Macedonia V Republic of Ireland - Saturday, 4th June 2011 - Euro 2012 Qualifier

[Stuttgart88]

I'm not saying I'd start with Cox myself, but I always think it's good to have a positive, game-changing substitution option from the bench. Very often having to make a change weakens our team, so it'll be good to have a change up our sleeves that could strengthen the team. Let Robbie & Cox run the legs of their CBs and the let Long exploit that later.

[Stuttgart88]

German referee for Saturday, Florian Meyer. Anybody know anything about him?

[SwanVsDalton]

According to Wikipedia he was the fourth official for Milan vs Liverpool's 2007 CL final. This article is similarly stark though and has a good final line. (http://worldreferee.com/site/copy.php?linkID=544&linkType=referee&contextType=bio)

[French Toasht]

Outside of the top four or five clubs in England, the overall standard dips quite significantly and, I would argue, is very much on a par with the general standard around Europe. Even those players we have at the bigger clubs in England, you couldn't even describe them as regulars really.


I have to disagree. The likes of Middlesborough and Fulham of recent years have gone very far in Europe, and even if our players are not playing in the top half of the EPL, just to be playing against the calibre of player that plays in that league, week in week out, either on the pitch or training ground is a massive benefit for our players.

I think when you quoted the Scottish league as 15th in Europe, that gave me perspective. The SPL is a league I don't rate at all and genuinely think neither of the OF clubs would survive in the EPL. As for the rest of the clubs, well I think Rovers and Sligo could hold their own in that league against the rest of their teams. So if most of the leagues the Macedonia players are playing in are ranked below the Scottish league then I am not unduly worried.

Of course they have one star player in Pandev, but hopefully our (makeshift) back for will be on top of their game.

I think the biggest threat to the Ireland is ourselves. If we go one up early on, do we have the nerve to consolidate our lead and kill the game off or will we allow the opposition to get back into the game due to a lack of mental strength?


As an aside, I never understand Trap going public with his team a few days before the kick off. I see no reason why you would show the opposition you cards so early. May be a minor point, but why help make the Macedonians task in preparing for the game that bit easier?

We won't make things easy for ourselves on Saturday and it will be a nail biter right to the finish, but in truth thats probably why I love Ireland games so much!

[Yard of Pace]

In terms of size alone, I think Cox will offer a greater degree of penetration despite the fact that Long is, well, Long and we all know what he can do.

Shane did look a bit knackered on Monday and if we do need a goal late on I'd much prefer to be springing him from the bench rather than Cox. It's a gamble from Trap but I think the time Keane and Cox have spent together recently will bear fruit on Saturday night.

[Fixer82]

I actually think Keane and Cox linked up much better with each other than I ever saw Long and Keane link up. Where I think Long and Doyle know each other better. I think Cox will do well and Long coming off the bench will kill them off completely with his pace and strength. Hopefully Hunt will also be up for this one and run at them and throw them into complete disarray with his out and out mentalness ;)

[French Toasht]

Just on the Long/Cox debate, I'm just baffled as to Cox being a starter. Trap is clearly not paying any attention to the form book here at all.

Cox - 19 Premier League games this season - 1 goal
Long - 45 Championship games this season - 23 goals

Cox may have played well against the NI reserves but really is that enough to merit ripping up the form book?

[Sullivinho]

Jonuz talks up both sides, but predicts Robbie's 50th will have to wait.. (http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/soccer/keane-must-wait-for-50th-goal-says-jonuz-156575.html)

[theworm2345]

Cox may have played well against the NI reserves but really is that enough to merit ripping up the form book?
For Trap? Yes.

[drummerboy]

I think McGeady could be the match winner for Ireland in this one. We really need him to perform.

[BonnieShels]

I actually think Keane and Cox linked up much better with each other than I ever saw Long and Keane link up. Where I think Long and Doyle know each other better. I think Cox will do well and Long coming off the bench will kill them off completely with his pace and strength. Hopefully Hunt will also be up for this one and run at them and throw them into complete disarray with his out and out mentalness ;)

Completely agree with you on all fronts here.

And your last line gave me my first guffaw of the day.

