"A skinny rat, a skinny little rat"

[an_ceannaire]

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/dunphys-a-skinny-rat-a-skinny-little-rat-1911608.html

and Dunphy was a;ways banging on about how much he liked Hunt :D

Your still ****e tho Stevie!!!!

[as_i_say]

I have heard a few interviews from hunt lately and you would need a translator like trap has to understand half of what he says. Dead right on this occasion though

[Den Perry]

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/dunphys-a-skinny-rat-a-skinny-little-rat-1911608.html

and Dunphy was a;ways banging on about how much he liked Hunt :D

Your still ****e tho Stevie!!!!

Dunphy was wrong in what he said no doubt in my mind, but Hunt has showed once again how stupid and immature he is with an outburst more akin to a playground. I can never remember having despised an Irish player before, but this guy is a complete moron

[as_i_say]

Dunphy was wrong in what he said no doubt in my mind, but Hunt has showed once again how stupid and immature he is with an outburst more akin to a playground. I can never remember having despised an Irish player before, but this guy is a complete moron

Which is more moronic? Hunt's reaction or the incredible stupidity of Dunphy's post match analysis? Hunt may be a few subs short of a bench but he's right in this case. Dunphy was an absolute disgrace the other night.

[Hibs4Ever]

Hunt is 100% correct in what he said. Hopefully RTE take note and get that pr!ck Dunphy off the studio panel

[centre mid]

People will tune-in in their droves to see what Dunphys reaction is now, RTE cant buy this publicity. Dunphy is earning his money this week.

[an_ceannaire]

why would they get rid of Dunphy!!! He brings in ratings! You may not like him but by God people love to lsiten to him. In order for you to hate him, you must be listening to him!! Lots of people claim to hate him, but everyone watches him! Would you rather have someone like Redknapp who bangs on about how world Class the ballboys are :rolleyes:

And as for Hunt, I cant abide him :mad:

[dr_peepee]

If it's true then Hunt is well out of order... No two ways about it.

[Duggie]

who decides who talks to the press or do the conferences? hunt shouldnt be put forward. he gets on my nerve but hes one of us and I support him but he has to big a mouth IMO.

[Den Perry]

Which is more moronic? Hunt's reaction or the incredible stupidity of Dunphy's post match analysis? Hunt may be a few subs short of a bench but he's right in this case. Dunphy was an absolute disgrace the other night.

Dunphy is an analyst, he gets paid to speak his views however controversial people find them. Hunt on the other hand is a professional footballer who has become extremely outspoken and its not as if he is a senior member of the squad who's views are of significance.Ok he's 28, but in terms of importance he's well down the pecking order(except in his own opinion of course).

However, for a person in the public eye to react in the way he has using the language he has, displays nothing but a lack of intellect.

[magnumpi]

hunt's not the most articulate, but if i'd put in the kind of performance they did on saturday and then heard dunphy, i'd blow my lid too.

i hate people talking about how dunphy bumps up the ratings on tv etc. that's demeaning to football viewers/the general public. Irish Football shouldn't be akin to the ****ing X-Factor. People should want to hear about in which areas right-minded analysts think the team has room for improvement, but also should hear the players that represent their country showered with praise where it is due.

dunphy did absolutely nothing as a player, and therefore i don't respect his opinion, especially when he's being so outspoken.

giles - class player, and adds valued critique most of the time.

sounness - adds a balanced view to what can sometimes be one-sided analysis.

just need a 3rd panel member. ok, not cunningham, or whelan, but FFS that cnut dunphy should not be on the public pay-roll.

[an_ceannaire]

Dunphy and Giles are a team, the most compelling interesting team on Football Analysis today.
Brilliant TV, if you dont like it, dont listen to it.....there is no one forcing you to. Turn on RTE and listen to Rico and Gabriel Egan instead.....
Far more people would be gutted than delighted if RTE chopped Eamo

And once again, Hunt is a useless loudmouth muppet

[John83]

... Would you rather have someone like Redknapp who bangs on about how world Class the ballboys are :rolleyes:
Is that really so much better? How ****ed up is the Irish mentality that unchecked, unjustified bile is preferable to some vacant hagiography?

