the October articles ran along the lines of “he doesn’t talk about the game or tactics. He just motivates you and and makes you feel tall.” That never washed with me. I want more from a manager at this level and on that size of a salary.

The evidence is clear: we have a style that picks up points on the road but that allows our opponents to do the same to us at home. Plan B is chaos.

As for the FAI, I don’t know. We always complain. Yet October was a super month for the underage sides. All of them, even the U21s for a change. And as Kingdom says, the basics of appropriate pitches and goals all appear to be in place and I think the national underage leagues with the LOI clubs holding the balance of power now is a good thing.

[Straightstory]

O'Neill's luck finally ran out. If you play primitive hoofball stuff like that you'll get found out sooner or later. At least football won tonight - passing, ball control, possession and movement - they way it should be played. The World Cup will be much improved by us not being there. As Dunphy said, nobody plays like Ireland anymore. We've been suffering this rubbish for years, first Trappatoni, now the current incumbent. It's killing us. I gave up going to games years ago. We need a new manager and we need to start playing proper football.

[ifk101]

I have had to reconsider though when results like Vienna and Cardiff came along but even still I was highly sceptical of all the ex-players singing his praises in the press. All the October articles ran along the lines of “he doesn’t talk about the game or tactics. He just motivates you and and makes you feel tall.” That never washed with me. I want more from a manager at this level and on that size of a salary.

There is a monetary value to motivation - not many can motivate the best out of others. But yes agree, we should be getting more for our money but maybe that in itself is the problem. The large salary makes the manager overtly cautious and negative in his approach because it emphasises the getting of results. That or O'Neill subsconsciously knows he is out of his depth for the salary he is getting.

[ccfcman]

If he just stood at the post instead of kicking the ball into the net who knows how this conversation would be going. I can't for the life of me figure out why his body is positioned the way it is. The worst goal we've ever conceded.

Agreed, well, up until Ward teed it up for Eriksen.

[Closed Account 2]

The trouble is under MON, we don't really have a tactical identity. Or successful (and even semi-successful) teams in the past had a definable tactical identity. Under Jack we did play a direct game with long balls, but also with a target man who was good in the air (e.g. Quinn, Aldridge to an extent) we had dynamic combative midfielders (Townsend) who could mop-up the middle of the park. Under Mick we tended to use a build with full attacking backs (Kelly, Carr, Harte) and had a bit more possession with quality passers in central midfield (Kinsella, Holland). Under Trap we were a very well drilled defence who usually didn't ship many goals (except against the very top sides at Euro 2012 and afterwards), the idea was even with limited players we could keep games tight, stay in them (e.g. Moscow) and perhaps nick something late on (or in a second leg a la Paris).

Under MON we don't really have any identity at all, we play aimless long balls when fielding strikers who haven't a chance of winning anything in the air; we alternate between a "flair" midfield devoid of ball winners one game, to one that is overloaded with ball winners (and has no incision) the next. As others have said it's telling that his ex-players keep saying stuff like "MON doesn't do tactics" and the most depressing thing about the whole campaign was the interview with the Danish manager (on Sky)at the end where he said he couldn't believe how tactically naïve we were compared to our well-drilled performance at the weekend. He was asked about how good Eriksen was and he said (whilst almost apologetically chuckling) something along the lines of "he rarely gets this much space". He even said "say thanks for the open tactics" at the end - I don't think he meant it as an intentional dig at us, he was just so shocked/perplexed at our naivety.

[Stuttgart88]

Brady and Hendrick were awful and have been all year. Brady’s deliveries have been generally brutal.

I think the criticism of Christie is a bit harsh. The rebound off the post was a bit jammy the way it went off his trailing leg. I didn’t notice whether he could have recovered quicker after the Ward breakaway. He got forward better than most of our players. I still think it’s a real shame that Doherty and Cunningham have been overlooked for so long but I think Ward’s errors were far more telling.

For years I’ve been saying that central midfield just doesn’t do what central midfield is supposed to do. Theirs got between our lines regularly. We never did to theirs. Sisto(?) would frequently carry the ball and attack space. He wanted it, always. Ours ran away from it. We are afraid to develop play through the middle. We can work the ball wide reasonably well but often too slow.

[geysir]

This team are tightrope walkers and not necessarily good ones - when they make it all the way to the other side, they look heroic. When they fall off, they look idiotic.

