Noticed this on another board. At least one bigoted view.
See good and bad coming out of it all this year.
See good and bad coming out of it all this year.
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Celebrating failure and the creation of a Catholic Elite... discussDID YOU NOTICE A SIGN OUTSIDE MY HOUSE...? -
Perfectly described Bonnie.
If Maxwell did not order the killing of the rebel leaders and they were just prisoners, this event would just be a small memory today.Last edited by TheBoss; 06/01/2016, 2:11 AM.Comment
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Sorry, not sure I'll be discussing it here - I might head to an English football forum to show my disgust at the modern Ireland and display my republicanism...
Not so I agree with Bonnie - there was already a Catholic Elite by that stage.
Hard to know how it would've played out without the executions. Would there have been the impetus for the War of Independence? Would Home Rule have been implemented, which could’ve taken the sting out of an armed campaign? A lot of "What If's" with no definitive answer imo.If you attack me with stupidity, I'll be forced to defend myself with sarcasm.Comment
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It's only the 6th of Jan, but every time I see something to reference 1916 - I wish it was 2017 already.Comment
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Yeah, my thoughts exactly. Hopefully it will peter out after Easter.#NeverStopNotGivingUpComment
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That's what I always maintained when discussing it. When I first went to Kilmainham Gaol I was just aghast at how stupid the Brits were with the executions. Especially of that of Connolly. Mindboggling.
When I think of how Redmond got shafted by the whole thing and it gets me so mad.
It just shows how often we stuck our foot in it. See Parnell's fall from grace...
I hated the Rising as a kid as it moreorless sowed the seeds of partition and I have no pride or want to celebrate or commemorate partition.
I think the war of Independence doesn't happen without the Rising in the fashion that it occurred. Home Rule would have softened any want for "Independence" straight away.DID YOU NOTICE A SIGN OUTSIDE MY HOUSE...?Comment
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You could say that as well. But there's a consideration to be made that Northern Unionist opposition to HR was always in existence.
Despite the Covenant and this opposition; HR was going ahead once the war was over. (Bear in mind that no one thought that WWI was gonna last til 1918)
What I feel the Rising did was solidify the fomenting "us v them", Dublin v Belfast attitude. This made partition inevitable. It was a perfect storm of ****-up after ****-up since Parnell that brought us to where we are.
Once the Rising failed and the instigators became martyrs the similarities between Unionism and Nationalism petered out and the "us v them" attitudes became more entrenched than before.
When you consider from what the United Irishmen had developed from this is a huge change in attitudes within 100 years or so.DID YOU NOTICE A SIGN OUTSIDE MY HOUSE...?Comment
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Was asked to put something together today for Proclamation Day at work. Guaranteed I'll annoy somebody. It's the little motivators that mean so much!
Hello, hello? What's going on? What's all this shouting, we'll have no trouble here!
- E Tattsyrup.Comment
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DID YOU NOTICE A SIGN OUTSIDE MY HOUSE...?Comment
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It's the FE college where I work full-time. I'm sure DIT will get round to organising something, probably around 2017 or so. It's all about the merger at the moment, so we're not supposed to think about separatism. Or revolution! I don't know yet if it's going to be confined to our students/staff or open to the public. If it's the latter will I send you the details?
I'm a post-revisionist, Bonnie. I view Ruth Deadly Edwards and her ilk with the same scepticism as anything published by Mercier and Collins Press!! That's why I know I'll tread on some bunions, but in fairness, that's something to look forward to!Hello, hello? What's going on? What's all this shouting, we'll have no trouble here!
- E Tattsyrup.Comment
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[QUOTE=BonnieShels;1854254
I hated the Rising as a kid as it moreorless sowed the seeds of partition and I have no pride or want to celebrate or commemorate partition.
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Poppycock Bonnie and that doesn't read as the sentiments of a kid.
In northern parts of Ireland the seeds of partition were sown decades before the 1916 rising, with roots going way back to the plantation.
Partition was not caused or reinforced by the 1916 rising, where on earth do you get such ideas from?
Do you not have a basic overview of British imperialism around the world ,in the 18C, 19C and 20C?Comment
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Of course, it's a healthy development in terms of historical debate that the old personality cults surrounding Pearse and Dev have long been slain, even if Connolly is now in danger of becoming another sacred cow (clearly as a participant he can't have been a committed democrat). As for the Rising approach, it's fair to say it acted as an accelerant of political change, even if to celebrate it risks endorsing the Provo campaign. Still, the failure to enforce the enacted Home Rule Act, and the expansion of partition to six counties demonstrates Redmond's political impotence, so while devolution was on the tanle by 1920, to state that any concession would have occurred without the Rising is an unprovable counterfactual. Finally, commemoration should be placed in the historical context, alongside the Battle of the Somme and international developments.Comment
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