[tommy_c12000]

In terms of size alone, I think Cox will offer a greater degree of penetration despite the fact that Long is, well, Long and we all know what he can do.

Shane did look a bit knackered on Monday and if we do need a goal late on I'd much prefer to be springing him from the bench rather than Cox. It's a gamble from Trap but I think the time Keane and Cox have spent together recently will bear fruit on Saturday night.

He was still buzzing aroung closing down defenders and the keeper on the 90 min mark, no way you can say he looked knackered. The boy is flying at the moment and we wud get 90 mins of high tempo football from him

[tommy_c12000]

Just on the Long/Cox debate, I'm just baffled as to Cox being a starter. Trap is clearly not paying any attention to the form book here at all.

Cox - 19 Premier League games this season - 1 goal
Long - 45 Championship games this season - 23 goals

Cox may have played well against the NI reserves but really is that enough to merit ripping up the form book?

At least one member on the site has helped me to reassure myself that Im still Compos Mentis

[tommy_c12000]

I actually think Keane and Cox linked up much better with each other than I ever saw Long and Keane link up. Where I think Long and Doyle know each other better. I think Cox will do well and Long coming off the bench will kill them off completely with his pace and strength. Hopefully Hunt will also be up for this one and run at them and throw them into complete disarray with his out and out mentalness ;)

Linked up better together against a 3rd choice NI team and looked reasonably competent against a weak Scotland defence. That vindicates putting him in for his 1st competitive start in Skopje alright. The boy has only ever scored one prem goal and has the grand total of 8 premiership starts. Absolute rubbish. You cannot justify starting a bit part West Brom player (and that is what he is with 8 starts this season) in front of Long.

[geysir]

Those sleeping pills are taking their time to kick in, Tommy.

[SwanVsDalton]

Hard to disagree. We should start out best options, and Long's form and record, domestically and internationally, is far superior to Cox. Just a few weeks ago he was being touted to replace Keane in our starting team. I don't necessarily think it's a key decision, if Keane is fit, but I'd rather we hit them with everything we have early on. It'll be interesting to see if Cox's selection really does herald a different approach.

[tommy_c12000]

Those sleeping pills are taking their time to kick in, Tommy.

Just taken another 2 so im good to go for another 15 mins id say but screen is looking blurrier by the sec!

(took 6 before they worked last nite, must be all the adrenaline pumping for sat nite)

[ArdeeBhoy]

The issue shouldn't be the attack, but the usual.

As in Feck all creativity in midfield & as dodgy (& poor) a full-back combination as I can remember.
Both are accidents waiting to happen.....

[tetsujin1979]

Ward hasn't played with McGeady (assuming he's on the left from the reports) so starting those two as a left sided pair in a qualifier is a lot more risky than Kilbane + McGeady IMO

[theworm2345]

The issue shouldn't be the attack, but the usual.

As in Feck all creativity in midfield & as dodgy (& poor) a full-back combination as I can remember.
Both are accidents waiting to happen.....
I'm convinced Kilbane banged your missus.

[the doc]

I'm guessing St. Ledger won't be risked then? Probably a sensible decision given the length of time he's been out of action.

I have to agree with this, Trap would get slaugheterd by the media if he started St Ledger and he then broke down.


Better to play safe, have St Ledger on the bench, ready and willing to come on later in the game, when players tire and we need to close out the game.

My gut feeling is O'Dea will partner O'Shea.

[geysir]

Much patience is being afforded to St Ledger to see if he can prove match fitness.
Loyalty works both ways.

[Stuttgart88]

We know that CM and full back are positions we're weak in, but it's been like that for ages. The creativity comes from our width and the inventiveness of our forwards, plus the use of long balls.

This will be Andrews' first competitive start since Paris and he was well up for it that night. We need a big performance from him. He's both a ball winner and a guy who can drive forward. His worst games for us have been bad, his best games have been very good. We need him and Whelan to be on top form. Whelan showed his capability in recent months: good enough to thrash Bolton, not good enough to compete against City. He's good enough for Macedonia.

[Kingdom]

Looks like Robbie's out. If match was tomorrow he wouldn't take part - source RTE

[Stuttgart88]

The match isn't tomorrow.

[Charlie Darwin]

We must have the most innuendo-happy team in the world.

