Euro 2008 - Is there any hope?

[Wolfie]

I certainly think its crucial we approach the games with the intention of winning them as opposed to "not losing".

If we're serious about qualifying - 6 points should be the ambitious target with 4 considered acceptable.

[youngirish]

DmanDmythDledge and Eirebhoy have a look at the remaining fixtures and tell me how you can come to the conclusion that 2 points is going to be anywhere near enough to qualify? 3 points is an absolute minimum and that's only if we beat the Czechs.

[citizenerased]

6 points all the way lads, thats what we should be striving for, last night was evidence that we are capable of playing decent possesion football, it will be interesting now to see what midfield stan starts with against slovakia..Id leave kilbane out.and stick in Reid, ............what we need now is for richie dunne to break - open Rosicky at the weekend...

''Whats that comin over the hill, its Richie Dunne, its Richie Dunne!!!!'''

[eirebhoy]

DmanDmythDledge and Eirebhoy have a look at the remaining fixtures and tell me how you can come to the conclusion that 2 points is going to be anywhere near enough to qualify?
Do you think I haven't looked at the fixtures? For some reason people think me saying "2 points isn't the end of the world" means "2 points would be fantastic".

Anyway,

Ireland:
Slovakia (a) - Draw
Czech (a) - Draw
Germany (h) - Win
Cyprus (h) - Win
Wales (a) - Win

Czechs:
San Marino (a) - Win
Ireland (h) - Draw
Germany (a) - Defeat
Slovakia (h) - Win
Cyprus (a) - Win

Leaves us both on 24 points. That is all I've said. If we draw these 2 games we're certainly not out of it.

[Sligo Hornet]

I'd bet my mortgage 2 points won't be anywhere near enough to qualify. Have a look at the remaining fixtures and tell me how you came to that conclusion?

I'm with you YI.....2 points and we are out....4 is the minimum to keep things interesting......6 and I think we will do it!

[youngirish]

Do you think I haven't looked at the fixtures? For some reason people think me saying "2 points isn't the end of the world" means "2 points would be fantastic".

Anyway,

Ireland:
Slovakia (a) - Draw
Czech (a) - Draw
Germany (h) - Win
Cyprus (h) - Win
Wales (a) - Win

Czechs:
San Marino (a) - Win
Ireland (h) - Draw
Germany (a) - Defeat
Slovakia (h) - Win
Cyprus (a) - Win

Leaves us both on 24 points. That is all I've said. If we draw these 2 games we're certainly not out of it.
I would eat my own head if we managed to draw 2-2 or more (unlikely) with the Czechs followed by successive wins against Germany,Wales and Cyprus while still expecting the Czechs to get nothing from a German team we had just beaten.

2 points is never going to be enough realistically.

[Nailer77]

Of course there's hope. Take 4 points from those September games and things actually look encouraging. As someone said 2 points wouldn't be the end of the world but realistically we need to pick up 4. And its not beyond the realms of possibility given how poor the Slovaks looked in Croker. Also remember that the Czechs were no power houses in Lansdowne last year, which was very surprising to me. Do I expect us to pick up 4? No I don't but there's hope.

[paul_oshea]

I would eat my own head if we managed to draw 2-2 or more (unlikely) with the Czechs followed by successive wins against Germany,Wales and Cyprus while still expecting the Czechs to get nothing from a German team we had just beaten.


young one, im with ye on this, you are talking practical sense, rather than theoretical sense. What EB is saying on paper is fine and dandy, but the reality will be very much different. 4 points at least, and if thats the case a draw v slovakia and a win v czechs. To be honest I wish the czech game was first.

[youngirish]

I think we should really be beating the Slovaks tbh. Yes our away form is poor but their home form is even worse. They've been beaten 3-0 and 4-1 by the Czechs and Germans at home. They've had more impressive results away from home thus far in this group. Surely we should expect to manage a 1-0.

[eirebhoy]

I would eat my own head if we managed to draw 2-2 or more (unlikely) with the Czechs followed by successive wins against Germany,Wales and Cyprus while still expecting the Czechs to get nothing from a German team we had just beaten.

2 points is never going to be enough realistically.
I certainly do expect the Czechs to get nothing in Germany, especially if we beat Germany beforehand. I also think they'll be doing very well to win in Cyprus. Of course we'd also be doing very well to win our last 3 games. Anyway, 4 points should be the minimum aim. I'm actually confident going to Slovakia with Dunne and McShane at the back.

