UEFA Euro 2028

[JR89]

Build a 35K stadium for a few matches and a budget of what 200 million plus?!

No thanks.

Give us 25% of that money and we will build 8 - 10 football academies around the country that will help develop the skills of boys and girls for the next 40 years :)

See that makes too much sense so will never happen. UL has some cracking facilities and would be great if we could develop more places like it around the country.

[backstothewall]

why could pairc ui chaoimh not be used?
Temporary seating could be installed on the terraces. Russia used temporary seating in at least one stadium in the 2018 WC

Gonna get the Cork folk up in arms here. But it won't be used because it's crap.

We were putting temporary seating into the old Lansdowne Road 15 years ago, but that wouldn't have been acceptable for a major tournament even back then. If that was the only issue we might get away with it, but it isn't. Even if you put seats in people would still be completely exposed to the elements behind the goals. And it's the lack of facilities for corporate hospitality. It's the lack of media facilities.

It's big enough, but that's all it has going for it. The GAA have built something there that would have been perfect for hosting games in Italia '90.


Build a 35K stadium for a few matches and a budget of what 200 million plus?!

No thanks.

Give us 25% of that money and we will build 8 - 10 football academies around the country that will help develop the skills of boys and girls for the next 40 years :)

It doesn't have to be one or the other

[Real ale Madrid]

Gonna get the Cork folk up in arms here. But it won't be used because it's crap.

We were putting temporary seating into the old Lansdowne Road 15 years ago, but that wouldn't have been acceptable for a major tournament even back then. If that was the only issue we might get away with it, but it isn't. Even if you put seats in people would still be completely exposed to the elements behind the goals. And it's the lack of facilities for corporate hospitality. It's the lack of media facilities.


I think the Premium Level in the New PUC has more than enough corporate and media facilities than would be required tbh. Would be great to get games down here - if casement is an option I don't see why they wouldn't at least have a look at PUC.

[backstothewall]

Thinking a bit more, I actually think Belfast might get it's act together for this.

There's a deal there to be done to build a 45,000-50,000 seater stadium that would have the GAA as owners/anchor tenants, but which can be reconfigured along the same lines as the Stade De France to host athletics events.

The GAA would get a new stadium that's actually big enough for their needs. NI Football and Ulster Rugby would get access to somewhere big enough for their biggest events. The unionist politicians wouldn't miss the possibility Belfast hosting the Commonwealth games somewhere down the road.

[kennedmc]

Gonna get the Cork folk up in arms here. But it won't be used because it's crap.

We were putting temporary seating into the old Lansdowne Road 15 years ago, but that wouldn't have been acceptable for a major tournament even back then. If that was the only issue we might get away with it, but it isn't. Even if you put seats in people would still be completely exposed to the elements behind the goals. And it's the lack of facilities for corporate hospitality. It's the lack of media facilities.

It's big enough, but that's all it has going for it. The GAA have built something there that would have been perfect for hosting games in Italia '90.



It doesn't have to be one or the other

True it doesn't. But I don't see why any real need for another large football stadium in our small country given the state of current facilities.

If they did have money ringfenced for stadium works e.g. 200 million I'd then much rather it was given out to 30 LOI and other senior clubs as interest free loans / grants to upgrade their facilities which is desperately needed.

Yes I will admit to going off topic here :D

[jbyrne]

I think the Premium Level in the New PUC has more than enough corporate and media facilities than would be required tbh. Would be great to get games down here - if casement is an option I don't see why they wouldn't at least have a look at PUC.

there has been far worse than PUC used at the euros before. i got drowned at the croatia game in Poznan even though it had a roof on all four sides.
the stand i was in was more like a meccano set than a properly constructed stand


Gonna get the Cork folk up in arms here. But it won't be used because it's crap.

We were putting temporary seating into the old Lansdowne Road 15 years ago, but that wouldn't have been acceptable for a major tournament even back then.

no one will convince me that the temporary seating at both ends of Ekaterinburg Arena in Russia 2018 was any better than what we used to install in Lansdowne Road.

[nigel-harps1954]

Blowing money on stadia would be madness, while football here remains in a state of relying on buttons.

You simply cannot ignore a 75,000+ capacity ground sitting idle in Dublin while all of this is going on.

[Kingdom]

I think the Premium Level in the New PUC has more than enough corporate and media facilities than would be required tbh. Would be great to get games down here - if casement is an option I don't see why they wouldn't at least have a look at PUC.

It's to do with hotel spaces as well in the city, parking facilities directly on site, and alternative entry points into the ground.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Blowing money on stadia would be madness, while football here remains in a state of relying on buttons.

You simply cannot ignore a 75,000+ capacity ground sitting idle in Dublin while all of this is going on.

100%. If nothing else this co-hosting will shine more light on the crazy state of affairs where public money has spent building massive stadiums throughout the country that are criminally underused.

[nigel-harps1954]

100%. If nothing else this co-hosting will shine more light on the crazy state of affairs where public money has spent building massive stadiums throughout the country that are criminally underused.

Tens of millions of public money spent building stadia that aren't fit for purpose.

[Real ale Madrid]

It's to do with hotel spaces as well in the city, parking facilities directly on site, and alternative entry points into the ground.


I'd be amazed of any of those were issues with regards PUC.

Hotel rooms : surely as many in Cork as in places like Poznan
Parking: PUC was used as a vaccine centre with ample on site parking and as for entry points to the stadium, I'm not sure with all the development and work that has gone on around the stadium ( it's now wheelchair accessible all round for example ) that shouldn't be an issue either.

