New crossborder tournament: Unite the Union Champions Cup

[MattB11]

Last 20 minutes or so of their teams season and about to win the teams third piece of silverware of the season and those dunderheads stood belting out the fields of athenry and the celtic symphony, absolute embarrassment

[marinobohs]

Last 20 minutes or so of their teams season and about to win the teams third piece of silverware of the season and those dunderheads stood belting out the fields of athenry and the celtic symphony, absolute embarrassment

Yet when Munster rugby fans 'belt out' the same song...…

[dundalkfc10]

It was obviously planned that their bus would arrive at Oriel 5 minutes before kick off. They appear to have had to take a scenic tour around north County Louth as they arrived earlier than expected. The Guards closed the Carrick road to traffic, erected barricades and escorted the fans into the away section.

There is no way I would go to an away match is these circumstances.

For all the horror being mouthed by snowflakes about political chants, this is the issue that would get to me most as a fan.

It was humiliating night for Linfield fans. To see them taking down their "No Surrender" flag at halftime out of embarrassment almost brought a sympathetic tear to my eye.

They tried to leave at half time and were told by Gardai they would have to wait until the end

[ArFella]

Last 20 minutes or so of their teams season and about to win the teams third piece of silverware of the season and those dunderheads stood belting out the fields of athenry and the celtic symphony, absolute embarrassment

*fourth... absolute embarrassment

[trevy]

I doubt if many Linfield fans would come down again for the same fixture next year given the tight travel and security measures, the hammering they took and the provocative chanting of some Dundalk fans. The fact that the tv cameras and microphones are at the Shed side of the ground where Dundalk's more noisy fans go probably made the chanting sound worse on tv than to fans on the other side of the ground.
Congratulations to Dundalk for their performance on the night and picking up 3 trophies in one season is a great achievement.

[Ezeikial]

*fourth**... absolute embarrassment

Congratulations to Dundalk for their performance on the night and picking up 3 trophies** in one season is a great achievement.

** Fifth..... if you count the Malone Cup. when Georgie Kelly got a hatrick

[EatYerGreens]

I think some are missing the bigger picture. In the NIFL, there have been year on year improvements in dealing with supporter behaviour, particularly with offensive chants and banners. Yes it pops up now and again, but it is the exception, not the rule. When it does occur, clubs are generally quick to take action to deal with those responsible. E.g. Cliftonville played Linfield twice recently. At the first game there were issues which both clubs attempted to deal with on the night, but in the middle of a game it is not always to do more than minimise such, as it can inflame a situation. However, for the next game action was taken, including the identification of some of those involved and several were refused entry. There were no such issues at the 2nd game.

With all the talk of an AIL, many were looking to see the 2 games between Linfield and Dundalk as a sort of measure of a potential future league, both on and off the pitch. The off pitch issues have and will be focussed on by supporters of a losing team. That is natural and happens over all sorts of issues, not just offensive songs etc. Therefore what has happened has been viewed by many as a microcosm of what an AIL might hold. People focus on Linfield given the past, but there are other clubs who if playing in an AIL could give rise to bigger reactions/issues to their presence at a LOI ground. Therefore, many view that an AIL could reignite many of the issues that have been nearly extinguished in the NIFL.

However, the football on the pitch aside, from reading their comments post last night, it was not the songs that did most damage to support from Linfield supporters, and indeed many other NIFL team supporters, for an AIL, it was how they were treated like cattle just to go to a game. They had to meet in Banbridge at 4pm. Then they had to get on buses and be transported to the game. They then travelled by back roads, lights had to be kept off on the bus, only arriving at the ground some 3 hours later just as the teams were coming out. Normally a 30 min journey. That's what they and fans of other NIFL clubs view as a possible future in an AIL just to support their team at an away game. Fans will quickly vote with their feet.

Surely an AIL could and would just do what was done in the examples you gave of the Cliftonville-Linfield matches ? i.e. identify the d!ckheads and take measures to root them out ?

This isn't beyond the wit of those promoting the AIL concept. And if anything they'd have a stronger motive to deal with it, as the entire project could be derailed by any such serious problems.

I don't know why or how you conclude this couldn't be addressed.

