Cork City Financial Discussion

[Hairy Bowsie]

Wasn't it "cleric issue" that was blamed last time and then we found out that they just hadn't got the money.

[tiktok]

Wasn't it "cleric issue" that was blamed last time

The money was just resting in Father Ted's account.

[Bald Student]

Wasn't it "cleric issue" that was blamed last time and then we found out that they just hadn't got the money.
Apparently there was also a 'problem at the printers' the time the programs weren't available.

[tiktok]

Just another in a long line of dramatic own goals by the club it seems, and the whole 'clerical issue' rings hollow.

I get paid by Bank Transfer every second Thursday, everyone in my place of work has the money in their accounts at 0:01 on the Thursday regardless of the Company's bank or the employees.

It's beyond embarassing at this stage, I'm seriously worried. While I appreciate that we have zero income until the first game of the season, the current situation is completely unacceptable, people are working their backsides and come payday, they're being treated with a complete lack of respect.

So sick of it at this stage.

[Celdrog]

In our case the club has a new owner who had to lodge 500,000 into a bank account to satisfy the examiner that he had the finances to take over the club... Who's bank account - maybe it could be used to pay your staff.........

[gael353]

Who's bank account - maybe it could be used to pay your staff.........

good point and this 500,000 lodgement has never been confirmed by anyone only coughlin and co. he bought the club for one euro. didnt buy the pub he was saying he was buying............and on and on. i wish this season clubs would stop waffling and concentrate not on winning stuff (if that happens fair enough) but what we all know is important, survival.

[micls]

good point and this 500,000 lodgement has never been confirmed by anyone only coughlin and co.

It was confirmed by the examiner...how long it stayed in the account is another matter though....

[pineapple stu]

Did most of it go to Mathews?

[micls]

Did most of it go to Mathews?

I havent a notion what was doen with the money, or if that particular money was spent at all. The examiner made it a condition that he lodge 500k in a bank to prove he had funds, thats all I know

[tiktok]

good point and this 500,000 lodgement has never been confirmed by anyone only coughlin and co. he bought the club for one euro.

You're way off on both points.

Coughlan had to show that he had sufficient funds to meet the proposed scheme of arrangement with creditors and to implement the business plan he submitted to the High Court. That the examiner confirmed evidence of these funds is a matter of High Court Record.

The cost of getting the club was the scheme of arrangement with Creditors, 7.5% to unsecured creditors, 15% to the revenue commissioners.

The issue is whether or not he's using the money that he proved was there and had indicated would be used for CCFC. Stories in recent days suggest he's incredibly slow to do so unless backed into a corner. The treatment of staff and players through this is just not on, they've been through too much as it is.

Cork City FC will take years to recover from the bad reputation we're currently cultivating.

[Guitd]

if this is true its 2 fingers to players and FAI--think its time to pull the plug on these fools-who wer still signing players up to last week with apparently no money to pay them-- here we go again and the season hasent kicked off yet ---:mad:

[micls]

The star article claims we have til Friday to sort it and Finn Harps are on standby

[gufc2000]

Rumours are the players are going on strike. Surely it would be way too short notice to throw Finn Harps in if it comes to that

[tiktok]

if this is true its 2 fingers to players and FAI--think its time to pull the plug on these fools-who wer still signing players up to last week with apparently no money to pay them-- here we go again and the season hasent kicked off yet ---:mad:

Just so we're clear, it's one person who's respnsible for every decision at the club and for every penny spent or otherwise. The rest of the 'fools' are the ones who have spent months getting us a licence only to find their bank accounts barren this weekend, they're people with kids to feed, bills to pay, mortgages to service and lives to live.

Relegation now would finish our club, our budget [apparently] is based on top flight gate receipts etc., we'd go straight into liquidation. I don't see how it could be avoided. Tom Coughlan could make thousands of enemies in one fell swoop.

[tiktok]

Rumours are the players are going on strike. Surely it would be way too short notice to throw Finn Harps in if it comes to that

I'd say Harps have already been informed to have plan B ready to go, they only need to get to Sligo Saturday week, they can manage that to start with anyway. Hard to argue with the players going on strike if they haven't been paid, they've been through it all before and should never have had to go through it again.

[Mr A]

I'd say Harps have already been informed to have plan B ready to go, they only need to get to Sligo Saturday week, they can manage that to start with anyway. Hard to argue with the players going on strike if they haven't been paid, they've been through it all before and should never have had to go through it again.

Harps with a plan B?!?

Comedy Gold!

[tiktok]

Harps with a plan B?!?

Comedy Gold!

If you won't, Fingal will!

[srfc1928]

If you won't, Fingal will!
Very disapointing to hear about the Cork situation.
But if its true, then they really should be demoted.
Enough is enough at this stage
If so hopefully Harps are in a position to take their place
rather than Fingal

[The Lep]

It wont be Fingal as they only got a first division licence due to the pitch size.

[atfconline]

Didn't Fingal fail to get a Premier Licence?

[tiktok]

The Indo are reporting that CCFC's licence is safe regardless.
That seems ridiculous, even to me.

