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Quote:
Originally Posted by dynamo kerry
Thanks DK, as you point out the topic of this thread is getting more people on the BB list (thereby imo ensuring a fairer distribution of whatever the BB allocation is for home games and possibly away games too) but it's been hijacked slightly by a debate on the fairest distribution method for away games which I would have thought should be in another thread entirely?
I don't recall to many regulars missing out on Paris. These are people who bbed with the FAI and got their away tickets from the FAI.Quote:
Originally Posted by Newryrep
Galah - who is out the WL and travelled quite a bit. Who else?
I suspect many of the others are those who you'll find travelled with 747 or got their away tickets elsewhere.
I know a number of people travelling and all got tickets from the FAI.
Any away ticket scheme would have to assume home attendance and be limited to the bbers and WL.
Fair enough, no point in getting too hung up over the points system. A category system to me works better, but you can see the merits of a one point system. The crux of the matter is we both think a points system is the way to go.Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenforever
I won't be traveling away unfortunately. Same seats as the last few years in the lower Cusack for the home game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenforever
[QUOTE=Junior;1264365]Scenario: A few high demand games with low number of tickets and the fans who are succesful in the first ballot will automatically be ahead of the other fans (because they have been awarded a point) for the 2nd game and future games and so on and so on.......Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior
Sorry Im just being a pain in the Ar$e now arent I?[/QUOTE]
YES :)
Next competative away game is Set 2010 - assuming SA 2010 will have no ticket issues - Every body has 9 months to prove the number of points they are due.
If this wasnt the case ( which it would be ) a high demand glamourous game with low tickets could see a mixture of regulars/first timers - but as the games progress the regulars will still be getting tickets and the first timers/non regulars will be dropping out so their points remain the same
Galah is now sorted through the faiQuote:
Originally Posted by gspain
There are plenty of tickets floating around for Paris at this stage
One thing that is coming out from all this is that the FAI should be holding regular fan focus groups.
I have no objection to a points system but home games would have to be included to some extent. How about a very simple "away games count double" - 2 points for every away game and 1 point for every home game. Those going to home games (especially the unattractive friendlies) make up a large percentage of the hardcore support and keep the FAI afloat financially. The extra effort of going to away games should be rewarded though so double the points.
I haven't missed a competitive home game since 1983 (and I think I only missed about 3 home friendlies). In the last 10/12 years (since I've had the resources to do it) I've racked up a fair few away games as well but, to me, the home games are just as important as the away games (none of them are easy from here in New York).
So in effect everyone on the block booking just gets one points - as as we have already established block bookers do not turn down tickets for fear of being dropped from the list. This system is ridiculous as when for instance the France away game comes up you've someone on the waiting list who gets to two or three away games a campaign spending a fortune being superseded by a block booker who goes to all home games (say five/six home games a year based on the old Lansdowne setup with all the home friendlies). The waiting lister would love to be going to home games and getting points.Quote:
Originally Posted by EastTerracer
Home and away should be treated separately.
Three away games would get more points than 5 home games so I don't see your point. Another alternative is to reduce the weighting for home friendlies then - this would definitely give the edge to those who travel abroad over home game only types.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluetonic
It seems to me you never see my points.Quote:
Originally Posted by EastTerracer
Someone who goes to one away and all the homes will get priority of someone who goes to three away, this shouldn't be the case. No person should be punished because the FAI can not cater for their need for a home ticket, no person should be awarded points for going to home games.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenforever
but he initally got rejected did he not
Babysis also got rejected, i will check the other threads if I have time. I appreciate all may not have got their tickets through the FAI but certainly some have .
Yes but after contacting them he got sorted, remember the ticket office have had to deal with thousands of applications over a very short period of time and from the various posts anyone who emailed the ticket office poining out their travel record seems to have been sorted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Newryrep
The system is far from perfect but I personally think the staff in the ticket office have bent over backwards trying to sort people out, I know I have received a number of emails from them which were sent very late in the evening.
Hopefully babysis is sorted, if not i should be able to do something for her
Seleccted quotes from YBIG
I think Im still in shock. In all my away matches in 7 years I have never travelled without a ticket and always bought from the FAI. I got my rejection email at 6.36 so if there had have been 8500 instead of 8000, I really wonder if I would have been successful. I applied just after the glitch was sorted with the booking as well. It wouldn't take my first few attempts. Desperately looking for 2 spares... Please PM
Cyprus through FAI, The others through 747, Im in a state of shock here, Thanks for the pms lads
I defo think that because my address was US that had something to do with it. Don't think they bothered to look at my booking history however, since I have only missed 1 away match this campaign and 1 the previous.
i went to 3 away games got all my tickets thru the FAI and got rejected i am also a BB and now i hear people getting tickets who havent been to 1 what the fupp is going on here Delaney is a fuppen bacstard something has to be done
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newryrep
I can't comment on any of the above without knowing the facts.
However anyone who is a bber or on the WL in their own name and has been buying away tickets from the FAI using the correct reference number etc who has been refused should still contact the ticket office and query the rejection.
yeah to be fair to them, i never filled in BB number (or waiting list number as it is) because was in work at the time and didnt have it handy but the application only had "if known" beside it so presumed would still be safe without it as all my details on record. Seems like they filtered by block blocker number and allocated on that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by galah
I reckon you have it spot on
Unlike the last ticket scramble they made no reference to a lottery and seem to have taken into account your past record where you included the details by way of BB / WL numbers.
Also with the sheer volume of applications some errors are likely to be made.
I dont believe too many of the posters who say
"I know a lad, never been to a match got 4 tickets" as they say paper never refused ink
On Ybig a couple of people have been exposed as not being the 100% genuine people they calim to be
I cant speak for EastTerracer but I fully see your points (and those of the others) but I still maintain that you cant simply exclude Home Games completely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluetonic
This suits you personally but in my opinion it is not a fair reflection of a supporters support for the team which should include home and away games.
I think the 1pt for Home games and 2pts for away games suggested would be a simple mechanism that at least tries to reflect both angles.
How many people would go to away games but not home ones? And why?
cant get tickets for home gamesQuote:
Originally Posted by Schumi
cant afford home games and away games
****ed off with FAI
based in mainland europe
Prefer the away games for atmosphere, new location, pi$$ up with the lads..., cant afford to do both, cant afford time work of for both and so on and so on...
Plenty of reasons for it - couldnt estimate how many though.
If the home block booking is a closed shop which it is, why should those who can't get tickets but want them fall behind in the points system? As I said already block bookers take tickets and shift the out of fear of losing the allocation. It's a case of the rich getting richer whilst the poor remain poor.Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior
On the other hand away tickets are available for the majority of games so are a better indication of loyalty.
Keep the the home and away systems separate.
You need to get rid of this notion that all BB'ers are luck b'stards who get loads of tickets and just go to the best games and offload the crappy fixtures. Thats simply not the case, it happens sure but I would say its no where near as rife as you make out. If I attend 5/6 homes games and 1 away in a campaign, I dont think that should put me bottom of the pile (obv excluding those who havent travelled at all).Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluetonic
I think we will need to agree to differ or risk going round in circles.
At the end of the day, none of this would make me decide to travel/not travel anyway. I make that decision first and look how Ill source my tickets next.;)
I don't have that notion at all. I can only speak from my own experiences One individual has eight tickets in a block booking, three go to every game, the other five are made of whoever wants to go in the days before the games. Sometimes there is a ticket left over with the cost being absorbed by those who go. It's not sold on outside the group - can't control what happens to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior
Same here, where there is a will there is a way, but that shouldn't have to be the case for regulars.Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior
[QUOTE=Bluetonic;1264666]I don't have that notion at all. I can only speak from my own experiences One individual has eight tickets in a block booking, three go to every game, the other five are made of whoever wants to go in the days before the games. Sometimes there is a ticket left over with the cost being absorbed by those who go. It's not sold on outside the group - can't control what happens to it.
QUOTE]
No matter what system you have in place you will always have exceptions which I firmly believe are in the minority. The vast majority of BB'rs are loyal long standing fans.
Nobody's denying that but it's irrelevant to this discussion. Still not one blockbooker has been able to say why they should control large allocations of tickets rather than the FAI.
The only reason is that its easier for the FAI that way.
I'm on the waiting list and don't see any problem with the way the block book works. The people who have been going for 20 years deserve to be getting tickets ahead of me as far as I'm concerned.Quote:
Originally Posted by eaststand85
Anyways I don't see what difference it makes whether one person controls 4 tickets for example or is asked to supply 4 names for the 4 tickets. The 4 tickets are going to be sent out too the same guys who go to every game and they'll all meet up as they always do.
If as is being claimed the block book scheme has loads of touts on it - which I don't believe for an instance - surely whoever controls them is just going to get 3 other names together.
Someone using the GAA as an example of an organization who knows how to look after ticketing is a complete joke. I see way more touts on the way into an All Ireland then they would do for a soccer or rugby match. 82,000 capacity stadium and the county board of a senior team in the final get something like 12,000 tickets for the final
I'm blue in the face saying this but you issue fan cards and get rid of the outdated system of issuing a physical ticket for each game. It greatly reduces transfer of tickets between big groups, touting (to the small degree that exists), etc..,Quote:
Originally Posted by Nah Nah Nah Nah
The comparison is that the GAA are embracing the technology that is available. Last season they trialled the fan card, next season it will be increased. The FAI aren't bothered being innovative, very simple example is in November 2007 they carried out a block booker and waiting list fan survey and got email addresses of the same, yet even though the majority of people pay their invoice online they still contact people by post which is a waste of time and money.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nah Nah Nah Nah
Do you think it's good enough for the FAI not to be innovative or are you happy with an association which made a loss of €16m odd in the last financial year?
Yes it would stop the transfer to touts but to me this is very, very minimal from the BB scheme.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluetonic
How exactly is the card going to stop transfers of tickets between big groups? If you know someone who you're giving a spare ticket you have it's not going to bother you whether you give them a physical ticket or a card as you know them so you'll get the card back.
I know people with season tickets cross channel and they're constantly giving out their swipe cards to friends, friends of friends etc
The FAI already have a fan scheme called the block book scheme. The FAI can learn lots from the GAA but how to do ticket allocations is certainly not one of those
At this stage its probably best to wait and see how many tickets change hands and are available at face value when we get back to Lansdowne, that'll be the real answer. We should be able to get a good idea of this from here and YBIG.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nah Nah Nah Nah
Do you agree that the issuing of physical tickets to the same people every couple of games is unnecessary in this day and age, the posting of invoices etc..., could be handled better by the FAI?
This isn't just talk of implementing a system for the sake of it, it's something which would set the FAI up for the future. The move to a 'new' stadium was a great opportunity to do this in my opinion. Sooner or later they will have to move away from the current archaic system. Invoices can be issued, payments received, tickets loaded onto fan card etc.., all in the blink of an eye these days keeping human interaction to a minimum and freeing up people to handle exceptions.
Just say such a system was in place for the home games and the away games had a system implemented such as we have discussed on here today well then its not too wild to assume the time spent processing requests and issuing tickets would be kept to a minimum, a day or two at most. The system would be future proof.
You say bb'rs 'control' large allocations of tickets, and I suppose we do, but for most of us it is an inconvience. Most of us I'm sure pay up front and then end up pulling the money back in. I personally would have no problem with the FAI going one ticket per block booker, and I'll supply the details of the others in the group, and then the FAI can send out more invoices, deal with more emails and phone calls, more money transactions etc etcQuote:
Originally Posted by eaststand85
I don't see how this benefits anyone on the WL, certainly not the FAI, and will only make life easier for the main block booker who now only has to look after their own ticket.
Of course if they chose to implement an fan card system like I am blue in the face saying all their processes will be automatic and require minimum human interference.Quote:
Originally Posted by Polster
It benefits everyone as follows imo:Quote:
Originally Posted by Polster
- The main block booker who as you say now only has to look after their own ticket or pair of tickets.
