What could/should the FAI do for the league?

[legendz]

Folks, they say if you mention the word 'pyramid' three times legendz will appear!lol, lol & lol :D :D :D

The guy with username of Stuttgart was more of a supporter of the idea than I was but anyways that neither here nor there.

The FAI to be fair have tried different structures. They've gone from 10 to 12 and back to 10 in the Premier Division.

They tried front loading the season with a lot of games. If comment from some quarters is a fair reflection of general consensus, it hasn't quite worked out.

The FAI are currently implementing the underage leagues, now at U15 to U19.

They tried the A Championship. I support that idea but they are right to address the underage structures first. Once the underage structures are complete, an intermediary league for LoI reserve teams and non-LoI teams who are part of the youth leagues could be put in place in a few years time.

What can clubs do to improve the league? Is the work being done by Waterford an example? Their owner seems to have the football nouse to get structures in place. Very early in his ownership I heard of Waterford making partnerships with junior clubs in neighbourhing counties. This broadens their talent pool net but can also help build connections with a wider area and bring more support.

Limerick to follow Waterford's example would build strong connections with Clare, Kerry and Tipperary.

[EatYerGreens]

One 50-seater bus would cost somewhere in the region of €400-500k? [guessing]
Great idea, if the FAI had a spare €8-10 million lying around. And even if they had, they wouldn't be buying buses for LOI clubs.

The two main problems with creating a sustainable/professional league are population and the GAA, and not in that order.

Holy fcuk ! I wouldn't apply for a job in procurement, if I was you ;)

[nigel-harps1954]

I don't like this comment thrown out by a few people of "would X league have an interest in joining up?".

They shouldn't be asked. They should be told.

The FAI are the governing body of all football in Ireland. They should be setting out the rules, regulations, and running order of football across the country.

The problem is, many of the FAI directors come from these junior leagues and they've no interest in progression themselves.

It's time they took football in Ireland by the balls and enforced a proper pyramid system.

[Real ale Madrid]

Holy fcuk ! I wouldn't apply for a job in procurement, if I was you ;)

What do you mean we can't have Gold plated taps in the bathrooms on our bus. If Cobh have them we are getting them.

[EatYerGreens]

What do you mean we can't have Gold plated taps in the bathrooms on our bus. If Cobh have them we are getting them.

For half a million you'd probably get them, and still have change

[nigel-harps1954]

Holy fcuk ! I wouldn't apply for a job in procurement, if I was you ;)

He's actually right though. That would be close to the cost of a new 50 seat coach.

To get them second hand, a 2015-2016 coach will set you back around €200k at least.

[Philosophizer]

They shouldn't be asked. They should be told.
It's time they took football in Ireland by the balls and enforced a proper pyramid system.

Well said. When the German FA wanted to totally overhaul German football (about 15 years ago now) there was major opposition from all quarters. It involved all the major German clubs having to build and operate academies that adhered to rigorous standards. The German FA said it was their way or the highway. In the end all the clubs signed up, some very reluctantly. 15 years later their clubs were teeming with young talent and they won the World Cup.

[Real ale Madrid]

He's actually right though. That would be close to the cost of a new 50 seat coach.

To get them second hand, a 2015-2016 coach will set you back around €200k at least.

Big difference between 200k and 500k! - Anyway I reckon you could pick up a good quality bus 2-3 years old for around 80,000k if you bought more than one. If you had a depot of 10 buses controlled by the FAI and sent out as required each weekend. You would be talking about an initial investment of approx 1m in the league, and a rolling investment of approx 100k per year to invest in upkeep of stock,depreciation etc. Some sort of central investment in things like this would be a great start from the FAI. Considering JD's salary is 400k per year its hardly groundbreaking stuff.

[Eminence Grise]

Yeah, but a €400k bus only holds 50. For the same money JD takes everybody for a ride.

[marinobohs]

Well said. When the German FA wanted to totally overhaul German football (about 15 years ago now) there was major opposition from all quarters. It involved all the major German clubs having to build and operate academies that adhered to rigorous standards. The German FA said it was their way or the highway. In the end all the clubs signed up, some very reluctantly. 15 years later their clubs were teeming with young talent and they won the World Cup.