[cavan_fan]

When we talk about 4 points do we mean beat Slovaks, draw with Czechs. As a matter of interest what would 3 points mean. Given we are likely to be competing most with Czechs for 2nd would think that is the truly vital match, we need to take points from them.

[paul_oshea]

As a matter of interest what would 3 points mean


According to EB a definite 26 ponits and 2 ahead of the czechs :D

I still feel we will end up on 21 or 22. its just annoying cos of the crap lowly points we got in the last group. We always seem to up our points when needed but miss out by 1 point or so......its always a case of IF ONLY. IF ONLY we had beaten cyprus. We would be 2 points ahead now. IF that had happend though we prolly woulld have drawn to slovakia or wales!

[Stuttgart88]

I haven't got the table in front of me but I think right now I'd take a defeat in Slovakia and a win in Czech Rep and take our chances from there.

2 points will be OK if that's all we can get having tried hard for more.

As TP said a while back, it does look like we've turned a corner. Credit where it's due but it's a shame that critical errors on and off the pitch have cost us a few points.

Whatever about Cyprus and failing to maintain our lead to the Czechs, Richard Dunne's late miss in Stuttgart is really bugging me!

[Wolfie]

Whatever about Cyprus and failing to maintain our lead to the Czechs, Richard Dunne's late miss in Stuttgart is really bugging me!

Yeah, maybe a bit harsh but I try not to dwell on Robbie Keane's late headed miss against the Czech's either!!

[geysir]

That miss by Robbie against the Czechs has hurt our chances in this group much more than any of the other 2 losses.
We were a soft enough touch when this group started. We have just a decent chance, most will agree that Stan is close enough to putting out our best team and they will be giving their best.

[paul_oshea]

That miss by Robbie against the Czechs has hurt our chances in this group much more than any of the other 2 losses.


ya because it was against the czechs!!!

[billybunter]

based on recent form (ours and the opposition) as well as the run in schedule, I think Ireland would have to be favorites to take the second slot in this group. So of course there is hope.

[geysir]

Time to sober up Billy :)
todays odds
Czechs to qualify 2/9
Ireland to qualify 7/2
Ireland not to qualify 1/5

[TheBoss]

If we can get 4 points from these 2 games v Czech Rep and Slovakia, that would be make him happy. The other games are very much winnable ones, the 2 home and Wales away, which will be a Home game virtually with the support that will fill the stadium as Wales will be out and lots of free tickets for the Irish Fans.

[Lionel Ritchie]

While there's a mathematical chance of making it I won't stop hoping. But realistically I don't see it happening. We might well only pick up three more points in this group.

Last night was encouraging but frankly it'd have been arguably more useful if it had been us that got beaten BUT in the process found a trick we can pull when we're behind to an inferior side away from home.

I think the "ah sure we'll be grand" factor is a danger and shouldn't be underestimated.

[Ordinary Fan]

let's not get carried away with a friendly, the result was great but the Danes were'nt interested and still should have scores first. Our competitive away form is rubbish and as much as I want us to qualify, I think we are still short of players and experience to make it.

I think we will unluckly draw 1:1 with Slovakia and a third Irish side with injuries and suspensions will loose 2:0 to the Czechs!

[paul_oshea]

Again, Im with wolfie on this. :p

[billybunter]

Time to sober up Billy :)
todays odds
Czechs to qualify 2/9
Ireland to qualify 7/2
Ireland not to qualify 1/5

guess the bookies dont agree with my logic then. Fook them!

[DmanDmythDledge]

Do you think I haven't looked at the fixtures? For some reason people think me saying "2 points isn't the end of the world" means "2 points would be fantastic".

Anyway,

Ireland:
Slovakia (a) - Draw
Czech (a) - Draw
Germany (h) - Win
Cyprus (h) - Win
Wales (a) - Win

Czechs:
San Marino (a) - Win
Ireland (h) - Draw
Germany (a) - Defeat
Slovakia (h) - Win
Cyprus (a) - Win

Leaves us both on 24 points. That is all I've said. If we draw these 2 games we're certainly not out of it.
I was thinking the same but for us to draw with Germany and the Czechs to draw with Cyprus.

It could well be enough to get us through but as I'd agree with youngirish (and whovever else said it) that we need to aim for more to be sure.

