Summary of clubs in difficulty at the moment

[Dodge]

Loads of threads, bit all over the place. I’ll see if I can summarise. Feel free to amend and update

Bohs
Currently being chased in high court for wages owed to 2 players. Another 8 haven’t been paid. Fundraising by funs is ongoing but is only to be released to club if a premier division licence is granted. Players under contract negotiating pay off with club, no agreement yet. Debts still there and fundraising efforts are primarily to get rid of players.
Biggest question?
What happens if Bohs don’t get premier license? They be in first division with huge contracts and without the six figure sums raised by fans? Are Bohs effectively blackmailing the league. License must be an issue for them, otherwise why mention it?

Drogheda
Looking for fans to raise €200k in order to pay for semi pro team next year. If the money isn’t raised board will recommend winding club up.
Biggest question?
How much to go amateur/local for a year and why isn’t this option being pursued?

Galway
Debts not too bad it seems but presence of Leeson seems to be biggest problem for fans, sponsors and the Galway football community. Team going more local but seems a sensible enough decision (see Drogs above)
Biggest question?
Does Leeson have a contract? If not how can the board justify not sacking him? Hopefully the hard working GUST can make things more transparent

While other clubs are cutting back (some severely), none seem to be in any real danger (despite rumours about Fingal in particular) and the 3 here seem in the most danger

Oh and Sunday newspaper journos, you're welcome! No need for you to dig around now...

[pineapple stu]

Galway
Debts not too bad it seems
Close on a million per their last filed accounts. Quite big by any LoI club's standards.

[marinobohs]

Dodge, couple of things on Bohs part - Premier Licence issue relates to loan agreement not fundraising, proposed deal with players would cover costs of players remaining for 2011 season and if we dont get agreement with players we wont get any licence (to the best of my knowledge and subject to fudge)

[Spudulika]

Good summary, I expect it'll be added to in due course.

One question, if Bohs only get an A licence, or even a 1st Division one, will they still be eligible for the Europa League, from UEFA rules they should be so long as they comply with insurance and medicals. Cork were still playing in Europe until the end of the game, I thought.

[John83]

There's also Sporting Fingal, who've lost their main sponsor in Gannon (something like 750k last year? And a €60k(?) loss all the same). The move to Dalymount also adds to their costs. They're making out like everything's okay, though the numbers don't add up for some of us.

[pineapple stu]

They're paying (small; four-figure) transfer fees for players too, so they've cash somewhere.

[Quayman]

Last year Dundalk had a 200k loan/deficit and the loan taken out was to be repaid fairly quickly so I'd say taking the interest on the loan into account, we didnt look to healty although crowds where similar to previous years, we had a cup run in the League cup, Europe, several televised games which gave us a boost. We are not in severe trouble but its reported that the playing budget is one of the lowest in the league around the 7 k mark.

[Dodge]

AFAIK Finglas have a backer on board so should be OK. I'd be pretty confiednet of saying they'll be in premier league and europe next year


One question, if Bohs only get an A licence, or even a 1st Division one, will they still be eligible for the Europa League, from UEFA rules they should be so long as they comply with insurance and medicals. Cork were still playing in Europe until the end of the game, I thought.
No, its a progression. Everything you need for a premier license is included in the UEFA license (and of course, more). Cork last played in Europe in 2008. It was the end of that seaso that their problems erupted


Dodge, couple of things on Bohs part - Premier Licence issue relates to loan agreement not fundraising, proposed deal with players would cover costs of players remaining for 2011 season and if we dont get agreement with players we wont get any licence (to the best of my knowledge and subject to fudge)
Ah OK, this makes more sense. Whats the latest in terms of a)funds raised and b)money pledged in loans? Theorhetically Bohs could come to agreement with players, and still not get a Premier license. In this case, the fundraising would have to pay for players (etc) with loan money reverting to fans. Bohs working on tiny enough budget? (and I don't know if there are definite reasons why they would be denied a license)

[oriel]

Good summary, I expect it'll be added to in due course.

One question, if Bohs only get an A licence, or even a 1st Division one, will they still be eligible for the Europa League, from UEFA rules they should be so long as they comply with insurance and medicals. Cork were still playing in Europe until the end of the game, I thought.

Bohs will not be eligible to play in Europe if the do not get a PD licence, it is the FAI who nominates clubs, so their place will most likely go the next best highest finishing side from 2010, which would be St Pats.

[passinginterest]

Fingal seem to have found funding from somewhere. I heard from a reliable source they'll have 18 full time pro's for the coming season, source was also very sceptical about the reliability of the promised funds and the long term prospects of the club as a professional outfit.

[The Lep]

There's also Sporting Fingal, who've lost their main sponsor in Gannon (something like 750k last year? And a €60k(?) loss all the same). The move to Dalymount also adds to their costs. They're making out like everything's okay, though the numbers don't add up for some of us.

It doesnt matter if the numbers dont add up for you.The thread is about clubs in difficulty at the moment and Fingal isnt one of them. Dodge has it right.

