Montenegro V Republic of Ireland - Wednesday, 10th September 2008 - World Cup 2010 Q

[irishultra]

First two qualifers out of the way, and now we play the waiting game.....

[maxwellsmart]

A really good performance, I can not pick a bad game by any player. They played as a team and passed the ball around very well, in control for most of the game and deserved the win in the end. A bit disappointed at that, but to get 4 points from 6, with 2 good performances away from Home, is something that Irish teams have rarely done over the years, it was usually hanging on in the game and sneaking a goal and trying to hold on, where as now, it is far more controlled and the players know what they are doing.

I can only be positive for future games, I can see us, challenging Italy for first place on current form. Italy were not great yet again and Georgia had a few good chances there aswell. All is looking good for once.

Can't agree with you there. Hunt was very very poor. Okay, he'll run all day but he was not dangerous(and I can't rem when he was dangerous for Ireland)and at the end of the day he is meant to be an attacking player.He does not appear to have a football brain (evidenced when he chased a guy into the corner in 1st half and ball hit him on head - Doyle already had the guy closed down). He is a headless chicken and liable to do anything. That said,some headless chickens have their uses (eg Chris Waddle) and I would have him on the squad but only as an impact sub to use his pace against tiring opposition

[irishultra]

See if we had a decent set piece taker in the starting 11, Hunt and McGeady's work would be actually merited. I would regard a wingers work to trouble the opposition, so if the opposition are fouling a player on a regular basis(McGeady) in dangerous areas then he is doing his bit.

[geysir]

I just had a quick read of the match thread, I can't believe I was just after watching the same game.
It's a long long time since we have performed like that, pretty much dominating 2 away games with composed controlled play.
O'Shea was inspirational and apart from a fluke deflection we were not troubled.
McGeady getting more solid. He had a chance, it was about our only chance therefore much of the focus is on his poor miss. I think he grew a bit out there.
Overall I am much more confident of a top 2 spot.

[eekers]

First two qualifers out of the way, and now we play the waiting game.....

Ah, the waiting game sucks. Let's play Hungry Hungry Hippos!

The problem for me was the back 6 stayed back at all times except for set pieces. We had two wingers trying to cross the ball to the centre with no one arriving from midfield to get on the end of it. Hopefully this is just the 'away tactic'. Okay of course that means we're more solid defensively, but its just not how I like the game being player personally.

[ifk101]

The chances Montenegro got were from 2 small slips in defence from Kilbane, Stephen Reid slipping on the grass and a deflected shot from 25 yards out. Other than that they never really troubled us - they ran out of ideas quite early in the game and the only attacking threat they posed was from shots a long way out or from them trying to fool the ref into giving them free kicks.

I'm disappointed we didn't win but I'm happy that we look very comfortable away from home against a team that is regarded as having a strong attacking threat. We have a shape and organisation that was not there before and I think we can look forward to the rest of the qualification campaign as these two away games have shown that we do have a real chance of qualification.

[Reality Bites]

Leaps and Bounds we really are taking Shape and its great to see! missing something in the final quarter though to unlock defences and get Keane and Doyle more sniffs -dare I say it Stephen Ireland?

[shakermaker1982]

I'm surprised people are being so negative at the team as a whole. Partnerships are developing all over the field which should give us a solid foundation for the trickier ties that lie ahead. The two wingers were average at best and it's a problem area for us but if Duff is wrapped in cotton wool that is one wing sorted. Maybe McGeady and Hunt are not cut out for international football? Some guys just never adapt to the pressures,

Wins against Cyprus and Georgia at home are needed now + I hope the FAI do something about the atmosphere because we need to make Croke Park a fortress.

[Pike B]

Our qualification hopes in this group, lie with equalling, or improving upon, Bulgaria and Italy's results. Last night we had a wonderful opportunity to get a two point jumpstart over Bulgaria, and we just left it behind us. We were never in any real danger, yet Trapp made no attempt to strenghten our attack, and seemed happy to take a point and run. This will bite us in the behind, before the end. Very disappointing result.
Stephen Ireland on the right, Duff on the left, or else we're in trouble.

[jbyrne]

Maybe McGeady and Hunt are not cut out for international football? Some guys just never adapt to the pressures,

Wins against Cyprus and Georgia at home are needed now + I hope the FAI do something about the atmosphere because we need to make Croke Park a fortress.

i thought mcgeady did ok actually. watch the game again and see how often he tracks back. also held onto possession a few times well when we needed to keep the ball in their half. his miss was poor though

with regards to atmosphere, its up to the fans to create it. you cant create artificial atmosphere. i've always thought that a few well positioned fans with bodhrans around the ground is the best way of getting the crowd going. fai initiatives like plastic pop music after goals and the carlsberg band have actually helped ruin the atmosphere

[drummerboy]

Given 9 - Once again he was brilliant

Finnan - 8 Excellent never put a foot wrong
Dunne - 9 Solid as a rock
O’Shea - 9 Another excellent performance, thank heavens he has finally come of age
Kilbane - 6 Steady. Looked uneasy when the Montenegran sub started to run at him.