Thinking of all the public money that went into this and the shambolic nature of the redevelopment, this is exactly the type of event we should be bringing to Cork imo

[backstothewall]

no one will convince me that the temporary seating at both ends of Ekaterinburg Arena in Russia 2018 was any better than what we used to install in Lansdowne Road.

That was mental, and was very widely criticised at the time. But the reality is that this is a joint bid. Stunts like that won't work because the English would (very reasonably) point out that they have half a dozen stadiums that don't have anything like that sort of issue.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Yeah, that is the other thing. This is going to be an English Euros, with Cardiff, Glasgow, Dublin and maybe Belfast helping out. That's how they will see it anyway.

[jbyrne]

incredibly its being reported today that Russia plan to bid for Euro 28 (and 32)

[NeverFeltBetter]

I would assume their suspension precludes such things. They can say they are applying all they like. They can also say they're going to qualify for the World Cup.

[JR89]

incredibly its being reported today that Russia plan to bid for Euro 28 (and 32)

Turkey bidding too but you'd feel the UK and Ireland bid would be favourites to get it.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Another thing I saw raised elsewhere, regards Croke Park and the possibility of Casement, is that the tournament will intersect with GAA Championships, and I doubt UEFA will be interested in not having reserved use of the grounds for the period in question. I'm thinking more and more Ireland's involvement will be limited to the Aviva.

[jbyrne]

Another thing I saw raised elsewhere, regards Croke Park and the possibility of Casement, is that the tournament will intersect with GAA Championships, and I doubt UEFA will be interested in not having reserved use of the grounds for the period in question. I'm thinking more and more Ireland's involvement will be limited to the Aviva.

when has the GAA ever worried about this when there is a few quid to be made? I am thinking Ed Sheeran and pairc ui chaoimhs availabilty for possibly corks only football championship game this year

[NeverFeltBetter]

I'd say they'd worry about the reaction in their Congress to the idea of Croke Park being unavailable for the All-Ireland Semi-Finals and Finals, at least. It would have to be a lot of money for that. And I don't want the GAA getting any of it.

[tetsujin1979]

The hurling final was moved to August in 2018 for the Pope's visit in Croke Park in September

[EalingGreen]

No offence to other posters, but there are some serious misconceptions going on here.

Assuming this bid is successful, you have to remember that in reality, it is "England's bid". I mean, they could easily stage a 32 team tournament on their own with the stadia they already have. However due to the politics of UEFA, they needed to rope in the other four Associations for their votes, and to make the bid look something different from "those bloody English again, with their Home of Football and We Invented The Game, dontcha know?"

Add to that the fact that Westminster will be putting up serious dosh, and the other four Associations will have to accept pretty much what the FA allows.

Re FAW, that means the Millennium. The SFA will get Hampden and possibly Murrayfield? While the FAI will get the AVIVA. It is just possible that Croke might also be allowed, but I think it highly unlikely, for two reasons. First, unless hosting the final, no other city has ever been permitted two stadia. And second, Croke would likely need serious money spent on it to bring it up to UEFA tournament standard in 2028. And even then, the FAI isn't going to be happy at Irish government money for football actually going to the GAA - that's if your government would be prepared to stump up the extra in the first place (debateable). And as for eg Cork or Galway... try 2128 fellas!

Which leaves little ol' Norn Iron. First of all, the minimum UEFA capacity requirement is 30k, with Windsor currently being 18k. UEFA might just make an exception down to 25k, but even then I really doubt WP could physically accommodate that and even if it could, it would cost many millions, which ain't gonna materialise.

Which leaves Casement. The GAA have right royally screwed up on this one. First, their original 40k plan was rejected on planning grounds, also a Judicial Review and local opposition. Then they came back with a revised 34k plan. This (somehow) got Planning Permission from Stormont, but the locals are just as unhappy and have been granted a second JR.

And even if the GAA wins this one (not guaranteed), such has been the effect of inflation over the intervening 14 years, that they now need another £33m (and counting), over and above the £62m originally awarded by Stormont in 2008.

For political reasons, the present SF Sports minister wants to grant this, but even if the money could be found, both the IFA and Ulster Rugby are going to say: "If we managed successfully on time and within our original budget, why should the GAA now be rewarded for their failure? We should get an extra wedge too.".

One way out for her might be get extra dosh from Westminster by using Casement to host Euro games (if they do get it built within the next 6 years, that is). And as for GSTQ ringing out over Casement etc, there is no guarantee NI will qualify, and even if we do, the GAA would need the IFA's support in making their funding request to Stormont/Westminster and as the great philosopher Marx* once said: "Whenever I hear people say 'It's the Principle, not the Money', rest assured it's the Money!" So they'll just have to stick their fingers in their ears for 90 seconds and quietly hum the Soldiers Song!

Meanwhile - and especially if Casement doesn't materialise - if Westminster is going to have to be stump up serious cash for this whole event, they'll be politically bound to spread it out between the four nations. And if NI football isn't getting a shiny new 30k stadium, which it won't, then top of the IFA's shopping list is a shiny new Training Centre. This could be used as a base for one or more of the teams playing in Dublin/Glasgow/Liverpool etc, then afterwards provide far more of a long term benefit to the domestic game than 3 or 4 internationals in June 2028.

I'd certainly be happy with that.


* - Groucho, not Karl.

