Ireland 0 - Holland 4 Reaction

[Dr. Ogba]

Just to throw my tuppence worth in....

The first half was absolutely shockin and I thought the midfield were to blame, especially Kavanagh. Was keepin an eye on him from the start and he never once came to receive the ball short from the defence or goalkeeper, hence the constant long balls cause there was nobody else to pass to!!! Reid was anonymous,very disappointing, had high hopes of him rising to the occasion...Andy O'Brien was the worst player on the pitch, poor marking poor positioning, just looked lost....Also Paddy Kenny's distribution was painfully slow...

But, I'm gonna try and draw on a few positives
I thought Elliott was excellent throughout, looked sharp, super touch and was still running his heart out in the 90th minute. Thought McGeady was one of the best players on the park in the second half. Finnan was class as usual. I was actually very impressed with Miller, OK he gave away a couple of silly balls but was constantly looking for it and provided the passing and movement that was sorely lacking in the first half....Kevin Doyle also looks like he'll be able to cut it at premiership level....

Here would be my best team for Stuttgart

Given
Finnan O'Shea Dunne Harte
McGeady Reid Miller Duff
Keane Doyle

[macdermesser]

Just to throw my tuppence worth in....

The first half was absolutely shockin and I thought the midfield were to blame, especially Kavanagh. Was keepin an eye on him from the start and he never once came to receive the ball short from the defence or goalkeeper, hence the constant long balls cause there was nobody else to pass to!!! Reid was anonymous,very disappointing, had high hopes of him rising to the occasion...Andy O'Brien was the worst player on the pitch, poor marking poor positioning, just looked lost....Also Paddy Kenny's distribution was painfully slow...

But, I'm gonna try and draw on a few positives
I thought Elliott was excellent throughout, looked sharp, super touch and was still running his heart out in the 90th minute. Thought McGeady was one of the best players on the park in the second half. Finnan was class as usual. I was actually very impressed with Miller, OK he gave away a couple of silly balls but was constantly looking for it and provided the passing and movement that was sorely lacking in the first half....Kevin Doyle also looks like he'll be able to cut it at premiership level....

Here would be my best team for Stuttgart

Given
Finnan O'Shea Dunne Harte
McGeady Reid Miller Duff
Keane Doyle

Miller and Harte to start against Germany?! O'Shea at centre back?

No to Harte... he won't mark his man leaving a gap .. cross in from the right side to Klose 1-0 after 2 minutes

O' Shea will probably partner Reid in the centre, like it or not. And Finnan and Carr will also probably start

So the only positions up for grabs are RM and who plays with Keane

[Real ale Madrid]

Right lads – lets leave the eL player debate right where it is ok. I’m sure the mods on here would rather that old chestnut be left in the closet. We know where everyone stands on this issue and bringing it up after a 4-0 defeat counts as WUMing imo.

As for the game – this is the usual overreaction here. Fellas saying that they are not going to watch for the 1st time in 26 years. FFS get over it - supporting your national team should be regardless weather we are good - or no good as the case may currently be!

As for the future – a team like ourselves cannot to be missing our 4 best players on any given day. Given, Dunne, Duff and Keane are our 4 best players and are key in each aspect of our game – with these 4 in the team we can give anyone a game, we need to keep as many creative players in our team as possible and added to our good old fashioned passion and pride we have a good chance of qualifying. Last night however showed us what will happen if we are missing our key players – a country of our resources cannot cope – unfortunately that was plain for all to see.

People are already being very hard on Staunton. Managers should be judged on performances in the competitive games, friendlies are after all meaningless. If the German public had their way leading up to the world cup then Klinsman would have got the boot. Remember the 3rd placed team in the world cup was beaten 4-1 by Italy last February. Expectation was at nil and his players turned around and nearly won the thing despite having very few talented players. So roll on September – sure we haven’t a hope!

[stickyjoe]

Morrison is a total waste of space, at last Giles and Co. copped onto him last night. I would of expecting better from someone taken from the south terrace to play.A player that tries to make it look like hes going for the ball but really has no interest. Doyle and Keane up front against Germans - no debating.

Next on my hitlist is OShea, the less said about him the better.Why did Ferguson give him a contract extrension?

As for the muppets that were booing/jeering robben last night cos he plays for chelsea

[PaulB]

Right lads – lets leave the eL player debate right where it is ok. I’m sure the mods on here would rather that old chestnut be left in the closet. We know where everyone stands on this issue and bringing it up after a 4-0 defeat counts as WUMing imo.

As for the game – this is the usual overreaction here. Fellas saying that they are not going to watch for the 1st time in 26 years. FFS get over it - supporting your national team should be regardless weather we are good - or no good as the case may currently be!