McGeady - 7 Thought he had a good game. Worked tirelessly.
Whelan - 8 Another excellent performance. Hope his stoke manager was watching.
Reid - 8 Excellent. However he did tire towards end of 2nd half
Hunt - 6 Worked tirelessly. However he gave the ball away a lot and his delivery from set pieces was woeful.

Keane - 7 Good game. Worked hard, and looked dangerous when he got the ball to feet.
Doyle - 8 Excellent. Kept showing and worked tirelessly.

Could have won it, should have had peno. Cyprus will not be easy next month.

[Duggie]

listen lads its a long road, a group was never won after the first two games. im happy the way we controlled the game, looked solid. duff to come back in and we have 3 home games to come. next up 3 points against cyprus.

[Dun Laoire]

Ah, the waiting game sucks. Let's play Hungry Hungry Hippos!

The problem for me was the back 6 stayed back at all times except for set pieces. We had two wingers trying to cross the ball to the centre with no one arriving from midfield to get on the end of it. Hopefully this is just the 'away tactic'. Okay of course that means we're more solid defensively, but its just not how I like the game being player personally.

Me too. We need to go for the jugular at home especially in our next two games. If thats the way he wants to play away well thats is perfect but i hope he doesnt play the "not to lose" mentality card at home or we could be in trouble.....with the exception of Italy maybe.

[OwlsFan]

Positives

(1) Equalled what Bulgaria got there.
(2) Defence as solid as it was in Jack's days away from home. Can't find any fault with the back 4 except the 2 slips by Kilbane who otherwise had an excellent game
(3) O'Shea growing in to the role as an excellent centre-half. He should move out of Man U and play in that position regularly for some mid ranking Premiership team.
(4) McGeady had one of his better games.
(5) Midfield was solid if unspectacular.
(6) Unbeaten run continues.
(7) We didn't concede.
(8) Whole team worked hard and we played to a system.

Negatives

(1) For those who say we should have won, look at the stats. We had one strike on goal worth talking about and McGeady's miss. We created NEXT TO NOTHING for 90 minutes.
(2) A win would have put us 2 pts ahead of Bulgaria on a comparison table.
(3) We still can't win away from home.
(4) The strikers carved out next to nothing and there were no telling balls from midfield.
(5) Hunt's distribution is a disgrace.
(6) Gut feeling that we really needed those 3 points to qualify.

Overall, however, the positives outweigh the negatives but I worry about us having the ability to break teams down at home. That's why we do need someone with that extra creative touch like Andy Reid in midfield.
-----------------------------------------

Amused at the Eircom advert on RTE with Stephen Reid telling the child to feint one way and then go the other. He ended up on his backside twice to an opposition player doing that :D

[Pauro 76]

Amused at the Eircom advert on RTE with Stephen Reid telling the child to feint one way and then go the other. He ended up on his backside twice to an opposition player doing that :D

Next time you see the advert, watch the team shot. Notice Shay Given, he forces a smile, then a fantastic grimace. Well worth seeing.

[paul_oshea]

I thought given time to reflect and reanalyse the game given some comments here, but the same fact remains. Had we played georgia in georgia, I am sure we would have only come back with 2 points. People on here are getting carried away with the fact that we have not lose on 2 away outings in a row, something we hadn't done in a long time, and getting all excited like a fat kid at the site of chocolate cake. We did nothing in the forward 1/3 of the field, we were limited as well, very limited in fact that are only two chances were hit straight at the keeper or wide.

I watched the game in a pub last night with neutrals and a few irish who would watch the games but not be overly concerned. Two of them came out with this comment after half time "puke football". A little taken aback I said in fairness lads away from home they are holding onto the ball at least. Everyone just went ya the ball is going backwards or sideways but never forward, its as boring as you can get with no inventivenes/incisive passing. I had to agree as the game wore on, fair enough we were defensively solid but we never ever looked like winning this game. How many saves did their keeper have to make, and from how far out were we shooting as well? Going on finnans performance i can see why he was sold, he doesnt offer anything going forward anymore, there were 3 times in teh game when there was a huge space out right and we were like where is finnan the ball should be played out there to the space but instead it went across field. Controlling the game defensively doesn't mean we were class if its against mediocre oppossition. Remember lads they conceded 9 in 3 before this. We really need to sort out our attacking play.