[ifk101]

First, unless hosting the final, no other city has ever been permitted two stadia. And second, Croke would likely need serious money spent on it to bring it up to UEFA tournament standard in 2028. And even then, the FAI isn't going to be happy at Irish government money for football actually going to the GAA - that's if your government would be prepared to stump up the extra in the first place (debateable). And as for eg Cork or Galway... try 2128 fellas!

FYI, Porto had two venues in 2004 with Lisbon hosting the final. On your second comment, Croke Park isn't an option - it's the premier GAA venue, in high use during the summer - the GAA aren't going to give up Croke Park for an extended period during their high season and especially not for foreign games. Cork is more likely than a NI venue however unlikely that is - there is a structure there after all. But in agreement with your venues; the Aviva, Cardiff, Glasgow, Murrayfield, and the rest in England.



... then top of the IFA's shopping list is a shiny new Training Centre. This could be used as a base for one or more of the teams playing in Dublin/Glasgow/Liverpool etc, then afterwards provide far more of a long term benefit to the domestic game than 3 or 4 internationals in June 2028.

Eirambler said as much earlier in the thread. NI's involvement will be as a training base and hopefully our involvement will also result in spending on facilities.

[seanfhear]

No offence to other posters, but there are some serious misconceptions going on here.

Assuming this bid is successful, you have to remember that in reality, it is "England's bid". I mean, they could easily stage a 32 team tournament on their own with the stadia they already have. However due to the politics of UEFA, they needed to rope in the other four Associations for their votes, and to make the bid look something different from "those bloody English again, with their Home of Football and We Invented The Game, dontcha know?"

Add to that the fact that Westminster will be putting up serious dosh, and the other four Associations will have to accept pretty much what the FA allows.

Re FAW, that means the Millennium. The SFA will get Hampden and possibly Murrayfield? While the FAI will get the AVIVA. It is just possible that Croke might also be allowed, but I think it highly unlikely, for two reasons. First, unless hosting the final, no other city has ever been permitted two stadia. And second, Croke would likely need serious money spent on it to bring it up to UEFA tournament standard in 2028. And even then, the FAI isn't going to be happy at Irish government money for football actually going to the GAA - that's if your government would be prepared to stump up the extra in the first place (debateable). And as for eg Cork or Galway... try 2128 fellas!

Which leaves little ol' Norn Iron. First of all, the minimum UEFA capacity requirement is 30k, with Windsor currently being 18k. UEFA might just make an exception down to 25k, but even then I really doubt WP could physically accommodate that and even if it could, it would cost many millions, which ain't gonna materialise.

Which leaves Casement. The GAA have right royally screwed up on this one. First, their original 40k plan was rejected on planning grounds, also a Judicial Review and local opposition. Then they came back with a revised 34k plan. This (somehow) got Planning Permission from Stormont, but the locals are just as unhappy and have been granted a second JR.

And even if the GAA wins this one (not guaranteed), such has been the effect of inflation over the intervening 14 years, that they now need another £33m (and counting), over and above the £62m originally awarded by Stormont in 2008.

For political reasons, the present SF Sports minister wants to grant this, but even if the money could be found, both the IFA and Ulster Rugby are going to say: "If we managed successfully on time and within our original budget, why should the GAA now be rewarded for their failure? We should get an extra wedge too.".

One way out for her might be get extra dosh from Westminster by using Casement to host Euro games (if they do get it built within the next 6 years, that is). And as for GSTQ ringing out over Casement etc, there is no guarantee NI will qualify, and even if we do, the GAA would need the IFA's support in making their funding request to Stormont/Westminster and as the great philosopher Marx* once said: "Whenever I hear people say 'It's the Principle, not the Money', rest assured it's the Money!" So they'll just have to stick their fingers in their ears for 90 seconds and quietly hum the Soldiers Song!

Meanwhile - and especially if Casement doesn't materialise - if Westminster is going to have to be stump up serious cash for this whole event, they'll be politically bound to spread it out between the four nations. And if NI football isn't getting a shiny new 30k stadium, which it won't, then top of the IFA's shopping list is a shiny new Training Centre. This could be used as a base for one or more of the teams playing in Dublin/Glasgow/Liverpool etc, then afterwards provide far more of a long term benefit to the domestic game than 3 or 4 internationals in June 2028.

I'd certainly be happy with that.


* - Groucho, not Karl.
Karl was probably the better comedian ( Though Un-intentionally ) and that wasn’t easy considering Groucho Marx was a Great Comedian.

[geysir]

FYI, Porto had two venues in 2004 with Lisbon hosting the final.
Afaia, up to now a city can have 2 venues, only if one is also used as venue for the Final.

[backstothewall]

Which leaves little ol' Norn Iron. First of all, the minimum UEFA capacity requirement is 30k, with Windsor currently being 18k. UEFA might just make an exception down to 25k, but even then I really doubt WP could physically accommodate that and even if it could, it would cost many millions, which ain't gonna materialise.

Which leaves Casement. The GAA have right royally screwed up on this one. First, their original 40k plan was rejected on planning grounds, also a Judicial Review and local opposition. Then they came back with a revised 34k plan. This (somehow) got Planning Permission from Stormont, but the locals are just as unhappy and have been granted a second JR.

And even if the GAA wins this one (not guaranteed), such has been the effect of inflation over the intervening 14 years, that they now need another £33m (and counting), over and above the £62m originally awarded by Stormont in 2008.

For political reasons, the present SF Sports minister wants to grant this, but even if the money could be found, both the IFA and Ulster Rugby are going to say: "If we managed successfully on time and within our original budget, why should the GAA now be rewarded for their failure? We should get an extra wedge too.".