As for the future – a team like ourselves cannot to be missing our 4 best players on any given day. Given, Dunne, Duff and Keane are our 4 best players and are key in each aspect of our game – with these 4 in the team we can give anyone a game, we need to keep as many creative players in our team as possible and added to our good old fashioned passion and pride we have a good chance of qualifying. Last night however showed us what will happen if we are missing our key players – a country of our resources cannot cope – unfortunately that was plain for all to see.

People are already being very hard on Staunton. Managers should be judged on performances in the competitive games, friendlies are after all meaningless. If the German public had their way leading up to the world cup then Klinsman would have got the boot. Remember the 3rd placed team in the world cup was beaten 4-1 by Italy last February. Expectation was at nil and his players turned around and nearly won the thing despite having very few talented players. So roll on September – sure we haven’t a hope!

Missing 4 of our best players is no excuse for that performance. Last time we played Holland in Amsterdam we beat them 1-0 with a patched up side..

There was a total lack of organization and leadership last night, and ultimately the manager must accept the flak. I'm not calling for his head, but that was totally unacceptable alst night imho..

[Dr. Ogba]

Morrison is a total waste of space, at last Giles and Co. copped onto him last night. I would of expecting better from someone taken from the south terrace to play.A player that tries to make it look like hes going for the ball but really has no interest. Doyle and Keane up front against Germans - no debating.

Next on my hitlist is OShea, the less said about him the better.Why did Ferguson give him a contract extrension?

As for the muppets that were booing/jeering robben last night cos he plays for chelsea

Agreed on the booing lark...I was standing in the east terrace and some of the "fans" started booing Robben and Van Persie (probably because they play for rivals of Man Utd) and I was just plain embarrased. If either of them had been blatently diving then it would have been warranted but they were being booed when their names were being announced for God's sake!

I genuinely think O'Shea is a far too easy target, I think O'Brien should be turfed out as far away as possible from the Irish set-up...he was awful....

I'm contemplating setting up some sort of vigil to pray for Richie Dunne to recover from his injury asap cause without him we're fooked!!!!

[drummerboy]

Whats really worrying was wrong Staunton got it tactically. Ireland have always been competitive, have always closed people down as a unit. But last night we didn't do it as a unit and it allowed the Dutch knock the ball around with ease. It was better in the second half, but I'd blame Kilbane, a player whom I admire for his endeavour, for the 2 second half goals. Firstly he overran the ball and it was played in behind him which resulted in a goal. The next one he tried to play the off-side when Andy O'Brien had followed his player in, result another goal. Keven is clearly not a full back at this level.

[shakermaker1982]

I'd think of pairing Andy Reid up with S Reid in the centre of MF. O'Shea and Kavanagh are not good enough for me at this level. I was confident we'd snatch a draw in Germany but I'm actually afraid of the scoreline for the 1st time of my life. We never got thrashed with such ease before- we were always 'competitive' with regards to pressure and harrying but some of those lads last night had no fire to compensate for their lack of talent.

[RogerMilla]

staunton has no idea tactically , it was obvious after 5 mins that everything was going through van der vaart and he should have been man marked and negated or at least bloody inconvenienced!!

miller and reid in midfield is not the answer , the germans will destroy us there. we are as good as them around the park in a few positions but central mid is a disaster for us and will be until someone steps up.

I for one cannot see a candidate , nevermind two .
andy reid patently unfit , steven reid poor last night, liam miller not strong enough in the tackle and giving away too much ball, john o'shea seems to have forgotten how to play football. the kav just not good enough , carsley?? finnan?? oh dear

[Norman]

I was equally as disapointed, it was like watching headless chickens. During the first half when Holland were over running our midfield, players were continualy looking to the bench for guidance - it wasn't there. My worry is why our Senior players went missing, I hope it is injuries rather than a problem with Stan. I bet they will all line out for the respcetive clubs this weekend,
It was a pleasure to watch Holland, their simple passing game & movement was clinical.

Lads lets roll up the socks and not get too down about the Germany game despite last nights results.

[NeilMcD]

Very dissappointing performance. The spine of the team tonight was not there. Kavangh O brien O Shea and Reid were not at the races in teh 1st half and I suppose thats the most dissappointing thing because none of those guys are ineperienced. Reid may have been injured but Kavanagh was terrible. Mc Geady and Doyle were the only positives and maybe the pace of young O brien on the left wing. Could be an impact sub to bring on to play on the break possibly at some point in the future. Doyle must start with Keane in Germany. We need to find a good centre of midfield partnership. A lot of thinking for Staunton to do in the mean time.

I do think that Holland are one of those teams though that love a frienly like this were they get plentry of room to destroy and they did do that last night. I dont think things are as bad as they seem in the same way they were not as good as people thought after the Sweden game.

[youngirish]

That was the worst Irish performance I've seen in watching over 20 years of international football. I thought it was a bad appointment when the FAI went all out to tempt the Walsall assistant manager to take the post ignoring the fact that Walsall were doing terribly in League 1 at the time but little did I know how bad an appointment it could turn out to be.

