Euro 2008 - Is there any hope?

[Wolfie]

Euro 2008 - Is there any hope?

Many may question the sanity of even posing the question but just thought I'd throw it out there anyway.

The margin for error is practically down to zero (need a series of big wins both home and away) and the obvious chasm of points to claw back is demoralising before we kick a ball.

Are we dead in the water for 2008 or is a comeback of Lazarus / Noel Edmunds like proportions remotely attainable?

Deal or no Deal?

[Fergie's Son]

No deal. Not with Stan Muppet in charge anyway.

Agree, agree, agree.

[Qwerty]

Paul Le Guen anyone? :)

[Wolfie]

Paul Le Guen anyone? :)

We could do with Paul Daniels to turn this one around.

[The Legend]

not a lot, not a lot.

[billybunter]

i think we got caught up in the emotion of the cyprus/ czech republic week. when you look at our table in the cold light of day - it does not look good. I'll cheer them on anyways, but pity about that fiasco in cyprus. Wonder if duff and keane will ever fulfill their potential. we would need to go on an unprecedented run of results, and quite honestly, when was the last time that happened? The only positive is the fact wales / cyprus / slovakia may take points off other teams, but in fairness they are probably saying the same about us!!!

[theworm2345]

As long as were arent mathematically eliminated, there is hope. You learn that when your from Chicago. If there is a chance, then you can hope (see: Chicago Cubs :()

[RogerMilla]

worm , i was going to post this self same thing yesterday and i'm glad you did. truth be told i think we won't qualify but were we to win the next 4 games and other results to go our way then we would be heading to prague and trnava with a full head of steam. bottom line is we will not do it but i reserve the right to dream the dream if we put slovakia and wales emphatically to the sword in croker.

[shakermaker1982]

Beating San Marino means we are 3 points off the leaders having played a game more. The Germans drawing with Cyprus has tightened up the group and puts pressure on them. If we then win our back to back games with Wales and Slovakia in March then we are sitting on 13 points whilst zee Germans have to play the Czechs away on the same day as our Welsh fixture (someone will drop points here - maybe even a draw). Maybe I'm too optimistic but if we will all our games at home we have a fighting chance...... keep the faith!!!

[eirebhoy]

For some reason I got over the Cyprus match very quickly but I'm still disappointed we failed to beat the Czechs. Any team will be doing well to win in Cyprus so if we beat the Czechs we'd have as much chance of qualifying as ever. In saying that, I'd have taken a win here and a defeat over there so a draw over there might make up for it (assuming Germany win the group). 3 wins from our next 3 games is vital though.

[elroy]

Agreed eireboy, 9 points in the next three games is a must and if you look at it- San Marino and 2 home games against mediocre opposition-we should win them, otherwise we def dont deserve to qualify.

Im not looking beyond those three games at the moment, if results go our way and Germany beat the Czechs (or at worst draw with them) away then we are right back in it.

If we can keep and improve on the standard we saw against the Czechs then we might just have a chance.

[youngirish]

If we are to have any hope of qualifying we need Slovakia and Wales to take a few unlikely points of Germany (possibly one or the other by drawing with them in Germany or one beating and another drawing with them at home) and then I still think we'll probably have to beat Germany at Croker.

I think the Czech's should coast now - we are not going to beat them away and they've already hammerred Slovakia away. Germany might beat them at home but I can't see that in itself doing us any good.

In all honesty I think you'd have to be very optimisitc (maybe even slightly insane) to expect us to finish anywhere higher than 3rd and under Stan that in itself is going to be tough.

[0325422]

theres plenty of matches left, i wouldnt write anybody off. would have preferred if cyprus drew with the czechs and not the germans but anyway. i still believe its going to be germany to top the group and ireland chasing the czechs until the wales match. i also believe there is no point in blaming stan solely for the results either. roy keane has given him his full backing and thats enough for me. roy is a straight talker and says it like it is. no bulls@%t .....

[SuperDave]

i think we got caught up in the emotion of the cyprus/ czech republic week. when you look at our table in the cold light of day - it does not look good. I'll cheer them on anyways, but pity about that fiasco in cyprus. Wonder if duff and keane will ever fulfill their potential. we would need to go on an unprecedented run of results, and quite honestly, when was the last time that happened? The only positive is the fact wales / cyprus / slovakia may take points off other teams, but in fairness they are probably saying the same about us!!!


un·prec·e·dent·ed [uhn-pres-i-den-tid] http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/unprecedented
–adjective
without previous instance; never before known or experienced; unexampled or unparalleled: an unprecedented event

yours,
p. dant

[republicofwhite]