One way out for her might be get extra dosh from Westminster by using Casement to host Euro games (if they do get it built within the next 6 years, that is). And as for GSTQ ringing out over Casement etc, there is no guarantee NI will qualify, and even if we do, the GAA would need the IFA's support in making their funding request to Stormont/Westminster and as the great philosopher Marx* once said: "Whenever I hear people say 'It's the Principle, not the Money', rest assured it's the Money!" So they'll just have to stick their fingers in their ears for 90 seconds and quietly hum the Soldiers Song!

Meanwhile - and especially if Casement doesn't materialise - if Westminster is going to have to be stump up serious cash for this whole event, they'll be politically bound to spread it out between the four nations.

If we were starting again in the North, we wouldn't want to start from here.

Whenever Windsor Park and Ravenhill were being tarted up, the IFA and Ulster Rugby should have been allowed/encouraged to throw their cash in together and build something capable of hosting a Euros Game or Rugby World Cup match on a new site down in the Titanic Quarter or somewhere similar. At around the same time Brighton built Falmer Stadium for not much more than the 2 projects combined and have something vastly superior to show for it. But that's all water under the bridge.

I agree about the politics of Casement. They got planning permission because the SDLP infrastructure minister found a way not to say no to the GAA, and the SF sports minister was doing everything she could to get the cash to build it, but what they are building is a boondoggle. It's simultaneously too big for a county ground Antrim, but too small for an Ulster provincial HQ.

Given that, and the never-ending legal difficulties you mentioned, it seems the best thing for all involved would be moving on from Casement and trying again somewhere else. Quite frankly what we need to break the log-jam is a unionist sports minister, not beholden to the GAA, who can explain to them in words of one syllable that Andytown is a completely daft place for this.

What do you think of the idea of a big GAA stadium somewhere else in the city, that could also host athletics? If a unionist sports minister was able to get the words Commonwealth Games into every other sentence, could they get away with handing even more money over to the GAA?

Ideally it would be on the Co. Antrim side of the river to keep the GGA on board, so the Giants Park might be a decent site.


Afaia, up to now a city can have 2 venues, only if one is also used as venue for the Final.

It doesn't really matter. There's no way they would allow 2 cities to have more than one stadium. They will allow one, and that city will be London.

If it was allowed they could present a plausible bid for a tournament that never goes outside the M25. Even allowing London to have 2 there will be at least 3 60,000+ stadiums there that won't be used at all!

[geysir]

If we were starting again in the North, we wouldn't want to start from here.

Whenever Windsor Park and Ravenhill were being tarted up, the IFA and Ulster Rugby should have been allowed/encouraged to throw their cash in together and build something capable of hosting a Euros Game or Rugby World Cup match on a new site down in the Titanic Quarter or somewhere similar. At around the same time Brighton built Falmer Stadium for not much more than the 2 projects combined and have something vastly superior to show for it. But that's all water under the bridge.

I agree about the politics of Casement. They got planning permission because the SDLP infrastructure minister found a way not to say no to the GAA, and the SF sports minister was doing everything she could to get the cash to build it, but what they are building is a boondoggle. It's simultaneously too big for a county ground Antrim, but too small for an Ulster provincial HQ.

Given that, and the never-ending legal difficulties you mentioned, it seems the best thing for all involved would be moving on from Casement and trying again somewhere else. Quite frankly what we need to break the log-jam is a unionist sports minister, not beholden to the GAA, who can explain to them in words of one syllable that Andytown is a completely daft place for this.

What do you think of the idea of a big GAA stadium somewhere else in the city, that could also host athletics? If a unionist sports minister was able to get the words Commonwealth Games into every other sentence, could they get away with handing even more money over to the GAA?

Ideally it would be on the Co. Antrim side of the river to keep the GGA on board, so the Giants Park might be a decent site.

Currently Casement Pk plans are for 35k capacity which is ample for Ulster GAA championship purposes though expansive for Antrim GAA, but who knows they could rise to fill those boots.
Good point on the rugby and soccer, could have built the one stadium as both fields of play are compatible, whereas, even if the GAA was willing to share their pitches are just too big.
One alternative should NI qualify for 2028, they could play their group games in Edinburgh, should Scotland be fixed in Glasgow.
If NI don't qualify, would their fans be that concerned about not being able to host a group in Belfast?

[Eirambler]

Croke Park doesn't need much (if any) work to bring it up to UEFA standard, it would just be a question of whether the Hill is used as temporary seating or just left empty. It's a 70,000 seater stadium even without using Hill 16.

The bigger issue is whether two stadiums in Dublin will be allowed, but my suspicion is that if the tournament goes to 32 teams the rules will be clarified to allow this.

I wouldn't worry about any clashes with the GAA championship, money always comes first with the GAA, that would be easily dealt with.

I can't believe there are people suggesting Pairc Ui Chaiomh here though. Sorry lads, but there's no nice way to say it, it's an absolute sh!thole - even in its recently upgraded state. It's just two stands down the two sides of the pitch and the rest is terracing. Grand for the Munster Championship but there's not a hope in hell that the Euros goes anywhere near Cork. Sorry, but that's just the reality here.

[EalingGreen]

FYI, Porto had two venues in 2004 with Lisbon hosting the final.
Portugal needed 10 venues.
Here are the 8 cities which hosted them, by population (2021 figures):
518k - Lisbon
250k - Porto
121k - Braga
106k - Coimbra
54k - Aveiro
45k - Leiria
41k - Faro
40k - Guimares

Meaning they were never going to build even a 28k stadium in eg some town of 30k or35k people, which already had its own professional club attracting average attendances of a few thousand.

