Michael Doyle

[tetsujin1979]

Paul wheeling out the old "most people who go to games" chestnut again. Classic stuff.
most people, who go to games, and are not on foot.ie, and post on ybig, and go to away games, and have mates who do the same, and have the same opinions as POS and TOWK, and so forth.

[Stuttgart88]

No Stutts, it's notit's not what? His manner that bugs me? It is. And yours.

[paul_oshea]

His opinions are not the same as everyone else here. That was i was referring to, and so everyone is jumping in and disagreeing with him broadly.

Ye have all missed the point, its nothing to do with those who go to games etc, its just those who dont post on foot.ie...:D And go to home games or away games or general interest in irish football etc :P

As i said bad manners on an internet forum, you need to get out a bit more ;-)

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Pages 1-3 were absolute comedy, and should go down in foot.ie folklore.

I don't see anything remotely funny about it.

No other country, not just England, would tolerate what he had to put up with in the second half of the Trapattoni era.

Several cases of mistaken identity.
Stuff constantly leaking to the press about the slapstick nature of the way Trapattoni was approaching the job.
The belligerence and complete lack of respect shown towards players like Kevin Foley, Steven Reid and Andy Reid.

Andy Reid. People on here making wisecracks about his weight and professionalism. That's all well and good, and sometimes amusing but when did you ever hear Andy Reid make derogatory remarks about Trapattoni? Never. The lad kept what happened between himself and Trapattoni to himself and I credit him for being the bigger man. Contrast that attitude with Trapattoni.

Several players have went on record as saying that the blow-up shouldn't have happened and that Trapattoni was out of order.

A lot of this seems to get blown by the wayside because it's just us, little Irelanders. What the harm?

[tetsujin1979]

His opinions are not the same as everyone else here.No, the majority of his opinions are the same, and have been discussed here before, and agreed upon. Very little of what he has said hasn't been said before


That was i was referring to, and so everyone is jumping in and disagreeing with him broadly. Actually, everyone is disagreeing with specific points he has made, without backing them up with evidence, and proving him wrong


Ye have all missed the point, its nothing to do with those who go to games etc, its just those who dont post on foot.ie...:D And go to home games or away games or general interest in irish football etc :Pthen don't keep using it to validate your opinions


As i said bad manners on an internet forum, you need to get out a bit more ;-)most posters have respect for one another and their opinions (attack the post not the poster, etc) and don't appreciate anyone stepping out of line

[Charlie Darwin]

The lad kept what happened between himself and Trapattoni to himself and I credit him for being the bigger man
I think that was the problem.

You obviously think Trap treated the players appallingly. I think he treated them as professionals. His comments about Stephen Reid were stupid and somewhat misinformed, but he's generally been vindicated by the fact Reid has barely put together a run of games since. On Andy Reid, he was spot on, a man who wasted his talent and is only belatedly realising some of that potential in his mid-thirties. Kevin Foley, he got dropped from a squad at the last minute. It's unfortunate, but sometimes coaches have to make these decisions, and Foley acted like a spoiled brat about it and his career has nosedived since. Darron Gibson was unprofessional in his dealings with Trap, Shane Long has been unprofessional in his public comments about managers. Trap didn't cause these players' problems.

[Stuttgart88]

Well said Tets.

Paul knows this full well though. He likes TOWK because he winds up several of those here he has less respect for. That's my suspicion anyway. I've said umpteen times here already that when he uses a spurious means of supporting an argument and fails to accept it when he's been called, that's what irks me and I consider it bad form. I couldn't give a hoot whether he says please or pardon or holds his cutlery the right way.


Anyway, there were far too many misunderstandings and miscommunications during the Trap era. Some of it certainly was Trap's fault, some of it the FAI's and some of it the players'.

I couldn't give a hoot if Kevin Foley's feelings were hurt. Trap made a tough decision, it happens. I think his freezing out of Andy Reid was a terrible misjudgment.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

No, the majority of his opinions are the same, and have been discussed here before, and agreed upon. Very little of what he has said hasn't been said before

Actually, everyone is disagreeing with specific points he has made, without backing them up with evidence, and proving him wrong

then don't keep using it to validate your opinions

most posters have respect for one another and their opinions (attack the post not the poster, etc) and don't appreciate anyone stepping out of line

When have I ever attacked a poster? I have never said anything to anyone that hasn't ever been directed at me. There is one poster in particular that makes a habit out of belittling every contribution I make - even off topic - but I have never responded with anything remotely out of hand.

