Martin O'Neill and Roy Keane

[NeverFeltBetter]

Presumably to be kept on, but for how long? What will it take for the trigger to be pulled? Nations League failure, or struggling with Euro qualification?

[IsMiseSean]

With the likelihood of a number of retirements on the horizon, we need to rebuild.
Allowing O'Neill and/or Keane in charge of that task will be a monumental failure.

[Closed Account 2]

What do people think of Slaven Bilic? His Croatia teams played with a superb blend of attacking panache and defensive organisation. They are obviously blessed with better attacking players than us, but in his tenure their back line was similar to ours in terms of ability.

[seanfhear]

After West Ham Bilic needs a good long rest and maybe even to have a good long look at himself and see if being a manger is for him .

He would be a big gamble .

[mark12345]

The Case For O'Neill Staying:
1. He was hired to do a job for the FAI, a job where the goal was to get his team to the World Cup. He came very very close.
2. He has blooded a couple of good players in Callum O'Dowda and Cyrus Christie
3. He has been loyal to his players.
4. Getting rid of O'Neill would mean starting all over again.
5. O'Neill has a good grasp of the Irish scene, whereas a foreign or English manager might not.
6. He restored confidence to the team in that they became hard to score against.


The Case Against O'Neill Staying:

1. Ireland were as lucky as lucky can be in this campaign. We needed teams to do us a series of favors in the final two games and all of the favors came to fruition. It was an uncanny run of luck. We were also lucky in Wales, having defended for most of the ninety minutes and also in Georgia, again having defended for almost ninety minutes.

2. O'Neill's loyalty to his players was a major part of his downfall. It was clear to everyone that he stayed loyal to Glenn Whelan, when he should have jettisoned him for a more capable midfielder. Proof of his wrongdoing regarding Whelan came in the final three games where he stared Arter in his stead (if Whelan was so brilliant why would he drop him for the team's three most crucial games). Also he stayed loyal for far too long to Daryl Murphy. Murphy had scored a goal in Serbia but was not worthy of a place in the starting eleven (many would argue, and rightly so, he wasn't worthy of a place on the subs bench either). Be that as it may, having been picked on the back of a two goal performance against Moldova, Murphy was made the main striker in Cardiff. It was patently obvious after 45 minutes that he was completely ineffective in the role he was playing. Admittedly if he was given a ball or two in front of goal he might have made hay, but under the circumstances he should have been withdrawn at half time in Cardiff. O'Neill's loyalty to his man meant that we had no tip to our spear. We emerged with a victory nonetheless, but there was no apparent evaluation of Daryl's performance and so he was given two subsequent starts against Denmark. Again he should have been withdrawn at half time in Copenhagen - Long or Hogan are far more mobile - and insanely he was started from the off in the Dublin game. Loyalty, blind loyalty from O'Neill cost his team.

3. O'Neill was single handedly responsible for the dropping of two points against Austria. Austria were one of the weakest teams to visit Dublin in years. They were there for the taking, yet we treated them like they were Germany. We played scared - hoofing the ball all day long and paid the price with the goal against us just before half time. We spent the rest of the game chasing the win and, inexplicably, Hoolahan was kept off the pitch until the final twenty minutes. When he came on, Wes changed the game. We got an equaliser and almost a winner. Proof positive that he should have started.

4. Hard to outdo the performance against Austria, Martin hit new depths with the performance in Tblisi. One was left to ask oneself if the players had been instructed to stand in their own penalty area and just kick the ball back to their opponents rather than try something constructive? How could a manager ask his players to do that? He never would - it is the equivalent of football suicide. But, based on the subsequent evidence, that's apparently exactly what Martin O'Neill instructed his players to do.

5. More of the same against Wales. We defended well, no doubt about it, but remember Wales were without their two most creative players (Allen being injured), and got the smash and grab goal.

6. O'Neill basked in the glow of the Cardiff success, and even deserves a modicum of credit for his team's keeping a clean sheet in Copenhagen. But having said after Copenhagen that we needed to be creative in the return leg, the manager left his most influential player off the park from the off. If Hoolahan was not good enough, or not influential enough to play in three quarters of the tie against Denmark, why then bother bringing him on for the final quarter. Very misleading. Did Wes have something to offer the team or not?

7. The sum total of Martin O'Neill's performance as a coach for this campaign was misguided loyalty to his players, and a catalogue of highly questionable decisions regarding team selection. Ultimately it was his suicidal tactics (the performance in Tblisi is beyond reproach) and the style of play he fermented with his players which are most galling

[Closed Account 2]

There will be a few countries looking for new managers now. Ourselves, Italy, Scotland, the USA, possibly Wales, NI and Holland.

[samhaydenjr]

Presumably to be kept on, but for how long? What will it take for the trigger to be pulled? Nations League failure, or struggling with Euro qualification?