[EatYerGreens]

I think some are missing the bigger picture. In the NIFL, there have been year on year improvements in dealing with supporter behaviour, particularly with offensive chants and banners. Yes it pops up now and again, but it is the exception, not the rule. When it does occur, clubs are generally quick to take action to deal with those responsible. E.g. Cliftonville played Linfield twice recently. At the first game there were issues which both clubs attempted to deal with on the night, but in the middle of a game it is not always to do more than minimise such, as it can inflame a situation. However, for the next game action was taken, including the identification of some of those involved and several were refused entry. There were no such issues at the 2nd game.

With all the talk of an AIL, many were looking to see the 2 games between Linfield and Dundalk as a sort of measure of a potential future league, both on and off the pitch. The off pitch issues have and will be focussed on by supporters of a losing team. That is natural and happens over all sorts of issues, not just offensive songs etc. Therefore what has happened has been viewed by many as a microcosm of what an AIL might hold. People focus on Linfield given the past, but there are other clubs who if playing in an AIL could give rise to bigger reactions/issues to their presence at a LOI ground. Therefore, many view that an AIL could reignite many of the issues that have been nearly extinguished in the NIFL.

However, the football on the pitch aside, from reading their comments post last night, it was not the songs that did most damage to support from Linfield supporters, and indeed many other NIFL team supporters, for an AIL, it was how they were treated like cattle just to go to a game. They had to meet in Banbridge at 4pm. Then they had to get on buses and be transported to the game. They then travelled by back roads, lights had to be kept off on the bus, only arriving at the ground some 3 hours later just as the teams were coming out. Normally a 30 min journey. That's what they and fans of other NIFL clubs view as a possible future in an AIL just to support their team at an away game. Fans will quickly vote with their feet.

This is because it was essentially a one-off event with no precedent. Hence over-the-top measures were taken to mitigate against any trouble.

If these sorts of fixtures were happening week in week out across the island, then the police both sides of the border would a) know exactly what level of risk and issues they were dealing with, rather than assume the worst, and b) Chill the fcuk out about it all.

You can't take an exceptional event and try to translate it into ongoing/everyday circumstance.

[Nesta99]

Imagine the outrage if there had been some significant incident and full security hadnt been in place!! I agree that as such fixtures became more frequent that arrangments would be less severe assuming no problems occured. Without wanting another dose of Oriel Park bashing if there wasnt the need to have all supporters enter the ground via the same route I think the arrangements in place for Dundalk fans going to Windsor would have been applied, an advisory rather than compulsory travel on club coaches. Its a valid observation made earlier that it must have been prearranged to arrive minutes before kick-off and hence the ridiculous situation of driving around North Louth killing time.

[marinobohs]

This is because it was essentially a one-off event with no precedent. Hence over-the-top measures were taken to mitigate against any trouble.

If these sorts of fixtures were happening week in week out across the island, then the police both sides of the border would a) know exactly what level of risk and issues they were dealing with, rather than assume the worst, and b) Chill the fcuk out about it all.

You can't take an exceptional event and try to translate it into ongoing/everyday circumstance.

I suspect the silly sectarian chanting would also lessen (there will always be one or two) if/when matches became more frequent. there is a novelty element to 'one off' matches but I doubt if the silliness would be replicated on a weekly basis.
Its honestly a bit snow flake to oppose an AIL because a few clowns sang some RA song(s) and even more so to whine about the 'Fields of Athenry'. If people want to be offended they will find something to be offended about, personally I don't like the UDA/UVF but hearing people singing about them never stopped me attending matches in the SETANTA and I never met anybody who cited it as a reason not to attend.

[Steve Bruce]

I suspect the silly sectarian chanting would also lessen (there will always be one or two) if/when matches became more frequent. there is a novelty element to 'one off' matches but I doubt if the silliness would be replicated on a weekly basis.
Its honestly a bit snow flake to oppose an AIL because a few clowns sang some RA song(s) and even more so to whine about the 'Fields of Athenry'. If people want to be offended they will find something to be offended about, personally I don't like the UDA/UVF but hearing people singing about them never stopped me attending matches in the SETANTA and I never met anybody who cited it as a reason not to attend.

That's all well and good branding people snowflakes, but you have to think of why it's enough to not want an AIL.

The Irish League was blighted by sectarianism for decades, it has taken a massive effort for a lot of clubs to minimise it to the point where 99% of games you wouldn't hear anything sectarian.

It's a major reason families are slowly coming back to local football. Our crowds are up across the league by 45% compared to 10 years ago.

