European Football 2012

[A N Mouse]

The league format seems very odd to me - does anyone know did the results from the first 22 games get carried across to the Championship group, excluding those against the bottom 4?

This would seem to be the case, from what I can tell

The corrections on soccerway seem to correspond with that - most easily seen in the results grid on wikipedia

Zestafoni lost full 24 points. Metalurgi lost 10, and have since made up the other 7.

.....This is an article of the league rules posted on Zestafoni's Facebook page.

http://translate.google.com/translat...777%26lang%3D1

Main things to pick out: The 8 teams were among the "Metallurg" has more victories (15-13).
At the moment, "Metallurgy," the leader, because they have more wins

Is anyone aware of any other leagues that use wins ahead of goal difference in tiebreakering rules?

[JC_GUFC]

This would seem to be the case, from what I can tell

The corrections on soccerway seem to correspond with that - most easily seen in the results grid on wikipedia

Zestafoni lost full 24 points. Metalurgi lost 10, and have since made up the other 7.



Is anyone aware of any other leagues that use wins ahead of goal difference in tiebreakering rules?

That Wikipedia link says it's head to head is the determining factor, Soccerway has Rustavi top though so maybe there's something in the other theory though as Zestafoni are ahead on GD and Head to Head record.

[JC_GUFC]

Both teams won 2-1, Zestafoni with an injury time winner.

As you were going into the final day of the season (i.e. not really sure who's actually top!)

Rustavi have the tougher game, away to 6th placed Kolkheti Poti, who can't move position but have won their last 2 matches.

Zestafoni are home to bottom side Merani Martvili, they can move up one place but there's no relegation from this Championship group so nothing really at stake.

Games are on Sunday

[TheBoss]

Translating from zestafoni website, after the previous game: http://translate.google.com/translat...cZestafoni.htm

The last line says:
"Zestaponelta great victory with the score 4-1, and despite the fact that the rating list "Zestaponi" and the City "metallurgist" present an equal number of points been accumulated, in accordance with the provisions of the 2011-2012 year XXIII National Championship, the championship lead in the Imereti region dwellers"

Zestafoni are from the Imereti region, so it looks like they are top.

[Dodge]

BTW, as Pats are already in, its not too important to us, but Zestafoni winning would mean Dinamo Tblisi would definitely miss out on Europe. Zestafoni play Dila in cup final

But other results went our way so its not critical

[Bawnville Hoop]

Soccerway has updated the table, Metalurgi still top. The official league site for Georgia have also updated their table, Metalurgi top also.

@TheBoss, The championship lead is held by Metalurgi so that is why they are top.


Taken from the official website (Discussion is Zestafoni, google translator used)



Here is the championship table, if you're curious. More points and wins(which seems the main factor)

[A N Mouse]

Soccerway has updated the table, Metalurgi still top. The official league site for Georgia have also updated their table, Metalurgi top also.

In fairness you wouldn't take anything from the fai site as gospel.

Taken from the official website (Discussion is Zestafoni, google translator used)

Why display 27 games played, if you're only taking into consideration 13?

Here is the championship table, if you're curious. More points and wins(which seems the main factor)

It would seem to be a question of what is meant by this bit in bold from the wikipedia entry

Championship round

Zestafoni, Dinamo Tbilisi, Torpedo Kutaisi, Metalurgi Rustavi, Merani Martvili, Baia Zugdidi, Dila Gori and Kolkheti Poti ended the first phase in the top eight positions of the table and thus entered the championship round.

The results of the matches among these teams will be used as a base ranking. Each team will then play another double round-robin schedule against every other team.

Faced with conflicting, machine translated, posts from facebake, and the wikipedia article. I'd lean toward wikipedia, and kicker

[JC_GUFC]

Here is the championship table, if you're curious. More points and wins(which seems the main factor)

I can't be having that, the team with most wins wins the title. Something lost in translation I suspect, however I think Metallurgi may well be top on the basis that they have more points in the Championship round.

Why display 27 games played, if you're only taking into consideration 13?

They've played 13 games in the Championship round, these are added to the 14 of 22 games the teams who entered the Championship round played against each other in the first part of the season.

As I say above I suspect that if teams are level on points the Champions are decided by the team who won most points in the Championship round of the season. I have no basis whatsoever for thinking this other than it seems to be the only logical way they're top.


Edit:

After all this debating over the Georgian league I feel it must be a certainty that Rovers get drawn against their Champions in the qualifiers making it all somewhat redundant!

[Dodge]

Wouldn't be a Euro thread without bringing up Vaduz of Liechtenstein. Lost the cup final for the first time in 15 years and miss out on Europe. They'd have beed seeded in Round 1. The other crowd aren't.

[Bawnville Hoop]

In fairness you wouldn't take anything from the fai site as gospel.



Why display 27 games played, if you're only taking into consideration 13?