Meaning doubling up on on Porto as well as Lisbon was the only way Portugal could possibly host it.


iOn your second comment, Croke Park isn't an option - it's the premier GAA venue, in high use during the summer - the GAA aren't going to give up Croke Park for an extended period during their high season and especially not for foreign games.

If the money was right, I suspect they would - it's extra revenue from a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. But there would still be significant costs to make it UEFA Category 4 level and I can't see the Irish government diverting some more of soccer's funding to that end, or the FAI standing idly by, so I agree with you that Croke almost certainly won't be used, just for differing reasons.


Cork is more likely than a NI venue however unlikely that is - there is a structure there after all. But in agreement with your venues; the Aviva, Cardiff, Glasgow, Murrayfield, and the rest in England.

I've just googled PuC and I'd bet my house on Cork not happening.
For one thing it only has 21k seats and converting terracing is not a simple matter of bolting on a few seats. And for another, its barely one third under cover - UEFA doesn't do open seating. Third, it almost certainly doesnt have the extensive VIP, Corporate, Sponsors and Media facilities necessary to stage such an event.
Look, for example, at the hoops the FAW had to jump through to stage the 2017 CL Final at the Millennium i.e. one game on one day:
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/full-inside-story-how-champions-12928557
Meaning it would take tens of millions to get Cork up to standard and there's no way the Irish government is going to plough any more into that stadium, while UEFA awards tournaments to countries in the knowledge that money will be spent developing soccer stadia, not those of some other sport.
Above all, there's no way the English FA (or its Westminster paymaster) is going to tell eg Bristol or Leeds that they cannot host a Group because Cork GAA has got it. Forget it.

[EalingGreen]

We've 6 years to get this right. We really must have a second venue somewhere outside Dublin built in time for this.
Where outside Dublin justifies building a 30k all-seater soccer stadium costing maybe €50m?

[EalingGreen]

Far more likely some manner of dispensation will be sought for Windsor Park, which UEFA was happy to see host the Super Cup recently. And if such a dispensation was granted, well, Thomond holds 20K+ and has held football internationals before...
Not a hope for either (imo).

The Super Cup doesn't attract much interest, which is why UEFA has farmed it out in recent years to the likes of Tallinn, Skopje and Trondheim, which drew crowds of fewer than 20k. Even Budapest only drew 15k in the 67k Puskas Arena for Bayern vs Sevilla in 2020. While this year it's Helsinki and 2023 is Kazan. Yes, that Kazan...

As for Thomond, UEFA simply isn't in the business of doing business with other sports, even if it had the requisite 30k capacity, which it doesn't.

[EalingGreen]

why could pairc ui chaoimh not be used?
Temporary seating could be installed on the terraces. Russia used temporary seating in at least one stadium in the 2018 WC

For Ekarerinburg, the Russians deliberately built a stadium with a hole at one end, OUTSIDE of which they could build a temporary 18k stand which could be dismantled afterwards, and all secured, no doubt, by the usual brown envelopes stuffed with non-consecutive folding stuff for select Blazers at FIFA.

https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/9-lThWYSx11G2wIkCYsTe9jdxE0=/0x0:4337x2737/1120x0/filters:focal(0x0:4337x2737):format(webp):no_upsca le()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/11530135/GettyImages_962022190.jpg
https://www.sbnation.com/lookit/2017/10/3/16409096/russia-world-cup-stadium-stand-outside-stadium

Good luck with trying that at PuC!

[seanfhear]

Not a hope for either (imo).

The Super Cup doesn't attract much interest, which is why UEFA has farmed it out in recent years to the likes of Tallinn, Skopje and Trondheim, which drew crowds of fewer than 20k. Even Budapest only drew 15k in the 67k Puskas Arena for Bayern vs Sevilla in 2020. While this year it's Helsinki and 2023 is Kazan. Yes, that Kazan...

As for Thomond, UEFA simply isn't in the business of doing business with other sports, even if it had the requisite 30k capacity, which it doesn't.
Maybe after Covid / The War / Massive Recession = = UEFA might not be as fussy as it once was ! !

[ifk101]

I've just googled PuC and I'd bet my house on Cork not happening.
For one thing it only has 21k seats and converting terracing is not a simple matter of bolting on a few seats. And for another, its barely one third under cover - UEFA doesn't do open seating. Third, it almost certainly doesnt have the extensive VIP, Corporate, Sponsors and Media facilities necessary to stage such an event.

Look, for example, at the hoops the FAW had to jump through to stage the 2017 CL Final at the Millennium i.e. one game on one day:
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/full-inside-story-how-champions-12928557
Meaning it would take tens of millions to get Cork up to standard and there's no way the Irish government is going to plough any more into that stadium, while UEFA awards tournaments to countries in the knowledge that money will be spent developing soccer stadia, not those of some other sport.
Above all, there's no way the English FA (or its Westminster paymaster) is going to tell eg Bristol or Leeds that they cannot host a Group because Cork GAA has got it. Forget it.

Not in disagreement but the comment was Cork is more likely, however unlikely, than a stadium in NI hosting games. If Casement gets built, it will be to GAA specs - which presumably means an extra expense + rebuild on top of that to get it to European Championship standard. Cork is more financially viable imo as there is a structure in place and the financials would be specific to upgrading it to European Championship requirements.