[Duggie]

Dunphy and Giles are a team, the most compelling interesting team on Football Analysis today.
Brilliant TV, if you dont like it, dont listen to it.....there is no one forcing you to. Turn on RTE and listen to Rico and Gabriel Egan instead.....
Far more people would be gutted than delighted if RTE chopped Eamo

And once again, Hunt is a useless loudmouth muppet

i listen to them as most of us still do but in fairness dunphy talks utter crap most of the time. he just has a go for the sake of it, thats his thing. he never does any proper analysis. have u ever heard him praise an irish manager ? i havent.

[Den Perry]

Is that really so much better? How ****ed up is the Irish mentality that unchecked, unjustified bile is preferable to some vacant hagiography?


here we go again, John 83 defender of the morals of Ireland....

[eaststand85]

I think Hunt & Dunphy have far more in common than they realise. Neither a particularly great player (although in fairness both give/gave everything for their country) but both very outspoken men who sometimes say more than they should for the wrong reasons.

And is it just me but do they also look a little alike? ;)

[tiktok]

Do I have to pick a side, because I think they're both terrible?

Hunt runs off at the mouth too much, the lad is passionate, but not that bright.
Dunphy now sets out be outraged and controversial regardless of the match, he's become a parody of himself.

[irishfan86]

Normally I'd say Hunt was out of line, but what Dunphy said post-Italy was probably as close to treason as you can go without being strung up.

Absolutely dire.

I'm all about criticism when it's required, but there wasn't much to criticize on Saturday. There were more positives than negatives, despite the sour taste a lot of us felt, and to say what he said was downright unpatriotic.

He's got an agenda as we all know, but it has nothing to do with the success of the Irish national football team.

Dirty rat is bang on the mark. Get him off the air.

[an_ceannaire]

Normally I'd say Hunt was out of line, but what Dunphy said post-Italy was probably as close to treason as you can go without being strung up.

Absolutely dire.

I'm all about criticism when it's required, but there wasn't much to criticize on Saturday. There were more positives than negatives, despite the sour taste a lot of us felt, and to say what he said was downright unpatriotic.
He's got an agenda as we all know, but it has nothing to do with the success of the Irish national football team.

Dirty rat is bang on the mark. Get him off the air.


Jesus Wept :rolleyes:

[Soccer Mom]

Dunphy does what he does and says what he says because he is a self-publicist that has make a lot of money out of being controversial. Of course Hunt's comments are feeding into that. Dunphy loves nothing better than when someone rises to the bait. Something like Hunt's intemperate comments were just what Dunphy hoped for when he went into his rant on Saturday.

PS: Pat Kenny is talking about this topic on radio now. Just what RTE and Dunphy want - to boost the ratings on Wed.

[Dun Laoire]

Hunt is getting a bit of stick in here and i have to say it saddens me.

[Drumcondra 69er]

Do I have to pick a side, because I think they're both terrible?

Hunt runs off at the mouth too much, the lad is passionate, but not that bright.
Dunphy now sets out be outraged and controversial regardless of the match, he's become a parody of himself.

Good post. I quite like Hunt but he definitely talks to much and doesn't seem to be the brightest spark.

Dunphy has been a parody of himself for a long time now, once he gets a hobby horse it utterly blinds him. I watched the RTE analysis on line on Sunday night after a bit of a sunday session with some of the Birmingham Irish lads that were over. I'd been out straight after the game as well and gave up trying to hear what they were saying on the telly in the pub so hadn't heard anything that had been said after it. I put the analysis on hoping to see the goals again and instead got to listen to the most vitriolic nonsense I've heard Dunphy talk in years.' Terrible perfoamnce, shameful....'!! Shameful???!!! What a crock of sh1t.

Dunphy talks about it being personal between Trap and Andy Reid yet bases his entire analysis of the game on the fact that Reid was missing rather then what happened on the pitch. It's now personal between Dunphy and Trap yet Eamon won't see it that way. It's wearing thin at this stage but as people have said it brings in ratings so he won't be coming off our screens anytime soon. Be interesting to see what he says on Wednesday but in it's own way it'll probably be quite predictible.

[Emmet7]

Serious football people think Dunphy is a muppet.

The only people who think Dunphy is cool, are the bandwagoners who only watch Ireland play when they are winning, those who have no affiliation to their local soccer team, those who never lined out for any soccer team in their lives, those who would switch the channel when a League of Ireland match is on.

He's not a serious commentator. I just hope the Irish players and Trapattoni understand that. He is a sensationalist, nothing else.