[Dodge]

Its about the clubs most in trouble. Its the LOI, we're all one bad decsion away from the next crisis

[John83]

It doesnt matter if the numbers dont add up for you.The thread is about clubs in difficulty at the moment and Fingal isnt one of them. Dodge has it right.
And in any summary on that subject, it's reasonable to mention a club which has had news stories like this one (http://www.fingal-independent.ie/premium/news/council-will-not-face-any-liability-2476726.html) in the past month.

[The Lep]

Im sure Dodge would have added Fingal if the thread was started before xmas and fair enough but read what the thread says, MOST IN TROUBLE AT THE MOMENT.

[BonnieShels]

Great thread Dodge.
Uh oh John you angered the Lep.

[The Lep]

Nope :)

[John83]

Uh oh John you angered the Lep.
It's difficult, but I've managed it. For my next trick, I'm going to eat my lunch.

[The Lep]

Ucd will be my second team this year just to see who we sign next year :)

[Dodge]

Ucd will be my second team this year just to see who we sign next year :)

Might work as a joke if you were a Pats fan.

Thankfully we wouldn't lower ourselves to that level of wit ;)

[Sean South]

What's the point of this thread? There are enough topics about the clubs in "difficulty at the moment"

Geek central.

[Dodge]

Of course there's tons of stuff out there, but I couldn't follow them so I was seeing was I up to date. As marino showed above I wasn't...

[BonnieShels]

But the attempt was worthy.
Anybody got any craic on any other clubs bar the 'Usual 4'?

[pineapple stu]

How bout yourselves? Are ye safe in Tolka for a while yet?

[John83]

And on that subject, how are Longford and Athlone doing regarding paying off historic debt?

[SwanVsDalton]

What's the point of this thread? There are enough topics about the clubs in "difficulty at the moment"

Geek central.

It's a good one-stop shop. If anything it should be stickied - 'Club Meltdown Watch - Pre-Season 2011'?

[marinobohs]

Ah OK, this makes more sense. Whats the latest in terms of a)funds raised and b)money pledged in loans? Theorhetically Bohs could come to agreement with players, and still not get a Premier license. In this case, the fundraising would have to pay for players (etc) with loan money reverting to fans. Bohs working on tiny enough budget? (and I don't know if there are definite reasons why they would be denied a license)

Dodge, not 100% certain (nobody is at Dalymount :confused:) but think the following is where we are at - Some of the funds raised went to pay players for November (players were originally told they could/would not be paid once season ended). Unless deal done with all players then we cant apply for a licence so there would be less (no ?) urgency in doing any deal with players at all. As has been said elsewhere an element of brinkmanship between the parties (club and players) which may run all the way to end January. Not a chance members/fans could raise enough to complete deal with players so if loan deal does not work they are not getting paid (our next fixture would be the courts)
Outside of 3/4 players that resign on reduced terms I dont think we will have any budget for next season.
Apart from reaching agreement with the players I am unaware of anything stopping us getting a licence.

[legendz]

How can the league look to expand with so many clubs in trouble? While I'll like to see it expand and hopefully it will in time, the league should reduce size from 22 to 20, with 10 in each division.

Back on topic, are Fingal definitely out of the woods? I was surprised they were not mentioned at the beginning of this thread.

[Rasputin]

But the attempt was worthy.
Anybody got any craic on any other clubs bar the 'Usual 4'?
According to the well placed "inside sources" on the always-ultra forum we are but a step away from implosion.
The marathon FAI investigation into our finances will surely be out soon, surely?

[SkStu]

According to the well placed "inside sources" on the always-ultra forum we are but a step away from implosion.
The marathon FAI investigation into our finances will surely be out soon, surely?

oh, did they write a letter again? ;) ;)

[Macy]

How can the league look to expand with so many clubs in trouble? While I'll like to see it expand and hopefully it will in time, the league should reduce size from 22 to 20, with 10 in each division.
Clubs being in trouble is nothing to do with the number of clubs, and everything to do with bad financial management. One of the things a 10 team premier was supposed to do was concentrate resources - that worked out well!

[John83]

Back on topic, are Fingal definitely out of the woods? I was surprised they were not mentioned at the beginning of this thread.
See the exchange between me, The Lep and Dodge. The short of it is that they're supposed to have found some funding - not clear where - so they're not going pop just yet. (Also, they paid a transfer fee for Bolger, and outbid Dundalk for his wages, which suggests confidence in their budget. Well, that or insanity, it being the LoI.) Anything longer term is just speculation.

[Rasputin]

oh, did they write a letter again? ;) ;)
Stu please, how could I possibly know any of the inner workings of my own club.
At this stage our fans and indeed the MC are now getting all information we need from the well placed "inside sources" on the always-ultra" forum.
It is indeed a great resource to have.
I just hope the "inside sources" know when this tribunal like financial investigation into our finances comes to fruition.

[Mr Maroon]

I disagree with the "debts not too bad" part. They're not exactly good!

[Longfordian]

And on that subject, how are Longford and Athlone doing regarding paying off historic debt?

