Roy Keane on Henry and John Delaney [Archive] - Page 2

tricky_colour

20/11/2009, 2:03 PM

Thing is FIFA cheated by rigging the draw mid competition to suit their desire to get the big yeams through.

That is clealy a message to the ref and linesman that cheating is acceptable to get the desired result.

That makes the FIFA unfit to run the World Cup and hence makes the world cup a sham of a competition.

The 'winner' of the world cup cannot say they could beat Ireland in a fair match in because none of the teams in the competetion they will play will have done that.

Ireland should play the 'winner' for the World Cup trophy.

Emmet7

20/11/2009, 2:06 PM

How many other poor decisions that impacted any other clubs or countries have you campaigned so strongly against as a matter of interest?
Yup, I'm a football fan meself.

This kind of farce has been brewing in soccer for years. Week in week out there are similiar farcical decisions such as the one in England where the ball went wide and the ref gave a goal or the one a couple years ago where Roy Carroll saved the ball several yards behind the goal line.

Leaving aside that this is Ireland, this result shows once and for all the need for video refereeing on important decisions. It's now in most other major sports, why should soccer be exempt? Maybe it's because we have a crowd of conservatives at the top of the tree who want to see nothing major change.

Maybe they should just allow Adidas sponsored teams compete in the World Cup and be done with it.

Because we all know come 2014, it may be Nike who are a major sponsor of the World Cup and the demand will be to give an easy route to the finals for Nike sponsored teams. Or it may be Adidas again or some other major sponsor.

The integrity of the sport has been damaged. There is only one way to restore that integrity.

Stuttgart88

20/11/2009, 2:08 PM

And that negates his point about Ireland bottling chance after chance, the shocking defending leading up to the goal, and the hypocritical nature of Irish fans, players and management crying foul when it suits them how?Nothing wrong with Keane's points about the missed chances or the poor defending (not helped by the French being offside - and the ball would have gone out of play if not illegally controlled by Henry) but the Georgia reference is plan wrong. A slightly better example would be McShane's handball at home to Montenegro - blatant penalty - but not a deliberate attempt to deceive and unseen in any event.

I tell you what Jebus, it's a good job Charles Manson never set up a camp in Ireland. There seem to be plenty of people around capable of being sucked into a dangerous personality cult all too easily.

Milesmayhem24

20/11/2009, 2:10 PM

A lot of what he said made sense, I have to say.

The problems I'd have were singling out Given in particular - the ball coming at that trajectory, which Dunne would normally clear (but was nudged out of the way by Squillaci who was offside) is not the keeper's ball. That's just bitterness

What he says about Gerogia is right though. We got a penalty for a refereeing mistake and nothing was made of it. Just because this was a bigger game, shouldn't make a difference

I'm also p*ssed off with his comment we were "afraid of making the next step". Bullsh*t, yes we missed plenty of chances, but their keeper had two stormers and would we have played like that if we were afraid??

Stuttgart88

20/11/2009, 2:11 PM

I'm sure Roy Keane just manfully shrugged off any injustices he felt he suffered playing football. Apart from trying to maim people who hadn't realised he'd done his knee ligaments in of course.

superfrank

20/11/2009, 2:17 PM

Thing is FIFA cheated by rigging the draw mid competition to suit their desire to get the big yeams through.
And yet Slovenia's win over Russia hasn't been discredited by FIFA. Also, it is arguable that Ukraine would be a far more attractive draw than Greece, yet that result stands.

China, a massive potential market who are also sponsored by Adidas, failed miserably in qualifying.

People were writing up their conspiracy theories on here as soon as the referees were announced.

One missed decision by the ref has been ridiculously overblown and it's getting extremely embarassing, your own post is a clear example:
The 'winner' of the world cup cannot say they could beat Ireland in a fair match in because none of the teams in the competetion they will play will have done that.

Ireland should play the 'winner' for the World Cup trophy.
Utter nonsense.

colster

20/11/2009, 2:18 PM

Has anyone read this in the Times.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/international/article6925119.ece?token=null&offset=12&page=2

Keane has never forgiven Delaney for failing to contact him during the incident and misleading the media as to his whereabouts after his controversial exit from the World Cup in 2002 after a row with Mick McCarthy over facilities in Saipan.

Keane said: �John Delaney talks about the honesty and integrity of the game but I would not take any notice of that man.

