http://www.herald.ie/sport/soccer/ja...-30671802.html
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I don't feel I should have to qualify my opinion, but I'll do so anyway. What we badly need now are legitimate options. The great thing, and I've probably not said this before, is that with the current management system we're not going to be picking up spoofers. I'm not saying it's happened in the past, but a player I'd have been happy not to declare has been Anthony Pilkington. The boy just never looks bothered. ANd personally I don't think he gives us anything, not even depth.
Depth, and quality has always been our issue. Quality you can work around with a decent system. Depth you cannot. Everyone, and I mean that, should look at the recent game against Germany to show that Paul McShane, proud and rightly so born and bred Irishman, is just not good enough, under any circumstances for the national team squad. MON decided to play a midfielder with 180 mins experience at right back rather than Paul McShane. There is enough common sense within the ranks of the FAI's tech development bureau to target the areas we're weak in at senior level, and then filtering this down the grades - no different to the front row in rugby - so that players can develop specifically for a position, and God forbid, can make career choices as they go along.
You could say at the moment we've a core of about 40 that you can say we could reasonably call upon. I have taken huge liberties (lenihan/Sheridan) I will include players I personally don't rate. It's weak reading. I've put in bold the players who if possible I feel we should be improving on (and I included Robbie in this, purely because we need to find someone to take up his mantle soon, not because I don't rate him.)
Forde Westwood Randolph Elliot Henderson Given (6)
Coleman Ward OShea Wilson Pearce Keogh Clark Delaney St Ledger Duffy Lenihan McShane Kelly (13)
McGeady Brady McClean Pilkington McCarthy Whelan Gibson Hendrick Meyler Hoolahan Quinn Walters Reid Green (14)
Keane Long Stokes Doyle Sheridan Murphy (6)
Now, I reckon there are others around the Championship, League 1 and possibly the LOI who all could rightfully say that they could hold their own in the above list of players. Derrick Williams is a player who could develop into a fine defender, and he's at a club that could well be riding high in the Championship next season in Bristol City. There's plenty of the under 19 team that went far three years ago that if they get a bit of luck can eck out a decent career for themselves.
If Bamford, Kane, Christie and McGoldrick all declared for us, and Grealish remained with us, it would be seismic. It would make a huge improvement to the squad. It would mean the core getting stronger and wider, and maybe even open some other options with formations etc.
In a way, you kind of have to admire Northern Ireland in the past decade. They've smaller resources and numbers than us, the players coming through that are decent that we can plunder, we've done so, yet when they have to turn to a solid (if unspectacular) player from the bowels of League 1 or 2 then they do it. and if it doesn't work out, they pick a youngster from the 19's who might only be getting reserve football and they test him out.
I'm sure it was mentioned last week on this site, about picking kids that the underage coaches know is good, but for one reason or another the club career has stalled or whatever. I kind of wish we would either utilise some of our friendlies for those purposes, or pick a year of B Internationals and use them for that purpose.
Finally to get this post somewhere back on track, I pray to God Grealish stays with Ireland, because I think he could have a fantastic career with us, but I'm not so sure England will get the best from his talents. I reckon he'll be in Europe by his mid-20's. I would see a lot of Steve McManaman in him
O'Neill in the dark.
http://www.independent.ie/sport/socc...-30673434.html
He's playing this scenario well. I suspect he knows more than he is letting on.
Neither Kane nor Bamford would take the place of any one of Gibson, Meyler or HendrickQuote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
I was talking more about Noble coming in for Gibson or Hendrick or Naughton coming in in Meyler's place.Quote:
Originally Posted by tetsujin1979
Personally, I think Kane and Bamford could be coups if they declared but they don't have any interest so they are null and void.
At least McGoldrick sounds enthusiastic.
Was trying to think about the sort of reception that Jack Grealish would receive should he make his bow against the USA. I don't doubt it would be reminiscent of James McClean's reception. That made the hair stand on the neck. Circumstances were slightly different but McClean showed such determination to represent us that the footballing public welcomed him with open arms (his club career was very positive at the time also).
I was just about to post the above but I remembered I should insert a caveat before my post would be gobbled up by someone quick to point out Jack's recent hesitance. Maybe hesitance did exist but the most critical club decision of his young career also existed at the same time. Add to this pressure from the football association in the country he was born in. The kid deserves some slack.