I honestly don't understand why the respect thing is relevant. I have a basic courtesy towards practically every other poster on the site because they have been here longer than me and I am "the new guy". Several times I have complimented several users - Stutts in particular - because I respect their opinions.

The only thing I feel I should apologise for is being too abrasive and assertive in my opinion, but that's all it is - an opinion.

Honestly the impression I get sometimes is that I should just retract everything I say and fall in line with everyone else. Not something I have ever commanded anyone else to do.

Would that make people happy? Because I will gladly do it; but it won't be what I really believe.

There is no need for accusations like that and frankly I think it's a little out of line but hey, it's your prerogative and you're entitled to say it.

[OwlsFan]

I thought you were supposed to be off studying for exams?

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

I thought you were supposed to be off studying for exams?

It was a Microsoft Excel assignment and Business Law project. The former has been rescheduled and I handed the latter in already.

[DannyInvincible]

TOWK; I think the issue is with your selective picking and choosing of which points to respond to, along with your habitual failure to back up particular claims you make. Rather than admitting any weakness in your argument and possible strength in some other posters' counter-arguments when you're pulled up on something, you tend to just brush matters under the carpet and continue trotting out the same lines over and over. Obviously, there's no obligation upon you to respond to all points raised on an internet forum, but, when it is evident that you have the time to do so because you re-peddle challenged opinions as if they're self-evidently factual, it's common courtesy to at least acknowledge valid counter-arguments and that you may not always be right. In that sense, your manner is mildly ignorant. That's what Tets means when he talks of having respect for other posters and their opinions and what Stutts means when he talks about forum ettiquete, manners or whatever.

As for geysir, he's just winding you up because your defensiveness makes you so easy to wind up. Chill out. :)

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

TOWK; I think the issue is with your selective picking and choosing of which points to respond to, along with your habitual failure to back up particular claims you make. Rather than admitting any weakness in your argument and possible strength in some other posters' counter-arguments when you're pulled up on something, you tend to just brush matters under the carpet and continue trotting out the same lines over and over. Obviously, there's no obligation upon you to respond to all points raised on an internet forum, but, when it is evident that you have the time to do so because you re-peddle challenged opinions as if they're self-evidently factual, it's common courtesy to at least acknowledge valid counter-arguments and that you may not always be right. In that sense, your manner is mildly ignorant. That's what Tets means when he talks of having respect for other posters and their opinions and what Stutts means when he talks about forum ettiquete, manners or whatever.

As for geysir, he's just winding you up because your defensiveness makes you so easy to wind up. Chill out. :)

I have opinions that differ to some people, Danny. It's as simple as that. I think the two main things that people challenge me on... well three if you count McGeady... are interpretations of quotes.

I don't think I am being selective. Maybe I am too abrasive or assertive in my interpretations.

It's not malicious, trust me!

I think debate like this is healthy on a forum and it adds life to it.

[DannyInvincible]

Certainly. It's all good. I'm not saying you have to have the same opinions as everyone else; just that it's only rational and decent to accept the strength in others' arguments and to back up your claims when pulled up on them.

[paul_oshea]

Tets im all for attacking neither the post or the poster, i'm for reasoned debate.

Perhaps it just didnt irritate me but I thought towk has been fair minded, and Stutts it has nothing to do with having less respect for certain members, i have equal disrespect for you all of you :P Seriously though it's just because to me he talks sense, something I don't see a lot of on here very often. He was a bit OTT on RK, and I don't agree with all his points but generally I find him well informed, realistic and to the point - even if the points are sometimes long. I find it refreshing as said earlier because its what I encounter everywhere but on foot.ie!!

BUt as towk said if we all jumped in line it would be rather boring, and no one should do that.

[SwanVsDalton]

I find it refreshing as said earlier because its what I encounter everywhere but on foot.ie!!.

Why are you even here? You appear to absolutely hate it.

POS you have thousands of posts and I can only presume you've read thousands of threads. Yet you still think it's right on to just talk about posters like we've some kind of dullard hivemind, even though there are literally millions of posts just a click away that disprove that - millions of posts that show the wide variety of disparate opinion on here.

You're either chatting weak, weak sauce or betraying the fact you couldn't be arsed reading anything.