�People forget what went on in the World Cup in 2002 and that man talks about honesty. He didn�t even have the courtesy to call me then, all he said when he was interviewed was I was on the Island somewhere.

What a bitter idiot? 7 years later and he's still whinging about someone not calling him. I bet Delaney would have got a 2 word answer if he had done.

NeilMcD

20/11/2009, 2:18 PM

Yeah I think the motivation of Keanes comments are the huge problem here. MOst of what he says is rubbish and is motivated by bitterness in this case, esp about Given etc, and possibly about McShane. Even the comment, that he felt sorry all of the fans and managment and for some of the players implies he does not feel sorry for all of them.

I do think the calls for a replay are embarassing to be honest, esp by the Fianna Fail politicians.

Stuttgart88

20/11/2009, 2:20 PM

What he says about Gerogia is right though. We got a penalty for a refereeing mistake and nothing was made of it. Just because this was a bigger game, shouldn't make a differencePlenty was made of it - there was no end to talk of how lucky we were - but at no point was there any intent to deceive or cheat or break the rules on behalf of any Irish player. That's the critical difference for me.

There's an expression "never look a gift horse in the mouth". Obeying that motto is all WE were guilty of in that instance. Thierry Henry was guilty of cheating. I'm sure it was instinctive and I'm sure he's probably a nice guy but that's the difference between the two situations.

jbyrne

20/11/2009, 2:21 PM

..but his comments about Delaney are not far off the mark. 70 euro for a child to watch a home game at Croker etc etc blurg

and up to €100 in the stade de france

That's it lads, slag him off and don't try and answer his point about Georgia or the shocking defending

two players off side in the immediate lead up to the goal. that is actually good defending. the players cant help it if the linesmen missed the offsides.

we didnt cheat the goal v georgia and andrews was denied a perfectly good goal in the same game

ronburgundy

20/11/2009, 2:21 PM

And that negates his point about Ireland bottling chance after chance, the shocking defending leading up to the goal, and the hypocritical nature of Irish fans, players and management crying foul when it suits them how?

but jebus he also talked a lot of nonsense. he said the players werent mentally strong enough, that they were afraid of the next step. absolute bull**** after such a brilliant performance where nobody hid and everybody stood up and was counted. and saying that given should have come for it is just tryin to spin it in some way because of his dislike of shay given. do you really expect any real irish fan to say 'good man roy, your always right'. when he played for ireland i thought the passion he showed on the pitch was for the love of his country now i think it was just all about his reputation

Milesmayhem24

20/11/2009, 2:35 PM

There's an expression "never look a gift horse in the mouth". Obeying that motto is all WE were guilty of in that instance. Thierry Henry was guilty of cheating. I'm sure it was instinctive and I'm sure he's probably a nice guy but that's the difference between the two situations.

If you're sure it was instinctive, then how is that not France obeying the principal of never looking a gift horse in the mouth. Are you saying he was guilty of cheating as he didn't obey the rules of the game? Then surely every single player is at one time or another, either by diving, pulling jerseys etc.

The blame has to go the referee/linesman for missing something everyone else saw. Should never have even gotten to the handball stage as it was offside before that

dynamo kerry

20/11/2009, 2:37 PM

Who signed Paul Mc Shane again? in reference to where are the defenders in the 6 yard box?

Bitter man .. bringing Saipan into it... but his comments about Delaney are not far off the mark. 70 euro for a child to watch a home game at Croker etc etc blurg

off topic moment:

mac- sorry, are you really having a dig because kids pay full price?

I trust not.

If you are, why are you bringing kids to the more expensive seats?

incidentally - I toook out your recording of the marseillas the other day. class stuff.

Fixer82

20/11/2009, 2:55 PM

He's right. we're bitching and moanin bout being robbed once again. The match should have been over in 90 minutes and McShane should never have let that ball bounce....

dynamo kerry

20/11/2009, 3:03 PM

He's right. we're bitching and moanin bout being robbed once again. The match should have been over in 90 minutes and McShane should never have let that ball bounce....

I agree the game should have been over in 90 min and I also agree the ball bouncing was bad. Not sure it was definitely just mcshane's fault though.
bad free to give away in the first instance too.