To be fair the German FA 'encouraged' clubs by making funding more available to those who complied, problem here is the FAI have very little funding to make available ! you are right though that getting anything done4 by the FAI takes an eternity, this stems back to the old management structure where different factions objected to pretty much everything.
A major overhaul is needed and that is unlikely to be reached by consensus

[pineapple stu]

I think the bus comment was meant slightly tongue in cheek in fairness! Club buses would be remarkably inefficient compared to using bus companies

[Eminence Grise]

Spoilsport.

I was waiting for a Dundalk fan to observe that if Cork City spent €500k they might get a coach that goes forward in Europe!

[ArFella]

Spoilsport.

I was waiting for a Dundalk fan to observe that if Cork City spent €500k they might get a coach that goes forward in Europe!

They already have team bus for Europe, they usually park it in front of their goal :P

[Real ale Madrid]

They already have team bus for Europe, they usually park it in front of their goal :P

Well played.

[pineapple stu]

Spoilsport.

I was waiting for a Dundalk fan to observe that if Cork City spent €500k they might get a coach that goes forward in Europe!
Alas, to quote Monty Python, I'm a chartered accountant, and consequently too boring to be of interest... :p

[Eminence Grise]

It's fun to charter an accountant
And sail the wide accountancy,
To find, explore the funds offshore
And skirt the shores of bankruptcy.
It can be manly in insurance -
We'll up your premium semi-annually.
It's all tax deductible,
We're fairly incorruptible,
We're sailing on the wide accountancy.

[gufcfan]

no reason why our guys could not do their psv licence along with their coaching badges.

We want the league to be more professional in attitude, not less.

[legendz]

Are the FAI still on track for being debt free by 2020?

[EatYerGreens]

Are the FAI still on track for being debt free by 2020?

Yes. But they meant 2020 in the Islamic calendar, not the Gregorian one.

It's currently 1437 AH for Muslims, not 2018 AD.

[Kingdom]

Big difference between 200k and 500k! - Anyway I reckon you could pick up a good quality bus 2-3 years old for around 80,000k if you bought more than one. If you had a depot of 10 buses controlled by the FAI and sent out as required each weekend. You would be talking about an initial investment of approx 1m in the league, and a rolling investment of approx 100k per year to invest in upkeep of stock,depreciation etc. Some sort of central investment in things like this would be a great start from the FAI. Considering JD's salary is 400k per year its hardly groundbreaking stuff.

I think it's a super idea. I really do. Plus you wouldn't be buying the coaches surely, isn't that what fleet management is about? And it doesn't have to be a LOI exclusive use initiative either. The SFAI runs inter-league comps for 12s 13s 14s and 15s. I know for 3 of our games this year we had to rent coaches separately, no reason the "Pats" bus for example couldn't be used by the SDFL for their Sat/Sun games during season either.

There's the possibility also of using these buses midweek too to offset the cost. With a decent livery (I'm thinking of some of the Leinster rugby adorned buses I see around Dublin), it adds to the promotion value of the product.

[CorribsideSteve]

Are the FAI still on track for being debt free by 2020?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izQB2-Kmiic

[Kingdom]

I don't like this comment thrown out by a few people of "would X league have an interest in joining up?".

They shouldn't be asked. They should be told.

The FAI are the governing body of all football in Ireland. They should be setting out the rules, regulations, and running order of football across the country.

The problem is, many of the FAI directors come from these junior leagues and they've no interest in progression themselves.

It's time they took football in Ireland by the balls and enforced a proper pyramid system.

Agree totally Nigel. If they've the balls to do it to the schoolboy clubs, then surely they'll have the balls to do it to the Intermediate clubs.

[EAFC_rdfl]

I think it's a super idea. I really do. Plus you wouldn't be buying the coaches surely, isn't that what fleet management is about? And it doesn't have to be a LOI exclusive use initiative either. The SFAI runs inter-league comps for 12s 13s 14s and 15s. I know for 3 of our games this year we had to rent coaches separately, no reason the "Pats" bus for example couldn't be used by the SDFL for their Sat/Sun games during season either.

There's the possibility also of using these buses midweek too to offset the cost. With a decent livery (I'm thinking of some of the Leinster rugby adorned buses I see around Dublin), it adds to the promotion value of the product.