I watched the Irish game repeat on sky sports on saturday night/sunday morning. It was actually a very good performance from the Irish team. Apart from the goals, they were far far better than most people make out. The Italians hardly got a look at goal the entire match. Pirlo did not control the ball or anything like it. Pirlo was a disaster in Bari by the way, the Irish midfield shut him out of the game and he had to be subbed.

Dunphy has a record of stabbing people in the back at their moment of greatest triumph. Eg Seamus Heaney, Jack Charlton, Trapattoni, and so on. It's disgraceful really. But it's how he makes his money. Find a person who is popular and then attack them. It sells papers.

He has no interest in attacking the coach of a Phoenix Park team for example. That wouldn't sell papers.

The guy has no principles, no honour and no respect for anyone. So why should anyone have respect for him? Hunt is right!

Dunphy hates to see anyone succeed and tries to drag them into the gutter where he is most comfortable.

[geysir]

Rats are getting a raw deal here but I suppose 'skinny little rat' is saying he is not even a real rat.

I would have to confess to having similar mental images to Hunt whenever Dunphy's spiteful pot boils over.

[Den Perry]

Serious football people think Dunphy is a muppet.

The only people who think Dunphy is cool, are the bandwagoners who only watch Ireland play when they are winning, those who have no affiliation to their local soccer team, those who never lined out for any soccer team in their lives, those who would switch the channel when a League of Ireland match is on.

He's not a serious commentator. I just hope the Irish players and Trapattoni understand that. He is a sensationalist, nothing else.

I watched the Irish game repeat on sky sports on saturday night/sunday morning. It was actually a very good performance from the Irish team. Apart from the goals, they were far far better than most people make out. The Italians hardly got a look at goal the entire match. Pirlo did not control the ball or anything like it. Pirlo was a disaster in Bari by the way, the Irish midfield shut him out of the game and he had to be subbed.

Dunphy has a record of stabbing people in the back at their moment of greatest triumph. Eg Seamus Heaney, Jack Charlton, Trapattoni, and so on. It's disgraceful really.

The guy hates to see anyone succeed and tries to drag them into the gutter where he is most comfortable.

You have not got a clue. Your first paragraph is just total bo***x. I think Dunphy was way out of order the other night, but there are times when he does talk sense, and overall I like watching him, even if it is only for the entertainment factor...and I am affiliated to my local team, I do play football and I do watch LOI.

You're statement re Pirlo on Saturday night proves that you my frien are clueless about the game

[blobbyblob]

As much as Dunphy has a right to say what he wants about the Irish performance and is paid to do so, Stephen Hunt has a right to comment on Dunphys performance - theres not too many that would disagree with him.

Fair play to Hunt for having his say.

Its reasonable to assume that the players hears about or reads reviews on their performances - Someone like Dunphy has an awful lot of power at his disposal with the comments that he makes. If those comments are detremental to a players confidence and in turn their performance in a green shirt, then it becomes a performance.

I dont think that Hunt would have had such a strong opinion on the subject if that wasnt the case.

Golden Rule of Criticism: First look at who is giving it. Then decide whether its worth taking or not.

[Den Perry]

As much as Dunphy has a right to say what he wants about the Irish performance and is paid to do so, Stephen Hunt has a right to comment on Dunphys performance - theres not too many that would disagree with him.

Fair play to Hunt for having his say.

Its reasonable to assume that the players hears about or reads reviews on their performances - Someone like Dunphy has an awful lot of power at his disposal with the comments that he makes. If those comments are detremental to a players confidence and in turn their performance in a green shirt, then it becomes a performance.

I dont think that Hunt would have had such a strong opinion on the subject if that wasnt the case.

Golden Rule of Criticism: First look at who is giving it. Then decide whether its worth taking or not.

So are you saying that it was worth taking as Dunphy has so much "power"?:rolleyes:

[Emmet7]

You have not got a clue. Your first paragraph is just total bo***x. I think Dunphy was way out of order the other night, but there are times when he does talk sense, and overall I like watching him, even if it is only for the entertainment factor...and I am affiliated to my local team, I do play football and I do watch LOI.

You're statement re Pirlo on Saturday night proves that you my frien are clueless about the game

Yeh, what team do you play with and what level?

Just give us the league and the division and that will tell us your ability.

Dunphy hasn't a clue.

How many times did you watch Saturday's game? If only once watch it again. Watch it with your own eyes and don't depend on Dunphy with his bitter twisted agenda to tell you how it was.

