Grattan Overrated !!
Hooper, I travelled to Tipperary to see J'boro and Clonmel Town last Sunday, Clonmel Town ran away easy winners and surely have to be a big contender for the FAI this year. I left this game early and travelled around the corner where your "Great" Grattan were playing. They were not as good as you quoted above..they must have obviously played their best football when they played against yerselves, because they were nothing at all like you described..they looked a very young side, and very small, maybe a big midfielder, but he didn't do much running at all, after that they best they had was their right back...they were lucky to come away 3-2 winners I have to admit...Don't know if Peak were watching, but they wouldn't have much to write home about if they were....Originally Posted by hooperlooper
You laugh at me because I'm different,
I laugh at you because you're all the same........
That's the joys of cup football.......you only have to look at a few weeks ago when you see Rock beating Town, wo would have seen that, yet Town come out on Sunday and send J'Boro packing...and J'Boro would be no Rock Rovers !!!! So you can't judge any team on previous results...I'm sure every team up's their game for FAI Cup games...Maybe I'm wrong
You laugh at me because I'm different,
I laugh at you because you're all the same........
it all depends on whether the team playomg in the fai/mjc is home or awayYou might be right, I'm not one to say but if he is so much in favour of Saints re match times, referees and opposition teams, why does he have Saints A's at 11.00am and their B's at 11.30am this Sunday ? If Lewis was so much in favour wouldn't you think he'd put the fixtures at pm and another at am ???
What really gets to me in the league is when TSDL teams are playing in the FAI or MJC on a Sunday that the league decide to have the B teams play in the am, not that surely doesn't makes sense
Can anyone tell me if Peak Villa have any players on the Oscar Traynor Team ? Looking at the fixtures for the 27th/28th, I see the Oscar Traynor have a game against the Defence Forces on Sat 27th and Peak have a Tipp Cup game on Sun 28th, surely this can't be correct ???
if away then the b team should get not a fixture obviously so they can support thir firsts
if fai team is at home then there shouldn,t be a problem with b,s getting an AM fixture either at home (if club has two pitches) or close so they can make it back for big one.???
ok cup football can sprout the odd surprise !That's the joys of cup football.......you only have to look at a few weeks ago when you see Rock beating Town, wo would have seen that, yet Town come out on Sunday and send J'Boro packing...and J'Boro would be no Rock Rovers !!!! So you can't judge any team on previous results...I'm sure every team up's their game for FAI Cup games...Maybe I'm wrong
but i think you can judge a team on previous results.
thats how they win trophys , its called consistancy
and clonmel town would be the great example of this
peake and gratton on prevoius results is a very difficult one to call
but my point is for the winner it it doesn,t look good ???????
looks can be deceiving
i agree with some of what you said van,it was'nt the best of games to watch,the pitch was very soft so it took any individual skill from the game and it was just who ever wanted it more as the game wore on,but in all fairness,the first 45 grattan were very nervous and to defensive,you said yourself there a young side who are not used to playin at this stage of the fai junior,they gifted a goal to celtic,and fought hard to claw back to 1 apeice at half time,to be honest we should have gone i n 2.1 up if we had been more clinical in front of goal.the second half was all grattan,celtic never offered much,long balls easily delt with,they struggled with grattans 3.5.2 formation.the center of midfield you say was handy but didnt run much,set up one,and scored one,and its his job to sit in the hole in midfield and not to run much,to give grattan credit,they ran the second half of the game,celtic made 3 changes at the back to try to cope with the grattan strikeer,small quick guy,an he should have had a hat trick,we took the lead with a great 2nd goal,gave away a soft equaliser and up it again to get the winner,it was'nt a classic to watch but the best football was played by grattan,some lovely passing in very congested areas,they tried to play the ball bac to front without just leatherin it,for any team to got to another county,play against one of the top 3 or 4 sides and win 3.2,that is a great result,1 nil,can be lucky,2 or 3 can be a freak result but a 3.2 away win shows grattan are no push overs,they took what was thrown at them by a side that was very highly rated and still did the job,peakvilla are comin down to our back yard so they better be prepared for it and show a little respect,theres a david out there for every goliath
Ohhh so true !