So many feelings on tonight but for some reason I can't stop thinking about those half-time subs and our consistent inability to implement any kind of plan B.

No-one may like plan A but we can surely all agree that it basically comes down to not conceding and nicking a goal.

Against Wales at home, we needed a plan B. Didn't have it.

Against Serbia at home, we need a plan B. Didn't have it.

Before tonight, it wouldn't have taken a genius to work out there was a realistic chance we would go in at half-time one goal behind and needing two. So O'Neill responds by taking off two workhorse, combative midfielders for two passers who can't tackle butter.

Now, I appreciate the gamble inherent in this move. But how can we move from one tactical extreme (compact shape, defensive mentality, physical intensity) to another (passers, players looking for space, possession and interplay)? How does that make sense? Who was going to win the ball for us to play with it? Hendrick, who looked gassed after 30 minutes? Brady playing (please for the last time ever) in deep central midfield?

I almost think O'Neill saw us own the ball for 10 minutes before half-time and thought Denmark would sit back and let us have it...

I don't buy the game was over after 45 minutes, although we had dug ourselves a nice comfy hole. I just wish we had an idea of how to respond to the foreseeable situation we found ourselves in.

Was a bit surprised with the first 45, just expected us to wrap up and wait for the second half to go for a goal. Instead it was more like Serbia - thrash and metal, physicality, bite, pressure. At least we went for it, but, as ever, needed so much more composure. The problem with revving these players up is they're all the more likely to overheat.
True, there was no plan B but there was no good plan A. The game plan was doomed to fail before a ball was kicked, no plan B could have salvaged that mess. We just happened to score a goal but we were shapeless with players having random strange roles. Denmark thrived in that chaos, the space and created chance after chance, our players ended up making mistake after mistake. Then O'Neill completely self destructs and sabotages the team in order to save the team.

[ifk101]

Blame is the wrong word for Christie. It's more a case of him lacking positional awareness - this part of his game is not up to international standard. And there are plenty of examples of that last night. He looks good going forward, had a great run at the start of the second half, but on the back-foot and dealing with 60 yard cross field balls .....

The warning signs with Christie have been there for awhile though. Thinking back to the Belarus game in Cork.

[OwlsFan]

O'Neill's luck finally ran out. If you play primitive hoofball stuff like that you'll get found out sooner or later. At least football won tonight - passing, ball control, possession and movement - they way it should be played. The World Cup will be much improved by us not being there. As Dunphy said, nobody plays like Ireland anymore. We've been suffering this rubbish for years, first Trappatoni, now the current incumbent. It's killing us. I gave up going to games years ago. We need a new manager and we need to start playing proper football.

Once you start quoting Dunphy and state you stopped going to support your country years ago, you lose all credibility. Apparently your team has not only to entertain you, play "proper football" and be successful before you start supporting them! Go and follow the mega rich clubs then like Manchester City and Barcelona. Those of us who follow and support Ireland will continue to do so no matter what as much of the crowd did at the end of the game. All I ever demand of a team I support is 100% from the players and no one can deny that this team has given that.

Of our relative comparisons, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, none is going to the World Cup and two didn't even get to play-offs. Scotland has tried to play "proper football" for years - where have they got with that? We made a play-off as the 4th seed in the group !! That is some achievement. We broke an almost 30 year hoodoo not once but twice in winning away at Austria and Cardiff. I was at both and they will stay in my memory for the rest of my life.

Last night was a disaster but had nothing to do with the style of play. Basic defensive errors and one was in fact caused by Ward attempting to play "proper football" and lost possession instead of playing it down the line. With a bit of luck we might have been 2 up before the Danes scored.

I was surprised by the introduction of McGeady and the removal of Meyler and Arter and it did smack a bit of panic but MON took a gamble and it failed. We had a great Euros under MON and a failed play off. For us, I think that is success. The manner of defeat is shocking but I'd prefer that to an Henry type situation.

It will be hard for MON to come back from this because we have seen it with managers before, once on a slippery slope, it's hard to stop sliding downwards. The first 4 games of the next campaign will be crucial. Poor results like Trap and McCarthy, and he'll go but for the moment I will continue to support him and the team.