[paul_oshea]

cyprus could only beat san marino 1 - 0, do you honestly think that they are going to pose any threat in a meaningless last group game to the czechs?

[Torn-Ado]

Still don't think we'll qualify regardless of last nights result.

[DmanDmythDledge]

cyprus could only beat san marino 1 - 0, do you honestly think that they are going to pose any threat in a meaningless last group game to the czechs?
Did you not listen to Stan, it's a difficult place to go to.:D

Cyrpus are a good team at home (not just saying that because they beat us). They held Germany to a draw and beat Spain a few years ago. They only lost 1-0 away to the Czechs as well.

[Paddy Garcia]

I'd be very surprised if we beat Germany. Better to go for 2 away wins.

[eirebhoy]

cyprus could only beat san marino 1 - 0, do you honestly think that they are going to pose any threat in a meaningless last group game to the czechs?
yes. Surely we know by now that Cyprus are a decent side at home. As for it being a meaningless game for Cyprus. It was no different for Malta in similar circumstances a few years ago:
http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/archive/edition=4395/preliminaries/preliminary=3835/matches/match=19625/report.html

Cyprus will treat it like they treat every game. It's not like they're aiming for qualification anyway.

As for Paddy Garcia's comment, I'd honestly be surprised if Germany beat us.

[stojkovic]

I think four points is a MINIMUM requirement in Central Europe.

Assuming the Czechs lose in Germany I think can get whatever we need against Germany and Wales to qualify. Germany will already have won the group and hopefully we can call in a few favours against the Welsh.

So if we get the four points I think we WILL qualify.

[Paddy Garcia]

As for Paddy Garcia's comment, I'd honestly be surprised if Germany beat us.

But you are counting on a win.

TBH given our recent competitive performances I would not at all be surprised to lose that game, & likely a reasonable performance whcih Stan can consider as a moral victory. Think a draw is most likely though.

[eirebhoy]

But you are counting on a win.

Not really. I was just pointing out that 2 draws in the next 2 games could see us qualifying if we won our remaining 3 games. I'm confident we could beat Germany though.

[Wolfie]

Again, Im with wolfie on this. :p

Sound, Posh. Great to see that you place such a high value on my opinion.

As we both know, my view on here is as legitimate as anyone elses. No more, no less.

The petty attempts to sarcastically single me out and therefore rubbish my view is a bit sad.

This was such a ridiculous thread for me to introduce - there's obviously such a low level of interest in assessing the boards mood of whether we've a chance of qualifying or not. The point being, if no-ones interested, the thread will have a natural life span and die off.

The thread that everyone really wants to discuss, of course, is "The word "Job" when playing for your country" .

[paul_oshea]

Sound, Posh. Great to see that you place such a high value on my opinion.

As we both know, my view on here is as legitimate as anyone elses. No more, no less.

The petty attempts to sarcastically single me out and therefore rubbish my view is a bit sad.

Wolfie dont be getting upset, I was actually being serious!!

I noticed that you wrote the same sorta stuff as I would. Dont be so sensitive :)

[citizenerased]

in fairness the group is over-rated..we should get 4 points in the two games at least...anything less in unacceptable...d the only thing id doubt would be the players bottle..

[bwagner]

citizenerased - spot on mate just take a look at this group
Poland
Finland
Portugal
Serbia
Belgium
Armenia
Kazakhstan
Azerbaijan

To me that is a real tuff group

[carloz]

Denmark
Sweden
Spain
Northen Ireland
Latvia
Iceland
Leichtenstein


There is another very difficult group if we were in it. With the exception of Germany we are in a very easy group, IMO the easiest geoup of the lot. I dont understand how some people are saying we have the hardest group. To the best of my knowledge Scotland were seeded the same as us and look at the group they got. Of course people will then comed back with the stupid argument that we play better against good teams, i really dont understand why this is the case. The simple thing is qualifying from this group is in our own hands, if we do our own business we will qualify. If we beat the Slovaks that will really set up the Czech game and im sure they will not be looking forward to playing us

[Pád Von Tirpitz]

To me that is a real tuff group

I disagree - it's more of a tough group.

Ireland to take two points from the next two games and still hold out faint hope, against all common sense. I don't think it's going to happen this time but we've probably started to head in the right direction and a lot rests on the draw for the next qualifiers.

[Wolfie]

Wolfie dont be getting upset, I was actually being serious!!