[Duggie]

I thought given time to reflect and reanalyse the game given some comments here, but the same fact remains. Had we played georgia in georgia, I am sure we would have only come back with 2 points. People on here are getting carried away with the fact that we have not lose on 2 away outings in a row, something we hadn't done in a long time, and getting all excited like a fat kid at the site of chocolate cake. We did nothing in the forward 1/3 of the field, we were limited as well, very limited in fact that are only two chances were hit straight at the keeper or wide.

I watched the game in a pub last night with neutrals and a few irish who would watch the games but not be overly concerned. Two of them came out with this comment after half time "puke football". A little taken aback I said in fairness lads away from home they are holding onto the ball at least. Everyone just went ya the ball is going backwards or sideways but never forward, its as boring as you can get with no inventivenes/incisive passing. I had to agree as the game wore on, fair enough we were defensively solid but we never ever looked like winning this game. How many saves did their keeper have to make, and from how far out were we shooting as well? Going on finnans performance i can see why he was sold, he doesnt offer anything going forward anymore, there were 3 times in teh game when there was a huge space out right and we were like where is finnan the ball should be played out there to the space but instead it went across field. Controlling the game defensively doesn't mean we were class if its against mediocre oppossition. Remember lads they conceded 9 in 3 before this. We really need to sort out our attacking play.

dont really agree with any of this. i must have watched a different game.

[cavan_fan]

Well I'm happy but a bit frustrated. I'm guessing there will be a lot of that under Trap. The Irish Times had an article this week saying he's only tinkered witht he team. But I thik it's been a huge change. The team is playing under a really clear system. Everyone knows their job. The back four defend as a unit and stay back. The 2 in midfield protect them, pick up the ball and move it on. Only the 2 wide men are givne licence to attack. Finally the strikers take turns coming back to link up. The reason everyone looks more competent is that they know what is epxected of them and this is a huge thing in international footbal.

The tactics should suit us as we are strong on wide midfield players. The problem last night was our best one is injured (as always), the next 2 played poorly (and it is a position where it either goes well or badly) and Trap doesnt seem to trust any of the others including A Reid.

I'm not sure it will change too much at home by the way. I'd say he will want his two in midfield to sit there and don't see A Reid replacing Whelan. By the way no need for Ireland to come back as he wont get a place in this team. Not because he is not good enough but because Trap will only pick him in CM and he is not combative enough.

Anyway good to feel there is a plan again. My hunch is we will do well (2nd or close 3rd) but not qualify. I still think it will be the next manager (Tardelli??) who will benefit from this stabilisation phase.

[bholg]

Going on finnans performance i can see why he was sold, he doesnt offer anything going forward anymore, there were 3 times in teh game when there was a huge space out right and we were like where is finnan the ball should be played out there to the space but instead it went across field. .

Unfair I think - Id say he was probably told not to venture forward. You dont suddenly lose the ability to cross the ball like finnan.

[paul_oshea]

ok duggie so break it down.
Did you think we created loads of chances?
Did you think Finnan got forward enough?
Did you think Hunt played well and crossed well and held the ball up well?
Did you think glenn whelan always picked out the forward pass rather than the easy back to defenders pass?
Did you think that robbie keane didnt have to drop to the halfway line to receive the ball?
Did you think that we played with urgency going forward and played good counter attacking football, or did we slow it down and wait for players to come forward(who must have been focused defensively rather than offensively if you agree with this answer)
Did you think we hoofed the ball forward a lot more than Saturday?

[paul_oshea]

Unfair I think - Id say he was probably told not to venture forward. You dont suddenly lose the ability to cross the ball like finnan.

Why not, because we were playing for a draw? Surely he wouldn't have been told this if we wanted 3 points like Trap said?

[elroy]

As a form of comparison, after the first two games in the last campaign (which were both away), we had no points, six conceded and two scored. This time around we have four points, conceded one and scored two.

This team isnt suddenly going to set the world alight, but it cannot be denied there are real signs of progress here, particularly in defense.

Key now is the home games against Cyprus and Georgia, we need to take six points from these. That will leave us with ten points heading into a home game against Bulgaria. Its a positive start and def something to build on.

[Duggie]

Why not, because we were playing for a draw? Surely he wouldn't have been told this if we wanted 3 points like Trap said?

we werent playing for the draw, finnan got forward well and his distribution was good. he had a good game. paul were u drunk while watching the game :rolleyes:

[ifk101]

I thought we had a number of good goal chances - McGeady's in particular. We also should have been awarded a penalty.