Staunton has all the tactical qualities of the average schoolboy manager. He had the defence playing an offside trap against some of the world's quickest attacking players that obviously they hadn't worked on as they kept on getting caught out.

When we did attack we looked predictable but at the same time disorganised (if that makes any sense). I rate our chances as zero of getting anything bar a severe beating out of the German game with that pleb at the helm.

On the plus side I thought Johnathan Douglas had a decent game when he came on.

[NeilMcD]

e but little did I know how bad an appointment it could turn out to be.

S on.[/QUOTE]


Sorry how bad has the appointment turned out to be. Its still early days we have won 3-0 which did not mean we were great and we have lost 4-0 which does not mean we are rubbish. Judge a man on this qualifiers in the same way Kerr Mc Carthy and Charlton and Hand and Giles were all judged. Not on 3 friendlies.

[fergalr]

staunton has no idea tactically , it was obvious after 5 mins that everything was going through van der vaart and he should have been man marked and negated or at least bloody inconvenienced!!

Agree 100%. Whatever about using eL players, any eL manager would have spotted this obvious problem and done something about it.

[galwayhoop]

ok so it was terrible last night and the dutch passed right through us and were lightening quick with everything .. kick outs, throws, free kicks. thought van de sar was class. played like a sweeper for the first half allowing the full backs push on and we were under pressure straight away, only when doyle came on did we start closing him down and at least it meant we werennt in trouble every time the keeper got the ball! personally thought young o'brien showed a bit of potential on the left, if a bit green yet. and douglas was ok too showing a bit of passion.

we are away against a world cup semi finalist in two weeks and make no bones but a draw wud be an absolutely smashing result. expect us to tighten up centrally (hope to god he dosent go 4-5-1!) and our attacks to come from out wide. i wud think:
given
finnan, dunne, o'brien, harte
miller (mcgeady), reid, o'shea, duff
doyle, keane

o'shea is definately not a centre half but cud do a job with reid to make more solid in the middle and both sit in to allow duffer and miller or mcgeady to push on.

[elroy]

Couple of points about last night
It was essentially a pre season friendly, still no excuse but keep it in mind.

Everyone get off Stans back, we have him for the next two years at least and it was only a friendly, lets hold fire at least untill after the German game.

Formation?! Why the tinkering so much, its not like we have to quality to mess around with, 442 and stick with it.

Defence is the major problem IMO, countless times last night,it was two on one etc or dutch players were free in acres.

I thought we created a number of good chances but never looked like taking any.

Start of 02 campaign, no one was expecting anything and with an average team(not much better than now argaubly) they put in a great performance in Holland, similar situation now and a big performance is due after last night.

Youth! We have a number of journey who we know inside out, I think this campaign should be all about blooding the younger players and see what happens. Alan O'Brien, Stephen Ireland, Kevin Doyle, Aiden McGeady, they have all showed at times that they have great skill, lets use it.

Finally, friendlies!! BK won almost every one and put in some great performances, however when it really matter we were rubbish.....perhaps now it will be the other way round (Clutching straws I know!)

[wws]

sack the board

[endabob1]

I think in Germany it'll be this
Given

Carr
O'Brien
Dunne
Harte

Finnan
O'Shea
S.Reid
Duff

Doyle
Keane

Alternatively he might op for Andy Reid in behind Keane at the expense of Doyle. While McGeady was the one bright spot last night I expect Stan to be more cautious away from home.

[Seano]

Apologies for bringing this up again and I expect a fairly hostile reaction to it, but we've being going down hill since McCarthy got the boot, its probably what we deserve for the disgraceful way he was treated in the end. Like him or hate him as a person or manager, but he regurarly got the Irish team punching above its weight.

[brine3]

What we learned last night:

- Kilbane is clueless at this level, for the 71st match in a row now.
- We only have one decent striker (Keane). Perhaps Doyle as well in the future.
- We are weak in midfield.
- We need a gameplan. (say what you want about Kerr, but at least he always had a game plan, even if it was often a defensive one. he'd never have lost 4-0.)
- Alan O'Brien is very fast, like Kevin Kilbane was six years ago. Coul be a good player, could be another Kilbane.
- Andy O'Brien needs to speak up on the pitch and organise that defence. He has the experience and the knowledge, he needs to make himself heard. I've seen him do it for Newcastle.
- John O'Shea still has a mental block every 10 minutes.
- Steve Carr doesn't add much to the squad.
- Paddy Kenny needs to make sure everyone is marked before a corner. Given would never have let Huntelaar stand free for the first goal.

Now, considering we are weak in midfield and short on strikers, I'd go 4-5-1. We got away with 4-4-2 before because we were playing a virtual 4-5-2 with Roy Keane in midfield. He's long gone now, we have to stop playing like he's still in the team.