Republic of Ireland V Oman 3rd September 2014 & Georgia 7th September 2014

[Charlie Darwin]

It's on Setanta Ireland, assuming you're still in Gaillimh, otherwise I assume it's on Premier Sports. It'll be on stream if you can't access them.

[IsMiseSean]

Yeah, still in Gaillimh. Not coming up on the Sky guide for Setanta Ireland either. Maybe it will closer to the time.

[Charlie Darwin]

That's weird, I read it a while ago but it's not showing up when I search for it. Maybe I read something from the game in 2012. It will definitely be on TV though, probably on Setanta.

[pineapple stu]

On the radio news this morning that Shay Given is in line for a call up, on the condition that he plays?

Interesting.

Can't find anything online though. He played for Villa last night in their loss to Leyton Orient.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Saw it on Facebook too, so must be true then...
Maybe as 'third choice'? Randolph/Westwood injured?

[gastric]

Report here. Don't think this is good for Irish football. Would rather see the likes of Lawlor get a chance than Shay.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/european-championships/shay-given-in-line-for-shock-international-return-reports-30543802.html

[Stuttgart88]

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/european-championships/shay-given-in-line-for-shock-international-return-reports-30543802.html

Indo saying it's increasingly likely he'll play if the reports are accurate. These are the reports that say he'll play. So, it's increasingly likely he'll play if the reports that he'll play are accurate. Nice one Indo.

[gastric]

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/european-championships/shay-given-in-line-for-shock-international-return-reports-30543802.html

Indo saying it's increasingly likely he'll play if the reports are accurate. These are the reports that say he'll play. So, it's increasingly likely he'll play if the reports that he'll play are accurate. Nice one Indo.

Thanks Stutts, trying to steal my thunder! And DeLorean, you should have thanked me rather than Stutts' example of very badly written English.:eek:

[Stuttgart88]

I've just thanked you to make you feel better.

[paul_oshea]

I have to say i LIke this approach from O'Neill. Too often we hear crap about trying players for the future and breeding in as an excuse for covering losses and downplaying. O'Neill is very much about the here and now and getting the results required through whatever means. Its very refreshing to see and hopefully we wont see as much on here and other sources about building for the next campaign or any of that crap. Get the players in who will get us the results regardless of age or experience.

What can Given add though with so few games? I can't imagine a lot and he was poor for Ireland before being dropped. Seems I'm not the only one concerned about Forde though. If Westwood gets a consistent run at club level it will be interesting to see if he looks better for Ireland than he has done previously. Sorry for forde a very nice fella by all accounts but hopefully it means the shifting of him from the No.1 spot - serious liability as demonstrated over the last few games.

[Stuttgart88]

Paul, after Portugal everyone was concerned by Forde! I agree with O'Neill's thinking in this regard too , although Forde a "serious liability" is harsh but the fact remains that he is not a top drawer keeper. He has put in some great performances, especially in Germany and Sweden but I'd just have more confidence in Shay. That said, he was rooted to his line for Orient's goal last night and Forde's willingness to take high balls was welcome after Shay's tenure.

On the assumption Shay is sharp enough Id welcome his return. I think Keane's judgment will be instrumental here. This campaign is no time for sentimentality or being nice to future prospects.

[Closed Account]

Thanks Stutts, trying to steal my thunder! And DeLorean, you should have thanked me rather than Stutts' example of very badly written English.:eek:I think Stutts was trying to be funny, I had a wry smile anyway. Reportedly.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Hang on, is this the same Forde who certain people claimed was 'too good for Celtic' (even now!) and people want to see him dropped?

He's not a great keeper nor will he ever be, but rather him than Shay at this stage. You can only go 'Back to the Future', so far...
Doubtless a certain Corkonian has 'talked' him into this?

[Closed Account]

Hang on, is this the same Forde who certain people claimed was 'too good for Celtic' (even now!) and people want to see him dropped?