Roscommon GAA have done this - they have a coach the same size as Bus Eireann/Citylink intercity buses. It's decked out in their colours and I passed it on the motorway a few weeks ago midweek, with a fleet of cars following with flags on show. Obviously bringing an underage team (county or club) somewhere.

[Kingdom]

Roscommon GAA have done this - they have a coach the same size as Bus Eireann/Citylink intercity buses. It's decked out in their colours and I passed it on the motorway a few weeks ago midweek, with a fleet of cars following with flags on show. Obviously bringing an underage team (county or club) somewhere.

I knew I'd seen an inter-county side do it. They have the CR logo all over it I think.

[marinobohs]

I think it's a super idea. I really do. Plus you wouldn't be buying the coaches surely, isn't that what fleet management is about? And it doesn't have to be a LOI exclusive use initiative either. The SFAI runs inter-league comps for 12s 13s 14s and 15s. I know for 3 of our games this year we had to rent coaches separately, no reason the "Pats" bus for example couldn't be used by the SDFL for their Sat/Sun games during season either.

There's the possibility also of using these buses midweek too to offset the cost. With a decent livery (I'm thinking of some of the Leinster rugby adorned buses I see around Dublin), it adds to the promotion value of the product.

...and brings a whole new meaning to 'the coach driving the team on'

[EatYerGreens]

Roscommon GAA have done this - they have a coach the same size as Bus Eireann/Citylink intercity buses. It's decked out in their colours and I passed it on the motorway a few weeks ago midweek, with a fleet of cars following with flags on show. Obviously bringing an underage team (county or club) somewhere.

It's easy to afford a fancy bus when you don't have to pay anyone for doing anything in your organisation. I'm surprised they don't have county limousines.

[Eminence Grise]

I'm a Rossie. My Dad has two Limousines. But mainly Herefords and the odd Charolais.

Clearly the source of my beef with the FAI.:D

[Ezeikial]

I think it's a super idea. I really do. Plus you wouldn't be buying the coaches surely, isn't that what fleet management is about? And it doesn't have to be a LOI exclusive use initiative either. The SFAI runs inter-league comps for 12s 13s 14s and 15s. I know for 3 of our games this year we had to rent coaches separately, no reason the "Pats" bus for example couldn't be used by the SDFL for their Sat/Sun games during season either.

There's the possibility also of using these buses midweek too to offset the cost. With a decent livery (I'm thinking of some of the Leinster rugby adorned buses I see around Dublin), it adds to the promotion value of the product.

This is where a really good idea falls apart

We would demand the right to veto who else uses our bus - SFAI how are you? Biddies to bingo would be the next thing

[outspoken]

Only way forward is a breakaway. An independent body running the League (just like how the FA and Premier League are separate bodies in the UK) and allow that body to source a proper sponsorship deal which would increase prize money. Strike a proper TV deal to again increase prize money and any games not covered on TV allow the clubs to stream them online and make revenue off it.

[pineapple stu]

Strike a proper TV deal? You make it sound so easy...

The reality is the clubs need the FAI and their cash and their tie-in with a national team the networks are (for now) interested in. And the FAI need the clubs, but don't realise it yet.

A breakaway is in no-one's interest, and is not really feasible anyway

[redobit]

Not allowing a situation where a club has to go 11 weeks without a home league game would be a start. Especially when they force a postponement of a home game in the middle of those 11 weeks. It would be hilariously daft if it wasn't so serious.

[EatYerGreens]

Only way forward is a breakaway. An independent body running the League (just like how the FA and Premier League are separate bodies in the UK) and allow that body to source a proper sponsorship deal which would increase prize money. Strike a proper TV deal to again increase prize money and any games not covered on TV allow the clubs to stream them online and make revenue off it.

You seem to be confusing the League of Ireland with an organisation that has some power. Any power, in fact.

The FA didn't want the Premier League to go off and do its own thing in the early 1990s, but had no choice. They couldn't stop them, as the Premier League didn't need them, and a football association without its top clubs is a spent organisation. So they were forced to go along with it.

The LOI breaking away from the FAI is a daft idea. There is no queue of sponsors and broadcasters just waiting to throw money at the organisation as soon as they free themselves from the confines of the FAI. None.

[TonyD]

You seem to be confusing the League of Ireland with an organisation that has some power. Any power, in fact.