The debate on here tends to be reasoned, well intentioned and articulate. Compared to most football forum cesspits, this place is an oasis.

FOOT.IE AND PROUD BABY!

[Charlie Darwin]

Why are you even here? You appear to absolutely hate it.

POS you have thousands of posts and I can only presume you've read thousands of threads. Yet you still think it's right on to just talk about posters like we've some kind of dullard hivemind, even though there are literally millions of posts just a click away that disprove that - millions of posts that show the wide variety of disparate opinion on here.

You're either chatting weak, weak sauce or betraying the fact you couldn't be arsed reading anything.

The debate on here tends to be reasoned, well intentioned and articulate. Compared to most football forum cesspits, this place is an oasis.

FOOT.IE AND PROUD BABY!
ALL THE WAY TO TERMONBARRY BABY YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAHHHHHHhHHHHH!!!

[Crosby87]

Will you chaps answer me on a question i have been getting for 2 weeks for some reason? I'm being serious. Why is St. Patricks Day not a "big deal" in Ireland? I have me own idea but i want to take it to the experts.

[paul_oshea]

It is a big day.thankfully though you didn't call it st patty's day.

[DannyInvincible]

Perhaps it just didnt irritate me but I thought towk has been fair minded.... Seriously though it's just because to me he talks sense, something I don't see a lot of on here very often. He was a bit OTT on RK, and I don't agree with all his points but generally I find him well informed, realistic and to the point - even if the points are sometimes long. I find it refreshing as said earlier because its what I encounter everywhere but on foot.ie!!

Don't you think it slightly ignorant and disingenuous for someone whose sometimes-suspect arguments are challenged with valid arguments to just duck their head in the sand and don a veneer of infallibility, as if nothing else was worthy of even consideration? It's a childish, if not mildly insulting, way to exchange ideas.

What is refreshing about hearing the same thing you hear everywhere else over and over again? Is there anything enriching about that? I usually find it refreshing when I hear and engage with diversity of opinion - I learn more that way - and there's plenty of it on here.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

What's the point.

[Crosby87]

I know what you are saying Danny, I think. You feel some on here belabour the point over and over.... As Sammy Hagar said, "What is already understood need not be discussed." When he was talking about Van Halen.

POSH thanks for the comment as usual but seriously...i keep getting Q's on St. Pats. Can you elaborate?

[Crosby87]

The One Who Knows,
I think you are a great asset to this board but you are behaving like a little b*tch. It is a F-Ng sports message board. Do you really need the constant reinforcement that you are so smart? Just keep giving your opinion. That the board board heavy weights (who i do respect actaully as good people) are even replying should be enough for you. Take your bra off! Judging by some of your spots today i think ye may be a little needy.....

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

The One Who Knows,
I think you are a great asset to this board but you are behaving like a little b*tch. It is a F-Ng sports message board. Do you really need the constant reinforcement that you are so smart? Just keep giving your opinion. That the board board heavy weights (who i do respect actaully as good people) are even replying should be enough for you. Take your bra off! Judging by some of your spots today i think ye may be a little needy.....

I think this is the first comment of yours I've ever seen that's actually being remotely on topic.

Here's a thanks.

I still prefer The Worm.

[DannyInvincible]

Danny, you have already made your opinion abundantly clear. There is no need to keep repeating the same things ad nauseum. I refuse to listen to other peoples point of view. Others refuse to listen to my point of view. Neither side is willing to bend. Can't we just draw a line in the sand? I have already attempted to do it but it looks like it's going to be futile.

Now anyone that even mildly stands up for me or my opinion will be challenged.

And why would anyone else even bother agreeing with anything I say if this is what they'd have to put up with..

You're playing the victim again. Nobody's being abused and we're all grown adults who can exchange a few words. People will disagree with and challenge you if your arguments and (mis)representations don't stand up to scrutiny. Nobody's going to just disagree with you for the sake of it, or simply because you're TOWK, who, of course, everyone has it in for, bar Paul. :rolleyes: Debate here generally follows a more logical and nuanced pattern, thankfully. There's no official consensus or orthodoxy. Sure plenty have even pointed out to you that they happen to agree with a lot of what you say whilst disagreeing with some other points of yours. It really isn't a case of you (and Paul) versus the world.