[Drumcondra 69er]

Expected Kikbane to start but still would have prefered Ward. Would be very disappointed if Cox starts ahead of Long, bad move for me, Keane and Long linked well v Slovakia despite Keanes lack of sharpness. Praying that he'll make Saturday, surely players should be told to take it handy on the tackles last session before the flight ffs...and it ****ed rain in Thessaloniki all day just while Ireland hits a heatwave, forecast for ****ing rain in Skopje on sat and all....

[geysir]

Sounds like you are sporting a hefty hangover, Drums.

[Kingdom]

The match isn't tomorrow.

Be nice! I've since read the thread and realised it's old news. Also saw the expected team. Not surprised about Cox ( http://foot.ie/threads/152120-Macedonia-v-Ireland-Match-Thread?p=1491901&viewfull=1#post1491901 ) .

Seen elsewhere (YBIG perhaps?) that Trap has spoken of a different approach due to the physicality of them in Dublin, and the relative failure of the long ball. If there is any truth in that, then surely he's looking at keeping the ball on the deck and playing a more composed game - Foley, Fahey and Coleman would benefit in those scenarios.

Just echoing Bonnie's post earlier, I've been in knots all week in anticipation. Nothing grips me like the week leading up to an Ireland game. I love it.
Convinced we'll win. Backed Aiden to score and Ireland to win (again), amongst a couple of others.

Genuinely excited now. Boarding a plane in about 12 hours for my most exotic away trip yet. €1.60 a pint - if only I drank! Anyone going via Belgrade tomorrow?

[Stuttgart88]

Nothing grips me like the week leading up to an Ireland game. I love it. Me too. I even buy The Indo every day during match week.

Speaking of which, can we try and second guess David Kelly? I reckon there'll be references to:

Lily-livered decision to play Georgia in Germany
Keane is a horrible person
Trap is an obstinate has-been
Trap didn't know Harte was Irish

[Kingdom]

Why do you buy that garbage? Emmet, Carl, Gav and Pat in the Times are standard fare during international week. Kelly? pfffft - second guessing him is like second guessing which direction Hyland's eyes will be looking in the herald

[geysir]

Stutts just likes to get a bit of indignation off his chest.

[Stuttgart88]

'cos I live in London, mate.

The Indo gets printed here so it's the same version that appears in Ireland.

The Irish Times international version is only an abbreviated version of the real thing and never has up to date football. Sometimes it doesn't even have any football.

The Examiner isn't on the shelves quickly enough for my commute.

Anyway, I reckon Kelly will cite the no-shows as evidence that the players have all lost faith in Trap's medievel methods.

[geysir]

How did we manage before these 24/7 updates?

Already available - a picture of the moment when Robbie pulled up in training 'after injuring himself in a tackle with Damien Delaney 15 minutes into the practice game. Assistant manager Marco Tardelli described it as a “slight problem”

http://www.irishtimes.com/sports/images/tile/2011/0602/1224298292668_1.jpg?ts=1307044756

[Charlie Darwin]

I'm gonna take a long punt and predict he mentions Trap sipping pina coladas by the pool in his villa.

[geysir]

I predict that he mentions Traps age in every paragraph.

[BonnieShels]

Apparently as per Early the First 11 lost 5-0 against the substitutes. Now in saying that, the teams I saw today had Murphy in goal for the the firsts and Given in for the subs.

[Stuttgart88]

They probably saw what Delaney did to Keane and let them win.

[Charlie Darwin]

I'm having cold feet. I think he'll be sipping margaritas instead.

[therock67]

(Lengthy) tactical preview of Saturday's game for anyone interested:
http://www.thefreekick.com/blog/2011/06/macedonia-v-ireland-tactical-preview/

And a quick guide to the likely Macedonia team:
http://www.thefreekick.com/blog/2011/05/macedonia-the-bluffers-guide/

[geysir]

From the tactical preview
'Taking inspiration from the Champions League victory for a distinctly ordinary Barcelona side, the key to Ireland’s defensive performance relies in not exposing the makeshift back four to constant pressure'

I really don't know how that shower of distinctly ordinary wasters managed to win the CL. We have to take inspiration from that fluke.