It would seem to be a question of what is meant by this bit in bold from the wikipedia entry



Faced with conflicting, machine translated, posts from facebake, and the wikipedia article. I'd lean toward wikipedia, and kicker

You can lean towards whoever you want, personally I've seen enough information to believe Metalurgi are top.
How can you believe Wikipedia anyway. Sure I can go on to that page and edit it right now......

Here's a direct link to the Georgian football website:
http://gff.ge/UmaglesiLigaTableandCalendar-en.aspx/

Oh and I got that link from the wikipedia page, where it referenced the goal difference part.

[A N Mouse]

You can lean towards whoever you want, personally I've seen enough information to believe Metalurgi are top.
How can you believe Wikipedia anyway. Sure I can go on to that page and edit it right now......

Here's a direct link to the Georgian football website:
http://gff.ge/UmaglesiLigaTableandCalendar-en.aspx/

Oh and I got that link from the wikipedia page, where it referenced the goal difference part.

If only the championship round counts, then the table should reflect that.

Given its the first year of it taking this format it possible that's there's some confusion over the tiebreaker rules - but the rules apply over a given number of games (13 or 27, at present).

I think the position on the table may be getting worked out using the results of the championship round, and then the previous numbers being added to them - without doing a re-sort, or being re-sorted incorrectly.

You didn't post a link to whichever german site you got the details for only the championship round from, so I'm not in a position try this my self now - but I could be disavowed of this notion by a full comparison of that with the official table.

[Dodge]

Spanish table 'during' the league and at the end can be slightly different. They seperate teams 'in running' based on goal difference, but at the end based on head to head. Georgians could do similar. Until its over, I wouldn't be getting attached to any of the half arse translations, or wikipedia.

[DaveyCakes]

Sheriff are champions in Moldova

[SkStu]

Sheriff are champions in Moldova

after beating Shels in the FAI Cup last year, it was obvious they would move on to bigger and better things but i didnt see this coming.

[A N Mouse]

Bawnville yourself and jc muddied the waters, by seeming to claim that the results since the split carried more weight - I got sidetracked focusing on that.

The simple fact is that the official table is sorted by points, then wins. Looks like this is a done thing in, some, former soviet countries - and probably other places too.

The russian premier league do it, though you'll have to look at 2010 for a points tie.
Belarus do it
Ukraine use goal difference

And tomorrow we may or may not find out, for sure, if Georgia use it. Or as per dodge's example its just for convinence until they have to seperate them at the end.

[Bawnville Hoop]

Bawnville yourself and jc muddied the waters, by seeming to claim that the results since the split carried more weight - I got sidetracked focusing on that.

The simple fact is that the official table is sorted by points, then wins. Looks like this is a done thing in, some, former soviet countries - and probably other places too.

The russian premier league do it, though you'll have to look at 2010 for a points tie.
Belarus do it
Ukraine use goal difference

And tomorrow we may or may not find out, for sure, if Georgia use it. Or as per dodge's example its just for convinence until they have to seperate them at the end.

I don't think we will know tomorrow even if Metalurgi win their final game. No doubt Zestafoni will protest in any way possible to claim they are first. Vice versa should they favour Zestafoni if the 'championship' rule is the acclaimed priority.

Anyway first things first.... Bayern Munich winning tonight.

[adamd164]

Chelsea win Champions League... so Rovers almost surely unseeded?

[Bawnville Hoop]

So there is now one spot left. If Ludogorets(Bulgaria) and Metalurgi Rustavi(Georgia) win their last game Rovers will take the final spot.

To get a seeding spot the 2 teams below have to win their league.

Georgia – Metalurgi Rustavi (Level on points but ahead, 1 game left)
Bulgaria – Ludogorets (2 points behind, 1 game left v First)

Sunday 2pm: Kolkheti Poti v Metalurgi Rustavi
Wednesday 3.45: Ludogorets v CSKA Sofia

[Dodge]

Chelsea winning last night promoted 2 more teams out of QR1. So now we're left with 74 teams in QR1. Of those 32 are Northern teams, 16 seeds and 16 non seeds (unless a Luxembourg team upsets the top three in their cup - its at the semi stage)

So if UEFA went with 8 groups of 8, and 1 group of 10, they could have all Northern sides together. If they stick with groups of 10, 1 Northern seed will move.

The 16 northern unseeded sides are;
FK Šiauliai - Lithuania
JJK ( Jyväskylä) - Finland
Cliftonville - Northern Ireland
Daugava Daugavpils - Latvia
Llanelli - Wales
Crusaders - Northern Ireland
Jeunesse d'Esch - Luxembourg
IBV - Iceland
Trans (Narva) - Estonia
Por Akureyri - Iceland
Kalju (Tallinn) - Estonia
NSÍ Runavík - Faroes
Portadown - Northern Ireland
CS Grevenmacher - Luxembourg
Víkingur - Faroes
Cefn Druids - Wales

So thats Norn Iron x 3, Wales x 2, Faroes x 2, Estonia x 2, Luxembourg x 2, Iceland x 2, Latvia, Lithuania, Finland in store for Bohs or Pats

[nigel-harps1954]

Chelsea winning affected Europa League?