I usually ignore what's said in a pub about football matches. Usually people look for consensus. So if one says "jaysus lads this is arse football", you'll get everyone around him nodding in agreement.

[Oink]

Lets be fair, on another day we would have got that peno, Keanes shot might have gone in, Doyle could have put his on target and McGeady may have finished.... on another day we could have won 2-0, I think last night was one of those games where you just dont get the rub of the green.

I really dont remember any decent chances for Montenegro (apart from the deflection) and if that happens at home you have to priase the away team.

I thought it was an astute performance against a tricky side, it's been years since i've said that about an Irish game.... let alone an away game.

I thought Doyle had an excellent game but I still think the partnership with Keane needs work, they both seem to run into the same positions and work back at the same time.

I think we missed someone from the midfield arriving late in the box last night, how many times did their defence fluff at a cross into the box but end up with enough time to recover.... if we had someone making the run and attacking the cross from outside the 18 yard box I think we could have nabbed a goal or 2.



I think John O'Shea has been possesed by the spirit of the undead Franco Baresi.

[Pike B]

Good Man Pike you a tactical genisus - for every educaed Irish football supporter out there -This thread is definition of Stupidity - can we give Pike an award for his lack of football knowledge - You are a typical highlights on the premiership on Saturday evening type of guy!
For a guy with Reality Bites for a name, you don't seem to like the truth genius...

[Claret Murph]

Look 4 points away from home , I am happy the Trap seems happy also what more do you want .
I think we can all see imporvement in this side from the back as it's been said we have two big games coming up at home , in the run of things draw away and win at home and we are top of the group and off to SA simple as that .
As for Trap when the FAI hired an Italian what did anyone think that they would get ? For me it's defence defence and defence that's what they do and that's what they have been good at for years . If you wanted free flowing football then we should have got some Dude from Brazil and we would have been looking at 1 point from our frist two games .......

[NeilMcD]

Very comfortable point.

Disappointed we didn't win - something was lacking upfront, not sure whether it was a bit more guile or just a bit of old fashioned physicality.

I thought almost everyone acquitted himself well but Hunt infuriated me. Worked hard and definitely contributed to the direction of the game but his set pieces ware simply atrocious and his general distribution poor.

Duff could have had a field day against this lot.

Who ever said we had problems in central midfield? :) Whelan and Reid were excellent and Whelan in particular is showing that international football still has room for an intelligent technical footballer even if the English league doesn't.

Defence was rock solid - take a bow the much criticised O'Shea & Kilbane.

The team is definitely taking shape. It looks cohesive and functional which is something we haven't been able to say for a while. That by itself compensates for not winning in my mind. My only reservation is that points won now can compensate for unexpected or undeserved points lost in future.

My wish list: Duff in for Hunt, McGeady to be more assertive and the front 2 to be more threatening.

Could Andy Reid have improved things? Maybe if we'd taken Hunt off, played slightly narrower and with McGeady playing a freer role behind Keane & Doyle. Did Montenegro have the width to exploit this shape? Not sure but I don't think so.


Once again I agree totally with all of that Stutts. Delighted with O Shea from the 2 games and from Whelan. Two suprises for me. Doyle was top class again and his effort is unreal, He never wants to be beaten for the ball. Not sure if this comes across on TV or not.

This is a tough place to come and win and i think we have got a big advantage by winning against Georgia "away". Big game for us is the night that Bulgaria play Georgia away next month.

[Pike B]

Look 4 points away from home , I am happy the Trap seems happy also what more do you want .
I think we can all see imporvement in this side from the back as it's been said we have two big games coming up at home , in the run of things draw away and win at home and we are top of the group and off to SA simple as that .
As for Trap when the FAI hired an Italian what did anyone think that they would get ? For me it's defence defence and defence that's what they do and that's what they have been good at for years . If you wanted free flowing football then we should have got some Dude from Brazil and we would have been looking at 1 point from our frist two games .......
You tell me honestly, hand on heart, you didn't once think last night watching the game, 'bring on Reid, this crowd are there for the taking'? I know I thought it.