Watch the game man. Ireland dominated the first half.

Tell me the chances Italy had to score? If we are to believe Dunphy it could have been 4 or 5 nil to the Italians given their dominance.

The problem is a lot of people don't know how to analyse a game. But football people know how to analyse a game and they know a spoofer when they see one. And Dunphy is a spoofer par excellance.

In the land of the blind, the one eyed man (Dunphy) is king. Unfortunately his analysis is wide of the mark most of the time.

[Scram]

The Hunts do appear like hillbillies even though I admire their tenacity.

Surely something like “Anyone taking Eamonn seriously should be locked up, he’s RTE football punditry’s version of Ryanair’s O’Leary” and just laughed it off, would have been more reasonable?…making Dunphy look like the fool instead of vice versa.

ps. Emmet 7, to say “Ireland dominated the first half”…or any part of the game is way off the mark!

[an_ceannaire]

Yeh, what team do you play with and what level?

Just give us the league and the division and that will tell us your ability.
Dunphy hasn't a clue.

How many times did you watch Saturday's game? If only once watch it again. Watch it with your own eyes and don't depend on Dunphy with his bitter twisted agenda to tell you how it was.

Watch the game man. Ireland dominated the first half.

Tell me the chances Italy had to score? If we are to believe Dunphy it could have been 4 or 5 nil to the Italians given their dominance.


Ok first of all, who the hell are you?
And what kinda sanctamonious up your own hole bull**** comment is that!!!!
What difference does it make what level of football Dan or any of us played....what the hell does that have to do with anyones ability to comment on a game of football?? By your reckoning do you have to be a gigolo to enjoy a good porno???
Get off the soapbox ya clown!!!:rolleyes:
what level did you play at!!! the cheek of you!!!!!!
:rolleyes:

[eaststand85]

The Hunts do appear like hillbillies even though I admire their tenacity.

Surely something like “Anyone taking Eamonn seriously should be locked up, he’s RTE football punditry’s version of Ryanair’s O’Leary” and just laughed it off, would have been more reasonable?…making Dunphy look like the fool instead of vice versa.

Absolutely correct but Hunt likes the limelight too.

[Den Perry]

Yeh, what team do you play with and what level?

Just give us the league and the division and that will tell us your ability.

Dunphy hasn't a clue.

How many times did you watch Saturday's game? If only once watch it again. Watch it with your own eyes and don't depend on Dunphy with his bitter twisted agenda to tell you how it was.

Watch the game man. Ireland dominated the first half.

Tell me the chances Italy had to score? If we are to believe Dunphy it could have been 4 or 5 nil to the Italians given their dominance.

The problem is a lot of people don't know how to analyse a game. But football people know how to analyse a game and they know a spoofer when they see one. And Dunphy is a spoofer par excellance.

In the land of the blind, the one eyed man (Dunphy) is king. Unfortunately his analysis is wide of the mark most of the time.

Backtracking are we? now it depends on what level I've played to?

In addition, if you read my post you would see that I didn't agree with Dunphy's analysis of Saturday night.So either your eyesight needs fixing or you truly are a dope.

PS I'm sure I havn't played to your level on FIFA10

[DeLorean]

Yeh, what team do you play with and what level?

Dunphy hasn't a clue.

I presume the 7 after the username is your age?

Dunphy played with Man Utd, pretty high level. I think he's full of sh!t but going by your logic it should give him a terrific insight.

[Den Perry]

I presume the 7 after the username is your age?

Dunphy played with Man Utd, pretty high level. I think he's full of sh!t but going by your logic it should give him a terrific insight.

rofl... brilliant!!

[Emmet7]

I presume the 7 after the username is your age?

Dunphy played with Man Utd, pretty high level. I think he's full of sh!t but going by your logic it should give him a terrific insight.

When did he play at Man Utd?

Dunphy signed as a schoolboy with Man Utd, as have thousands of other kids.

He didn't play one senior match with Man Utd, not one.

He was let go because Busby saw he was not up to it.

He plied his trade as a journey man pro in the old Division Two mainly, in and out of teams.

He never played a first division game. He never played in a world cup. He never played in a European club competition. He never played at the top level of club soccer or an international tournament.

I know that shouldn't disqualify anyone, but he's talking from a theoretical viewpoint when he talks about the top level. He thinks beating the Italians, Germans, etc is easy. He thinks we have world class players.