We're getting there, slowly but surely as far as I know. Don't know what the story is with Athlone.

[L.T.F.C.]

And on that subject, how are Longford and Athlone doing regarding paying off historic debt?

No idea about Athlone, but apparently we made a profit of €4k last year, and I heard that the Trust have reduced the debt significantly. Martinho would be the man to ask though.

[pineapple stu]

How much did the Trust raise last year? And how many people are involved?

[Lim till i die]

Summary of clubs in difficulty at the moment (http://www.airtricityleague.ie/)


























http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/fb/718smiley.svg/300px-718smiley.svg.png

[legendz]

Clubs being in trouble is nothing to do with the number of clubs, and everything to do with bad financial management. One of the things a 10 team premier was supposed to do was concentrate resources - that worked out well!

Agreed, clubs in trouble is to do with bad financial management. With so many in trouble, it does not seem to be the time to be looking for an expansion of the league. If Boh's and Drog's situation gets worse and they have to settle for an A licence, the FAI should leave the number of clubs in the top two tiers at 20. It should have happened last season with Derry and Cork.

[Dodge]

I disagree with the "debts not too bad" part. They're not exactly good!

As I said lads, I was doing more for myself than to be a historical record. Bits and pieces eke out all over the place so good to get somethigns straight

For the record, I hope all clubs survive, and want Bohs to be refused a European license (for selfish reasons obviously)

[legendz]

See the exchange between me, The Lep and Dodge. The short of it is that they're supposed to have found some funding - not clear where - so they're not going pop just yet. (Also, they paid a transfer fee for Bolger, and outbid Dundalk for his wages, which suggests confidence in their budget. Well, that or insanity, it being the LoI.) Anything longer term is just speculation.

Thanks for the update. I hope all the fees and wages are under a sound financial plan and not a casino financial plan on Europa League success.

[Longfordian]

How much did the Trust raise last year? And how many people are involved?

Somewhere around 80 or 90 members I think at the moment. They've been keeping quiet on figures as they've been negotiating deals with creditors and don't want to be seen as gloating about it. They've eliminated a good bit of the debt over the past couple of years from what I've heard.

[pineapple stu]

Jayz. That's a decent membership given ye get crowds of 200-300!

[bluemovie]

Don't know what the story is with Athlone.

They've just appointed Mike Kerley as manager so I'd say it's safe to assume they'll be in major difficulty soon enough. Gate receipts will fall sharply after the first few defeats to Salthill and Mervue. Sorry, Athlone fans, I wish you the best, but that man is THE worst manager of all-time.

[legendz]

Somewhere around 80 or 90 members I think at the moment. They've been keeping quiet on figures as they've been negotiating deals with creditors and don't want to be seen as gloating about it. They've eliminated a good bit of the debt over the past couple of years from what I've heard.

Is this Trust going to be running the club going forward, or is it already? It's good to hear the club are getting close to a sound financial footing. The Drog's might want to have a look at what ye've been at.

[Lim till i die]

They've just appointed Mike Kerley as manager so I'd say it's safe to assume they'll be in major difficulty soon enough. Gate receipts will fall sharply after the first few defeats to Salthill and Mervue. Sorry, Athlone fans, I wish you the best, but that man is THE worst manager of all-time.

No he isnt.

Can't see gate receipts falling too sharply from the might 80 or so that attended their final game of last season.

[pineapple stu]

Mike Kerley who took Limerick to the play-offs with a squad of ten players? Thought that was a decent enough appointment myself.

[Lim till i die]

Exactly.

Amazing second half to his first year with Limerick, poor second year in shocking circumstance, disaster below in Waterford, mildly successful second stint in Limerick, was a lunatic to quit when he did.

It's patchy but it's not the cv of the worst manager ever.

Overall, if Athlone can keep him from having one of his funny turns he'll do alright, the football will be a refreshing change aswell.

[bluemovie]

Mike Kerley who took Limerick to the play-offs with a squad of ten players? Thought that was a decent enough appointment myself.

That's what we thought when we got him! I didn't want to reply to Lim till I die cos it's too far off-topic, but here's a brief one. Maybe I'll rephrase to far and away Waterford's worst ever manager (and we've had millions), but any Blues fan will refer to him as "the worst manager ever". Great first season with Limerick, but since then? Not only was his record at Waterford Played 17 Won 0 Drew 3 Lost 14 (including 10 in a row before he left), but in several of those matches, we didn't have a single shot on target, he ruined players' confidence, their fitness and discipline was shocking (as said by his replacement and admitted by players) and yet he promised we'd finish in the top half of the Premier Division. I thought his Limerick team a few years ago were poor. Scully has done miles better.

[Dodge]

He was Dolan's assistant at Cork too wasn't he?

[L.T.F.C.]

Is this Trust going to be running the club going forward, or is it already? It's good to hear the club are getting close to a sound financial footing. The Drog's might want to have a look at what ye've been at.
I think the trust is a totally separate entity from the Club and the running of it.