[Fixer82]

Linked up better together against a 3rd choice NI team and looked reasonably competent against a weak Scotland defence. That vindicates putting him in for his 1st competitive start in Skopje alright. The boy has only ever scored one prem goal and has the grand total of 8 premiership starts. Absolute rubbish. You cannot justify starting a bit part West Brom player (and that is what he is with 8 starts this season) in front of Long.

I would start Long every time for Ireland (even ahead of Keane at the moment) but from what I could see there was more of a gel with Cox and Keane than Keane and Long. I'd still start Long personally but if Cox starts I won't be disappointed

[Noelys Guitar]

It has to be remembered Long got a heavy knock to the head early in the home game and that seemed to effect him. It will be a surprise if Cox starts but I can see why Trap would choose him. He has very quick feet and if he does play I can see him winning us a peno. Once he gets on the ball in the box he shields it so well and turns so fast that it might lead to a a few rash challenges from Macedonia. Long is a better finisher though and better in the air than Cox. Very close call and they could yet both start (depending on Robbie's injury). I'm hoping Kelly gets the nod at right back because he is a natural defender and is good in the air. Roll on Saturday.

[BonnieShels]

Let us remember the good times and the fact that the keeper's positioning was tosh...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDympITk3A4

[ArdeeBhoy]

I'm convinced Kilbane banged your missus.

If only.

But him and McShane, FFS. We almost don't deserve to qualify if these two are the best we can come up with.



We know that CM and full back are positions we're weak in, but it's been like that for ages. The creativity comes from our width and the inventiveness of our forwards, plus the use of long balls.

And whilst agreeing with S88, this game plan looks more tired with every passing match, despite Trap's relative excellence in trying to get something out of virtually nothing.
This will prove to be more our long-term downfall, than even two third-rate full-backs.

[Kingdom]

http://www.irishtimes.com/sports/soccer/2011/0602/1224298292668.html



Robbie Keane will take some part in Ireland training tomorrow, despite sustaining a leg injury in training this morning. The captain’s fitness remains a concern but the prognosis appeared to be more positive when the team arrived in Skopje this evening.

Ireland’s record goal-scorer had to drop out of the session at Gannon Park today, after injuring himself in a tackle with Damien Delaney 15 minutes into the practice game.

Assistant manager Marco Tardelli described it as a “slight problem” before the team’s departure this morning, but added: “I think he will be okay for Skopje.”

Since then, sounds emerging from the camp suggest he will not even take tomorrow off.

Ireland play Macedonia in the Euro 2012 qualifier on Saturday evening, and while Keane is certain to start if fit, it is the decision of who to play alongside him that may prove the most controversial.

West Brom’s Simon Cox appears to be in pole position ahead of Shane Long, after impressing manager Giovanni Trapattoni during the Carling Nations Cup.

Long sat out the fledgling tournament while on Championship play-off duty with his club Reading, but before Cox’s goal-scoring debut against Northern Ireland and his outing against Scotland, he was firm favourite to step in for the injured Kevin Doyle.

The striker earned high praise from his manager after putting in a man-of-the-match performance in the 3-2 friendly defeat to Uruguay in March, but that came after 70 minutes against Macedonia in which he got little change from a physical visiting defence.

Trapattoni may also be taking into account the physical and mental demands of a play-off final defeat to Swansea City on Monday, but given Long’s energy and return for his club this season – he scored 21 in 44 league games – it would be a surprise to see him omitted in favour of a newcomer who has struggled for regular football this year.

However, it is also possible the manager feels the Tipperary man might be a better impact player off the bench.

Should Cox score in an Ireland win, of course, all will be forgotten.

Victory will depend just as much on a defensive line denied its leader Richard Dunne, whose yellow card in the 2-1 win over Macedonia three months ago ruled him out of Saturday’s encounter.

It looks likely Stephen Kelly will start at right back rather than Paul McShane, while Tardelli suggested Darren O’Dea will get the nod over Seán St Ledger to partner John O’Shea at the heart of the defence.

“I think Darren O’Dea will start because St Ledger has been out for three months and that’s a long time coming into a game like this,” added Tardelli.