[tetsujin1979]

Disappointed with some of the comments on here, thought we played well.
Some of the comments about Whelan in particular are way off the mark, he's not a creative player, so why expect him to create? Trapattoni definitely does not want him in the creative role, that's Steven Reid, with Whelan keeping possession, making tackles and breaking up attacks, think Steve McMahon at Liverpool, Neil Lennon at Leicester and Celtic, even Deschamps for France. None particularly creative, and all took their share of criticism, but when they were missing for their teams, either through injury or suspension, they were badly missed.
The defence is looking solid, O'Shea has benfitted more than any other player under Trap. He's throwing himself into tackles, marking well, and has become another target man from corners. Finnan never looked under pressure, linked well with McGeady, and I can't remember a cross coming in from that side for the whole game.
McGeady's performance will be tainted by that miss, even if he had shot across the keeper, and aimed for the far post, it could have rebounded to Keane, Doyle, or Hunt who was running in. I thought he had a good game, some good deep crosses from corners, and one cross from the byline that nearly resulted in the game goal as against Georgia. Compared to Hunt's game, with missed free kicks, far more possession lost, and seemingly never able to beat his man, he played a far better winger's game.
Hunt was definitely the weakest link, and a better team than Montenegro would have exploited this. Ironic that Kilbane covered for him at left full, having had to cover for Harte at left full in a previous incarnation.
Up front, Doyle never stopped running, despite playing a little deeper than at the weekend, and frequently worked hard to retrieve loose balls. A good defence starts up front, and both Keane and Doyle never gave their defence time on the ball, forcing them into quick, stray passes.
The home game against Cyprus will doubtless have the old "revenge/we owe them one" cliches (which I personally can't stand, qualification is the motivation, not some misguided attemt to wipe clean a previous result) and on the showing of these 2 games, we will be well prepared, creative, patient, and should beat them comfortably.

[lionelhutz]

Ratings out of 10;

Given - 8.5 : Pray that he stays fit. Magnificent save from the deflected shot - im pretty sure 90% of keepers wouldn't have been able to change direction as quick. A couple of other solid saves to boot and non-stip orchestrating of the defence.

Kilbane - 6 : Solid enough 1st half but he got out smarted a couple of times too easily in the 2nd half - particularly for the Vucinic chance where if he went down, he probably would have got a penalty. Too easily turned.

Dunne - 8 : Great partnership forming with O'Shea. I think he has a calming influence on O'Shea. All no nonsense defending, some crunching tackles put in that were borderline frees but the ref was lenient. Thought he could have played a simple pass at times instead of hoofing it though.

O'Shea - 8.5 : I must say I doubted his ability to play centre half but he's been excellent for the two games. His reading of the game was McGrath-like and he looks very comfortable longside Dunne. A few timely interceptions too.

Finnan - 7.5 : Defensively he was brilliant and tried to support McGeady most of the time going forward. I can't recall them getting a cross in from his side. Though he didn't get many chances to put his trademark crosses in. Great to have him back.

Hunt - 5 : Extremely poor. Puts his head down and runs at defenders like a headless chicken. Needs to be alot smarter and realise the right time to have a go at defenders and when to hold back and play a simple ball. His crossing was atrocious too.

Whelan - 8 : I thought he outshone Reid last night. He really stepped up in the 2nd half when Reid looked like he was struggling. He constantly showed for the ball off defenders and played some decent balls out wide. Put some solid tackles in too and generally controlled the middle. His dink over the defender and shot on the half volley was lovely - would have been a beautiful goal.

Reid - 7 : Seemed to be struggling a little with injury. His reading of the game was still top notch and he was a steady influence on the team with some lovely passes. Seemed to tire badly in the 2nd and probably should have been replaced.

McGeady - 7 : He was very lively - especially in the 2nd half. He drew two defenders at all times and was alot more intelligent with the ball than Hunt. Won a number of frees, put in some great crosses in the 2nd half though he should have done better with his chance.

Keane - 7 : Living off scraps really. Great turn and shot that was saved by the keeper. Excellent vision and skill to create the chance for McGeady too. Didn't like seeing his tantrums again though.

Doyle - 8 : Worked so hard for the team, held the ball up brilliantly, won frees to relieve pressure and didn't give their defenders any space. Never got any chances at goal though besides the miscued effort that Hunt tried to turn in.

[Closed Account 2]

The match was tense, gritty and both teams played with an element of fear.

I thought that Dunne had an excellent game, he was given the task of marking Vucnic (Montenegro's best and most experienced player) and he did this very well for the full 90 mins.

In my opinion McGeady was also very good, it was dissapointing about his shot at the end, but for the whole match he seemed like the only player who could link the midfield up with the attack. Steven Reid and Whelan are great midfielders but they tend to both be a bit static, as others noted Hunt didn't have a great game so our only dynamic element of midfield was McGeady. He is an exceptionally good dribbler, his crosses can be good too but he needs time to place them, he didn't get that last night (also bear in mind we have no significant height upfront so there is less to aim at). One thing I noticed about McGeady last night was his willingness to collect the ball and just run with it down the wing. On numerous occasions he would just run with the ball into space, keep posession providing relief to the rest of the team. It's clear that the sweltering Adriatic heat caused a huge problem for a lot of our players, McGeady's willingness to take the ball and run was vital for the rest of the team.