The guy is completely deluded.

[an_ceannaire]

He is a damn site more qualified than YOU to talk, going by your own reasoning....unless that is your name is Johnny Carey perhaps? Dennis Irwin maybe? Frank Stapleton possibly...??
No?? Oh well then........shut up!!!

[drummerboy]

At the end of the day RTE need to sell advertising spots, and the bigger the audience the more Advertising Agencies will want to book ads on, during, and after the game. This is why RTE love Dunphy. They don’t care if he talks crap, as long as he gets people to watch the show and after Hunt reacted, they will be tuning in in their droves to hear what Eamo will say about Hunts outburst.

[Junior]

I watched the RTE analysis on line on Sunday night after a bit of a sunday session with some of the Birmingham Irish lads that were over.

Big Mick per chance?

[Stuttgart88]

I, for one, am glad Hunt made those remarks.

As I was trying to point out on an onther thread, there were elements of Saturday's performance that werre below par and deserved a degree of criticism, but Dunphy's reaction that it was "shameful" and that real football people in Ireland can only pre-date Jack Charlton were nothing but an insult to the players and the fans alike. No harm in getting insulted back.

[Emmet7]

He is a damn site more qualified than YOU to talk, going by your own reasoning....unless that is your name is Johnny Carey perhaps? Dennis Irwin maybe? Frank Stapleton possibly...??
No?? Oh well then........shut up!!!

He's more qualified than Souness, Lawrenson, or other European Cup winners?? Or better than Cascarino?

And please don't say Souness doesn't tell it as it is, or Brady or Lawrenson or Cascarino. Because we know they do.

Dunphy is his own best self publicist. Telling everyone repeatedly you are one of the world's best pundits doesn't make it so.

The other pundits have more confidence in themselves than to go around telling everyone how they are so much better than everyone else.

You don't see Alex Ferguson going around telling everyone how great he is and how every other manager is useless. Great men are usually modest men too.

By the way, I watch the Irish coverage because it's Irish and it's natural to see what Irish people think of an Irish match. Dunphy is someone that has to be put up with.

[an_ceannaire]

Cascarino!!!!!!
Tony Cascarino!!!! :D :D :D


The only club he was anything even approaching a success, was Milwall, and guess where Eamon was also a success as a footballer......yep...you guessed it!!!

Your a howl mate!!!

[tiktok]

Emmet7, to the best of my knowledge, Jose Mourinho never played a single senior professional game, he has enough medals jingling in his pocket to completely blow the idea that you have to have played at a high level to understand and comment on the game of football.

Dunphy is awful, but Cascarino as an alternative?
Seriously, give it up.

[an_ceannaire]

Emmet7, to the best of my knowledge, Jose Mourinho never played a single senior professional game, he has enough medals jingling in his pocket to completely blow the idea that you have to have played at a high level to understand and comment on it.

Seriously, give it up.

Add to that list David Moyes, Arsene Wenger etc etc

[noddy102]

Watch the game man. Ireland dominated the first half.

For somebody who has admitted they watched the game twice, and to come up with that conclusion, does not give me a very good belief in your ability to analyse a football game.

We looked very good up until we scored the goal. Then the Italians, more or less for the rest of the half, had the majority of possession and I was worried they'd score a second goal before the break.


Anyway, I'm going to add another piece to this debate here.

I remember after the Bari 1-1 game, Dunphy made some ridiculous comments that night, the worst being when he called Trapattoni:

'He was like a drunken gambler, throwing his chips on the table'.

He was referring to Trap's substitutions last night, and he went on to make a comment about bringing on Caleb Folan in particular. Nobody would dream of arguing over Trapattoni's tactical decisions that night, yet Dunphy found fault.

Yet again, he blows the lid, this time at the return game. We come away with a very respectable 2-2 draw, and almost won the game. Yet Dunphy has a go again. I didn't see it this time, and quite frankly I don't even want to watch it. But it is obvious that Dunphy has a personal problem with Trapattoni, whether it is over the whole Andy Reid issue, whether it is over his jealousy at hom succeeding, or whether it is simply for his own sense of achievement to be critical to ridiculous proportions.

I am happy Hunt has said something about Dunphy. Somebody, who has some form of influence needed to tell Dunphy exactly what he is, so that maybe he'll shut up. I can't say I respect Hunt as an intellectual, like the rest of you, or that I even consider him good enough to start for Ireland. I even admit, that I groaned when I saw him take the ball off Lawrence, for the free kick he had won, which led to St. Ledger's goal.