Hey hooper, I agree it wasn’t the best of games to watch, the pitch was very soft as are all pitches at this time of the year and yes it does take away any individual skill from the game, but that is two fold, for both teams. Like all games and especially FAI as you said it was just who ever wanted it more. Didn’t see all the 1st half, only came down from the other game with about 10 mins to go to half time. But what is a great bonus for any team is to score just before the break, it builds you up no end. Grattan came out a different team in the 2nd half and looked as if they wanted it more. The formation was 3.5.2 but for the majority of the game when your “small quick guy” got the ball he never seemed to have anyone to aim it at so had to take it on himself (which he wasn’t bad at at all)….As you said it wasn’t a classic, and I agree the best football, on the day, was played by Grattan, but “best” in terms of football wasn’t exceptional. Again as you said, it’s a great feat to go outside any county and bring home a result and that’s exactly what Grattan did and exactly what was asked of them. There is a david out there for every goliath, but peakvilla aren’t the goliath of the Tipp South league, I watched Clonmel Town on Sunday and they certainly rank as the goliath and I have seen St. Michaels before and they would rank up there with them, peak to me would be on par with Clonmel Celtic after seen Clonmel Celtic on Saunday.
Not sure if I’ll make the Grattan and Peak fixture, I’m a decies boy so mileage enters the equation
You laugh at me because I'm different,
I laugh at you because you're all the same........
cheers van,the grattan v peakvilla game is sat at 2pm at o'neill park,thats next to apple computers on corks northside,its defenitly on no matter how bad the weather................thanks for the comments on the game,wht did you think of celtics carry on for the penno,not very sporting,,,their website said they were missing a few,true as it may be,losing sides are always missing a few ar'nt they,to be honest they should just admit they were beaten fair and square by the better team on the day,and on the day is when it counts, as i said they payed no respect to grattan and look what happened
Cheers for the fixture time and venue. Not very sporting is right, but I suppose I can see where they are coming from, they are at home, 2-2 and are after giving away a peno...it's very disheartining for anyone so late in the game. I did overhear someone at the game saying they had two players on long term suspension, but at the end of the day you have to call a spade a spade, everyone has suspensions and injuries and you just have to made do with what you got on the day, and that goes for every team in the FAI Junior Cup...it might be an excuse for some teams, but nobody will ever know if they would have been better with the 2 extra players or not ??
As for the "no respect" things.....were you even in a dressing room and your manager said to you "give these lads a bit of respect"...I don't think I have ever heard that....It's usually...."don't give these lads an ounce of respect" and I'm sure that's said in many a dressing room every weekend.....What did you think of the referrees on the day ? It was good to see 3 officials at the game...will that be the same in the cork fixture ?
You laugh at me because I'm different,
I laugh at you because you're all the same........
yep,a ref and 2 linsmen,to be honest as soon as you reach the open stages of the competion its in eveyones best interest to have linesmen,who wants to go out because the ref was not able to spot a blatant off side ect,ect, on the lack of respect thing i was'nt on about the playing side as such,i just ment in general,they were looking forward to the peakvilla game on their website and their league site b4 a ball was even kicked against grattan,i wonder did they even check to see what kind of form grattan had been showing all season,me looking at the game i dont think havin any of their players back would hae changed much,it was like they just couldnt raise their game ,they didnt have the bottle to give it a go,i know they are a decent side but i expected a lot more,i can tell you that grattan will not go out of this competion without a fight,they havent lost or drawn a game all season in any competion over 90 or 120 mins,thats in the top league in cork and against the best msl junior sides as well,everybody dreams a little dream younever know,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,come on the GRATTS
Home town reffing Tipp style
Hahaha now theres a contentious point about having a ref and linesmen, did anyone notice anything strange about the standard of refereeing/linesmen at the Town V Janesboro game? It brought the phrase home town refereeing to a whole new level. Nine Janesboro players booked, and only two Town players. And at least on three occasions did Town players deliberately go in over the ball and stamp down on players in front of the referee who actually turned his back. Not to mention the linesman who was flagging for Janesboro foul throws even though he was 30 yards up the line. Sickening stuff and pathetic. Town will find it alot harder to progress if they get an away draw lets wait and see
obvioulsy a janesboro supporter yes? i agree that the referee was somewhat bias, but then you have to agree all the boro players did was tackle late and argue with the ref! at least 3 were boked for mouthin off no? I was at the game too and to be honest take the ref out of the game janesboro were beaten fair and square, tell me,had ye one meaningful shot on goal in the whole game, don't even think the town keeper was worked was he?, and still you'll complain, the boro keeper was outstanding makin 3 r 4 blinding saves in the second half alone, which all put together would suggest ye were beaten by the better team. As for the linesman get it right he wasn't calling for fowl throws, it was for the player throwing the ball coming onto the pitch while throwing so i believe he was well within the rules of the game, just admit it ye were outplayed and more importantly out battled!