Stuttgart88

20/11/2009, 3:03 PM

If you're sure it was instinctive, then how is that not France obeying the principal of never looking a gift horse in the mouth. Are you saying he was guilty of cheating as he didn't obey the rules of the game? Then surely every single player is at one time or another, either by diving, pulling jerseys etc.

The blame has to go the referee/linesman for missing something everyone else saw. Should never have even gotten to the handball stage as it was offside before thatWhat I'm saying is that he cheated, it was probably spur of the moment rather than anything premeditated. I doubt he was saying to himself "bugger, only 20 mins and it's a penalty shoot out, I'd better cheat next time I get the chance". Yes, players jostle and pull and do all kinds, but come on, don't tell me you can't see the difference between that and dekliberately using your hand to prevent a ball going out of play and setting it up nicely for a pass?

As for looking gift hoses, back to the original point - no Ireland player cheated in the Georgia game so it's not comparable. The Georgia penalty is more akin to, for example, Keane being allowed to score when obviously offside. It wouldn't be Keane's fault he was given onside, but it was Henry's fault he controlled the ball deliberately and more than once with his hand.

I find it hard to blame the ref as he was conned, but a linesman should have seen it, and the offside.

The Don

20/11/2009, 3:08 PM

He's right. we're bitching and moanin bout being robbed once again. The match should have been over in 90 minutes and McShane should never have let that ball bounce....

No he shouldnt, but unless Henry handballs it what difference would it make how poor the defending was. But Keane assertion that given should have come for it is rediculous.

jbyrne

20/11/2009, 3:08 PM

The match should have been over in 90 minutes and McShane should never have let that ball bounce....

doesnt excuse the cheating.

i re-iterate my point above that it was actually good defending to push up and leave two of them offside. if we hadnt pushed up we would probably have been in a better position to clear it. players have to be able to rely on the officials to get their decisions correct

Fr Damo

20/11/2009, 3:10 PM

Has anyone read this in the Times.

What a bitter idiot? 7 years later and he's still whinging about someone not calling him. I bet Delaney would have got a 2 word answer if he had done.

J D was in Ireland during Saipan as he was Hon. Treasurer with the FAI and not even a board member. So why the hell would he contact R Keane? M McCArthy would have walked if that had happened.
He might well have had the intellect and where withall to have the conversation with Keane but it was not his place to do so. J D was on telly at the time simply because he was availble in Ireland (all the other suits were in Japan) but in no way conected with the incident.

Keane should have finished the press conference when the Ireland question was asked and vented his frustration at his poor results on the reporters present and not the FAI.

R�iteoir

20/11/2009, 3:12 PM

I find the multiple Facebook campaigns, the "flaming torches" march on the French Embassy scheduled for tomorrow, the foaming at the mouth ranting about Refereeing Conspiracies, the Sponsors thing, the "FIFA only want big countries at the Finals" (someone should let the Slovenes, Algerians, North Koreans and New Zealanders know that they really shouldn't bother to turn up next year) more embarrasing and cringeworthy than Keane answering some journos loaded questions (and making some decent points amongst the stream of conciousness) in his usual forthwright style.

If people go down this route then it'd only be proper and right to have the following other games replayed - "in the spirit of preserving the integrity of the game" of course:

Argentina vs. England - 1986 World Cup

Argentina vs. West Germany in the 1990 World Cup Final - horrendous dive to win the penalty which won the match

England vs. West Germany in 1966

Italy vs. Czechoslovakia in the 1934 World Cup Final - sure didn't Benito have a big hand in selecting the Referees for the game - even had them round to dinner the night before for a "pre match talk"

Italy vs. Australia in 2006

Both Korea's matches against Spain and Italy in 2002

England vs. Portugal in Euro 2004

We could play them all over the one weekend in a curtain raiser to the Finals in South Africa - of course the problem is trying to get the original teams together - I'm sure we could sort out these minor details later on

Fixer82

20/11/2009, 3:13 PM

doesnt excuse the cheating.

i re-iterate my point above that it was actually good defending to push up and leave two of them offside. if we hadnt pushed up we would probably have been in a better position to clear it. players have to be able to rely on the officials to get their decisions correct

regardless of the (clear) offside ya still have to play the whistle and clear the ball....

ArdeeBhoy

20/11/2009, 3:14 PM

R.M.Keane is an egotistical PR*ck. End of.

An embarassment to his country, city and club. The next Dunphy-in-waiting.