I noticed that you wrote the same sorta stuff as I would. Dont be so sensitive :)

Sound Paul. Apologies - took that up wrong, there.

[bwagner]

Pád Von Tirpitz - Thats the funniest post I have ever read hhahahahaahahahahahahaahaha...no wonder no-one likes you

[paul_oshea]

Pád Von Tirpitz - Thats the funniest post I have ever read hhahahahaahahahahahahaahaha...no wonder no-one likes you



Have I missed something?

[bwagner]

Nobody likes Von T because he smells :O(
Anyways guys back to the group , I think if Stan gets the right team and right subs in both games (please god Shay is back) I honestly think we can get 4 points , 6 would not be a total shock but I reckon 4 would be enough to build on .These young team we are now seeing as little fear and there are hungry to make the cut in Switzerland/Austria

[wallis]

If we beat Slovakia and draw with the Czechs then I think we will qualify.

It leaves us a point behind the czechs but I cant see them winning in Germany as the Germans will need to win that game to clinch the group.

Germany will target that game as their three pointer and will be glad to leave Croker with a point.

[Wolfie]

The Wales away fixture takes place on the 17th Nov 07. The Czech's play the Slovaks in Prague that night.

We don't figure in the last round of games that take place on 21st Nov 07:

Cyprus v Czech Rep
Germany v Wales
San Marino v Slovakia

Still can't make my mind up if this is a good thing or a bad thing eg, to have the games over us or to be able to react to results as they happen on the pitch that night (if it still makes a difference).

Can anyone else visualise a panic stricken vigil by the tv that night- pacing the room and praying to God that Cyprus hold onto a draw? :( :eek:

I recall the last 4 minutes of Spain v Denmark in 1993 AFTER our game with the North had just ended? Excruciating.

[wallis]

With the way that Cyprus have performed at home in this campaign , I for one would NOT want to have to go there for three points. If they can stop us and Germany then they are very capable of upseting an under pressure Czech side.

[Wolfie]

I just hope we still have an interest that night.

Anyone else old enough to remember the Bulgaria v Scotland match in '87?

[billydoneit]

Anyone else old enough to remember the Bulgaria v Scotland match in '87?

Absolutely, a decent Bulgarian team as well, the Scots were not given a chance in that game if I remember correctly. The night (and the goal) that launched us into the big time....... I still believe with a bit of luck we could have gone on to win Euro '88, the performance against the soviets in Hanover remains my number 1 footballing memory, I thought we were brilliant that night. Anyway, enough nostalgia, I think we can take 4 points from these 2 games with a rub of the green and top performances all around but I have a feeling we will win in Slovakia and lose out by the odd goal against the Czechs.

[Bungle]

Absolutely, a decent Bulgarian team as well, the Scots were not given a chance in that game if I remember correctly. The night (and the goal) that launched us into the big time....... I still believe with a bit of luck we could have gone on to win Euro '88, the performance against the soviets in Hanover remains my number 1 footballing memory, I thought we were brilliant that night. Anyway, enough nostalgia, I think we can take 4 points from these 2 games with a rub of the green and top performances all around but I have a feeling we will win in Slovakia and lose out by the odd goal against the Czechs.

While I wouldn't be happy with that scenario, it would at least give our young team the confidence for future campaigns that they can go to places like Bratislava and come home with three points. We'd also be more or less guaranteed to be third seeds for the next campaign, which is something we could have only dreamt about after the Cyprus debacle.

[OwlsFan]

Anyone else old enough to remember the Bulgaria v Scotland match in '87?

Took the day off work to watch it. One of the if not the HIGHLIGHT of my years supporting Ireland. Watched the tape of the goal about 50 times afterwards. Sent Gary Mackay a christmas card for many years afterwards - I jest you not - thanking him for that goal.

The commentary by George Hamilton almost did my head in. He'd be talking about cracking open the Champagne bottles one second and the next second "oh, it's cleared off ther line!!!". The most nervous final minutes bar none I have ever experiences as the Bulgars pressed for an equaliser. I still get goose bumps thinking about it. Have the game on a betamax tape still someplace :D

[NeilMcD]

can you convert from Betamax to DVD. I would love a copy of that. I remember watching it also. We played Israel the night before and won 5 nil I think. David Kelly hatrick. Who was on the panel then. Was Giles, I kinda remember a crap studio like it was a hall in RTE with facke bushes in the background.