[geysir]

If he just stood at the post instead of kicking the ball into the net who knows how this conversation would be going. I can't for the life of me figure out why his body is positioned the way it is. The worst goal we've ever conceded.
Did the ball not rebound off the post and then went in off the back of Christie's leg?
There was a long string of culpability for that goal starting with defending the short corner, myself I though Meyler was caught cold, no anticipation and made a powder puff challenge.

[Real ale Madrid]

Did the ball not rebound off the post and then went in off the back of Christie's leg?
There was a long string of culpability for that goal starting with defending the short corner, myself I though Meyler was caught cold, no anticipation and made a powder puff challenge.

Yep - if he is standing on the line with his back to goal like he should be then its never an issue. In fact if there was no-one on the post at all it probably would have been cleared. A colossal error.

[Polster]

Bloody heck, didn't realise we were that bad. We made Denmark look like Brazil of the 70's. Surely there isn't that big a gap between us for 11 v 11. The tactics for me were shocking. It seemed like they were all psyched up to go out and run themselves into the ground, and I think that is what they did for the first 20 minutes. Where was the composure, ball retention? proper build up play? The only chances we made were on the break or set pieces. We were the home team and after a good away result I was really hoping for a more adventurous lineup. Either Houllihan behind the front man or two up top with Long giving at least some real pace. The one area where I thought the Danes looked most suspect was in defence, but we made it easy for them. This isn't hindsight, as I said I was really hoping for a more adventurous lineup and approach, not a team just racing around everywhere trying to block as if it was american football or some other game. I do think we have some decent players, Hendricks, Brady (probably at left back), Hogan, Long (when confident), O Dowda looks good, McClean can do a job, Cunningham is worth a shout and we definitely need to give some of the younger lads a try now.

Can't be watching that type of football, I don't mind negative football at times, but that was just shocking, headless chickens everywhere, and I lay more of the blame for that on the management than the players. Something has to change for sure. The sooner Christy Hughton becomes available and can be persuaded to come on board, the better.

[geysir]

Yep - if he is standing on the line with his back to goal like he should be then its never an issue. In fact if there was no-one on the post at all it probably would have been cleared. A colossal error.
Are we talking about the same incident? The first Danish goal? if it is then you need to look at it again.
Christie wasn't on the post, he was in the middle of the goal, had made an effort at full stretch to stop the ball, the ball rebounded off the post, hit his outstretched leg into the net. Zero culpability. Meyler was the nr 1 culprit.

[Stuttgart88]

Was it not Arter who was nutmegged easily? Meyler was covering Eriksen out wide? But I wouldn't fault Christie. Randolph was correctly drawn to the front post one the Dane broke into our box. It'd have been daft for Christie not to move in a bit.

[ifk101]

Meyler was the nr 1 culprit.

No he wasn't. And neither was Christie. Hendrick was asleep.

[Polster]

No he wasn't. And neither was Christie. Hendrick was asleep.

When you think about how bad everything and everyone was last night, management and players, all this arguing over individuals to blame seems a bit irrelevant.

I kept mentioning to the boy during the first half, how frustrating it was watching every player point the finger and give out to some one else, again childish and for me just shows up individuals with no confidence or real courage.

[ifk101]

You need to point out when something is amiss, otherwise how do we improve? Granted mid-game things can get heated and become less than diplomatic or encouraging.

With the goal from the corner, it wasn't was a piece of superior skill that scored the goal. It was down to a failure of duty/ lapse in concentration. It happens but frustrating in such a game.

[mark12345]

Once you start quoting Dunphy and state you stopped going to support your country years ago, you lose all credibility. Apparently your team has not only to entertain you, play "proper football" and be successful before you start supporting them! Go and follow the mega rich clubs then like Manchester City and Barcelona. Those of us who follow and support Ireland will continue to do so no matter what as much of the crowd did at the end of the game. All I ever demand of a team I support is 100% from the players and no one can deny that this team has given that.

Of our relative comparisons, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, none is going to the World Cup and two didn't even get to play-offs. Scotland has tried to play "proper football" for years - where have they got with that? We made a play-off as the 4th seed in the group !! That is some achievement. We broke an almost 30 year hoodoo not once but twice in winning away at Austria and Cardiff. I was at both and they will stay in my memory for the rest of my life.