He's not even worth the bandwidth of discussion....

Morbo

20/11/2009, 3:16 PM

R�iteoir

20/11/2009, 3:21 PM

Hasn't he been sacked yet? :confused:
I knew it wouldn't take him long to use this as an opportunity to deflect attention away from what a crap manager he is as well as getting another dig in at players like Given. Roy telling people to get over it :D the ironing is delicious.

Keane was asked what he thought in his Friday Press Conference, as were all the Prem & Championship Managers who had a link to this

Not like he's just decided to have a rant

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/euro2008/arshavin438getty.jpg

BradyIsMyHero

20/11/2009, 3:31 PM

Keane is a sad and bitter individual.

Still can't get over Saipan

Fr Damo

20/11/2009, 3:31 PM

Keane was asked what he thought in his Friday Press Conference, as were all the Prem & Championship Managers who had a link to this

Not like he's just decided to have a rant

It was nothing but a rant.... he brought Delaney and Saipan into it. I have not heard any other Irish connected managers press conferences yet but I bet they kept the time they spent answering this topic to a minimium. Most are more concerned about the future i.e Tomorrow Saturday or Sunday, when their team is playing.

CMcC

20/11/2009, 3:39 PM

Whatever about the other stuff he said he calls it right with McShane.

You cannot let the ball bounce in the box or you are asking for trouble.
You cannot let a ball pass you by and hope it goes out over the end line without at least makeing a decent effort to sheppard it properly.
You certainly cannot let a player of TH's ability get around goal side of you to enable him to get anything (hand or foot) on the ball.

You GET FEFFING RID full stop.

NeilMcD

20/11/2009, 3:40 PM

He was in bad form no doubt, did you see his reaction to the phone going off.

Alf Honn

20/11/2009, 3:40 PM

J D was in Ireland during Saipan as he was Hon. Treasurer with the FAI and not even a board member. So why the hell would he contact R Keane? M McCArthy would have walked if that had happened.
He might well have had the intellect and where withall to have the conversation with Keane but it was not his place to do so. J D was on telly at the time simply because he was availble in Ireland (all the other suits were in Japan) but in no way conected with the incident.

----

Not on the board?! Of course he was, he was the Treasurer at the time. He thought enough of himself to offer McCarthy a new contract in the bar during that World Cup without approval from the CEO.

Look, there's no doubt Keane was out of order in Saipan and McCarthy was correct to do what he did.

The point being put forward by RK is that JD was taking the limelight back in Dublin (leaving a mtg early to go on Dunphy's Last Word, I recall) and making sweeping statements to the Irish public about his whereabouts when, if he had bothered contacting him, the truth would have come out that he was in the hotel. Not too much to expect.

OwlsFan

20/11/2009, 3:42 PM

Poor defending

How can you defend properly against offside and handball? :confused:

Georgia Penalty

Who cheated on that? Who asked for a replay?

Didn't put the French away

Only valid point and I agree but then most people are aware of this. No praise of the performance though.

The only thing can comes out of that interview really is that Saipan, like for most of us, is never going to go away and he still feels it.

Ipswich vs Wednesday this Saturday. Mediocrity vs more Mediocrity. Hope the latter wins though;)

bennocelt

20/11/2009, 3:45 PM

Nothing at all wrong with what Roy said - the truth hurts

Fr Damo

20/11/2009, 3:52 PM

Think you'll find he was Hon Treasurer and not Finance Director, and there is a world of difference. He wasn't even fulltime with FAi back then. As I said, the only reason he was on the media then was because he was left behind.

I Don't go want to go into the details about Saipan again, wish RK would do the same. THE TOOL.

Alf Honn

20/11/2009, 3:58 PM

The man with the cheque-book is always full-time!:)

Metrostars

20/11/2009, 4:00 PM

Bit funny him telling everyone to get over it. I'm sure Haaland wished that Keane had gotten over his vendetta way back when.

CMcC

20/11/2009, 4:08 PM

Poor defending

How can you defend properly against offside and handball? :confused:

Ever hear of playing to the whistle?
The offside (while it should have resulted in a free out) was not the reason McShane didn't deal with the situation.
If he did deal with it, TH would not have got near the ball to handle it.