He's not a great keeper nor will he ever be, but rather him than Shay at this stage. You can only go 'Back to the Future', so far...
Doubtless a certain Corkonian has 'talked' him into this?
Being too good for Celtic(which I don't agree with) and not being good enough for Ireland are not mutually exclusive. Getting Shay back is a backwards step in my opinion though.

Forde and Westwood should have a clean slate coming into the next 3 games. Management should make a decision before the Oman game and stick to it right through the Germany game. That should be the prerogative.

[DeLorean]

And DeLorean, you should have thanked me rather than Stutts' example of very badly written English.:eek:

Well I was actually thanking Stutts for ripping the p!ss out of the conclusively inconclusive article, not the link to the article itself. I feel bad though so I have now thanked both of your posts :)

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

http://www.newstalk.ie/Givens-potential-comeback-explained-by-the-Irish-Suns-Neil-ORiordan

Neil O'Riordan elaborates on concerns about Forde/Westwood and the rumored Given comeback.

[Charlie Darwin]

Bringing back Shay would be a very Trap-like decision - kicking the can of finding a new goalkeeper down the road in order to qualify by any means. I'd rather we didn't lumber from campaign to campaign with no real strategy for long-term improvement.

[gastric]

I think Stutts was trying to be funny, I had a wry smile anyway. Reportedly.

I know and agree!

[DannyInvincible]

Interesting news on Given. I've always been a big fan of Shay, but I've no idea how sharp he is of late as I haven't seen him play. How can he demand to play when he's been mostly bench-warming for Villa and playing in the odd cup game?


That's weird, I read it a while ago but it's not showing up when I search for it. Maybe I read something from the game in 2012. It will definitely be on TV though, probably on Setanta.

Nothing here yet: http://liveonsat.com/LJS_FT_friend_intl_ALL.php

It usually indicates which channels will be showing a game, although I recall our friendly against Costa Rica in Philadelphia never appeared on it either.


Bringing back Shay would be a very Trap-like decision - kicking the can of finding a new goalkeeper down the road in order to qualify by any means. I'd rather we didn't lumber from campaign to campaign with no real strategy for long-term improvement.

Unfortunately, I fear that's all we'll ever be able to do unless something radically changes in Irish football. It's a sign that the up-and-coming talent is lacking.

[Stuttgart88]

Bringing back Shay would be a very Trap-like decision - kicking the can of finding a new goalkeeper down the road in order to qualify by any means. I'd rather we didn't lumber from campaign to campaign with no real strategy for long-term improvement.
I think O'Neill should pick our best keeper, not try to find our future keeper. I don't know which of our keepers is best at the moment but that's for O'Neill to make a firm decision on. O'Neill saw both Westwood and Forde in the same game recently and mustn't have been too convinced.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Given is an Irish footballing legend. I can't believe he is seeking guaranteed playing time in order to come back for Ireland. He must have been misquoted, or the media must be conniving against him.

[DannyInvincible]

Given is an Irish footballing legend. I can't believe he is seeking guaranteed playing time in order to come back for Ireland. He must have been misquoted, or the media must be conniving against him.

Are you feeling OK today, TOWK? It's not like you to give someone the benefit of the doubt. :p

[DeLorean]

I've always felt safe with Westwood in goals. I'd go with him. Bringing back Given might make a small bit of sense if he was playing regular football himself, but it just seems a bit daft.

[GypsyBlackCat]

I'd give Westwood the nod. He's playing first team football at Sheff Wed and was very unlucky at SAFC with injuries at the wrong time. I rather have Westwood, Forde and one from Elliott or Randolph.

[ArdeeBhoy]

I'd rather we didn't lumber from campaign to campaign with no real strategy for long-term improvement.
Hang on, in the other thread you said we 'have the players to do well'. Hmm, doesn't seem like it!

[geysir]

When he was fit Westwood was our nr1 after Given, if he has returned to form then Westwood should be able to eclipse Forde, marginally.

When Westwood was out of the reckoning then Forde was the nr 1, the best of the rest. Not much use howling at the moon over our goalkeeping options.

[Stuttgart88]

I wonder who the defenders prefer playing ahead of?