There is know doubt that Clonmel deserved to win but i would agree with shannonsider that the standard of the referreing was poor to say the least, there was a clear free out in the lead up to the second goal which totally changed the game,also in the first half the ref called a Clonmel player towards him and as the player approached he hit a Janesboro player on the face with his elbow,its unbelievable how he got away with that.obvioulsy a janesboro supporter yes? i agree that the referee was somewhat bias, but then you have to agree all the boro players did was tackle late and argue with the ref! at least 3 were boked for mouthin off no? I was at the game too and to be honest take the ref out of the game janesboro were beaten fair and square, tell me,had ye one meaningful shot on goal in the whole game, don't even think the town keeper was worked was he?, and still you'll complain, the boro keeper was outstanding makin 3 r 4 blinding saves in the second half alone, which all put together would suggest ye were beaten by the better team. As for the linesman get it right he wasn't calling for fowl throws, it was for the player throwing the ball coming onto the pitch while throwing so i believe he was well within the rules of the game, just admit it ye were outplayed and more importantly out battled!
EVERYTHING is black and white
Thats just textbook................
hooperlooper firstly good to see someone outside the league writing in. Was at the end of the game the other day, i too was over watching the town game and i have to say that grattan totally deserved their win. To be honest celtic huffed and puffed an awful lot but then again thats all they ever do. But be careful this weekend should be a totally different game. To put things in context its only been celtic players bragging about the football they play and their standard and no one else in the league, i have seen them enough over the years to know that in pubs they talk a good game but when it comes to it they (like last sunday) will only huff and puff. Tip football has only been about michaels and town in recent years but thankfully peake villa look like they are on the way back, which is most welcome. They will go to ye and play football and have some of the best players in the league playing for them on their day. Like ye they are not too physical and prefer to play the ball and had an extremely good win dwn in kinsale in the last round, hopefully it will be a good game for the neutral i should get down to it and may the best team win on the day
pearse you have valid points but on a number of occasions janesboro players could have got sent off also, you seem to have only saw one incident in the game, as a neutral i don't like to take sides but i watched the captian of janesboro in particular for a lot of the game and to say he wasn't a dirty player is an understatement(even when the ball was gone) alot of things went unnoticed in the game on both sides,true the standard is quiet poor with probably only one or two refs capable of refereeing at that level in tipp, but what can ya do its the tsdl committee that appoint them and not the fault of the clonmel players or club!
Somewhat bias? I agree with pearse and no doubt Town deserved the win alright but not the way they did it. There were bookings for dissent but to say the Janesboro players were frustrated with the disgraceful refereeing would be an understatement. Janesboro spent alot of the game defending and failed to create any clear cut chances and that has to be down to Towns play. However booking a guy in the first 3 minutes of the game highlighted to me exactly what Janesboro were going to get, or not get as the case was for the entire game. Out battled and out played yes. Ravaged from behind by the officials definitelyobvioulsy a janesboro supporter yes? i agree that the referee was somewhat bias, but then you have to agree all the boro players did was tackle late and argue with the ref! at least 3 were boked for mouthin off no? I was at the game too and to be honest take the ref out of the game janesboro were beaten fair and square, tell me,had ye one meaningful shot on goal in the whole game, don't even think the town keeper was worked was he?, and still you'll complain, the boro keeper was outstanding makin 3 r 4 blinding saves in the second half alone, which all put together would suggest ye were beaten by the better team. As for the linesman get it right he wasn't calling for fowl throws, it was for the player throwing the ball coming onto the pitch while throwing so i believe he was well within the rules of the game, just admit it ye were outplayed and more importantly out battled!
look there was bias no doubt i just agreed there with pearse in the last post and i said that few refs are upto that standard in tipperary, very few, you can call it ravaged if you like but then clonmel town don't appoint the refs the league do! You cannot hold the players accountable for that, the fact still remains janesboro were outplayed, such games are decided on mistakes and in particular the first goal which was a gift,i think this frustrated ye're players just as much as the ref did,ye're line didn't seem to help much to be honest as they were on the refs back from the first whistle,no dispespect but what happened ye on sunday that ye showed so little, ye are top in limerick and progressing well no?
standard in cork getting better
thanks jug,michaels and clon town are 2 of the best sides in the country and a credit to the tsdl,down in cork we are trying to bring up the junior standard but its hard mainly because of the amount of teams,if a guy dosent like playin with a team one week he joins another in the bar next door the next week,outside of cork it seem that there are less teams and smaller leagues but that if anything is a bonus to those leagues,fewer sides means guys have to try harder to develope there skills to get a game which is a great thing,we will always suffer in rebel county because there are too many teams and not enough commitment,grattan and kinsale are about the best because they are always looking at players and trying to bring good young players through,grattans team of 16 players from the game against celtic,all but one played there underage football with NUFARM just down the road from O'Neill park and NUFARM activley encourage there players to play with Grattan when they finish minor bedause the two clubs have a good relationship and want the areas best players to play with sides from there area
Last edited by hooperlooper; 17/01/2007 at 5:46 PM.