I think Montenegro are a good team, they certainly have a large amount of pace and skill in key positions. It will be interesting to see how they play away from home. Traditionally sides from the former Yugoslavia are very strong at home but tend to resort to a defensive style when they play away. This usually negates the advantage they have over the opposition (individuals with a high level of technique), I think Filipovic will deploy this tactic away from home. I think Montenegro will win at home against Cyprus and Georgia and I think they will probably (hopefully) get a draw with the Italians at home.

Again it was great to see no yellow cards for us last night, that means no suspensions for the Cyprus match next month and, even though it will be tense, I can see us winning it this time by one goal. It looks like Trap has installed a degree of discipline in the team and hopefully there will be fewer suspensions in this campaign.

[Drumcondra 69er]

I was disappointed we didn't win the game given the fact that we had at least one utter stone wall penalty not given and that if McGeady had gone across the keeper at worst I reckon we would have had a save from the keeper at the feet of one of Doyle, Keane or Hunt who were all steaming in.

But we look a team again, were solid and once we got to grips with the game after 15 minutes or so we dominated it. We would have been very unfortunate to have lost that game but no one will find it easy going there, they look a decent side but they go down way too easily, hate seeing that.

John O'Shea looks a different player under Trap, can't fault him defensively or concentration wise the last 2 games. Really think it would do his development good if he was to join a club where he could play centre half week in week out but can't see that happening. Credit where it's due, delighted to see him improve.

f we can win all our home games bar Italy (a draw may be enough there for Trap) we'll be there or thereabouts.....

[Pike B]

The match was tense, gritty and both teams played with an element of fear.

I thought that Dunne had an excellent game, he was given the task of marking Vucnic (Montenegro's best and most experienced player) and he did this very well for the full 90 mins.

In my opinion McGeady was also very good, it was dissapointing about his shot at the end, but for the whole match he seemed like the only player who could link the midfield up with the attack. Steven Reid and Whelan are great midfielders but they tend to both be a bit static, as others noted Hunt didn't have a great game so our only dynamic element of midfield was McGeady. He is an exceptionally good dribbler, his crosses can be good too but he needs time to place them, he didn't get that last night (also bear in mind we have no significant height upfront so there is less to aim at). One thing I noticed about McGeady last night was his willingness to collect the ball and just run with it down the wing. On numerous occasions he would just run with the ball into space, keep posession providing relief to the rest of the team. It's clear that the sweltering Adriatic heat caused a huge problem for a lot of our players, McGeady's willingness to take the ball and run was vital for the rest of the team.

I think Montenegro are a good team, they certainly have a large amount of pace and skill in key positions. It will be interesting to see how they play away from home. Traditionally sides from the former Yugoslavia are very strong at home but tend to resort to a defensive style when they play away. This usually negates the advantage they have over the opposition (individuals with a high level of technique), I think Filipovic will deploy this tactic away from home. I think Montenegro will win at home against Cyprus and Georgia and I think they will probably (hopefully) get a draw with the Italians at home.

Again it was great to see no yellow cards for us last night, that means no suspensions for the Cyprus match next month and, even though it will be tense, I can see us winning it this time by one goal. It looks like Trap has installed a degree of discipline in the team and hopefully there will be fewer suspensions in this campaign.
Run it to where exactly? He didn't put one cross in, and fluffed his only chance. Take off your Boys In Green Tinted Specs and look at it from a footballing point of view. The guy was limp, predictable and bloody well useless.

[Closed Account 2]

Run it to where exactly? He didn't put one cross in, and fluffed his only chance. Take off your Boys In Green Tinted Specs and look at it from a footballing point of view. The guy was limp, predictable and bloody well useless.

He would dribble from the edge of our box or the middle of our half into the oppositions half usually down the channels. If he hadn't been prepared to run
with the ball as much we would have played more of the game in our own half and then invited Montenegro to camp at the edge of our box, which was the usual away scenario under Stan...

McGeady (or any other wide player for us) has very little to aim at, physcially, in the box for us. If he has time (e.g. vs Georgia) he can pick out a player with a good cross, but unless we play with a physical target man (e.g. a few years ago the likes of Quinn or Morrison) there is very litttle to aim at in terms of crossing.

[Noelys Guitar]

i disagree with some of the comments about Hunts performance. He did his job of getting all over the pitch to break up their play. Protected both our full backs at different times. And he physically inserted himself into the entire 90 plus minutes. Yes he gave away the ball more times than any of us would like. But I believe Trap made the right decision by keeping him on the pitch for the entire match. Bringing on Reid might have won us the game. But it also might have lost us the game. In close games like this away from home when a player like Hunt is doing his primary job of protecting the defense why change it? As Trap said after last nights game lets see how Italy do in Montenegro before judging last nights result.