I think Noble is overrated myself anyway, and I'd take Gibson, Whelan and McCarthy over him without any hesitation.
I agree, it'd be a rapturous welcome I reckon. Agree with other point too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
PL player, yes. A huge upgrade on the current options? I don't think so. Imagine if he knocked Quinn down the pecking order. I'm not that receptive to that populist cr*p that can be spouted like 'he's taking the jersey of someone else', but I admire Quinn's resolve and persistence to become a Premier League and international footballer when he was in L1 not too long ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingdom
I know you're a Whelan fan Kingdom and I think it's debatable whether he'd offer more than Whelan but they play two different roles. Is he more comparable to McCarthy and Gibson? Yes. Is he better than either of them? No, I don't think so. Definitely not McCarthy and I think Gibson would offer more at the base of a two or 3 man midfield when up to speed.
I thought that was a bit embarrassing. You'd have thought Messi was coming on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
Grealish left out of the Villa squad today. What does that say about his international intentions?
There's lots to read into it.
TOWK should be able to refine it for us.
Spot on, he doesn't compete with Whelan, and in theory he doesn't compete with Mac either. I really like Gibson, who we must remember isn't a child anymore, and still hasn't forged any proper career for himself.Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
Quinn is a strange type of player. He doesn't really appear to ever do much more than keep play going, but that's the type of quality lacking in a lot of British based players, and he is obviously very determined. I like him, and would never mind having to fall back onto him.
I think Quinn does more than that. He's a busy player who puts tackles in and no mean crosser of the ball too.
This is why my posts are so long! To me, in comparison to most of the central midfielders, Quinn is not a particularly tough tackler. I'd class him very similar to Mark Kinsella, or Matt Holland, probably more the latter, in other words an excellent foil. He is more an effective closer of space I'd say. I wouldn't mind seeing him in a more withdrawn role in a friendly for example.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
When did we last produce a Messi?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fly
Not sure it quite works like that, the newspapers are a bit of a cartel, plenty of other papers printed the story, surprisingly the Daily Mail doesn't seemQuote:
Originally Posted by SwanVsDalton
to be one of them, perhaps it was not as good as their other made up stories.
It does not matter whether they speak to the paper or not anyway, Fallon is only a phone call away and
will be happy to provide one.
No. That's a potential libel. That's a couple of careers ruined and a paper risking it all for, what , 100 copies extra sold, if that? You'd be surprised how sensitive editors are to possible legal action caused by fabrication.Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
Re-adjust your trust Tricky.
Never. What's your point?Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingdom
I am always happy to see his name on the team sheet, he is the sort of player who will get at the opposition, not something I would really say about Whelan McCarty or Gibson.
I have just been looking for some evidence to illustrate this and I think this says a lot
games played, fouls committed, fouls suffered, fouled suffered per game
quinn 4 - 2 - 11 - 2.75
mccarthy 7 - 8 - 9 - 1.28
whelan 7 - 7 - 3 - 0.48
So he is 2.14 times more likely to be fouled than McCarthy and and a staggering 5.7 times more likely to be fouled than Whelan .
He is also half as likely to be fouled and either of them.
So to me it seems he gets involved in a positive way, he caused problems for the opposition, he is a bit of a terrier on the pitch
as opposed to a poodle.
Couple of other players
coleman 4 - 2 - 7
baines 8 - 6 - 14
Granted it isn't everything but I think it shows something, you would not be getting fouled is your were not causing problems
for the opposition and you would not need to foul the opposition if you were coping with them otherwise (although you could say you
could not get near enough to foul them). Would just add the stats are not from a lot of games so might not be fully representative but
even so the ratios are large so they are significant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SwanVsDalton
Firstly it is not libellous, you seemed to have assumed he would make the story up, now that is potentially
libellous. However you need not worry as he would have to prove in court he didn't make the story up,
something he will have great difficulty doing, especially so considering Grealish's tweet soon afterwards!!
ie "Some stuff in the papers today about me that I didn't even no myself"
Your initial post was confusing - who are the they of 'It doesn't matter whether they speak to the paper'? I assumed it was Grealish's family. So Fallon would be making it up. That not what you meant?Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
You really think Jack's tweet is the end of it? Since then we've heard nothing from Jack or the family. Nothing to discredit this 'false story', just a 'wow look at that stuff in the papers, journos eh?!' style tweet.
