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Everyone who reckons cork got away lighty cop on
If Fai took away Cork's Licence now they would not be allowed to play any more games in Prem league this season which would have the league in a worst mess.
If the cork have not sorted out their mess by end of season they will stugle to get a prem licence next season ( same thing that happend to shels)
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Originally Posted by holidaysong
That can still happen at the end of this season. The teams in the premier division next year will be the teams who get premier licenses.
Of course they got away lightly they were paying massive wages for players they couldn't afford which was stopping other clubs from signing them. Maybe Rovers, Bray or even yourselves could have signed some of these players and would be challenging more.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainee
Cork only lost 10 points which made no difference really to their season. But they affected other teams season's by taking points off them with these players.
How many points have cork taken off Galway this season?
In my opinion cork should have lost all their points up to now or at the very least start next season with a massive point deduction. a 10 point loss when they had nothing to play for is no punishment at all.
You realise the trouble Cork are in, don't you? You realise they may not be around, next year?Quote:
Originally Posted by Louth4sam
Got off lightly? :rolleyes:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louth4sam
Cork could now miss out on europe for next season, or even still not be given a premier licence for next season. On top of that they could also miss out on Setanta cup qualification. That adds up to €250k when you include gates, sponsorship etc.
Cork got a licence on the back of written assurances from the owner about putting money into the club. They might not get a licence to play in the premier next year.
The FAI cant really do much more at this stage. At the start of the season they could afford the squad because they had a backer who said as much in writing.
Small slap on the wrist? Rovers were deducted 8 points for submitting false accounts in their licensing application. They got no further sanctions for going into examinership.Quote:
Originally Posted by stickyjoe
City got deducted 10 points for going into examinership and may yet face further sanctions depending on how the rest of the season pans out. But for now the season continues on with minimal disruption to other clubs and City have to fight for survival let alone to avoid the possible further sanctions down the road.
The situation is different to Shels, City were given a budget and stayed within it. They were spending money that they were guaranteed. Now that guarantee is rescinded City received a ten point penalty for going into examinership and all future breaches of the license from now to the end of the season will also be punished.
In the words of a board member, "Not enough to build a stadium but enough to redevelop one"Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
Yes i do realise what trouble they are in and i have every sympathy for their fans but yes they did get off lightly with the punishment they received from the FAI. Are you saying they were punished severely?
They could say from next season they are not accepting non legally binding bits of paper to get around their own rules. It would be a feckin start from the idiots that were supposed to be ensuring this didn't happen again.Quote:
Originally Posted by bohs til i die
Are you reading what has been posted?Quote:
Originally Posted by Louth4sam
They were docked 10 points for entering examinership. They could yet be punished more, denied a premier licence for next season. It is far from over. The examinerhsip process hasnt even fully begun yet.
Yes i am reading what was posted. Do you really believe that they will be punished more by the FAI because i don't. The FAI will do everything in its power to keep Cork in the premier as they are such a big club with great attendances.Quote:
Originally Posted by bohs til i die
When Shels imploded I don't think they even applied for a premier licence for the following season but I can see Cork trying their luck and the FAI giving in.Quote:
Originally Posted by bohs til i die
What are the financial differences between a first and premier licence anyway?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louth4sam
I dont believe the FAI are the ones who have that say and if Cork's financial situation isnt assured I doubt they will get a premier licence
The FAI should do everything in its power to help clubs. However it should also punish them for breaking the rules. If City have unmanageable debts at the end of the season they will, most likely, be denied a premier license. Similarly they'll be punished for any other breach of licensing. Personally I hope that a deal can be agreed with the creditors (including staff & players) during the examinership process. This is what the process is for and is outside of football.Quote:
Originally Posted by Louth4sam
Would you feel it was a slap on the wrist if Sligo Rovers, Cobh Ramblers, Waterford Utd, or any other club in difficulty got a 10 point deduction for going into examinership (touching wood it doesn't happen)? Or should clubs like City, Drogheda, Bohs and St Pats* get punished more severely? The size and position of the club should have nothing to do with the punishment, one rule for all.
* Left out Derry as they seem to be cutting back for next season
Quote:
Originally Posted by holidaysong
Shels applied for and were given a premier licence for the 2007 season - which were awarded in Dec 06.
The First Instance Cmtee withdrew it in Feb 07 and issued Shels with a first div licence instead.