St Ledger has not played since picking up an injury in a training ground collision with Ciaran Clark in March and his lack of match-fitness, plus O’Dea’s physicality, which served him well in March’s game, appears to have swayed Trapattoni.

The experience of Kevin Kilbane is set to be preferred to the adventure of Stephen Ward, who scored on his debut against Northern Ireland last month.

In midfield, Stephen Hunt and Aiden McGeady will man the wings, while Glenn Whelan and Keith Andrews are set to start in the centre of midfield.

Rep of Ireland (probable): Given; Kelly, O’Dea, O’Shea, Kilbane; McGeady, Whelan, Andrews, Hunt; Keane, Cox.

[Crosby87]

After reading the last few pages now I think Sat Mornings headline will be:
HUNT FOR LONG COX
Trap orders Hunt to get balls to Long, Cox. (They already have them says Tardelli).
No innuendo intended.

And Sun Mornings Headline must then be:
Long Cox Lift Ireland
Long and Cox score to give Eire 3-2 Win in Skopje, please don't call our offices and complain about our headlines, its just what happened.

[TrapAPony]

Macedonians sweat on star of their own

YOU wait all week for an injury story of real substance and then two come along at once, as Macedonian defender Goran Popov joined Robbie Keane on the doubtful list for tomorrow night’s European Championship qualifier.

The locals crammed around the door that separates arrivals from the car park at Skopje’s Alexander The Great airport last night were more worried about Keane’s ability to sign autographs than his fitness.

But this being the security-conscious Ireland squad, they never got near him so instead they were left to sweat over an injury story of their own.

Popov, the big Dinamo Kiev left-back who excelled in Dublin in March, is one of the defenders Macedonian manager Mirsad Jonuz wants to get near Keane in the Philip II — The Macedonian stadium tomorrow night.

Keane will play — that’s what Jonuz suspects anyway — but he is not too sure about Popov’s ability to shake off an ankle injury that accompanied him through the same arrivals area after his flight from Russia on Monday.

To that extent, the Macedonia coach is now prepared to throw his normal caution to the wind in the early summer heat of Skopje and dispatch Parma teenager Stefan Ristovski in at the deep end for his first cap.

Goalkeeper Edin Nuredinoski, who practically threw the ball into the net at the Aviva in March, is also under threat to hold onto his position — after failing to hold Aiden McGeady’s shot in Dublin — with Jonuz ready to gamble on Martin Bogantinov between the posts.

"I will not hide from change if changes have to be made for this big game," said Jonuz at his final press conference in Ohrid yesterday before the team decamp to Skopje.

"Popov will train on Friday and he will have treatment to give him every chance but if he does not make it, then I will look at young Ristovski, who has potential.

"We need goals and we need points and we need to brave against Ireland, particularly as Shay Given is back in goals for them.

"My plan is to play three attackers and look to win the game."

Macedonians this week welcomed star player Goran Pandev home in triumph after his Italian Cup win with Inter Milan against Palermo on Sunday.

Pandev announced after his team’s training session yesterday that he is to see out the three remaining years on his contract with Marco Tardelli’s former team.

"I have a contract with Inter until 2014 and I will certainly remain at Inter," said Pandev as he acknowledged this was not his club’s finest season.

"Before you go to a great club like Inter you are aware of the expectations and the demands," he added.

"I know that this is the weakest we have played for some time but we will put that right in the future.

"For now I must concentrate on Macedonia and Ireland.

"We have a big game on Saturday and we must win. It is our last chance in the qualifiers so we have to win it.

"We played good football in Dublin but we didn’t score enough goals. We cannot make that mistake again against a team of Ireland’s strength."

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/soccer/macedonians-sweat-on-star-of-their-own-156635.html

[tricky_colour]

According to Wikipedia he was the fourth official for Milan vs Liverpool's 2007 CL final. This article is similarly stark though and has a good final line. (http://worldreferee.com/site/copy.php?linkID=544&linkType=referee&contextType=bio)

Germany gave Jedward 8 points so we will be fine, expect us to be awarded a couple of dubious penalties and a similar number of dubious sendings off of the Macedonian's!! ;)

[tricky_colour]

Looks like Robbie's out. If match was tomorrow he wouldn't take part - source RTE

Just as well as he would be in a empty stadium.