The FA didn't want the Premier League to go off and do its own thing in the early 1990s, but had no choice. They couldn't stop them, as the Premier League didn't need them, and a football association without its top clubs is a spent organisation. So they were forced to go along with it.

The LOI breaking away from the FAI is a daft idea. There is no queue of sponsors and broadcasters just waiting to throw money at the organisation as soon as they free themselves from the confines of the FAI. None.

Sadly that's all too true. Talk of getting a good TV deal for example is pie in the sky. The only drawing power in the game here is the national team. Until the demand for. The product is there then it's very difficult to move from where we are now. As to what the FAI could do, stop screwing the league and its clubs with affiliation fees would be a start. If they did that alone, even without touching prize money, it would be something. A proper plan to progress the league wouldn't go amiss either.

[legendz]

Get an actual tv deal that provides the clubs with some income.
Clubs with their own houses in order might be in the best position to negotiate deals like that.

Cork, Derry, Dundalk, Shamrock Rovers and Waterford would seem to be in a decent position to negotiate any deal in terms of the product they have to offer.

[osarusan]

I think the audience for LOI football on TV is tiny, no matter who is in charge and making deals.

[marinobohs]

Clubs with their own houses in order might be in the best position to negotiate deals like that.

Cork, Derry, Dundalk, Shamrock Rovers and Waterford would seem to be in a decent position to negotiate any deal in terms of the product they have to offer.


Hmmmmm recent history would show ALL of those clubs have had near fatal financial difficulties. If that's all you got........

[EatYerGreens]

Hmmmmm recent history would show ALL of those clubs have had near fatal financial difficulties. If that's all you got........

Haha ! How could he have forgotten "The Big Club" (c) ? :D

[marinobohs]

Haha ! How could he have forgotten "The Big Club" (c) ? :D

ANOTHER good example :D Sure, what could go wrong with letting that lot loose......

[Ashbohs]

First things first what are the issues gripes and grumbles of this season.
Address those first. Monday fixtures -out . Moving games for TV -out. Fining clubs left right and centre-out. Cancelling fixtures for Euro games -out. All of these things hurt revenue and to fix them costs absolutely nothing.
Then you can start improving the brand.
The bus idea is good in theory but if there was a few bob like that around it would be best served with providing every single club with cameras a gantry and a proper website and YouTube channel with links to proper club stores. Revenue streams open up .It's all streamlined and professional. Attracts sponsors.
You then approach a sports brand like umbro adidas joma hummel Nike whatever.
Put the contract for the whole league to tender . Separate from National Team. You then make a lot more from replica sales .
It takes a Co operative outlook to make this work . Bus Eirreann for travel . Subsided through contra deals. You are driving costs down and increasing revenues.
Then you can look at the structure and competition side of things to maybe strike a better standalone TV Deal.
The current one hurts teams financially.
To me that's your starting point. Look at what's wrong now and fix it .

[marinobohs]

First things first what are the issues gripes and grumbles of this season.
Address those first. Monday fixtures -out . Moving games for TV -out. Fining clubs left right and centre-out. Cancelling fixtures for Euro games -out. All of these things hurt revenue and to fix them costs absolutely nothing.
Then you can start improving the brand.
The bus idea is good in theory but if there was a few bob like that around it would be best served with providing every single club with cameras a gantry and a proper website and YouTube channel with links to proper club stores. Revenue streams open up .It's all streamlined and professional. Attracts sponsors.
You then approach a sports brand like umbro adidas joma hummel Nike whatever.
Put the contract for the whole league to tender . Separate from National Team. You then make a lot more from replica sales .
It takes a Co operative outlook to make this work . Bus Eirreann for travel . Subsided through contra deals. You are driving costs down and increasing revenues.
Then you can look at the structure and competition side of things to maybe strike a better standalone TV Deal.
The current one hurts teams financially.
To me that's your starting point. Look at what's wrong now and fix it .