Does a venue in Belfast or Cork make any difference to the English FA?

[backstothewall]

Where outside Dublin justifies building a 30k all-seater soccer stadium costing maybe €50m?

Galway. But not a soccer specific stadium.

As you will know we are currently trying to build a 35k stadium in Andytown for Ulster GAA. This would primarily serve as a new HQ for Connacht GAA, but Connacht Rugby or Galway United could use it if they thought they could draw in a crowd. And there would be concerts and that sort of thing. It wouldn't be a white elephant.

[Stuttgart88]

"Uefa confirmed that Russia, the subject of a series of sporting bans after the invasion of Ukraine, had joined Turkey and the UK and Ireland in submitting declarations before Wednesday’s deadline."

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/international/russia-warned-by-uefa-it-could-face-more-sanctions-if-it-bids-to-host-euros-1.4834260

I'd like to think our bid might beat Russia's. Turkey would be a great place for a Euros.

[pineapple stu]

I agree on Turkey actually. A big footballing country that's never really reached its potential and that has never hosted a major finals, but has a lot of decent options available to it. Bit like Russia in 2018.

[jbyrne]

For Ekarerinburg, the Russians deliberately built a stadium with a hole at one end, OUTSIDE of which they could build a temporary 18k stand which could be dismantled afterwards, and all secured, no doubt, by the usual brown envelopes stuffed with non-consecutive folding stuff for select Blazers at FIFA.

Good luck with trying that at PuC!

my post was in relation to the use of temporary seating as an issue.
the temporary seating installed in CP for football and rugby was fixed directly to the concrete terracing without the need for a scaffold. I am sure something similar might be possible for PuC

[seanfhear]

I agree on Turkey actually. A big footballing country that's never really reached its potential and that has never hosted a major finals, but has a lot of decent options available to it. Bit like Russia in 2018.
Probably the second best team at the 2002 World Cup but yeah I suppose they don’t generally do as well as they could alright.

[EalingGreen]

Not in disagreement but the comment was Cork is more likely, however unlikely, than a stadium in NI hosting games. If Casement gets built, it will be to GAA specs - which presumably means an extra expense + rebuild on top of that to get it to European Championship standard. Cork is more financially viable imo as there is a structure in place and the financials would be specific to upgrading it to European Championship requirements.

That's not how it works.

UEFA awards tournaments on the basis of which host can offer the most money, in two respects. First is how much money it will raise for themselves (gate receipts, TV, corporate etc). The other is how much they can screw out of governments (stadium rebuilds, facilities, infrastructure etc), with the latter providing a "legacy" for the game, both locally and generally.

Meaning they are not in the business of providing a legacy for other sports, and will only authorise the use of another sport's stadium if they have no other choice (see following).

Whilst in addition, the local football association - in this case the FAI - will not be happy to see a chunk of their government's sports budget go to another sport (GAA), since every Euro which went to Cork would be one less Euro which could go to soccer.



Does a venue in Belfast or Cork make any difference to the English FA?
Yes!

If Belfast can come up with a stadium, then in return for its vote, it has to get games there, even if it is a non-soccer stadium ("Hobson's choice"). Beyond which, Casement would also have the support of the IFA.

Similarly, the other Associations must each get to host games. In the FAI's case this will be the AVIVA (and just possibly Croke, though I really doubt it).

But even if UEFA sanctioned Cork/PuC; and even if someone were somehow to come up with the many millions to bring it up to UEFA standard; and even if the FAI somehow supported it, the English FA would still be opposed.

For that would be using up a place which could instead go to Sunderland, Sheffield, Milton Keynes, Brighton etc.

[backstothewall]

Meaning they are not in the business of providing a legacy for other sports, and will only authorise the use of another sport's stadium if they have no other choice

I'd say they don't mind so much about the ownership of the stadium so much as it being available to soccer. They've held plenty of games down the years in municipal stadiums owned by the local government or universities in countries where that's how things end to work. For that reason I'd say Lansdowne Road is more likely to be used than Croke Park.

It would increase the chances of UEFA going for Galway if the ownership of this hypothetical stadium was something like Lansdowne Road. Perhaps a 50% stake owned by the GAA and 50% owned by Galway City Council or the state.

Given the obvious association of President Higgins with both Galway and the sport it would tick the legacy box if Galway became the permanent venue for the Presidents Cup as a curtain raiser to the domestic season.


Edit: Turkey is a big threat on paper. Bigger than i think a lot of people realise. But given events in Ukraine I'd imagine there will perhaps be a reluctance to take a chance of the leadership of Erdogan remaining benign. Holding the last World Cup in Russia doesn't seem so great in retrospect.

[ifk101]

That's not how it works.

UEFA awards tournaments on the basis of which host can offer the most money, in two respects. First is how much money it will raise for themselves (gate receipts, TV, corporate etc). The other is how much they can screw out of governments (stadium rebuilds, facilities, infrastructure etc), with the latter providing a "legacy" for the game, both locally and generally.

Meaning they are not in the business of providing a legacy for other sports, and will only authorise the use of another sport's stadium if they have no other choice (see following).

Whilst in addition, the local football association - in this case the FAI - will not be happy to see a chunk of their government's sports budget go to another sport (GAA), since every Euro which went to Cork would be one less Euro which could go to soccer.

Casement Park, hello.



Yes!

If Belfast can come up with a stadium, then in return for its vote, it has to get games there, even if it is a non-soccer stadium ("Hobson's choice"). Beyond which, Casement would also have the support of the IFA.