Last night was a disaster but had nothing to do with the style of play. Basic defensive errors and one was in fact caused by Ward attempting to play "proper football" and lost possession instead of playing it down the line. With a bit of luck we might have been 2 up before the Danes scored.

I was surprised by the introduction of McGeady and the removal of Meyler and Arter and it did smack a bit of panic but MON took a gamble and it failed. We had a great Euros under MON and a failed play off. For us, I think that is success. The manner of defeat is shocking but I'd prefer that to an Henry type situation.

It will be hard for MON to come back from this because we have seen it with managers before, once on a slippery slope, it's hard to stop sliding downwards. The first 4 games of the next campaign will be crucial. Poor results like Trap and McCarthy, and he'll go but for the moment I will continue to support him and the team.

With all due respect Owls Fan, your attitude is exactly what is wrong with the game in Ireland and exactly what gotus to last night's performance. One hundred percent is the least we expect from the players, but would it kill the players or manager to stop hoofing the ball game in and game out or to string two passes together. Many years ago Soren Lerby said he wasn't interested in playing in England because he didn't want to watch the ball fly over his head for 90 minutes every Saturday. That was 25 plus years ago. Now between Danish and Irish football, which one do you think has progressed better over the years?

[osarusan]

When the game plan is to invite the opposition on to you but keep it tight and hope to nick a goal, and you then fail to keep it tight, you are in for a long hard game.

[seanfhear]

Allowing a two on one from a corner smacks of woeful organisation .

Pretty sure there were some close calls of this in the first leg as well .

A team that is going to play ultra defensive cannot be allowing these or nearly ones either .

[Kingdom]

The corner was a succession of poor game management manoeuvres. First of all Hendrick was too slow out for the short corner support.
Secondly Arter's positioning was horrendous, to say schoolboy defending is unfair on schoolboys.
Lastly Murphy needed to be closing down that space once the ball went past Arter. Even when Cisco* got the ball Murphy was static.

*I know what his name is.

I can't convey how upset I am after watching that game, and that campaign frankly. I think of the money that could be used to coach kids instead of what is being spent on the managers salary and my blood boils.

I think Mark12345 is probably being a bit harsh on a respected poster in the form of Owlsfan, but I agree with his general premise.

[Real ale Madrid]

Are we talking about the same incident? The first Danish goal? if it is then you need to look at it again.
Christie wasn't on the post, he was in the middle of the goal, had made an effort at full stretch to stop the ball, the ball rebounded off the post, hit his outstretched leg into the net. Zero culpability. Meyler was the nr 1 culprit.

Exactly! He's standing in the middle of the goal - he is supposed to be standing on the post - therefore he is out of position to begin with. Why would your full back be standing in the middle of the goal line from a corner - schoolboy stuff.

Then as the ball is scrambled across the goal he tries to get into the position he is supposed to be in, in the first place - he kicks it in after it hits the post. If he is in the correct starting position then its a simple punt down the field.

Pathetic!

[Treaty Gooner]

It was 2v1 from the corner for a second or two, he was beaten 1v1. Let's get that straight.

[Kingdom]

I kept mentioning to the boy during the first half, how frustrating it was watching every player point the finger and give out to some one else, again childish and for me just shows up individuals with no confidence or real courage.

I agree with what you say and in my opinion it comes down to leadership; all this talk of leadership within the side is just that: talk. And it starts from the goalkeeper, all the way up the field.

Duffy's a leader, McClean's a leader, Brady is a leader. Nope, not one of them. It was widely mentioned after the Georgia game that McClean was all over the place in trying to do everything, when in fact he should have held his own position. By taking the "responsibility" to make something happen, all he's doing is negating his own influence. That shows up a flaw in Cyrus Christie in allowing McClean to do what Christie should be doing.

It's the same with the two centre-halves. I counted three occasions where Shane Duffy just ballooned the ball nowhere, two of which went over the sideline. Leadership there is calling the 5 midfielders and letting them distribute the ball, and when they don't do the necessary, balling them out of it. I'd argue that the Centre-halves are being hamstrung by the goalkeeper also. Surely others have noticed that the guy literally does not come out of his box. As a consequence the defence just drops deeper and deeper. The goalkeeper needs to be barking at the two cbs to push out and literally get up behind them to force them out.

What happened when Denmark had to clear long last night? They had 3 players chasing down the ball at all times. We just don't have that outlet because we play so deep.