FAI as you say can't do much at this stage...but they can learn from this, they must in future refuse to accept "written guarantees" from so called backers which as has been demonstrated in Cork's case aren't worth the paper they were written on...instead starting next season they should insist on a bonding system whereby in the event of a club not meeting it's debts then the value of the bond could be drawn down... in reality I'd guess the likes of Arkaga would't be prepared to fund the cost of a bond.Quote:
Originally Posted by bohs til i die
If a club applies and qualifies for a premier license they should get it. It's not about giving in.Quote:
Originally Posted by holidaysong
Or give themselves powers to ban the guarantors from being involved in owning/running a football club under the FAI's juristinction from 5 years up to indefinately.Quote:
Originally Posted by Calcio Jack
Sorry, my mistake.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fintan Cassidy
Can't remember the last time had a Shels discussion ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by LeixlipRed
Genuine question but did someone really pay 20m for the lease at Tolka? Was this before the floods as I would think almost impossible to get planning permission next to the Tolka river now. Well certainly after recent changes mooted by Minister for the Environment.
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Originally Posted by pete
I posted this in another thread here the other day:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fintan Cassidy
Next time you're in Tolka Pete, examine the new apartments as you cross the bridge. Face Tolka and they're on your right. Note the flood protection built into the building as Fintan mentioned.
I saw new apartments next to the bridge on the Tolka Park side but i don;t think it floods at the bridge itself?Quote:
Originally Posted by LeixlipRed
If the lease has already been sold then fine but I suspect planning permission will be more difficult going forward...
Yea, the situation is different. Shels have paid or will pay ALL outstanding creditors and players, Cork are now in the process of seeing what %age they can offer creditors instead of paying ALL their debts. Shels also have an asset still worth millions while Cork have no assets.Quote:
Originally Posted by derm
But yes, relegation for Shels and a 10 point deduction for Cork is fair:rolleyes: I don`t think anyone from Cork will be using the term "ridden rock solid" for a while.
So you are proposing CCFC be relegated mid season? :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by stickyjoe
If we are unable to pay players or debts when applying for licence next season I suspect we will be relegated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
Why weren`t you deducted all points that you had this season and still play out the season? Similar to Rovers a few years back. A 10 point deduction is ridiculous, where is the logic or basis for this? Why was it not 5, 15, 25? Its typical making up the rules as you go along with the FAI and the reality is that they are bending over backwards to ensure that there is a premier division team in Cork next season, something that wasn`t done to help either Rovers or Shels.
I think Rovers were deducted 9 or 10 points. It just happened to be the start of the season so not all their points deducted. It was also for a different offense. I accept they are making it up as they go along but lets have some reality.Quote:
Originally Posted by stickyjoe
Where was the money we were ****ing away for years coming from? The sale of the lease. Ollie was special but he couldn't conjure money from thin airQuote:
Originally Posted by pete
You can't relegate a team mid-season. Cork could well face futher sanctions, so it's best to wait until the dust settles to see what happens.
I always thought Shels were ultimately happy to take relegation last year because of the fact they'd have been hammered off the pitch otherwise.
City are in examinership, this is a process to deal with paying debts. It involves coming to an agreement with your creditors. So yes, hopefully it will involve a percentage of debts owed, same as Rovers who you conveniently omit in this post.Quote:
Originally Posted by stickyjoe
I don't know the ins-and-outs of Shel's debts but I congratulate them if they have paid every creditor 100% of the monies owed, without any special agreements being reached.
It's not similar to Rovers at all. Rovers got no penalty for going into examinership, it wasn't a breach of the license afaik. Instead they got an 8 point deduction for submitting falsified accounts, and given every chance to remain in the premier division by on-the-field methods. You could look at it as why was the FAI bending over backwards to help the most famous Irish club after it submitted falsified accounts? Personally I think the FAI should bend over backwards to help any club that is in trouble while also punishing licensing breaches by the club.Quote:
Originally Posted by stickyjoe
And please, please, PLEASE look at the friggin date, or even the fixture list. The season is not over, Cork City are not even guaranteed to survive let alone be a premier team next season. Try to understand, going into examinership is now punished, having unhappy creditors when applying for a new license will be punished (like Shels), submitting falsified accounts will be punished (like Rovers). Shels and Rovers had one punishment, City could yet get several. It won't matter that's its a Cork club or not. What will matter is whether or not it can satisfy the creditors and the licencing committee.
Even if Rovers hadda beat Dublin City, the 400C woulda needed to get a Premier Licence for the following year to compete in the premier.
Regardless where we finish this year we still gotta reapply for the a premier division license for next year, as do all the other clubs.
Id say for any club that goes through examinership, It might be hard to get a premier license for the following season and a season in the first division in order to regroup might be the best thing for them anyways. It did us the world of good.
Worst case scenairo for Cork, FORAS could start a new team in the first next year and even go amateur ala Wallace for the first year if they had to!
bhs