In my preferred first XI selection from earlier in the week I gave Westwood the nod. I can genuinely see the merit in having Shay's experience in Georgia though.

[ifk101]

Given's experience is what separates him from the other two but there's a question mark hanging over his head. He's not playing at club level and he didn't leave the international scene on a high. Think I'd go with Westwood, time to look towards the future and place trust in a player that will be around for more than just a couple of games/ one campaign.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Why is Forde getting so much flak for the Portugal game? Look at the defence he had in front of him. Westwood conceded 6 against Germany didn't he? Forde helped keep the score down against them.

Westwood is injury prone. There is a decent chance that he will end up getting injured at some point if he starts the campaign as #1. Maybe better to continue with Forde rather than making an unnecessary change and risk Westwood getting injured during a match or changing goalkeepers within days/months of qualification games. It's not like there is much between them to begin with.

[DeLorean]

Does Westwood have any obvious weakness, outside of being injury prone? Given's not great on crosses, Forde is poor with the ball to feet and his agility has been questioned on here at times. Of couse, Given's agility may not be what it once was at this stage either for all we know.

[Charlie Darwin]

Hang on, in the other thread you said we 'have the players to do well'. Hmm, doesn't seem like it!
No idea why you think these are mutually exclusive. We have the players to do well, that doesn't mean they're going to be used properly.

Personally, I don't think calling on a keeper who's been retired for two years, who a lot of people thought was past it at the time and has barely played a game of football since is very encouraging for the future.

[Bray Head]

We have 3 keepers who have started the season as number 1 for their club in the championship - Forde, Westwood & Randolph. Given is no 2 choice at Villa and won't play another game till the FA cup in january unless Guzan gets injured.
Bringing Given back makes no sense and would not do anyrhing for the moral of the other keepers in the squad.

[DeLorean]

Why is Forde getting so much flak for the Portugal game? Look at the defence he had in front of him. Westwood conceded 6 against Germany didn't he? Forde helped keep the score down against them.

My faith in Forde has taken a dent in the more recent Irish friendlies. He was poor for a number of goals... the Serbia winner I think, definitely one of the Portugal goals and the concession of the penalty against Costa Rica too. I don't think anybody is exempting the defence from blame with regards the Portugal game, they were a shambles.

I don't think Westwood was to blame for any of the German goals, or at least not badly at fault.

[jbyrne]

That's weird, I read it a while ago but it's not showing up when I search for it. Maybe I read something from the game in 2012. It will definitely be on TV though, probably on Setanta.

heard it advertised for setanta on the radio this morning

[DeLorean]

Yeah, it's on Setanta Ireland from 7pm.

Setanta TV Listings (http://www.setanta.com/ie/listings/index.html)

[Stuttgart88]

I though Forde was poor against Portugal notwithstanding the donkeys he had in front of him. He patted a couple of shots back into the danger area, shots I think he could have either caught or pushed further away. I also read he was a bit flappy against Costa Rica. His concession of the penalty was poor judgment.

I thought he was more than decent against Italy bar one misplaced ball from feet that put us in a bit of bother. It's not like Shay never did the same though, and quite frankly his taking of high balls is the best we've seen since Bonner in the late 80s.

Westwood is suffering from having been in nets at home to Germany. He looked a bit off the pace and was maybe beaten a bit easily by one or two of the goals but in his first appearances he did really well, and saved the say at home to Macedonia I think. What differentiates Westwood from the others, in my opinion, is his sharpness and agility. He also has a super kick and his handling is generally good. I have seen him get totally lost under crosses though and his body language lacked any positivity during Sunderland's poor start last season.

I think there's little between them. If we had time to experiment I'd pick Westwood. For the here and now I can see what Given would bring.

[Charlie Darwin]

heard it advertised for setanta on the radio this morning
I know my footie.

Owen Cowzer @OCowzer (https://twitter.com/OCowzer) · 58m (https://twitter.com/OCowzer/status/504962189112123392)

Setanta announce they have exclusive rights to all Ireland friendly home internationals for the next four years.