We've a problem with application. The team genuinely appears to be full of energy and vigour. But we're applying it in the wrong areas. If we do the hard press in our half, it's just a waste of energy. The gap between the two banks of four and the striker is too vast, particularly when the striker is not mobile.

Robbie Brady lost the head when Denmark scored first. He was quite clearly heard to be balling all and sundry out of it in the passage of play between the two goals.

Coleman has been massively missed. And James McCarthy has been massively missed.

The manager deserves derision and to be slated for the decisions he made last night. I've no problem with a risk, but it has to be a calculated risk. This result has been coming and coming and coming. I wrote this last Sunday:

There are little things that annoy me about how we play. If O'Neill thinks that we're better off without the ball that's his call. However it's the consession of territory that annoys me. He obviously is afraid of our lack of pace at the back and is willing to allow us to defend inside the 18 line and then work the set-pieces. This will be the rock that we flounder on. Sure it narrows the space in behind for someone to get through, but drawing the guts of 16/17 players into and around your own penalty area is not clever. All it takes is one deflection, or one loss of concentration, or one misjudgement (see N.Iron penalty) and the game plan is undone.
He's been banking on absolute mental resolve throughout the campaign. It's just unfortunate that it has happened in the pivotal match of the campaign. It could have been Austria at home. It could have been Serbia away, when we got away with it. I'm gutted for the players, but not for the manager. What worries me also about last nights result is that it might be used as some form of vindication that we can't play football, or worse, that we should decamp into our own half for the full game and play anti-football. He's a spoofer, an arrogant spoofer, who feels he's above critique, and I hope to god this is the end for him.

We've got approximately a year before the next competitive games start, and the Nations League needs to be taken seriously. The FAI need to get as many games as they can in the summer, so the fringe players get an opportunity surrounded by a strong team in their preferred positions to show what they can do.

[Stuttgart88]

Exactly! He's standing in the middle of the goal - he is supposed to be standing on the post - therefore he is out of position to begin with. Why would your full back be standing in the middle of the goal line from a corner - schoolboy stuff.

Then as the ball is scrambled across the goal he tries to get into the position he is supposed to be in, in the first place - he kicks it in after it hits the post. If he is in the correct starting position then its a simple punt down the field.

Pathetic!I don't agree. I think that once Sisto was attacking the bye line inside our box and as Randolph had to then cover the near post it made sense for Christie to move in a bit. The situation had long since ceased to be just a corner.

[EAFC_rdfl]

I don't agree. I think that once Sisto was attacking the bye line inside our box and as Randolph had to then cover the near post it made sense for Christie to move in a bit. The situation had long since ceased to be just a corner.
Couldn't agree more. How can an attacker breaking into the box still be treated the way you would a direct corner into the box

[brine3]

Couldn't agree more. How can an attacker breaking into the box still be treated the way you would a direct corner into the box

Exactly, the entire team was standing around as if a direct corner was being taken, even though the short corner had started a good 5-10 seconds earlier.

It's as if nobody had ever drilled them on short corners in training. Wouldn't surprise me.

[Real ale Madrid]

I don't agree. I think that once Sisto was attacking the bye line inside our box and as Randolph had to then cover the near post it made sense for Christie to move in a bit. The situation had long since ceased to be just a corner.

Harping on about it seems pointless but his starting position was wrong and if he took up the position he was supposed to in the first place he would have never been scrambling. The corner isn't "over" until the ball is clear! There was plenty cover in the middle and the fact that the ball squeezed in the far post only exacerbates the error in my book and proves why cover is needed in that exact position in the first place.

[Polster]

I don't agree. I think that once Sisto was attacking the bye line inside our box and as Randolph had to then cover the near post it made sense for Christie to move in a bit. The situation had long since ceased to be just a corner.

We were awful, simple fact of the matter, had we fluckily went 2-0 up I still think we'd have lost. It wasn't close enough to bother looking at individual moments, yes games change on little things, but from start to finish we were as bad as I have ever seen, 5-1 was a fair reflection and Denmark are far from world beaters.

[Real ale Madrid]

Couldn't agree more. How can an attacker breaking into the box still be treated the way you would a direct corner into the box

An attacker breaking into the box right by the by line - the cover was needed at the far post! There was none - 1-1.