To leave what is a growing steady league, that everyone has helped to make more enjoyable for everyone, to leave it for an AIL that has nothing concrete, a potential major upsurge in sectarianism and supporters having to be sneaked into grounds in the dead of darkness for a football game, a journey that should take 35mins tops but took near 3 hours.

I think, a competition, with decent money in it, tv deal comprising of the top 3 in each league plus the two Cup winners playing in 2 mini leagues, the winners and runners up qualify to semis and then we have a final. This is the way forward until the supporters are familiar to each others teams and the stupid stuff is knocked on the head, or at least minimised to a tolerable level that it's easy ignored.

[marinobohs]

That's all well and good branding people snowflakes, but you have to think of why it's enough to not want an AIL.

The Irish League was blighted by sectarianism for decades, it has taken a massive effort for a lot of clubs to minimise it to the point where 99% of games you wouldn't hear anything sectarian.

It's a major reason families are slowly coming back to local football. Our crowds are up across the league by 45% compared to 10 years ago.

To leave what is a growing steady league, that everyone has helped to make more enjoyable for everyone, to leave it for an AIL that has nothing concrete, a potential major upsurge in sectarianism and supporters having to be sneaked into grounds in the dead of darkness for a football game, a journey that should take 35mins tops but took near 3 hours.

I think, a competition, with decent money in it, tv deal comprising of the top 3 in each league plus the two Cup winners playing in 2 mini leagues, the winners and runners up qualify to semis and then we have a final. This is the way forward until the supporters are familiar to each others teams and the stupid stuff is knocked on the head, or at least minimised to a tolerable level that it's easy ignored.

The level of sectarianism in IL was a damn sight more than a few muppets singing “The fields” . The fact there was NO incidents at Oriel is positive. Getting “offended” by a few numpties singing songs is pure snowflake stuff. You would hear worse in any League in the World.
If that’s the benchmark it’s purely because people don’t want an AIL for other reasons.

[Nesta99]

Can 'snowflake' be banned as a term?

[DCWA]

That's all well and good branding people snowflakes, but you have to think of why it's enough to not want an AIL.

No you don’t. It is simply not enough of to not want an AIL.

Genuinely I am perplexed that this has prompted such widespread comment here and elsewhere.

A few dodgy chants and and the cops being OTT the only issues arising from this game when the two teams play each other less than once in a blue moon. How can this be considered anything other than a success off the pitch? Literally no significant incidents whatsoever.

There are Premier League games, SPL games etc that this happens every single season (this isn’t just restricted to high profile derbies/rivalries) and these teams play each other twice a year.

Anyone who considers a few chants to be a genuine obstacle to completely reforming the game on this island needs their head checked.

[EatYerGreens]

Yet when Munster rugby fans 'belt out' the same song...…

The difference being that TFOA has become associated with Munster Rugby.

The idiots who sang it on Monday only did so because it's seen in football as a Glasgow Celtic song.

[EatYerGreens]

Can 'snowflake' be banned as a term?

Before its use starts to avalanche.

[Ezeikial]

Can 'snowflake' be banned as a term?

To protect the feelings of those who are self-obsessed and fragile, easily offended, or unable to deal with opposing opinions?

[marinobohs]

Can 'snowflake' be banned as a term?

I'm outraged that you are trying to ban a totally innocent term, how dare you. That's it, no AIL for me

[colonelwest]

OK boomers... *








*Please for all that is good in the world don't start bringing these sort of terms into threads, seeing them everywhere on social media non stop is bad enough. They're not clever, kills genuine conversation and doesn't win you any internetz pointz lads. Thanks for reading my Ted Talk.

[Steve Bruce]

The level of sectarianism in IL was a damn sight more than a few muppets singing “The fields” . The fact there was NO incidents at Oriel is positive. Getting “offended” by a few numpties singing songs is pure snowflake stuff. You would hear worse in any League in the World.
If that’s the benchmark it’s purely because people don’t want an AIL for other reasons.

"The Fields" wasn't the issue, it was the IRA songs, anti British Songs that where the issue. The fact that you and some others seem to brush it off so lightly, reinforces why it is an issue. If you don't see a problem then how can it be solved? Or more like, if you see people are finding it a problem, you would rather call them snowflakes than acknowledge the issue and deal with it. Either way it's not a good look to attract all sides of the community is it?

Also I don't know anyone who has this as the sole reason for not wanting an AIL, it is one part of it. The biggest part is Lucid's 2 year planning of the AIL is all fart and no ****e. Their is nothing of substance whatsoever.