**********************************

By Neil Ahern


Monday March 02 2009

THE FAI confirmed last night that Cork City are in possession of a full Premier Division licence for 2009, despite the fact that some players did not receive the back wages promised to them last Friday.

There was confusion among fans as to the club's Premier Division fate after it emerged over the weekend that Cork's players did not receive their monthly salary for February, which in some cases was to include an instalment of back payments owed from 2008.

But the Irish Independent learned last night that the Leesiders' 2009 licence is in no danger as the agreements reached on the back-paid wages before last Friday's deadline were enough to put them in the clear under UEFA licensing laws.

Three players did request that they be paid up front and the FAI has confirmed that they have been paid in full.

Punishment

Therefore, the only immediate punishment City may receive for reneging on agreements with the remaining players is a transfer embargo -- a mere slap on the wrist considering that the full transfer deadline closed last week.

Any embargo before July's transfer window would merely result in the club being unable to sign any out-of-work players.

Speaking about the situation last night, an FAI spokesperson said: "Cork City have told us that they have issued the payments to the players.

"However, if the players have issues, they have every right to write to League director Fran Gavin and necessary actions will be taken."

FAI internal compliance officer Padraig Smith and PFAI secretary Stephen McGuinness will travel to Cork this week for crunch talks with Cork City owner Tom Coughlan to clarify the reasons for the recent problems at the club.

Indeed, club captain Dan Murray was contacted by FAI representatives on Saturday to discuss the worsening situation, which resulted in one anonymous player expressing his anger to a Sunday newspaper.

"We had a meeting with the club a couple of weeks ago when they asked certain things of us regarding training, and we asked things of them with regard to wages," the player is quoted as saying.

"They wanted us to act in a professional manner and we expected the same of them.

"Last month the cheques didn't arrive until after 5pm on the last Friday of the month, when it was too late to lodge them to our bank accounts.

Wages

"This month's wages were due to arrive in the bank on Wednesday, but we waited until Friday and nothing arrived.

"It seems we are no better off now than we were under the old owners last season," he continued.

It is understood much of the confusion has arisen from a switch in payment methods at Cork, from a cheque system to an electronic system, as well as a change from weekly to monthly payments.

"We are very disappointed players weren't paid on time," said McGuinness yesterday.

"But at the moment we're working with the FAI and Cork City to make sure it is cleared up and it does not happen again."

[Dodge]

Its bad when I'm more fearful for Cork than angry about this. Seriously, this just isn't on.

[pineapple stu]

If you won't, Fingal will!
*cough* :)

In fairness, while I agree Cork should be penalised for what's gone on, I don't think you can relegate a club one week before the season begins when they've already drawn up contracts based on a Premier Division budget. That seems to be just asking for more trouble, as tiktok has pointed out. It's too late to take action now; the FAI's own deadline is way to late to allow them to change anything, and action should have been done weeks ago when players were being signed in the knowledge that they probably couldn't be paid; a transfer embargo then seems (in hindsight) to have been the best way to go.

Interesting to see how Cork fare this season. If they go into examinership twice in the space of twelve months, there's little chance of them coming out, I would have thought.

Is the FORAS money gone into the club?

[RonnieB]

What a fcuking joke. If it were another "smaller" club I wonder if the FAI would be so helpful.

[pineapple stu]

Like Cobh?

[tiktok]

*cough* :)

Or UCD of course.



Interesting to see how Cork fare this season. If they go into examinership twice in the space of twelve months, there's little chance of them coming out, I would have thought.


We won't go back into examinership, should it happen. It'd be straight into liquidation this time and a scrambling firesale of whatever baubles we have.


Is the FORAS money gone into the club?

No, not a penny of it.

[pineapple stu]

No, not a penny of it.
So the obvious next question is - where is that money? Should it not go to the club now to tide them through this mess? Or is it insufficient? Or are they waiting, Rovers-style, to get enough money together to buy Coughlan out?

[Celdrog]

Like Cobh?Or Dundalk, who didn't pay their players last March due to a "clerical error".

I don't see how Cork can be punished for this if its a one off. If it continues then its a diferent matter

[pineapple stu]

I don't see how Cork can be punished for this if its a one off.
The difference is that Cork were given a provisional licence on the basis that their finances were up to date by last Friday.

[Dodge]

I don't see how Cork can be punished for this if its a one off. If it continues then its a diferent matter

Its 2 months in a row. And the players are paid monthly

[Macy]

The difference is that Cork were given a provisional licence on the basis that their finances were up to date by last Friday.
Sure the FAI are great and Licencing isn't a farce. Same old people on about the negatives...

[tiktok]

So the obvious next question is - where is that money? Should it not go to the club now to tide them through this mess? Or is it insufficient? Or are they waiting, Rovers-style, to get enough money together to buy Coughlan out?

The money is in a Bank Account.
If the club request any money from FORAS, it'll be up to members to decide where it goes.

I'd be completely against handing any of that money over to the club right now, at leeast that's how I'd vote.

[pineapple stu]

So the club are in the mess they're in, and they haven't asked for any of the money?