[ArdeeBhoy]

No idea why you think these are mutually exclusive. We have the players to do well, that doesn't mean they're going to be used properly.


Make your mind up then! Though agreed about Given.

[Charlie Darwin]

Make my mind up about what? I don't need to. We have the players to do well, but we also have the players to not do well if the manager chooses to.

[Stuttgart88]

Yep, I think there's a good team to be put together from what we have available. I'm just not sure it will be put together though.

[paul_oshea]

Bringing back Shay would be a very Trap-like decision - kicking the can of finding a new goalkeeper down the road in order to qualify by any means. I'd rather we didn't lumber from campaign to campaign with no real strategy for long-term improvement.

You mean like we have done for the last 10 years or so?

[Charlie Darwin]

You mean like we have done for the last 10 years or so?
The start of my first sentence should tell you that's exactly what I mean.

[paul_oshea]

You play your best players when available. It doesnt matter about age, experience, morale or any other crap. Why do people play emphasis on sideline issues - excuse the pun. Its about getting the best results right now and doing that my putting your best available players out to achieve that result.

At the end of the campaign i dont give two hoots about how many players we brrought in, its about qualification or not. That's really building for the future.

[IsMiseSean]

Setanta have snapped up the rights to friendly games along with U21 & Women's games.

Setanta to show republic friendlies (http://www.setanta.com/ie/setanta-to-show-republic-friendlies/)

[ArdeeBhoy]

Make my mind up about what? I don't need to. We have the players to do well, but we also have the players to not do well if the manager chooses to.
Hmm, still seems a tad contradictory...

[Stuttgart88]

If we were the type of country who could rely on regular qualification it'd make some sense to take a long term view with some players. But given the situation Ireland is in it he best way to plant seeds for the future is to qualify now. It'll get passions burning again and importantly it'll bring some money into the Association.

[Fixer82]

Shay is past it I'm afraid. I found over the last couple of years he had in goal for us he was particularly slow at getting down to low shots.
Estonia at home, Armenia at home, Croatia in Euro 2012.

I would not be in favour of bringing him back.
It has all the hallmarks of doing to his reputation what becoming national team manager did to Stan's*

*bad things, very very bad things

[Charlie Darwin]

You play your best players when available. It doesnt matter about age, experience, morale or any other crap. Why do people play emphasis on sideline issues - excuse the pun. Its about getting the best results right now and doing that my putting your best available players out to achieve that result.

At the end of the campaign i dont give two hoots about how many players we brrought in, its about qualification or not. That's really building for the future.
Yeah, we really capitalised on that Euro 2012 qualification. It's all very well saying play your best players, it's another actually playing them. A 38 year semi-retired goalkeeper who was struggling enough two years ago is a curious choice for 'best player'.

[DannyInvincible]

The final 27-man squad is as follows:

David Forde, Keiren Westwood, Shay Given, Rob Elliot;
Richard Keogh, Marc Wilson, Seamus Coleman, John O’Shea, Alex Pearce, Joey O’Brien, Stephen Ward;
James McCarthy, Glenn Whelan, Darron Gibson, Aiden McGeady, Anthony Pilkington, James McClean, Robbie Brady, Stephen Quinn, David Meyler, Wes Hoolahan;
Robbie Keane, Shane Long, Daryl Murphy, Jon Walters, Kevin Doyle and Anthony Stokes.

Stand-by list:

Darren Randolph, Ciaran Clark, Paul McShane, Shane Duffy, Damien Delaney, Simon Cox and Conor Sammon.

Andy Reid has withdrawn due to injury.

[Stuttgart88]

Real shame about Reid. I share TOWK's concern over the CB hierarchy.

Glad to see O'Brien and Pearce making the grade. 4 keepers looks odd.

I think the rest is pretty straightforward although I thought Gibson was unlikely to be brought over. Doyle is good enough for sure, but still lucky to make it.

Edit: why no Hendrick? Injury?

Did McClean come back for Wigan yet?