But we have had a follow-up, fully by-lined by the same writer, endorsed by a different publication and set of editors, reiterating the story. And no repudiation from Jack and his family.
If someone was just making stuff up about me, I think I'd protest a bit more.
Couldn't agree more with this post.Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
Welcome aboard Jack. Thank you for choosing the land of your grandparents when it might not have been the popular thing to do with some so called experts out there. May you have a long and prosperous career with Ireland. And if you do happen to read this message board, I apologize for some of the folks on here who have nothing better to do it seems but offer rash and ill informed comments instead of affording you a little bit of slack, as is suggested above. There are plenty of them about in Ireland unfortunately.
This getting confusing. The papers do not need Jack or his families to peak to them, they canQuote:
Originally Posted by SwanVsDalton
write stories about them whatever, but truthful ones and made up ones. Certainly they did not stop
this completely fabricated story (and it is) so they can write pretty much what they like.
Yes Jacks tweet is the end of it, he has completely rubbished Fallon's story
what more do expect him or his family to do? Drive round to Fallon's house
and kick the living daylights out of him?
The second story is a joke, a complete p*ss take.
It really is not worth commenting on and that is exactly what Jack and his family have done.
Tricky, seriously, Fallon is a good journalist and he wouldn't write the story without a real source. Jack has previously indicated (or his brother has) that his father would manage his international future, and his father is the one who's been sharing the story around. It doesn't take a great amount of effort to connect the dots.
You're right Tricky. Papers can do whatever they want and no one will stop them because no one cares and there's no incentives for writers and editors not to lie and that's just how the media works.Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
can someone scan the sunday times interview. cant get sunday times where i liveQuote:
Originally Posted by Deckydee
Jack's tweet didn't go into any great level of detail. He just said he had no knowledge of claims made in the media. He didn't specify exactly which claims were news to him. Presumably, he was referring to the claim that he'd be in the squad for the US. This may well have been the case because his dad has been discussing matters with the FAI on his behalf. His dad posted Fallon's story on Facebook on Friday afternoon with the a message along the lines of "USA versus Ireland, Brad Guzan versus Jack"; you could only interpret that as approval or affirmation. Anyway, Jack's tweet has not been the end of it at all; Jack's dad has just confirmed this morning that Jack will be available for the US friendly.Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
Which is, of course, fantastic news.
Erm..... he isn't available for the Scotland game. He's available for the U.S.A. game. That is a friendly, which means he's won't be tied to Ireland if he plays. Like I am glad to be proven wrong but he could very well still end up declaring for England, though it's looking unlikely now.Quote:
Originally Posted by mark12345
And I don't think Jack reads football forums so I don't think he would be offended by any polite, constructive and well formed criticisms of some of his past comments and actions. He's a grown man.
I would love to see him become a bonafide Premier League player and play for Ireland over England because there certainly hasn't been a similar precedent in the past. It's still up in the air whether he's good enough though.
I hasten to ad that people clamoring for him to accept a call up to a competitive Intl. so he can come on in the 94th minute and be forever tied to Ireland probably puts him under more undue pressure than anything I've said.
Looks like I was right.
Calling him up just to cap him for a minute in a competitive game would be mad, and an insult to JG's intelligence. I think if he gets a game, or part of a game against USA it'd be great. It'd bring a bit of a box office element to the game and it'd help his transition into senior football. I don't know just how good he'll become but I'd be very surprised if he doesn't at least achieve a level that would be of meaningful benefit to Ireland.
I also think it'd be very hard for him to change his mind even if technically a senior friendly cap makes no difference to his future eligibility for England.
Yes I expect Jack will be delighted when he finds out.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
I'll probably regret asking this but here goes - how's that? :)Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
You were right first time!!! :pQuote:
Originally Posted by SwanVsDalton
It would be okay if both parties thought it was the best for the player, to stop all the speculation about his intentions and let him focus on football, eg the James McCarthy competitive cap.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
I love it!Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
Yes, if it was agreed in that context, absolutely.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir