Paisley Trying To Convert Catholics...

[liam88]

And while we're talking abotu religion..............
Who would Jesus support? (http://members.aol.com/bushnbin/jesus.htm)
(don't take it seriously-I go to church every Sunday-there are worse things about ;) )

[Lux Interior]

What a statement !!! That is the biggest pile of crap I ever read in my entire life.

The Pope advocates peace, now Paisley on the other hand formed the Ulster Resistance group who were prepared to shoot any catholic. Anyone who claims the pope is the anti-christ needs serious mental help. The word up here is that Paisley was never 'nutted' because he was a great promotion for the republican cause.

Ah, yes, trot out the old 'Ulster Resistance' reference - that'll take the bad look of all those atrocities committed in the name of 'republicanism'.

Paisley fromed the 'UR' in the wake of the 1985 A-I Agreement, when paranoia reached bizarre levels. His intentions were not to "shoot any catholic" but to arm 'Unionists', if a doomsday scenario prevailed (like I said, 'bizarre levels'), and in the event of those republican 'heroes' seizing any initiative during this uncertainity.

Paisley walked from the 'UR' shortly afterwards when the usual dark-glassed, denim-clad suspects got involved.

[eoinh]

I dont think Jesus would support a foreign team. Hes a Beitar Jerusalem fan i believe.

Celtic play too much high balls and ping pong football to even take a passing interest. Not a man for crosses is our Lord.

[Éanna]

What a statement !!! That is the biggest pile of crap I ever read in my entire life.

The Pope advocates peace, now Paisley on the other hand formed the Ulster Resistance group who were prepared to shoot any catholic. Anyone who claims the pope is the anti-christ needs serious mental help. The word up here is that Paisley was never 'nutted' because he was a great promotion for the republican cause.
They both claim to be christians yet don't manage to behave like it. The Catholic Church is about as Christian as Osama Bin Laden, but if people want to believe in it fine by me. I have no time for religion of any sort- its been responsible for more war murder and misery than anything else humankind has ever created- it should all be banned

[SÓC]

it should all be bannedYea coz that wouldnt ever lead to a war!

People use Religion as an excuse. Christ's message to mankind was a message of peace, to turn the other cheek.

Then again maybe we should be ban football too because it causes riots and started a war once in South America:rolleyes:.

The Roman Catholic Church is a bloody big organisation. It has bad apples, then again so does Cork City FC, that mean that all of Cork City FC is scum?

How does the Pope not behave like a Christian?

[brendy_éire]

Yea coz that wouldnt ever lead to a war!

People use Religion as an excuse. Christ's message to mankind was a message of peace, to turn the other cheek.

What a horrible message to teach. It's been taken completely out of context by Christian churches. Churches use it to teach people to be humble, meek, afraid to stand up for themselves. Not suggesting that people should use violence against violence, but 'turn the other cheek' implies that you should do nothing. What a load of crap! It is any wonder why the Church's word has gone unquestioned for centuries. People are taught to accept authority and let themselves be ruled regardless of the consquences.
Spot on about people using religion as an excuse for their actions. The Bible, Koran, Torah, etc can be used to excuse just about anything under the sun.


Then again maybe we should be ban football too because it causes riots and started a war once in South America:rolleyes:

What? Gon explain. :confused:


How does the Pope not behave like a Christian?

How much wealth does the Vatican have? Why does the Pope have such a lavish lifestyle? Was he elected? Can anyone get rid of him if he does a crap job? Why does he support capitalism? (how many times in the Bible does Jesus tell rich men to sell everythng they own and follow him?) Why does he work with fascists like Thatcher and Reagan?
Hardly a shining example of how to live as a Christian now.

[SÓC]

Turning the other cheek doesnt isnt to be taken literally but the fact is that The Holy Father the Pope has spoken out against Wars of all kind.



What? Gon explain. :confused:

Cant remember the details but a football match between two South Americian countries sparked a war.




How much wealth does the Vatican have? Why does the Pope have such a lavish lifestyle? Was he elected? Can anyone get rid of him if he does a crap job? Why does he support capitalism? (how many times in the Bible does Jesus tell rich men to sell everythng they own and follow him?) Why does he work with fascists like Thatcher and Reagan?
Hardly a shining example of how to live as a Christian now.
True the Vatican has wealth but then again so do many people. The difference is the Vatican does re-direct a lot of its resources towards places like Africa and the likes. You dont even have to leave Ireland. Look at all the Schools, hospitals and homes the Catholic Church runs, providing a service that the State would be rightly screwed with out.

Anyway Brendy I'd say your just still bitter over JP's role in bringing down the Iron Curtain;) :D

[brendy_éire]

True the Vatican has wealth but then again so do many people. The difference is the Vatican does re-direct a lot of its resources towards places like Africa and the likes. You dont even have to leave Ireland. Look at all the Schools, hospitals and homes the Catholic Church runs, providing a service that the State would be rightly screwed with out.

True, the Church does give money to the likes of schools, etc, but the Vatican has immense wealth. It's a complete contradiction of Jesus's teaching.


Anyway Brendy I'd say your just still bitter over JP's role in bringing down the Iron Curtain;) :D

Nah, it was far was from I want, and was doomed because it's economic policies anyway.
Still though, the Pope has no right to get involved in the political affairs of any state.

[eoinh]

Cant remember the details but a football match between two South Americian countries sparked a war.





Methinks it was just an excuse. Honduras v El Salvador was the game.

Theres a small article HERE (http://www.smash.com/seg/timelab/stories/085worldcup.html) about it.

There was also the Turners Cross battle of May 2004. Marked by the launching of an indiscriminate missle attack.

[liamon]

How much wealth does the Vatican have? Why does the Pope have such a lavish lifestyle? Was he elected? Can anyone get rid of him if he does a crap job? Why does he support capitalism? (how many times in the Bible does Jesus tell rich men to sell everythng they own and follow him?) Why does he work with fascists like Thatcher and Reagan?
Hardly a shining example of how to live as a Christian now.

Elected? WHat the hell does that have to do with being Christian? Was Jesus elected? Who was going to fire Jesus if he did a crap job? The Pope is chosen by the Church and IF you believe in all that stuff, then it's God's will.

As for working with Reagan and Co., try achieving anything on a global scale without the USA and see how far you get.

[SÓC]

Still though, the Pope has no right to get involved in the political affairs of any state.
He didnt, he was openly being a Catholic in a Communist country which denied the people their right to express their faith. He led open air prayers in Poland. It was one factor in the Commies losing their grip, seeing the mass public dis-obidence.

[brendy_éire]

Elected? WHat the hell does that have to do with being Christian? Was Jesus elected? Who was going to fire Jesus if he did a crap job? The Pope is chosen by the Church and IF you believe in all that stuff, then it's God's will.

Isn't everyone, according to Jesus, meant to be equal in the eyes of God? So howcome the Pope has this divine right to govern the Church? The claim of papal infallibility, the pope's word being the word of God, doesn't wash. The whole idea was only thought up after the unification of Italy and the pope's loss of the Papal States. Having lost his territorial power, he needed sometime else to exercise control.
The elitist, theocratical rule of the Pope and his cronies in the Vatican doesn't appear to sit well with Jesus's teachings.


As for working with Reagan and Co., try achieving anything on a global scale without the USA and see how far you get.

So that excuses him for actively working with fascists then?


He didnt, he was openly being a Catholic in a Communist country which denied the people their right to express their faith. He led open air prayers in Poland.

The Catholic Church has always been opposed to any form of socialism (why they loved the idea of Mussolini coming to power in Italy).
As for the current Pope, he used the Catholic Church in Poland to distribute funds to Solidarity, a trade union come political party. Regardless of the rights and wrongs of the Solidarity movement, the Pope was wrong to use Church funds to interfere in the political affairs of any state. He has no right to use funds, collected from the ordinary people, to fund political parties. How would you feel if the Church started giving FG money because the Pope didn't like the FF/PD government?

[Lux Interior]

Went to exclusively Protestant schools in the osc....their attempts @ Indoctrination was despicable ...

As a state school teacher (and also a pupil, many years ago), this is clearly a '********' statement "Indoctrination" .... of what .... ? Examples .....

I mean, did the study of Palmerston's foreign policy really turn you in to the bitter ex-pat you seem to have become?

PM me the schools then, Dev, and I'll do a bit of research ...... :rolleyes:

[lopez]

As a state school teacher (and also a pupil, many years ago), this is clearly a '********' statement "Indoctrination" .... of what .... ? Examples .....On a different level it's intriguing that you've put your head above the parapet about your job. Won't speak for Dav, but my most memorable moment of 'state' school was when my Scottish woodwork teacher called me - a 13 year old schoolboy - an 'Irish b*stard' in front of the class after f*cking up a pointless w*nk of a bowl I was making. If you fancy it I'll PM you the teacher's name and date of the incident and the school FWIW, :rolleyes: as you seem to suggest that teachers are (like priests and policemen to their respective constituencies) beyond reproach. Then you can research away for me too.

[Lux Interior]

On a different level it's intriguing that you've put your head above the parapet about your job. Won't speak for Dav, but my most memorable moment of 'state' school was when my Scottish woodwork teacher called me - a 13 year old schoolboy - an 'Irish b*stard' in front of the class after f*cking up a pointless w*nk of a bowl I was making. If you fancy it I'll PM you the teacher's name and date of the incident and the school FWIW, :rolleyes: as you seem to suggest that teachers are (like priests and policemen to their respective constituencies) beyond reproach. Then you can research away for me too.

PM if you wish ..... in no way would I suggest that there are not individuals within the profession with 'agendas', however to conclude that the state school is a mechanism for "indoctrination", as Dev suggests, is stretching the bounds of credibility.

Don't you think?

[lopez]

PM if you wish ..... in no way would I suggest that there are not individuals within the profession with 'agendas', however to conclude that the state school is a mechanism for "indoctrination", as Dev suggests, is stretching the bounds of credibility.

Don't you think?I'll leave Dav's situation for him to talk about (I assumed his education in NI was in the independent sector which is completely different) but you're right about 'individuals'. Trouble is that if the individuals with their own agendas are prevalent then whatever the state schools stand for become irrelevant.

Things may have changed now but during the era I was in school the seventies I witnessed numerous teachers making racist comments to black and Asian kids from the age of five. Perhaps its not indoctrination but the impression it gives to other kids is quite powerful. This of course doesn't even cover the coursework about history etc. which again is biased (in NI whether in RC schools or non-RC schools).

Ironically, I've always thought that (in England at least) indoctrination was worse in RC schools. Here, the point was to knock out any cultural affinity to your parents homeland in favour of being a good middle-class Brit who is also strongly Catholic. An example of this was the pressure put on my kids to buy poppies by their infant school - which I took up strongly with their headmistress (a nun from Cork). This pressure may have been there in the seventies secular state system but what I hear is no longer the case now.

I'll PM you the name and info - you never know he might have become your headmaster - but there's very little you or I can do about it. At least I wasn't subject to sexual abuse as unfortunately was the case of many other children.

[dortie]

I assume you mean roman catholic and proud :confused:


Yep, Roman Catholic and proud. Im also Republican and proud.

Alot of generalisation being posted here.

Good debate though.