Milesmayhem24

20/11/2009, 4:09 PM

What I'm saying is that he cheated, it was probably spur of the moment rather than anything premeditated. I doubt he was saying to himself "bugger, only 20 mins and it's a penalty shoot out, I'd better cheat next time I get the chance". Yes, players jostle and pull and do all kinds, but come on, don't tell me you can't see the difference between that and dekliberately using your hand to prevent a ball going out of play and setting it up nicely for a pass?

As for looking gift hoses, back to the original point - no Ireland player cheated in the Georgia game so it's not comparable. The Georgia penalty is more akin to, for example, Keane being allowed to score when obviously offside. It wouldn't be Keane's fault he was given onside, but it was Henry's fault he controlled the ball deliberately and more than once with his hand.

I find it hard to blame the ref as he was conned, but a linesman should have seen it, and the offside.

Yeah of course I can see the difference. But really it's just the degree of "cheating". Personally, I find diving a lot worse and there was a good bit of that on wednesday. Look at Anelka. The ref didn't give a penalty so must have thought it was a dive yet he didn't book him.

Regardless if someone cheated or not, it was a mistake by the officials (linesman most likely in this case), just as it was in the Georgia game. Even had he not handled it but taken it down on his chest, it still shouldn't have been allowed for the offside. Would we be calling for a replay then?

Anyway, Keane's comments about the players were ridiculous

Billy-Green

20/11/2009, 4:14 PM

I'm absolutely fuming with Keane, how dare he stick his nose in this and sh*t stir. He is using this as an excuse to have a dig at the fai over past differences. A bitter little man who just won�t leave things be. He should be ashamed of his lack of backing for a replay and has done the fai and this country as a whole no favours in our attempt to get justice served. Shame on you Roy Keane!!!!! :mad:

Greenbod

20/11/2009, 4:18 PM

Keane's opinions on International football should be given all the attention that the opinions of any failing rural east Anglian football club manager deserve.

......very little.

OwlsFan

20/11/2009, 4:20 PM

Ever hear of playing to the whistle?
The offside (while it should have resulted in a free out) was not the reason McShane didn't deal with the situation.
If he did deal with it, TH would not have got near the ball to handle it.

How can you defend someone who is ahead of you because he if offside and if the ball hadn't been controlled with the hand it would have gone out of play?

jebus

20/11/2009, 4:20 PM

Keane's opinions on International football should be given all the attention that the opinions of any failing rural east Anglian football club manager deserve.

......very little.

So who do you support?

Greenbod

20/11/2009, 4:21 PM

So who do you support?

Ireland

jebus

20/11/2009, 4:26 PM

Ireland

So you don't support anyone at club level?

Also I've just watched the full Roy Keane interview rather than soundbytes and he is 100% right

I've never been a big fan of his, always believed he should have stuck out the World Cup in 02 and complained afterwards but he's spot on with everything he says in that interview, 100% correct Roy

Greenbod

20/11/2009, 4:36 PM

So you don't support anyone at club level?

Also I've just watched the full Roy Keane interview rather than soundbytes and he is 100% right

I've never been a big fan of his, always believed he should have stuck out the World Cup in 02 and complained afterwards but he's spot on with everything he says in that interview, 100% correct Roy

Never said I didn't support anyone at club level............the clue to what is being discussed here is at the top of your screen - Foot.ie forums>international>Ireland.

You are the hypocrite here.......Keane is taking to extreme, exactly what you have accused many on here of doing, ie..He's still droning on and bitter about a percieved injustice done to him. The difference is it was 7 years ago!, the injustice done to the Irish team was 2 days ago

Also, nothing he says, whether correct or incorrect, changes the fact that Henry cheated.

Alf Honn

20/11/2009, 4:40 PM

I've never been a big fan of his, always believed he should have stuck out the World Cup in 02 and complained afterwards but he's spot on with everything he says in that interview, 100% correct Roy

---

Agree. Maybe in the cold light of next week when the emotion subsides, it will become evident how much of a chance Ireland themselves spurned to reach the World Cup.

Greenbod

20/11/2009, 4:46 PM

---

Agree. Maybe in the cold light of next week when the emotion subsides, it will become evident how much of a chance Ireland themselves spurned to reach the World Cup.

This has been evident to most people all along........the point is, despite the spurned chances, and remember the French had practically no chances to spurn!, we still could have got through had Henry not cheated.

OneRedArmy

20/11/2009, 4:47 PM