I'm not generally a pessimist but this for me, is definitely over. The recurring statistic that consistently comes back to haunt us is the fact that we have failed to win a competitive match against a footballing nation of note(many mediocre nations included i.e. Israel) since Holland. There is no hiding from this at all,thats why we hear it so much and it both speaks serious volumes and illustrates that we have no character, killer instinct, guile or cutting edge, in terms of both attitude and footballing talent. In addition, none of our stars(excluding Shay Given) ever fulfil trheir potential for their country. Allied to the fact that we have an unsuccessful Walsall defensive coach in charge of the whole thing,who is hypocritical and scared s*&tless to try and change things, this means the odds are stacked against us to get wins agaisnt Wales and Slovakia(probably even Cyprus at this stage), let alone Germany and the Czechs. Obviously I hold some hope but there's not a snowballs chance in hell we'll make it. My main worry is that we'll do so badly our seedings will be irreversibly damaged for the next few campaigns. Thats what we should be aiming to put right at this stage.

[galwayhoop]

theres plenty of matches left, i wouldnt write anybody off. would have preferred if cyprus drew with the czechs and not the germans but anyway. i still believe its going to be germany to top the group and ireland chasing the czechs .....

i agree here. 9 points from 9 and we're not out of it. personally i will be hoping that the germans win every remaining match. first place is unrealistic but if the czechs, slovaks, welsh all lose points they can be caught. with 2 qualifing automatically and no play-off to negotiate we gotta still push for it. if the germans beat the czechs and we win our 3 games we're not a million miles away although it would mean getting major results away from home..... positivity over: will we get there: don't think so espically under current regime.


roy keane has given him his full backing and thats enough for me. roy is a straight talker and says it like it is. no bulls@%t .....

:rolleyes:

the fact roy keane is currently working under niall quinn and apparently on talking basis with mick mcCarthy after all the mutterings and writings of the past 5 years should surely show that not EVERY little sentence that roy keane speaks is the Gospel. apparently not to some people

[cavan_fan]

Allied to the fact that we have an unsuccessful Walsall defensive coach in charge of the whole thing


If only we did, Stan wasnt the anything coach at Walsall, he was put on the coaching staff as a way around the salary cap for players. We should check if he had this fake job on his CV then have him done for fraud.

[republicofwhite]

This doesn't surprise me in the slightest. Thanks for the heads up. My exasperation has been accentuated but at least I'm more enlightened...:cool:

[Noelys Guitar]

Surely someone in the FAI other than Delaney and Blood must have had major doubts about Staunton before appointing him. And must have known after hearing him speak in person that he did not and does not have a ****ing scooby!

[billybunter]

super dave - apologies for the "beckhamism" ....... : )

[theleprechaun]

i believe we can still do it yet!!! as they say hope springs eternal

[Wolfie]

Beating San Marino means we are 3 points off the leaders having played a game more. The Germans drawing with Cyprus has tightened up the group and puts pressure on them. If we then win our back to back games with Wales and Slovakia in March then we are sitting on 13 points whilst zee Germans have to play the Czechs away on the same day as our Welsh fixture (someone will drop points here - maybe even a draw). Maybe I'm too optimistic but if we will all our games at home we have a fighting chance...... keep the faith!!!

Suspending disbelief, etc etc, - if we do get a run of results together, the fact we don't figure in the last round of fixtures could work against us. Although the last time that happened, Scotland beat Bulgaria away in 1987...........

[citizenerased]

Yeah, keep the faith lads...im an optimist and there is no reason to fear anyone, but then you realise we have focckkin STAN.........

[SligoBrewer]

we havent a donkeys chance lads..

duff and keane not firing...
a muppet who NEVER MANAGED BEFORE in charge..

world cup 2010? f*ck off!

[Golfer]

You have a better chance of seeing somoene from the DUP taking a seat in West Belfast than you have of us going to 2008.

[DmanDmythDledge]

Suspending disbelief, etc etc, - if we do get a run of results together, the fact we don't figure in the last round of fixtures could work against us. Although the last time that happened, Scotland beat Bulgaria away in 1987...........
I think it will help us. Better to have points in the bag rather than have games in hand.

[galwayhoop]

You have a better chance of seeing somoene from the DUP taking a seat in West Belfast than you have of us going to 2008.

looks like we'd better start booking the flights lads!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diane_Dodds

Diane Dodds is a member of the Democratic Unionist Party and is one of the six MLAs in the currently suspended Northern Ireland Assembly that represent the constituency of West Belfast.

[grounded]

For some reason I got over the Cyprus match very quickly but I'm still disappointed we failed to beat the Czechs. Any team will be doing well to win in Cyprus so if we beat the Czechs we'd have as much chance of qualifying as ever. In saying that, I'd have taken a win here and a defeat over there so a draw over there might make up for it (assuming Germany win the group). 3 wins from our next 3 games is vital though.

Loosing 5-2 to (according to FIFA) No.73 in the ranks is ok but drawing with No. 10 is disappointing?