Failure to get into Euro 2020, now that numbers are expanded would probably be right (Nations League will give an opportunity to experiment a bit). While aspects of the manner of our departure from the World Cup are definitely disappointing, overall getting into a playoff from a group containing four teams with serious qualification aspirations is within the range of "reasonable expectations" for us. I would hope to see some evolution in our system - it's all well and good to have a strong defensive set-up, but we have to be be better at forcing errors from opponents and pouncing on them to create chances - that's the part of Jack Charlton's strategy people who complain about his 'hoofball' plan forget - the point of the long ball was to constantly have teams chasing back to their own goal and then hounding them to force errors (See Houghton '88, Sheedy and Quinn '90).

Another important task for the management team is to blood in the talented youngsters coming through in the coming months, something they've already managed to do reasonably successfully over the past few years, even though qualifying for France actually limited opportunities to do this - so far they've given debuts to Rob Elliot, Shane Duffy, Cyrus Christie, Kevin Long, John Egan, Andy Boyle, Eunan O'Kane, Callum O'Dowda, Conor Hourihane, Harry Arter, Jonny Hayes, Daryl Horgan, Alan Browne, David McGoldrick and Sean Maguire - they need to give some of these players more responsibility as well as bringing in some of the youngsters coming through

[gastric]

Failure to get into Euro 2020, now that numbers are expanded would probably be right (Nations League will give an opportunity to experiment a bit). While aspects of the manner of our departure from the World Cup are definitely disappointing, overall getting into a playoff from a group containing four teams with serious qualification aspirations is within the range of "reasonable expectations" for us. I would hope to see some evolution in our system - it's all well and good to have a strong defensive set-up, but we have to be be better at forcing errors from opponents and pouncing on them to create chances - that's the part of Jack Charlton's strategy people who complain about his 'hoofball' plan forget - the point of the long ball was to constantly have teams chasing back to their own goal and then hounding them to force errors (See Houghton '88, Sheedy and Quinn '90).

Another important task for the management team is to blood in the talented youngsters coming through in the coming months, something they've already managed to do reasonably successfully over the past few years, even though qualifying for France actually limited opportunities to do this - so far they've given debuts to Rob Elliot, Shane Duffy, Cyrus Christie, Kevin Long, John Egan, Andy Boyle, Eunan O'Kane, Callum O'Dowda, Conor Hourihane, Harry Arter, Jonny Hayes, Daryl Horgan, Alan Browne, David McGoldrick and Sean Maguire - they need to give some of these players more responsibility as well as bringing in some of the youngsters coming through

In one way, not qualifying means that in the next year's friendlies in the build up to the WC, younger players can be blooded, experimentation can occur and maybe confidence can be built. There is certainly an opportunity, the question is will it occur.

[Stuttgart88]

I'm torn. Part me thinks better to stick with what we know because a replacement could be worse.

I'd be happy for him to go though. I have no idea, I mean no idea at all, what Keane brings to the table. One of the world's best midfielders must know how a midfield is supposed to work.

Seeing Walford and Guppy there just makes me think of the poor local FAI coaches and development officers who have had to wear a pay cut. Walford can't afford socks I suppose so maybe he's not draining too much FAI money.

Names that need to be in the mix are Stephen Kenny, Lee Carsley, Steven Reid and Keith Andrews. The latter two as back-up.

Chris Hughton would be great but he's the manager after next I think. I have a soft spot for McCarthy too but even rationally I think he could do a job especially if given a free hand now. He has proved himself as a rebuilder before.

Some McCarthy era stalwarts like Carsley, Cunningham, Breen, Kilbane, Kinsella all seem to have something going for them in the brains department, as does Keith Andrews.

[backstothewall]

I've been a big fan of O'Neill but I think It's time to call it a day. I would have given Trap more time but in truth he had lost his authority at Euro 2012 and never recovered it. I don't think O'Neill can come back from this.

A replacement will be tricky though. There is no obvious candidate out there.

We don't have to do anything rash though. We have all the time in the world. Maybe move on O'Neill, Guppy and Walford and ask Roy to take on the Cup of Nations.

I think we should do this without the Denis O'Brien money. It seems to poison the well with certain other journalists and broadcasters.

[IsMiseSean]

6 players under the age of 25 have been capped by O'Neill (maybe 7, not sure about John Egan).

3 of them came this year.

[backstothewall]

Upon reflection that idea in my last post about giving it to Keane is cobblers. He's burnt every bridge he's ever been on. It would be out of the frying pan and into the fire with the press.

Bring back Big Mick.

[brine3]

I think we should do this without the Denis O'Brien money.

You can be sure the Danish manager isn't on Martin O'Neill's salary.

[brine3]

Upon reflection that idea in my last post about giving it to Keane is cobblers. He's burnt every bridge he's ever been on. It would be out of the frying pan and into the fire with the press.

Bring back Big Mick.

I am a die hard Keane fan and back him to the hilt. But I don't think he's management material.

Let's move forward. No Mick. No Roy. No MON.

[backstothewall]

I am a die hard Keane fan and back him to the hilt. But I don't think he's management material.

Let's move forward. No Mick. No Roy. No MON.

I appreciate the sentiment, and i don't necessarily disagree. But who should it be?