[paul_oshea]

The match was tense, gritty and both teams played with an element of fear.

I thought that Dunne had an excellent game, he was given the task of marking Vucnic (Montenegro's best and most experienced player) and he did this very well for the full 90 mins.

In my opinion McGeady was also very good, it was dissapointing about his shot at the end, but for the whole match he seemed like the only player who could link the midfield up with the attack. Steven Reid and Whelan are great midfielders but they tend to both be a bit static, as others noted Hunt didn't have a great game so our only dynamic element of midfield was McGeady. He is an exceptionally good dribbler, his crosses can be good too but he needs time to place them, he didn't get that last night (also bear in mind we have no significant height upfront so there is less to aim at). One thing I noticed about McGeady last night was his willingness to collect the ball and just run with it down the wing. On numerous occasions he would just run with the ball into space, keep posession providing relief to the rest of the team. It's clear that the sweltering Adriatic heat caused a huge problem for a lot of our players, McGeady's willingness to take the ball and run was vital for the rest of the team.


I think those are very valid points. The only person to link up the two yesterday was mcgeady. BUt the problem is we are going to be missing players again during the campaign and we need others to be able do this.

[Ozymandias]

something that hasn't been mentioned and which I think was a factor in the way the game panned out was the pitch...it looked poor in terms of bobbles etc..therefore everyone seemed to need to take an extra touch and deffo avoided striking first time....

[cudsy1]

Some of you are overly critical and have short memories. If we had these two results under Stan/Kerr/Mick we would be all thrilled. 4 points from these two games is a job done. This team is growing, getting more cohesive and confident. Good job by Trap and the boys.

my sentiments exactly

"Some of you are overly critical and have short memories" - you can add the newstalk lads and listeners to this as well by the sounds of their post-match reaction last night

[paul_oshea]

i disagree with some of the comments about Hunts performance. He did his job of getting all over the pitch to break up their play. Protected both our full backs at different times. And he physically inserted himself into the entire 90 plus minutes. Yes he gave away the ball more times than any of us would like. But I believe Trap made the right decision by keeping him on the pitch for the entire match. Bringing on Reid might have won us the game. But it also might have lost us the game. In close games like this away from home when a player like Hunt is doing his primary job of protecting the defense why change it? As Trap said after last nights game lets see how Italy do in Montenegro before judging last nights result.

No he said how montenegro do in Italy next month. THe point at hand though re: Hunt, last night on rte, they showed the amount of times he lost it compared to won it, he lost it more than he won it. IF you play a player who isn't losing the ball and holds it up it is definitely more of an advantage than playing a player who constantly gives it back to them. Its definitely better to have a player that doesn't win the ball as much but doesn't lose it when he has it.

[lionelhutz]

Run it to where exactly? He didn't put one cross in, and fluffed his only chance. Take off your Boys In Green Tinted Specs and look at it from a footballing point of view. The guy was limp, predictable and bloody well useless.

Have to disagree. I recall three or four good crosses in the 2nd half. Yes, he fluffed that chance but in general play, he was very intelligent, held the ball up when needed and drew fouls at other times. Ok he wasn't electric, beating man after man like he sometimes does for celtic but he wasn't playing falkirk last night. I was impressed by him.

[paul_oshea]

Have to disagree. I recall three or four good crosses in the 2nd half. Yes, he fluffed that chance but in general play, he was very intelligent, held the ball up when needed and drew fouls at other times. Ok he wasn't electric, beating man after man like he sometimes does for celtic but he wasn't playing falkirk last night. I was impressed by him.

funny we said falkirk too when watching it :D

[Noelys Guitar]

No he said how montenegro do in Italy next month. THe point at hand though re: Hunt, last night on rte, they showed the amount of times he lost it compared to won it, he lost it more than he won it. IF you play a player who isn't losing the ball and holds it up it is definitely more of an advantage than playing a player who constantly gives it back to them. Its definitely better to have a player that doesn't win the ball as much but doesn't lose it when he has it.

First point.

By Daniel McDonnell
Thursday September 11 2008
NO words were necessary. When Giovanni Trapattoni shook his fist at the final whistle, he displayed his verdict on whether this was a case of a point gained or two dropped.

Afterwards, he said that maybe it won't be until Italy come here that it will be properly answered.

Second point.
I can think of a bunch players off hand who could have stepped into the team last night and not given up possession as easily as Hunt did (Reid, Murphy etc) But none of them would have covered the ground, won tackles and helped the team overall the way Hunt did and does. I like Andy Reid as a player and I hope to see him play a big part in us qualifying but I fully understand why Trap played Hunt last night. And if Duff or McGeady are injured against Cyprus then Hunt will start again.