Not having a go or anything but out of curousity could you please tell me how that works out?

[eirebhoy]

Loosing 5-2 to (according to FIFA) No.73 in the ranks is ok but drawing with No. 10 is disappointing?

Not having a go or anything but out of curousity could you please tell me how that works out?
I didn't crack into my brain and choose from a list of emotions after both matches so I can't explain why. :D Any team will be doing well to win in Cyprus so we didn't need to win there. I also realised, with the lineup Stan put out and the performance of the team that Stan is a poor manager so a disastrous defeat would have hopefully got rid of him. It was clear that Stan was going to be staying for this campaign though so I was 100% behind the team for the Czech match. They were there for the taken and we failed to beat them. I couldn't see any way for us to qualify after that draw and Stan was staying on either way.

[grounded]

Was just wondering.......moving on

Being german myself I thought the game in Germany was a cracker. If you play like that at Croke Park chances are pretty good to take the three points.

There are 6 points between Ireland and Czech. We still have to play Czech twice and plan on taking the 6 points of them. So there all sorted :p

[cavan_fan]

I think we all would all agree San Marino will lose all their matches, so it's more useful to look at a table ignoring mathces against them. At present thsi stands

Teams Pld Pts
Germany 3 7
Czech Republic 3 7
Slovakia 4 6
Cyprus 4 4
Wales 3 3
Republic of Ireland 3 1

This shows the scale of the task in hand, even though we have a game in hand against some teams.

[Wolfie]

Was just wondering.......moving on

Being german myself I thought the game in Germany was a cracker. If you play like that at Croke Park chances are pretty good to take the three points.

There are 6 points between Ireland and Czech. We still have to play Czech twice and plan on taking the 6 points of them. So there all sorted :p

There's nothing "grounded" about those intentions but you win hands down on complete and utter assurance that you'll get maximum points off the Czechs. There's a thin line between arrogance and confidence but i think you've stayed just about the right side of it!!

Thanks for the favour - rest assured we'll do our damndest to take three off Germany at Croker!! :D

(Bravado - a sure sign we're up against it)

[RogerMilla]

wolfie , bravado is about all we've got left chief ! i keep telling the germans that we will beat them next time and you know what some day i'll be right !!

[Wolfie]

wolfie , bravado is about all we've got left chief ! i keep telling the germans that we will beat them next time and you know what some day i'll be right !!

If we're still in with a shout by the time the Germany at home match rolls around (13.10.07) - It'll be a result in itself.

[citizenerased]

Of course it was dissappointing to get a draw with the czechs irrespective of their fifa ranking, we were robbed and as usual, bottled it and failed to launch a killer blow,,we desperately needed to win that after the cyprus debacle...fifa rankings are bolllix anyway...

[brine3]

Not a hope in hell, not with this board, this manager and this squad.

But hey, at least the players will be able to get ****ed again, like the good old days.

[Wolfie]

Euro 2008 - Is there any hope?

Many may question the sanity of even posing the question but just thought I'd throw it out there anyway.

The margin for error is practically down to zero (need a series of big wins both home and away) and the obvious chasm of points to claw back is demoralising before we kick a ball.

Are we dead in the water for 2008 or is a comeback of Lazarus / Noel Edmunds like proportions remotely attainable?

Deal or no Deal?

Suppose we're back in with a fighting chance!!!

[Jerry The Saint]

It's tempting to be optimistic (fun too :) ) but, as it stands, we have more games played and a worse goal difference than our 2 rivals despite having already played most of our easier games :(

On the other hand - we're joint top!

(This is why Paul Osam is right when he says that only a fool looks at the league table :D )

[youngirish]

Suppose we're back in with a fighting chance!!!

A chance that's all. We had two easy home games against dreadful to poor opposition. The real challenge will come now with three tough away games (Slovakia, Czech Rep and Wales) and our toughest home game (Germany). Judging by last nights performance Cyprus will be no pushovers in Dublin either and we have to beat them.

To have any hope I reckon we have to get 11 points plus from those games though we might need as many as 13.

Billsthoughts goal difference counts for nothing. It's head to head.

[galwayhoop]

It's tempting to be optimistic (fun too :) ) but, as it stands, we have more games played and a worse goal difference than our 2 rivals despite having already played most of our easier games :(


its head to head results that count - not goal difference - if teams finish on equal points. worked out on a home and away basis (like european club knock-out games). on that score we need to have a score draw at least against the czechs to have a realistic chance of finishing second - presuming germany steam roll everyone (except us of course ;) ).

[youngirish]

its head to head results that count - not goal difference - if teams finish on equal points. worked out on a home and away basis (like european club knock-out games). on that score we need to have a score draw at least against the czechs to have a realistic chance of finishing second - presuming germany steam roll everyone (except us of course ;) ).