To be honest, I was responding more to (well, OK... baiting :p ) Paul though, as I was surprised he saw such value and merit in your (now-past?) conduct. However, I believe Stutts is right in his suspicion that Paul was really just taking the basest of pleasures from seeing a few peacocks' feathers ruffled. Paul thinks we're all pea-brained peacocks suffering myopic but grandiose delusions. Your debating style was disingenuous and intransigent, but your opinions are certainly still more than welcome, as I've already insisted. You don't strike me as malicious. Just eager.

As for you, Crosby, I have no idea what you're talking about, as usual... :)

[gastric]

It might be an idea if someone set up a 'the one who knows- nothing' thread! Would agree with many of you, he is young, naïve, Stutts' b#st#rd son, a possible solicitor (see his comments about exams), has too much time on his hands and if we are not careful he may soon be influenced by Crosby. Perish the thought! ;)

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Yeah anyone that even remotely agrees with me must be doing it to ruffle some feathers. :rolleyes: That must be it.

Just conveniently ignore the fact that Paul said he doesn't agree with all of my posts several times.

Anyone that agrees with me on any points must be taken down a notch. How dare they..

[DannyInvincible]

Yeah anyone that even remotely agrees with me must be doing it to ruffle some feathers. :rolleyes: That must be it.

Just conveniently ignore the fact that Paul said he doesn't agree with all of my posts several times.

Anyone that agrees with me on any points must be taken down a notch. How dare they..

Eh? Is that in response to me? You're erecting strawmen now or I think you've misinterpreted. C'mon, man, don't take everything so seriously. You'll do damage to your health being so defensive and hostile. Give your head a rest. I'm off to sleep here anyway. G'night! :)

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Danny, give a little and get a little.

If you could admit that you brought up the same points against me ad nauseum then maybe I could admit that I can be repetitive.

You act like I am the only one guilty of repeating myself.

Now you're having a go at anyone that even defends me and making cynical assumptions about their reasons for doing so.

[Stuttgart88]

Danny does bring up the same point over and over. So do I. Here it is again: the point is that it's not your opinions that are the issue. When is the penny going to drop?

[paul_oshea]

I think this is the first comment of yours I've ever seen that's actually being remotely on topic.

Here's a thanks.

I still prefer The Worm.

the worm is chicago and crosby is new york.

[DannyInvincible]

If you could admit that you brought up the same points against me ad nauseum then maybe I could admit that I can be repetitive.

You act like I am the only one guilty of repeating myself.

I'll never say the same thing more than once. In fact, at no time will you find me reiterating an identical message over again. Repeating myself is just something I will not do.

In seriousness though, why would an admission from yourself be dependent on one from me? Don't let my conduct dictate your own. It's not a battle of wits. I have repeated my point, but it's because you've remained in denial and have been disingenuously (at least, it surely can't be naïvety at this point) appealing for us to let you air your opinion, as if it is being condemned and suppressed. No-one's stopped you from airing your opinion. It's been roundly welcomed and I think the forum is a better place for your presence. The more the merrier.

The issue some, including myself, have had is with your stubborn unwillingness to admit that your arguments may have logical or evidential holes in them from time to time. When people - it may just happen to be collective - spot these holes and point them out to you, it's not the baying mob you sense it to be; it's just fellow users of a discussion forum entering into civil debate with you. Don't interpret everything you read so literally. A challenge doesn't necessarily equate to a threat and it's OK to be wrong. Sure even I was wrong this one time!


Now you're having a go at anyone that even defends me and making cynical assumptions about their reasons for doing so.

Ack, I'm only ribbing Paul because he enjoys to see you upset the apple-cart so much. He was generally lauding your firebrand abrasiveness rather than particularly defending specific opinions you'd expressed. This whole episode has absolutely nothing to do with your opinions, nor Paul's opinions, nor whether or not the two of you share the same opinions. I've never said you do. It's been about your manner.

[Stuttgart88]

I'll never say the same thing more than once. In fact, at no time will you find me reiterating an identical message over again. Repeating myself is just something I will not do. You can say that again.

[BonnieShels]

Without doubt the last 6 pages of this thread were comedy gold. I mean top notch stuff. Some of the best foot.ie has ever come up with.

The comparisons to Eirebhoy (RIP), the ongoing defence of TOWK by POSH, geysir's irreverence, Kingdom calling it, Danny's verbosity, EG being crude in an academic way, CTP getting a Stutts reference, Crosby being on topic, Termonbarry, SvD having an 'I love foot.ie moment', Mr A looking and passing by... We all know you did Mr!)