Anyway, that's how I feel.

PS. If anybody has ever read It's Only A Game?, they might be able to ensivage a younger, less wash-ed up and negative Dunphy. Back then, he was actually extremely good analytically. Now his analysis is simply his own cornershop of controversy

[Stuttgart88]

Very often the guys who understand the game best are those for whom the game was difficult, and hence they have to be more thoughtful in how they try and understand what works and what doesn't. Roy Keane might be a good example of the corollorary of this.

[mandrake]

I, for one, am glad Hunt made those remarks.

As I was trying to point out on an onther thread, there were elements of Saturday's performance that werre below par and deserved a degree of criticism, but Dunphy's reaction that it was "shameful" and that real football people in Ireland can only pre-date Jack Charlton were nothing but an insult to the players and the fans alike. No harm in getting insulted back.

i agree with you stutgart88 i find that dunphy also uses 'people who know football' etc as way of getting people on his side, flatering people so they'll say 'yeah he's right' also when someone chanlenges him he says 'hey ask these guys these are the experts , pointing to graham and gilsey...

great entertainment tho... him and micheal o leary, bullies of the highest order but you nearly alwasy have to watch / listen

[SuperDave]

Jesus, what's with the personal insults lads? Keep it to football!

For what it's worth, Ireland didn't dominate at any stage on Saturday, though they were equal to the Italians for long periods (most of the match, imo, and definitely moreso in the first half). Pirlo was given a lot of time and space, though he made most of it for himself. I thought it was because there was too much space between our midfield and defence but if our midfielders had been deeper keane and doyle would have been even more isolated. Pirlo obviously learnt from his Bari experience, or was taught what he did wrong by Lippi.

I think Hunt is just right to speak his mind. I agree with what he said and think Dunphy is being sensationalist for the sake of it. Who here seriously thinks our central midfield would be better with Andy Reid in it? I think we would be overrun, regularly, way more than happens at the minute (we didn't win the battle on Saturday and haven't done for a while). I also think our current wingers are as good as him if not better so I have no place for him there either. The only conceivable place is off a central striker, or as a central player in a 4-3-3, or 4-2-3-1, with two out and out wide players and one striker, but that would mean dropping Doyle in which case we lose our defenders standard out ball of a long punt up the pitch (which incidentally we were doing less of on Saturday, imo). No-one is seriously suggesting dropping Keane. It's all a crock of ****e. Like mentioned elsewhere, McCarthy was criticised for being unprofessional and unprepared re training facilities, cheese sandwiches, diet etc (as was Jack for the Harry Ramsden's challenge, lest we forget) and now we have an Italian who comes in and not just for disciplinary reasons tries to stop players sitting up til all hours, not getting proper rest, drinking a few days before an important match etc etc and finds his authority questioned by the most out of shape player in the squad. So he's been dropped for disciplinary reasons and from a football perspective we aren't losing much and would have to change our team and our system considerably to play him? It's really not a reason to beat the manager when he's up. Reid may be useful in the squad but he is not a panacea for all our ills, far from it.

Maybe, though, the reason for Hunt's criticism is that he is smarter than we give him credit for. Maybe he wants to make sure Andy Reid never plays for Ireland again, thus increasing the chances of him playing.... not.

[an_ceannaire]

Very often the guys who understand the game best are those for whom the game was difficult, and hence they have to be more thoughtful in how they try and understand what works and what doesn't. Roy Keane might be a good example of the corollorary of this.


Shaking my head....let it go mate...let it go....its been 7 years.....:rolleyes:

[osarusan]

Shaking my head....let it go mate...let it go....its been 7 years.....:rolleyes:
Did you even read what he said?

He's saying that often it is those who were not the very best players who make good critics, and sometimes players who excelled at the highest level seem to find it hard to anaylse the game as well as we might expect they would.

Keane does seem to be an example of this.

[Stuttgart88]

Good analysis Dave.

In a way we're unfortunate that our better players include our wide players and Doyle. But they are our better players so they must start, so the shape must be as it is. Trap recognised our failings very early on and has come up with a system the allows us to play to our strengths and avoid exposing our weakness.

That's not to say we can't play better within this system because I believe we can. Yet we can still get 2 draws with Italy. Gotta take that as positive.