[Closed Account 2]

I think those are very valid points. The only person to link up the two yesterday was mcgeady. BUt the problem is we are going to be missing players again during the campaign and we need others to be able do this.

Yeah, that's true. The only thing is at least it seems we are not picking up the same level of needless yellow cards as under Stan. We will get injuries though I certainly think having Duff back will be good. Hopefully Stephen Ireland can come back into the fold as he would offer a good link up between midfield and attack too. Also there is the possibility of some of the more junior / young players coming into the fold over the next few games (e.g. Scannell) and fringe players might well develop over the campaign - e.g. Ronnie O'Brien, Joey O'Brien. Although I conceed the former is unlikely to feature for us now.

[lionelhutz]

I can think of a bunch players off hand who could have stepped into the team last night and not given up possession as easily as Hunt did (Reid, Murphy etc) But none of them would have covered the ground, won tackles and helped the team overall the way Hunt did and does. .

When Hunt continously lost the ball, it put Ireland under serious pressure and we had to exert alot more energy trying to regain possession than we would have had if he kept the ball. In the humidity last night, possession was key. Hunt kept throwing away the key.

With bodies and minds tiring all over the Irish team, Hunt should have been replaced by Reid early in the 2nd half, no doubt about it.

[Pike B]

Yeah, that's true. The only thing is at least it seems we are not picking up the same level of needless yellow cards as under Stan. We will get injuries though I certainly think having Duff back will be good. Hopefully Stephen Ireland can come back into the fold as he would offer a good link up between midfield and attack too. Also there is the possibility of some of the more junior / young players coming into the fold over the next few games (e.g. Scannell) and fringe players might well develop over the campaign - e.g. Ronnie O'Brien, Joey O'Brien. Although I conceed the former is unlikely to feature for us now.
Joey O' Brien is one I rate very highly. I think he could do a great job as a holding midfielder or full back. One for the future aswell as the present.

[Pike B]

When Hunt continously lost the ball, it put Ireland under serious pressure and the we had to exert alot more energy trying to regain possession than they would have had if he kept the ball. In the humidity last night, possession was key. Hunt kept throwing away the key.

With bodies and minds tiring all over the Irish team, Hunt should have been replaced by Reid early in the 2nd half, no doubt about it.
Agree with that 100%.

[paul_oshea]

First point.

By Daniel McDonnell
Thursday September 11 2008
NO words were necessary. When Giovanni Trapattoni shook his fist at the final whistle, he displayed his verdict on whether this was a case of a point gained or two dropped.

Afterwards, he said that maybe it won't be until Italy come here that it will be properly answered.

Second point.
I can think of a bunch players off hand who could have stepped into the team last night and not given up possession as easily as Hunt did (Reid, Murphy etc) But none of them would have covered the ground, won tackles and helped the team overall the way Hunt did and does. I like Andy Reid as a player and I hope to see him play a big part in us qualifying but I fully understand why Trap played Hunt last night. And if Duff or McGeady are injured against Cyprus then Hunt will start again.

In the interview on rte, he was asked, so are you happy with a point or is it 2 poitns dropped. He said "we will wait till next month when they travel to italy and we have cyprus at home, before we can say", or something along those lines. check it out on rte.ie

He covered great ground, no one is denying that but when he got the ball after tracking back he gave it away, the only advantage here is that it wasted a bit of extra time, which is fine if you are going for a draw.

[Billsthoughts]

Run it to where exactly? He didn't put one cross in, and fluffed his only chance. Take off your Boys In Green Tinted Specs and look at it from a footballing point of view. The guy was limp, predictable and bloody well useless.

Exactly!
Jesus I dont doubt for a second Mageady is capable of much better but some people want to forgive him anything. People seem to throw plaudits at him when he just gets the basic things right. I thought he was physically weak, he took the wrong option time and time again and he seems to run right into dead ends. His attitude in both games was good tho and Id have no problem with him staying on the right if Duff came back and hunt was dropped. Altho I would play Ireland ahead of him if he came back.

[Pike B]

Exactly!
Jesus I dont doubt for a second Mageady is capable of much better but some people want to forgive him anything. People seem to throw plaudits at him when he just gets the basic things right. I thought he was physically weak, he took the wrong option time and time again and he seems to run right into dead ends. His attitude in both games was good tho and Id have no problem with him staying on the right if Duff came back and hunt was dropped. Altho I would play Ireland ahead of him if he came back.
At last, someone on the exact same wavelength as myself!! I felt like I was fighting a losing battle, but you said it all there mate. Well done.