Seriously I should disappear more often because this week's worth of comment in here has been glorious.

No mypost, umbrella or manbag references but still. Almost perfect.

Kudos all.

[Stuttgart88]

Lonely in Ottawa then?

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Loving the nonsense about anyone agreeing with my opinion getting called out. The saying "doesn't play well with others" comes to mind. And I was sincere in my drawing comparisons with Eire Bhoy. I didn't mean to get myself drawn into a schoolyard debate of "his posts are better than yours. Na na na na na". I simply meant I shared his obvious enthusiasm for the Irish football scene. I really don't understand the cynicism over that?

So in short.

Robbie Keane backtracks on his quotes so they never happened and Scotland's ambivalence towards Aiden McGeady (and Ray Houghton) at underage level played no part in their declaring for Ireland. A scenario that is most recently repeating itself with Tony Watt.

What else am I being harangued about?

Oh yeah. The deity that is Robbie Keane shouldn't be dropped because he's..... Robbie Keane.

And my supposed manipulation of statistics to support my argument, like those goalscoring statistics against teams like Macedonia, Faroe Islands and Georgia that I manipulated. :rolleyes:

Yet it's okay to manipulate Shane Long's statistics.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

http://www.wsc.co.uk/forum-index/27-football/889378-99-days-to-go-interim-internationals?limit=20&start=100

Interesting discussion about International affairs here.

Have to say that I largely agree with The Awesome Berbaslug!!!.

[Stuttgart88]

Have you had any thoughts yet on my observation that McGeady was in no way whatsoever being clear in what he said in the quoted passage when you said McGeady was being clear? I'll point you to both the quote and my objection to your post if you want a reminder.

I couldn't give a hoot about Long's statistics. I've seen him pass up so many presentable chances at club and international level to conclude, wholly subjectively, that he's not the most reliable finisher (whatever his other strengths may be). More sophistry on your part, phrasing the question in a way that bears no relevance to the argument. Nobody has accused you of manipulating statistics or quotes. Statistics are statistics. Interpreting them is another matter.

And more wordsmithery too. One man's backtracking is another man's clarification. I still don't recall any reasonable answer to either my challenge to agree how Keane's remark could be interpreted given various scenarios that may pan out, or given Danny's perfectly fair assertion that Keane's proven loyalty and commitment to date suggests that the balance of probability is more sympathetic to Keane's position than you'd like to admit.

You persist in your delusion that your opinions are somehow grating with people. They're not. We love all kinds of opinion here. It's evasion, wordsmithery, disingenuous tactics and pure sophistry that bugs people. I'll give you credit though, you're one of the more complex WUMs we've seen on these pages for some time. Even Paul has fallen for it.

[Stuttgart88]

Seriously, if there was proper moderation of this forum TOWK's post number 135 above would be deleted.

It is so full of lies, sophistry and exaggerations that it completely insults those of us who spend time on this forum.

For example, I can't think of one person who thinks Keane us undroppable. No player since this forum started has divided opinion more, other than Roy. It's just that your argument as it was presented didn't stack up. I fear for your Business Law assignment marker if he says you need to present your critical thinking better. Instead of following his advice and fine tuning your reasoning you'll simply wait 3 weeks and re-present the same paper thinking he must be a demented idiot with no recollection of your first submission.

Nobody accused you of manipulating quotes or statistics. (Maybe Geysir?)

People have rightly accused you of avoiding tough questions

Nobody has any issues with unpopular opinions, in themselves.

Nobody has manipulated Shane Long's statistics, though many have criticised his finishing. Perish the thought.

Nobody denies Keane said what he said. Most accept they were at worst ambiguous and most agree they were out of character with his proven commitment. Some like me believe sub-editors at IMN relished the opportunity to spin them negatively.

Only you persist with the notion that McGeady was "clear" that Ireland's likely success (compared to Scotland) was a factor in his "declaration" when the only thing clear in the quoted passage was that he was glad to have played in the Euros.

[BonnieShels]

Lonely in Ottawa then?

I live in Nepean. No one can prepare you for this.


Also, I nominate you as a moderator.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Have you had any thoughts yet on my observation that McGeady was in no way whatsoever being clear in what he said in the quoted passage when you said McGeady was being clear? I'll point you to both the quote and my objection to your post if you want a reminder.