Similarly, the other Associations must each get to host games. In the FAI's case this will be the AVIVA (and just possibly Croke, though I really doubt it).

But even if UEFA sanctioned Cork/PuC; and even if someone were somehow to come up with the many millions to bring it up to UEFA standard; and even if the FAI somehow supported it, the English FA would still be opposed.

For that would be using up a place which could instead go to Sunderland, Sheffield, Milton Keynes, Brighton etc.

If Belfast can come up with a stadium ….
And if Belfast can not come up with a stadium, is that not favourable for Cork + Dublin? Meaning the FAI can host a group and not just individual games? A legacy for the sport on a national basis and not just centered on Dublin? Uefa and a national government could roll in behind that surely?
How many millions would it take to upgrade PuC?

(Turkey sounds more practical btw)

[pineapple stu]

Probably the second best team at the 2002 World Cup but yeah I suppose they don’t generally do as well as they could alright.
Galatasaray won the UEFA Cup and the Super Cup in 2000 as well. They get huge crowds at (some) club games, but they've never built on it really - I think they tend to be very short-termist. They'd rather spend ten million on an ageing top striker than develop a proper youth structure.

Erdogan's a nut, but he'll build a new stadium for any locality that supports him and I think he'd play UEFA's games better than us (the English were shown to be hopelessly out of their depth when bidding for the 2018 World Cup - though that's more a slight on the bids they lost to really). That'll surely be better than saying "Here's a GAA ground that we might be able to redevelop if we can get around the politics". You can say there might be crowd trouble at some games, but then it was the English who were the main culprits at the last Euros.

[sidewayspasser]

If I'm not mistaken, Turkey put in a bid for each of the last 4 or 5 Euros including the 2024 one. I'm not sure though whether that means they are overdue a successful bid, or whether that shows they don't have enough friends in UEFA to ever be successful.

[TonyD]

Is Turkey/Russia a joint bid, or did I read that wrongly somewhere ? Anyway, there is surely not a hope in hell of UEFA awarding Russia anything in the present circumstances, and probably the foreseeable future.

[sadloserkid]

Is Turkey/Russia a joint bid, or did I read that wrongly somewhere ? Anyway, there is surely not a hope in hell of UEFA awarding Russia anything in the present circumstances, and probably the foreseeable future.

Two different bids in everything I've seen.

[EalingGreen]

I'd say they don't mind so much about the ownership of the stadium so much as it being available to soccer. They've held plenty of games down the years in municipal stadiums owned by the local government or universities in countries where that's how things end to work. For that reason I'd say Lansdowne Road is more likely to be used than Croke Park.

It would increase the chances of UEFA going for Galway if the ownership of this hypothetical stadium was something like Lansdowne Road. Perhaps a 50% stake owned by the GAA and 50% owned by Galway City Council or the state.

Sorry, but there is NO chance that UEFA will permit Groups to be hosted in GAA stadia in either Cork or Galway, both of which would require many millions to be spent on them to bring them up to standard, in cities which are hardly hotbeds of soccer (no offence).

Finals tournaments are ALL about money. That's why they extended them from 16 teams to 24. But then they found that only the same few countries (Germany, France, Spain, Germany etc) would be able to host a Finals that big, so they then allowed joint bids. And as we saw with Austria/Switzerland and Poland/Ukraine etc, this persuaded their respective governments to spend enormpous sums on building shiny, new stadia for soccer, thereby expanding the game locally and enhancing the prestige of the local Associations etc.

As for your mythical 50:50 ownership split for a stadium which would cost millions to upgrade which will not be available, even if by some chance it did happen, the GAA will not want to give up their own control, nor the local council want to take on 50% of the maintenance costs for the next 50 years.



Given the obvious association of President Higgins with both Galway and the sport it would tick the legacy box if Galway became the permanent venue for the Presidents Cup as a curtain raiser to the domestic season.

When England was bidding for the 2018 World Cup, they sent the Prime Minister, Prince Willaim and David Beckham to Switizerland to present their case. And by all the stated (emphasise) criteria for a bid, their case was an excellent one.

They were given a polite hearing, some tea and buns and then were sent on their way empty handed.

And without meaning any disrespect to the man whatever, but your average UEFA Exco member couldn't pick President Higgins out if he was lined up in an identity parade of one.

They don't give a stuff about the President, never mind the President's Cup, unless he's got a big fat cheque in his back pocket, made out to the relevant people.



Edit: Turkey is a big threat on paper. Bigger than i think a lot of people realise. But given events in Ukraine I'd imagine there will perhaps be a reluctance to take a chance of the leadership of Erdogan remaining benign. Holding the last World Cup in Russia doesn't seem so great in retrospect.
I don't quite know why Turkey always gets the cold shoulder with their repeated bids, to both FIFA and UEFA. They're a decent footballing nation with some big clubs and a President who's prepared to build whatever number of stadia are required, in order to enhance his - and Turkey's - image.

It may be political eg the FA's of Greece, Cyprus and Armenia probably aren't too keen; it may be distrust of Erdogan; it may even have a whiff of Islamophobia? Though I'm really scratching around on this one.

[EalingGreen]

Casement Park, hello.

Just as eg FIFA came up with an exception to permit temporary seating in Ekaterinburg in 2018, or UEFA for Porto to have two stadia in 2004, if all else fits, these bodies will make exceptions.