- The FAI by giving them a complete database of (active) supporters for sales and marketing purposes which can be used as a tool for generating valuable revenue for Irish football from things like Vantage Club seats and official FAI merchandise, and will also allow them better track who's taking tickets for each match and help ensure they're distributed fairly when demand is particularly high (as in the upcoming play offs for example). Also, if the FAI could accept more people onto the BB and WL then this would surely increase the amount of people they can reach and promote football to. As has been mentioned elsewhere on the forum there's a danger of not enough young people making it to matches, this might help address that in some small way by ultimately ensuring more attendance at games as the same young people would find it easier to progress thru the WL
- Existing waiting listers by ensuring any tickets allocated to the BB scheme are distributed fairly and making it more difficult for touts. That's all anyone wants and I personally believe that if this is done then a higher churn on the BB scheme will result and those WL'ers who have patiently waited will be rewarded. Actually, one point which no one has raised is that there must also surely be a number of WL'ers getting tickets from BB'ers at present. If a BB'er gave the name of a WL'er when their allocation was divided up as suggested this would also help reduce the size of the WL which is what we all want (I think/hope).
Another point for consideration is the ROISSC's in Ireland and the UK. Im not entirely sure how they all work but Im pretty certain that all BB details are maintained by the Suporters Clubs (which will be in the 100's) and not the FAI.
Obviously this could move to the FAI if thats what the system required but in doing this would it then start to remove the need for groups and associations such as the ROISSC? One of its key activities is the organisation of members tickets - do we want to get rid of fan groups? I dont think we do.
Its a tangent I know but relevant I think.
Mentioned earlier in the discussion that FAI member clubs allocations could be managed separately and I see no reason why supporters clubs abroad couldn't be treated in the same way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior
Just another not here, back in Lansdowne waiting listers would be offered ticket to friendlies as the capacity of Lansdowne would be greatly increased, this won't be the case in the new Lansdowne as capacity is static. Only those sponsors tickets which aren't required for friendlies will move to the waiting list - I doubt this will be many.
On another note I hope to God the FAI are going to catagorise the tickets. I know they are talking about keeping the prices the same as Croke Park but there is no way a ticket in the lower at the half way line, should be the same as a lower at the corner flag, in the same way a ticket in the upper at the half way line at the front should be more than a lower at the corner flag, or upper corner flag. Please God someone tell me there is a range of ticket prices (similar to how they've catarogised the Vantage Club) around the ground and not just A & B.
There would of course be work to accommodate the block booking around this but in my opinion it has to be done.
No I meant that your system is for dictating who gets away tickets using a points tallied system.Quote:
Originally Posted by Newryrep
For a while there I thought you were going to use away match attendance for home game tickets. spaced out a bit. appreciate the explanation.
Although the FAI state that all general public seats are sold for the Aviva (they ar epaying €44 million so they deserve the publicity) even the most optimistic salesperson wouldn't claim they'll sellout the Vantage Club. In most cases the away allocation will also be available. I expect anyone on the WL will be offered tickets for games at the Aviva going forward.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluetonic
I hope they don't categorise any further. They have guaranteed to keep prices the same up to 2012. Categorising always pushes prices up not down. Maybe at the next price increase it might be a good idea.
Yeah I do agree that the card system is the way they should go alright - just won't get people onto the Block Booking list any quicker I don't thinkQuote:
Originally Posted by Bluetonic
Im a WLer. I dont ever recall a friendly in the last 10/15 years in LR where it was a struggle to get tickets. The only one that I can think of is the Brazil scoreless draw a few years back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluetonic
The issue of availabilty of Aviva tickets was discussed on newstalk last night. Apparently there will be more corporate tickets in the new LR (15k) than there is in croker. Astonishing if you ask me. On that basis, if the corporate level is 15k and the BB is approx 30k, its no wonder there was very little tickets left over for allocation to WL.
They were discussing the prospect of big games been moved to croker in future years. They rightly concluded it wont happen without a substantial compensation to Aviva, ie it wont happen.