I couldn't give a hoot about Long's statistics. I've seen him pass up so many presentable chances at club and international level to conclude, wholly subjectively, that he's not the most reliable finisher (whatever his other strengths may be). More sophistry on your part, phrasing the question in a way that bears no relevance to the argument. Nobody has accused you of manipulating statistics or quotes. Statistics are statistics. Interpreting them is another matter.

And more wordsmithery too. One man's backtracking is another man's clarification. I still don't recall any reasonable answer to either my challenge to agree how Keane's remark could be interpreted given various scenarios that may pan out, or given Danny's perfectly fair assertion that Keane's proven loyalty and commitment to date suggests that the balance of probability is more sympathetic to Keane's position than you'd like to admit.

You persist in your delusion that your opinions are somehow grating with people. They're not. We love all kinds of opinion here. It's evasion, wordsmithery, disingenuous tactics and pure sophistry that bugs people. I'll give you credit though, you're one of the more complex WUMs we've seen on these pages for some time. Even Paul has fallen for it.

I think he was reasonably forthcoming in saying that Scotland's lack of interest contributed to his decision to play for Ireland and in fairness to him, he made that decision at a delicate age and he is a player that Scotland would love to have so I have no qualms with McGeady whatsoever.

I agree with you. What I interpret from Keane's statistics is that he has a fantastic record against smaller teams but when you take everything - age, relevant stats, level of domestic football, form - into consideration, I don't think he is integral to our chances against Germany, Poland and even Scotland. What I interpret from Long's statistics taking the same things into consideration is that there is room for improvement but in terms of goals per minutes, people are unduly negative and overlook his broader contributions. I have also seen enough in the Serbia game to conclude that Hoolahan and/or Reid and Long is the way to go if everyone is fit. Just my opinion but it really seems to rile people.

Keane has been a guaranteed starter all through his Ireland career. He has never been put into a position where his place in the team is questioned - until recently. I commend him for his loyalty but the relevant quotes pertain to a scenario where he is no longer guaranteed starts.

I don't know how I am evading anything? I am addressing all of your opinions here. Wordsmithery? Aren't we all guilty of that? IDK how I am being deceitful. I truly believe everything I say and try my best to back it up. A lot of the points of contention relate to quotes. I cannot manipulate them in any way, only offer an interpretation of what they mean.

Paul is entitled to his opinion as are you and I. We are all our own men.

The WUM thing is unfair imo but you are entitled to it, Stutts.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Seriously, if there was proper moderation of this forum TOWK's post number 135 above would be deleted.

It is so full of lies, sophistry and exaggerations that it completely insults those of us who spend time on this forum.

For example, I can't think of one person who thinks Keane us undroppable. No player since this forum started has divided opinion more, other than Roy. It's just that your argument as it was presented didn't stack up. I fear for your Business Law assignment marker if he says you need to present your critical thinking better. Instead of following his advice and fine tuning your reasoning you'll simply wait 3 weeks and re-present the same paper thinking he must be a demented idiot with no recollection of your first submission.

Nobody accused you of manipulating quotes or statistics. (Maybe Geysir?)

People have rightly accused you of avoiding tough questions

Nobody has any issues with unpopular opinions, in themselves.

Nobody has manipulated Shane Long's statistics, though many have criticised his finishing. Perish the thought.

Nobody denies Keane said what he said. Most accept they were at worst ambiguous and most agree they were out of character with his proven commitment. Some like me believe sub-editors at IMN relished the opportunity to spin them negatively.

Only you persist with the notion that McGeady was "clear" that Ireland's likely success (compared to Scotland) was a factor in his "declaration" when the only thing clear in the quoted passage was that he was glad to have played in the Euros.

Ireland qualifying for the Euros vindicated his decision. I think that is pretty clear that International success factored in his decision. What I take out of that is that he would have regrets declaring for Scotland if they didn't reach tournaments and Ireland did. I'm not having a go at the guy. Darron Gibson has said pretty much the same. Eunan O'Kane is also on record in saying that his decision to choose Ireland over NI was a purely sporting reason.

I don't share the same mistrust towards the "meeja" that seems to be rampant among some here. I think he has to take responsibility for what he said. It wasn't scripted. Ambiguous, isn't that the same as open to interpretation, of which one of mine is causing so much consternation?