Agree RE all of that. the problem is trying to get LOI clubs to work together is like trying to corral the wind. Every clubs sole interest is itself and the first time something is offered to them individually they will abandon ship. Players, suppliers and the FAI all know this, there is no collective approach to problems and anyone trying to generate a collective approach would need a LOT of patience and perseverance (and the odd decade of the rosary ;) )

[Ashbohs]

Agree RE all of that. the problem is trying to get LOI clubs to work together is like trying to corral the wind. Every clubs sole interest is itself and the first time something is offered to them individually they will abandon ship. Players, suppliers and the FAI all know this, there is no collective approach to problems and anyone trying to generate a collective approach would need a LOT of patience and perseverance (and the odd decade of the rosary ;) )

Not as hard as you would think if there was the will from the top.
We have the PCA . This should be a priority of their remit.
We also have the participation agreement. You could insert some of these as stipulations of the agreement. The only one that I could see an issue with is the kits . But that becomes a re-branding situation. The Airtricity league in association with Adidas . The MLS do this and it works. It's just another form of sponsorship but the beauty of it is that even Athlone Town could benefit in some way.

[RathfarnhamHoop]

The central kit deal works brilliantly in the US but only for a few reasons.



In the US every club was starting from scratch so had no previous deals no no club was taking a step down in money and they had more pulling power as a unit than as individuals, this also meant that while in theory an LA club would be better to sponsor than say a Colorado there was no way of knowing for sure so there wasn't a case of Adidas buying it to get the big teams and getting stuck with the smaller ones they were getting 20(?) equal teams worth equal money initially the structure of the MLS with the draft and wage cap and no relegation means that this wont change much either.
The ownership model means that the clubs own the league which makes everything a lot easier to do.
The market in the US for sportswear is huge so Adidas were willing to invest and the potential for huge exposure was there from the beginning due to the money being thrown around so Adidas were getting a lot out of it,

In Ireland you'd have the situation where

The market isn't huge.
The potential exposure is unlikely unless a club becomes a Rosenborg/Celtic.
The clubs don't control the league.
Not all clubs are starting off or ever will be equal.
This means that a deal is likely to be very small and you'll be taking more money from the big clubs than you're getting the small clubs.
I don think it would be legally possible to sell something a club owns (its kit sponsorship rights) against it's will

So unless the structure of the league, ownership of the league and exposure of the league all change and the big clubs decide to be charitable and take a hit then it's a non runner

[Ashbohs]

Rathfarnhamhoop,I think the points you make re the MLS deal are slightly wrong in that it's only a recent deal signed with Addidas and not starting from scratch as it were.But I see the difficulty in it
Getting clubs to work together is the hard bit but again that's going to have to change radically before the FAI can do anything. The Ollie Byrne( no disrespect) mentality needs to change and fast. It is enabling the FAI to do **** all.The bigger more successful clubs need to look after the weaker teams WHERE POSSIBLE off the pitch if the league is to have a chance.
Say for example Rovers or Dundalk were secretly courting a large new sponsor and just as the last meeting was to take place Bray and Limerick players down tools over money. Sponsor pulls out . Who suffers . The wealthier club. We are only as strong perception wise as our weakest outfit.
Back to the kit issue . It may or may not be a runner but say Umbro or NB(to keep you happy) agreed via tender to cater for all the teams . The market becomes much larger to the company.
The range of merchandise becomes a lot cheaper to the clubs. Costs drop revenues rise. The biggest clubs will sell more and make more.
Loosing the uniqueness and identity is the only problem I can see with it.
However this co operative approach can and should be looked at with other areas of the football business.
Matchday programmes
Away Travel
Website and media
Perimeter signage .

It's worth exploring certainly the idea of a club website for each club linked to individual YouTube channels done on a professional basis just tailored to individual clubs.
It's done at most lower league clubs in UK with a section that you subscribe to for highlights and interviews.
Revenue streams open up
The title of the thread is what can the FAI do for the league . I'm just trying to stick to that

[legendz]

In the first division, I have been impressed by Drogheda. They have a nice squad of players , and on a sustainable budget. They always seem struggle when promoted though. That step up is beyond them as they end up competing for the same players as a number of other clubs and their wage bill goes up dramatically.(Taking this from "What's right with the league?". Fits in here in terms of fixing the league.

If clubs have a sustainable budget in the First Division, isn't it down to clubs to operate within the same budget on promotion to the Premier Division.

I've heard comments that the FAI fudge on the league licensing criteria. Is this an obvious failure to be fixed? More stringent criteria on the granting of a Premier Division licence and clubs being more on board with that?


Hmmmmm recent history would show ALL of those clubs have had near fatal financial difficulties. If that's all you got........
Yes, I know. Have they not turned a corner? They seem to have learned the lessons from the past.

[RathfarnhamHoop]

Rathfarnhamhoop,I think the points you make re the MLS deal are slightly wrong in that it's only a recent deal signed with Addidas and not starting from scratch as it were.But I see the difficulty in it
Getting clubs to work together is the hard bit but again that's going to have to change radically before the FAI can do anything. The Ollie Byrne( no disrespect) mentality needs to change and fast. It is enabling the FAI to do **** all.The bigger more successful clubs need to look after the weaker teams WHERE POSSIBLE off the pitch if the league is to have a chance.
Say for example Rovers or Dundalk were secretly courting a large new sponsor and just as the last meeting was to take place Bray and Limerick players down tools over money. Sponsor pulls out . Who suffers . The wealthier club. We are only as strong perception wise as our weakest outfit.
Back to the kit issue . It may or may not be a runner but say Umbro or NB(to keep you happy) agreed via tender to cater for all the teams . The market becomes much larger to the company.
The range of merchandise becomes a lot cheaper to the clubs. Costs drop revenues rise. The biggest clubs will sell more and make more.
Loosing the uniqueness and identity is the only problem I can see with it.
However this co operative approach can and should be looked at with other areas of the football business.
Matchday programmes
Away Travel
Website and media
Perimeter signage .

It's worth exploring certainly the idea of a club website for each club linked to individual YouTube channels done on a professional basis just tailored to individual clubs.
It's done at most lower league clubs in UK with a section that you subscribe to for highlights and interviews.
Revenue streams open up
The title of the thread is what can the FAI do for the league . I'm just trying to stick to that

I got my dates confused, they became a sponsor in year 1 but only got the league kit deal in 2004(year8) but the other points still stand.

You're talking as if the bigger clubs can afford to give up money, they simply can't. Use Rovers numbers for a base, Rovers shirt sponsor is worth 200k a year and kit sponsors are normally slightly more but well use 200k as a ballpark figure, That would mean a 4million euro kit deal for the league for Rovers to not lose out and I did a rough scaling figure blocking the teams into groups of 4 and scaling the sponsorship using 200k as the top one and got a deal of around 2 million for the league, that Would lose Rovers 100k a year or 5% of their budget for the whole club for the year, thats a lot of money to find somewhere so I cant see any of your big clubs ever going for it, they simply cant afford it, and without them it'd be worthless.

The other stuff you mentioned like websites, youtube channels, etc would work but as much as I'd like the kit thing to work from a business view for most of the premier division and the sponsors themselves it wouldn't make sense financially, with the current league format anyway.

[RathfarnhamHoop]

Rathfarnhamhoop,I think the points you make re the MLS deal are slightly wrong in that it's only a recent deal signed with Addidas and not starting from scratch as it were.But I see the difficulty in it
Getting clubs to work together is the hard bit but again that's going to have to change radically before the FAI can do anything. The Ollie Byrne( no disrespect) mentality needs to change and fast. It is enabling the FAI to do **** all.The bigger more successful clubs need to look after the weaker teams WHERE POSSIBLE off the pitch if the league is to have a chance.
Say for example Rovers or Dundalk were secretly courting a large new sponsor and just as the last meeting was to take place Bray and Limerick players down tools over money. Sponsor pulls out . Who suffers . The wealthier club. We are only as strong perception wise as our weakest outfit.
Back to the kit issue . It may or may not be a runner but say Umbro or NB(to keep you happy) agreed via tender to cater for all the teams . The market becomes much larger to the company.
The range of merchandise becomes a lot cheaper to the clubs. Costs drop revenues rise. The biggest clubs will sell more and make more.
Loosing the uniqueness and identity is the only problem I can see with it.
However this co operative approach can and should be looked at with other areas of the football business.
Matchday programmes
Away Travel
Website and media
Perimeter signage .

It's worth exploring certainly the idea of a club website for each club linked to individual YouTube channels done on a professional basis just tailored to individual clubs.
It's done at most lower league clubs in UK with a section that you subscribe to for highlights and interviews.
Revenue streams open up
The title of the thread is what can the FAI do for the league . I'm just trying to stick to that

I got my dates confused, they became a sponsor in year 1 but only got the league kit deal in 2004(year8) but the other points still stand.

You're talking as if the bigger clubs can afford to give up money, they simply can't. Use Rovers numbers for a base, Rovers shirt sponsor is worth 200k a year and kit sponsors are normally slightly more but well use 200k as a ballpark figure, That would mean a 4million euro kit deal for the league for Rovers to not lose out and I did a rough scaling figure blocking the teams into groups of 4 and scaling the sponsorship using 200k as the top one and got a deal of around 2 million for the league, that Would lose Rovers 100k a year or 5% of their budget for the whole club for the year, thats a lot of money to find somewhere so I cant see any of your big clubs ever going for it, they simply cant afford it, and without them it'd be worthless.

The other stuff you mentioned like websites, youtube channels, etc would work but as much as I'd like the kit thing to work from a business view for most of the premier division and the sponsors themselves it wouldn't make sense financially, with the current league format anyway.

[marinobohs]

I got my dates confused, they became a sponsor in year 1 but only got the league kit deal in 2004(year8) but the other points still stand.

You're talking as if the bigger clubs can afford to give up money, they simply can't. Use Rovers numbers for a base, Rovers shirt sponsor is worth 200k a year and kit sponsors are normally slightly more but well use 200k as a ballpark figure, That would mean a 4million euro kit deal for the league for Rovers to not lose out and I did a rough scaling figure blocking the teams into groups of 4 and scaling the sponsorship using 200k as the top one and got a deal of around 2 million for the league, that Would lose Rovers 100k a year or 5% of their budget for the whole club for the year, thats a lot of money to find somewhere so I cant see any of your big clubs ever going for it, they simply cant afford it, and without them it'd be worthless.

The other stuff you mentioned like websites, youtube channels, etc would work but as much as I'd like the kit thing to work from a business view for most of the premier division and the sponsors themselves it wouldn't make sense financially, with the current league format anyway.

Unfortunately agree with the above. the 'big' clubs will only sign up if it is actually bettering what they currently have (no surprise really) and that will never happen in a collective deal as the redistribution effect - benifiting the 'smaller' clubs will be to the detriment of the 'bigger' clubs. so the most attractive clubs (from a promotional point of view) will get less than they currently do ? how realistic is that ?

Fully agree on the joint utilization of websites and any promotional oppurtunities possible but as long as clubs compete against each other off the park as much as on it little will change. a participation agreement similar to US would simply never get passed here for the same reasons.

[legendz]

What could/should the FAI do for the league?

The FAI along with similar associations of lower ranked leagues need to lobby UEFA to address the Champions League - Europa League balance in favour of lower leagues.

It was a boost for the league here when Dundalk made the Europa League group stage.

With the Champions League put more out of reach of lower leagues, UEFA should put a stop to Champions League 3rd placed teams entering the Europa League Round of 32.

The Europa League subsequently should be expanded to 64 teams in 16 groups of 4, hopefully becoming a vibrant competition in time for clubs from leagues outside the chosen few being accommodated in the Champions League.

[Philosophizer]

The FAI along with similar associations of lower ranked leagues need to lobby UEFA to address the Champions League - Europa League balance in favour of lower leagues.

Easier said than done. Small clubs from smaller leagues have almost zero bargaining power with Uefa.

The big clubs from the big leagues hold all the cards. They want ALL the pie for themselves. And in recent years they're getting more and more of it - see the new rules this year allowing the top 4 sides from PL, Italy, Spain and Germany into the CL group stages automatically.

Uefa is scared ****less that the big clubs could decide at any minute to break away and set up their own competition so they're doing everything they can to placate them.

[marinobohs]

Easier said than done. Small clubs from smaller leagues have almost zero bargaining power with Uefa.

The big clubs from the big leagues hold all the cards. They want ALL the pie for themselves. And in recent years they're getting more and more of it - see the new rules this year allowing the top 4 sides from PL, Italy, Spain and Germany into the CL group stages automatically.

Uefa is scared ****less that the big clubs could decide at any minute to break away and set up their own competition so they're doing everything they can to placate them.

Again, this is the reality. given the whining from Mourinho and other managers over the number of games players play it is more likely the Champions League will be scaled back in terms of numbers that expanded, and the likelihood of smaller leagues getting more representation is extremely unlikely. to be fair UEFA has increased the money available for the Europa league but this was solely to 'buy off' the smaller League and to decrease their representation in the Champions League.