Not too familiar with Clonmel Celtic, would have seen them on Sunday and maybe once during the season….but as you say yourself, braggin doesn’t do much for any team, it’s on the pitch where it shows and obviously Clonmel Celtic did all their talking off the pitch !! I keep a close eye from the waterford border and it’s true about Tipp football only been about Michaels and C.Town in recent years and I myself have seen an improvement in peakvilla over the years and it’s a welcome change to see a new team contending for honours. Even this season they knocked St. michales out of the FAI and I think last season as well.hooperlooper firstly good to see someone outside the league writing in. Was at the end of the game the other day, i too was over watching the town game and i have to say that grattan totally deserved their win. To be honest celtic huffed and puffed an awful lot but then again thats all they ever do. But be careful this weekend should be a totally different game. To put things in context its only been celtic players bragging about the football they play and their standard and no one else in the league, i have seen them enough over the years to know that in pubs they talk a good game but when it comes to it they (like last sunday) will only huff and puff. Tip football has only been about michaels and town in recent years but thankfully peake villa look like they are on the way back, which is most welcome. They will go to ye and play football and have some of the best players in the league playing for them on their day. Like ye they are not too physical and prefer to play the ball and had an extremely good win dwn in kinsale in the last round, hopefully it will be a good game for the neutral i should get down to it and may the best team win on the day
For two teams that play “football”, peak and grattan, I’m just hoping the weather conditions improve the way we can see good football been played by both sides on the day…
You laugh at me because I'm different,
I laugh at you because you're all the same........
I have to say, being a Clonmel Celtic supporter and having watched the match last Sunday that the above is a little unfair. Any impression given from the website that Celtic took Grattan lightly is way off the mark. Firstly, the reports are written by a committee member who doesn't have close links to the manager or players. Secondly the manager had arranged to watch Grattan against Tramore prior to its postponement, other commitments meant he never got to see them but being originally from cork (played for Leeds schoolboys) he was fully aware of their results last season and this season. He had spoken to several people in Cork about how Grattan played and drummed it into the players all week about how tough it was going to be.
Grattan were full value for their win, played the better football and look a decent team but the team that they played against was drastically short of being the full Celtic team. I know every team has suspensions and injuries but there would be a very strong case made for saying that Celtic were short of their FIVE Best players ( John Ryan in goal, Cosgrave, Graham Doyle and Danny Madigan in midfield and Paul Kennedy up front). I'd imagine that anyone with any knowledge of Clonmel football would agree. Whereas Celtic have a decent eleven or twelve they don't have the depth to cope with that. I think that even with those players back it would have been a close game but without them it was near impossible. All the real fans knew this before the game and it was a surprise that it was as close as it was, questioning their bottle is a little ill informed.
I still see Grattan as going out against Peake Villa though. Villa are a better football side and if at full strength will beat them handy. In any case Grattan wouldn't have a hope in hell against Clonmel Town who (unfortunately) are a a level above all of us.
Also, I'm a little confused by the comments from others about 'Celtic players talking a good game in the pub'. All of the players know we are scrapping behind Town and Michaels and in a great year might finish above one of them (St. Olivers in 2002), but we'll not win the league. The Tipp cup might be a possibility (as town are out) but it's still a remote possibility. I've never heard players saying anything other than this, I mean we've never even beat town! So any comments about 'Celtic players talking a good game in the pub' is bull, I'd love to know who the players were supposed to be and what they were supposed to have said. i'd imagine its just made up.
Hooper, outside of cork there are less teams and smaller leagues is correct, but you have to pit that against the population of the areas as well, so I’m sure if you did your calculations and see the population of cork V population of Tipp V no of teams in Tipp and Cork, it might just throw up a surprise to you..Unfortunately in Tipp South blooding new players from youth level is few and far between. In div 1 of the youth league, there are 3 teams and in division 2 youth league there is 5 teams. Now if you look at the total amount of Junior teams which is 42, and 8 youth teams servicing these junior sides you have to agree that it’s not as easy as you think to have a good side in the TSDL when the majority of teams don’t have a youth system coming through. The youth system seemed better years ago and there was a constant influx of youth players onto their junior teams but that has dwindled in recent years. A lot of the faces in junior sides in the TSDL are faces that have been around for a long long time with the exception of Town and Michaels who have a good youth system going. One wonders in the future when the ageing players retire where will the players come from if there is no youth team to service any club !!!
You laugh at me because I'm different,
I laugh at you because you're all the same........
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