People are constantly going on about Long's goalscoring record when he has only started about half of his 40 odd appearances. It's no better or worse than what I do with Keane; and Keane is guilty of poor finishing too.

People did take issue with me suggesting that Keane be rotated for certain games; across multiple posts. That is a fact, Stutts.

[Stuttgart88]

You have regularly avoided answering very direct questions.

Will you ever cop on that your opinions don't rile people? You rehash that line to the point of tedium. Almost everything in post 135 above is presented disingenuously and it's a perfect example of what riles people.

As for McGeady, Scotland's antipathy is well documented. I didn't challenge you on that. I challenged your assertion that it was "clear" from the quoted passage that he was influenced by future success. I don't care if he was, it was simply not clear from the quoted passage. You evaded that (edit, I see you responded above albeit with a speculative remark).

In your para 2 above re Keane and Long, I don't think anyone really disagrees or at worst nobody thinks it's an unfair opinion. You have consistently assumed it's the view that is unpopular, it's not. It's your presentation.

[DannyInvincible]

Darron Gibson has said pretty much the same.

Look here, sonny Jim; I'll let Grealish and McGeady slide, but accusing a fellow former-St. Columb's lad of being a mercenary? That's the final straw!

http://i.imgur.com/5boWxqM.gif


It was unbelievable, you know, making the debut for your country. Everyone from Derry wants to play for Ireland. I grew up supporting Ireland, so it was a natural choice for me.

[PatJR]

I have also seen enough in the Serbia game to conclude that Hoolahan and/or Reid and Long is the way to go if everyone is fit. Just my opinion but it really seems to rile people.

Keane has been a guaranteed starter all through his Ireland career. He has never been put into a position where his place in the team is questioned - until recently. I commend him for his loyalty but the relevant quotes pertain to a scenario where he is no longer guaranteed starts.



If Hoolahan\Reid are on the pitch (and good enough to make an impact on the game - still have my doubts) then you definitely want Robbie on the pitch to make the runs and take the chances. There is the nagging problem that he always does better with a strike partner which is one reason I'd like to see them try out a 3-5-2 formation.

[paul_oshea]

That video is so american, in a futile rage, yet he breaks it on the weak end, and has the presence of mind to do so. Pussy.

[Eminence Grise]

Seriously, if there was proper moderation of this forum TOWK's post number 135 above would be deleted.

http://foot.ie/images/smilies-void/stop.png

Why stop at that one? Personally, I'd delete everything after #7. Seriously, this is the worst handbag fight I've seen on foot.ie in a long time. It's great (:rolleyes:)that people are so passionate about philosophy, ethics and the like, but maybe locating the PM button would be a sensible option.

[Stuttgart88]

Point taken.

[CraftyToePoke]

http://foot.ie/images/smilies-void/stop.png

Why stop at that one? Personally, I'd delete everything after #7. Seriously, this is the worst handbag fight I've seen on foot.ie in a long time. It's great (:rolleyes:)that people are so passionate about philosophy, ethics and the like, but maybe locating the PM button would be a sensible option.


Bit harsh there EG, a touch harsh. I'm in the 'keep her lit boys' camp on this one, it's great to hear the sparks of these conversational clashes fly around the hallowed virtual halls of foot once again. And I remain unconvinced that there isn't a WUM of some sophistication in our midst also, in the form of newbie. Even if not, he should be taught to respect his elders. Publicly.

[Eminence Grise]

I gave it 138 posts, Crafty. (Not even David Moyes will get that amount of breathing space!) I'm all for debate and stirring things up (at the risk of awakening the kraken I sometimes miss the righteous indignation and elliptical arguments that Ealing Green used to bring). But this is more spat than spark.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Relax, lads. It's a football forum for God's sake. Reasoned debate is healthy. I'm genuinely not trying to annoy anyone.

I tried to draw a line under this several times but people seem to want to continue it and then get irritated when I respond.

Sure can you blame me for getting mixed signals?

I think it's ran its course now. Leave this thread for Michael Doyle. It will undoubtedly be getting busy again with a day at Wembley on the cards!

And respect? Seriously, when have I ever disrespected anyone? I literally respect everyone on the forum. You are all very intelligent guys and I sincerely value each and every one of your opinions, even though it clearly isn't reciprocated in kind.