Interesting strategy!

[swano]

The money is in a Bank Account.
If the club request any money from FORAS, it'll be up to members to decide where it goes.

I'd be completely against handing any of that money over to the club right now, at leeast that's how I'd vote.

I think you are absolutely correct. Giving the club money to tide it over will leave you powerless to do anything if, in a few months, the same problem arises. We used to give our club money without much thought until people realised there was nothing to be gained in the long term by just handing over money without having a say in how it was used.

[SMorgan]

Or Dundalk, who didn't pay their players last March due to a "clerical error".

Keep off those mushrooms, they're making you hallucinate!!!

[Celdrog]

Keep off those mushrooms, they're making you hallucinate!!!
Just because Maxi didn't go to the PFAI headquarters with a can of petrol doesn't mean it didn't happen.

Gerry Matthews knew it happened (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/pfai-quiet-on-outburst-from-dundalk-chief-1324083.html)

[Nesta99]

Drogs fan commenting on Players not being paid :rolleyes: There was no clerical error, the players were informed that they would be payed after a lying week as is standard practice with many businesses! Vaughan and Lynch were quoted in the press as having a problem with this, they vehemently denied making contact with either the PFAI or media. Legal advice was sought on behalf of the two players and the gutter press journalist involved apologised! The players were informed in advance of this change in payment system. Now back on topic. I am worried for CCFC and cant understand the appearant recklesness that is persisting after last seasons messing:confused:

[Celdrog]

Drogs fan commenting on Players not being paid :rolleyes: Give me 1 reason why I can't comment on players not being paid?

[SMorgan]

Just because Maxi didn't go to the PFAI headquarters with a can of petrol doesn't mean it didn't happen.

Gerry Matthews knew it happened (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/pfai-quiet-on-outburst-from-dundalk-chief-1324083.html)

Not sure what the story you're linking is meant to prove. You say that Dundalk didn't pay wages and they said that it was due to a 'clerical error'. I say your arse is completely out the window on this and you haven't a clue what you're talking about. Now, prove me wrong, please


Give me 1 reason why I can't comment on players not being paid?

Oh, of course you can comment, just like we can laugh at you for doing so!!:D

[brianw82]

Give me 1 reason why I can't comment on players not being paid?

Because Drogheda's financial problems mean you'll never, ever be allowed comment on any players not being paid ever again.

Didn't you read section 4.3 of the foot.ie charter?

"If thost club hast financial problems, it dost forbid thee from speaking about financial problems of other clubs. Forever."

It's right after section 4.2 - "Do you know that for a fact?"

[Celdrog]

Not sure what the story you're linking is meant to prove. You say that Dundalk didn't pay wages and they said that it was due to a 'clerical error'. I say your arse is completely out the window on this and you haven't a clue what you're talking about. Now, prove me wrong, pleaseWell if you can't bloody well read nor remember the infamous row between Matthews and McGuinness last year over the line week, then its going to be hard to explain it to you, isn't it?

Original point is that if Cork's issue is the same as Dundalk's its a non issue. If you want to make 2+2=5 then fire away.




Oh, of course you can comment, just like we can laugh at you for doing so!!Thought we'd be very qualified to comment!!

[Nesta99]

You can comment on whatever you like! As i can roll my eyes at a comment as i like, particularly when it is inaccurate and as you are not comparing like with like.

This forum revolves around the old adage of 'stones in glasshouses'!
(our schooligans are less worse than your schooligans by the way;))

I took your original post as a sideswipe at unpaid wages in Oriel last season, which didnt occur, being blamed on 'clerical error' rather than it being if it is the same as what happened at Dundalk last season then Cork are fine.

[Celdrog]

I took your original post as a sideswipe at unpaid wages in Oriel last season, which didnt occur, being blamed on 'clerical error' rather than it being if it is the same as what happened at Dundalk last season then Cork are fine.Funnily enough it wasn't a swipe at Dundalk (we are no longer in that position) and it was supporting Cork.

Now I need to lie down :D

[Nesta99]

Funnily enough it wasn't a swipe at Dundalk (we are no longer in that position) and it was supporting Cork.

Now I need to lie down :D

Ah! Your reputation preceded you. Well i agree legitimate problems can occur with any payroll system. As a result of last season people will assume the worst and that Cork(and maybe others in due course) are delaying until a home game provides some cash etc, i hope this isnt the case!
Ye can swipe away at Dundalk it just wont erm...hurt any more - Drog insult proof(for now):p

[El-Pietro]

players have been paid

[Celdrog]

players have been paidAll of them?

[El-Pietro]

All of them?
to the best of my knowledge they have all recieved their wages for this month, if they havent i expect it will be in their bank accounts in the next day or so

depending on what bank they are with

[stickyjoe]

players have been paid

Fantastic, great achievement. Totally vindicates the decision to give Cork City a premier division licence.

[Dodge]

Fantastic, great achievement

Seriously? Its a great achievement to pay players who you signed last week?

[John83]

Seriously? Its a great achievement to pay players who you signed last week?
I think he may have been using sarcasm. I'm not certain though.