And the reason they might just make an exception for Casement would be if that was the only way NI could host a group and it had the support of the IFA (plus the acquiescence of the FA, who could hardly object). While Belfast is a big enough city with a decent football pedigree. And on the political front (big "P"), Belfast could be sold on the usual "Sport across the border", "supporting the Peace Process", "bringing fans together" spiel.

Whereas there is no need to bring in GAA stadia in ROI, since they already have the AVIVA, and the FAI would not support state funding for sport going to the GAA which could go directly instead to soccer, especially when they (FAI) are bringing the tournament to the country in the first place, not the GAA.



If Belfast can come up with a stadium ….
And if Belfast can not come up with a stadium, is that not favourable for Cork + Dublin? Meaning the FAI can host a group and not just individual games? A legacy for the sport on a national basis and not just centered on Dublin? Uefa and a national government could roll in behind that surely?


Dublin will get a group. If the AVIVA can accommodate all the games needed, then that will be it. But if not, then they'll rope in Croke, because (ahem) it's in Dublin, and because it should take much (any?) to upgrade.

There is no way the relevant authorities will agree to a GAA stadium in Galway or Cork (Clones anyone? lol), if only because that would deprive the FA of one more suitable, existing English venue, when they would already be having to "concede" venues to Cardiff, Glasgow and Dublin, and possibly also Edinburgh and Belfast.



How many millions would it take to upgrade PuC?

I have no idea, but it will be many millions.

For when eg the European Super Cup came to Belfast, the IFA had to spend a small fortune on the stadium (media, corporate etc) and lay a brand new pitch. And that was for a Mickey Mouse event in a modern(ish) football stadium which was barely half full.

PuC doesn't even have cover over 3/4 of the stadium ffs, never mind 30k seats.

[EalingGreen]

You can say there might be crowd trouble at some games, but then it was the English who were the main culprits at the last Euros.
People forget that there were 7 games staged at Wembley before the Final, without any trouble*.

And the FA have clearly persuaded UEFA that the Final was a one-off, with its own peculiar circumstances which needn't be repeated. Which is why UEFA have since awarded the 2022 "Finalissima" to Wembley, plus the 2024 Champions League Final.


* - Barring a few very minor incidents at the England semi-final, but no more than any big match anywhere.

[seanfhear]

People forget that there were 7 games staged at Wembley before the Final, without any trouble*.

And the FA have clearly persuaded UEFA that the Final was a one-off, with its own peculiar circumstances which needn't be repeated. Which is why UEFA have since awarded the 2022 "Finalissima" to Wembley, plus the 2024 Champions League Final.


* - Barring a few very minor incidents at the England semi-final, but no more than any big match anywhere.
Cressida Dick ~ Dicked that Final ~ ~ Total Policing Failure from her.

[ifk101]

Just as eg FIFA came up with an exception to permit temporary seating in Ekaterinburg in 2018, or UEFA for Porto to have two stadia in 2004, if all else fits, these bodies will make exceptions.
And the reason they might just make an exception for Casement would be if that was the only way NI could host a group and it had the support of the IFA (plus the acquiescence of the FA, who could hardly object). While Belfast is a big enough city with a decent football pedigree. And on the political front (big "P"), Belfast could be sold on the usual "Sport across the border", "supporting the Peace Process", "bringing fans together" spiel.

Why not lobby for a Windsor Park exception, on the points raised above? Or is UEFA more likely to make an exception for a proposed, non-existent GAA stadium with the required capacity, rather than an existing stadium with a below requirement capacity?


Whereas there is no need to bring in GAA stadia in ROI, since they already have the AVIVA, and the FAI would not support state funding for sport going to the GAA which could go directly instead to soccer, especially when they (FAI) are bringing the tournament to the country in the first place, not the GAA.
It’s not happening without State support. And what the FAI can offer as is is the Aviva. So anything beyond the given use of the Aviva is a plus for the FAI – even if the primary beneficiary of extended State support is a GAA structure. But from the State’s perspective, wanting beneficial spread beyond Dublin, an acknowledged need to do, is a push facilitator for an additional and non-Dublin venue.


Dublin will get a group. If the AVIVA can accommodate all the games needed, then that will be it. But if not, then they'll rope in Croke, because (ahem) it's in Dublin, and because it should take much (any?) to upgrade.

I don’t think Croke Park is a runner for reasons stated earlier.


There is no way the relevant authorities will agree to a GAA stadium in Galway or Cork (Clones anyone? lol), if only because that would deprive the FA of one more suitable, existing English venue, when they would already be having to "concede" venues to Cardiff, Glasgow and Dublin, and possibly also Edinburgh and Belfast.

But if the FA has conceded Belfast as a host venue, and this subsequently does not materialise (which is the most likely scenario), does this not open the door for the replacement use of an “non English” venue?


For when eg the European Super Cup came to Belfast, the IFA had to spend a small fortune on the stadium (media, corporate etc) and lay a brand new pitch. And that was for a Mickey Mouse event in a modern(ish) football stadium which was barely half full.

This is another issue with Casement. Even if Casement is built in time for 2028, it will be a GAA stadium to GAA specifications. To meet EC requirements, an additional small fortune would need to be spent to bring a newly built stadium up to standard, no? Agree, the super cup is a mickey mouse event but surprising Belfast’s decent football pedigree could not extend beyond a barely half full Windsor. But I suppose UEFA would be looking at visiting fans filling stadiums?



PuC doesn't even have cover over 3/4 of the stadium ffs, never mind 30k seats.

But the structure is there, and from a cost and time perspective, it seems a lot more viable bringing PuC up to scratch than a Casement Park that does not exist.