If we are going to be realistic we need the Welsh and the Cypriots to both take points of the Czechs I believe. If neither do manage to do so it's likely we'll have to beat the Czechs away and also win 3 of the other four games. This is not going to happen so it's up to the Welsh and the Cypriots.

[Block G Raptor]

I quite Fancy it now. the young lads coming through will have six months more experience and a few friendlies under there belts when the away games come around. The friendlies wil be more important this summer than the usual meaningless tripe we normally have. Stan made only one selection error last night (Finnan and O'shea in reversed roles) which is a huge improvement. His substitutions were bang on. so maybe just maybe he's learning from his howlers of the past. and maybe all the OTT media criticism is serving a purpose in a reverse psychology kind of way ie the players know what stan is really like not the 30 second press conference stan that we see so maybe they are ready to stand up and be counted for the gaffer
who knows maybe its a flash in the pan but maybe we have started to move in the right direction

[RogerMilla]

the cyprans ( a la apres match ) wont do anything in the czech republic i reckon , wales home game with czech is vital for us. hope the welsh get somethign there

[youngirish]

the cyprans ( a la apres match ) wont do anything in the czech republic i reckon , wales home game with czech is vital for us. hope the welsh get somethign there

The Cypriots have to play the Czechs in Nicosia. They nearly got a draw with them in the Czech Republic. 1-0 though Cech made a great save in injury time to hang onto the win.

[Jerry The Saint]

its head to head results that count - not goal difference - if teams finish on equal points.

So...you're saying we're DEFINITELY going to qualify:confused: :D

A 1-1 or 0-0 draw in Czechistan (good result under normal circumstances) is unlikely to be enough then without getting some extra help.



Team P W D L F/A Pts
1 Germany 5 4 1 0 21 / 3 13
2 Czech Republic 6 4 1 1 15 / 4 13
3 Rep of Ire 7 4 1 2 12 / 8 13
4 Slovakia 6 3 0 3 15 / 11 9
5 Wales 5 2 0 3 8 / 9 6
6 Cyprus 6 1 1 4 9 / 16 4
7 San Marino 5 0 0 5 1 / 30 0

Win three games and draw with Czech Rep. and Germany leaves us on 24 points.

Czech run-in

02.06.2007 v Wales (A)
08.09.2007 v San Marino (A)
12.09.2007 v Republic of Ireland (H)
17.10.2007 v Germany (A)
17.11.2007 v Slovakia (H)

Allowing for a draw against us and defeat to Germany, you could see them winning the rest so that brings them to 23 with a final game -

21.11.2007 v Cyprus (A)

- where they may only need a point depending on the score in the game against Ireland...?

[galwayhoop]

If we are going to be realistic we need the Welsh and the Cypriots to both take points of the Czechs I believe. If neither do manage to do so it's likely we'll have to beat the Czechs away and also win 3 of the other four games. This is not going to happen so it's up to the Welsh and the Cypriots.


yeah quite possibly but i was just explaining that the goal difference won't come into it, as its results against each other.

the point is really that even if we go and beat the slovaks away and only draw 0-0 with the czechs it means we have to finish with more points than them. we need to at least draw 1-1 or beat them. regardless of other results.

and yes you are right we probably need 6 points from those 2 games. also need to beat wales and cyprus and a draw with the germans should qualify us. not probable i know but, as the man says, while its still possible!

[galwayhoop]

ironic as it is but the 1-1 draw that saved stan may end up to be the one that knocks us out if we draw 0-0 to the czechs!!

[Nailer77]

There's always hope but its a big ask in fairness and as good as last night was we need to push on from it and not revert like we did after the Czechs. I think there's still some potentially strange results in this group so you never know. Still we've got the harder away games to come and going on our away form so far you've got to be realistic.

But...we've now got 6 months to build on this and introduce some alternative players to the squad in the friendlies ahead, we need to look at another CB, LB, CM and RW but it needs to be done right around a core of players that are established so its not just a mish mash of newbies with no direction. If we don't qualify but show some progression by November then I think Stan will have warranted another two years.

[Condex]

My predictions!!

Wales v czech * 1-1
san marino v czech * 0-10
czech v Ireland * 1-1
germany v czech * 3-1
czech v slovakia * 2-1
cyprus v czech * 0-3


SLOVAKIA v ireland * 1-2
CZECH REPUBLIC v ireland * 1-1
ireland v GERMANY * 1-1
ireland v CYPRUS * 4-0
WALES v irleand * 0-2

Germany to win group
Czech 23
Ireland 23

Then it would be us to go through as we did better against
Germany, a bit optomistic but what the hell!!!

[Block G Raptor]

The only optimistic bit there is Wales to hold czech the rest is possible if not probable