Kevin Doyle

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Originally Posted by elroy

Thats mad was only thinking something similar today watching parts of the Arsenal game, does AW have something against Irish players? Both Given and Doyle have been available in recent times for relatively small transfer fees and both imo are far superior to what is available to them at present, notbaly Bendtner/Eduardo and Almunia.

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I'd agree with everything in there except Eduardo not being as good as Doyle. Eduardo's (0.19 goals to games) stats are worse than Doyle's (0.27 goals to games) in the Premier League so far, but I think there's a couple of mitigating factors there. Eduardo came in from Croatian football and did need a bit of time to adapt. Then of course the leg break. I think if he got a good run in the team and found good form, he'd get lots and lots of goals for Arsenal. His international record is also very good, 18 goals in 28 games. Doyle has 7 in as many games.

Not to put Doyle down at all of course, I really like him, I think he's great for Ireland, but I'm not sure he'll ever be the kind of player that bags lots of goals. The most similar player I can think of is Kevin Davies, a nuisance for defenders to deal with and contributes a lot to the team in terms of build up but not on the end of the move all that often.

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Originally Posted by Serb

I'd agree with everything in there except Eduardo not being as good as Doyle. Eduardo's (0.19 goals to games) stats are worse than Doyle's (0.27 goals to games) in the Premier League so far, but I think there's a couple of mitigating factors there. Eduardo came in from Croatian football and did need a bit of time to adapt. Then of course the leg break. I think if he got a good run in the team and found good form, he'd get lots and lots of goals for Arsenal. His international record is also very good, 18 goals in 28 games. Doyle has 7 in as many games.

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I think you will find that the Croatian League is a bit better than the League of Ireland where Doyle came from and he adapted very quickly.

Doyles goalscoring record though isnt as good as it should be, but I do think it would improve in club football if he was playing for a better side. In this Wolves team it seems like he has to drop very deep at times to recieve the ball

Doyle is a good honest pro and will work his socks off and is good in the air but he needs to move to a better club or else his game is going to suffer, Should have left Reading 2 years ago and gone to Chelsea when they expressed an interest. He may or may not have gotten a lot of games but the chance to play with quality players in the Chamoions League would have been invaluable and would have given him a platform to show what he could do.

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Originally Posted by yapster

Doyle is a good honest pro and will work his socks off and is good in the air but he needs to move to a better club or else his game is going to suffer, Should have left Reading 2 years ago and gone to Chelsea when they expressed an interest. He may or may not have gotten a lot of games but the chance to play with quality players in the Chamoions League would have been invaluable and would have given him a platform to show what he could do.

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Reading would have had to accept a bid from Chelsea first. Doyle couldnt just have decided he wanted to go

Sadly it's beginning to look like Doyle & Hunt may be plying their trade in the Championship again next season,hopefully not,

I think Wolves may yet stay up. I fancy them to beat Burnley away in their next game. Pompey and Burnley are gone its a case of who will follow. I suspect if Wolves/Hull went down, the impact Doyle and Hunt have had in the EPL this year will enough to secure a move back to an EPL club.

Doyle doesnt score as many goals as he should, his finishing is not quite as high as you would expect. He is more of a creator than finisher, he set up a chance in the first half making a good run from the half way line, played the ball to the left and the ball was returned to him at the edge of the box. He has a decent bit of time and although got off an effort, didnt hit the target. A top finisher would at worst have tested the keeper.

not every good striker is prolific. Doyle brings a lot to Wolves and a lot to Ireland. Given the right service he has shown he can score at the top levels (European football obviously excepted). He just doesnt get that service with Wolves or Ireland. He still brings a lot to both teams and he deserves credit for that. I think hes a smashing player, never giving less than 100%. A player that we should be proud of.

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Originally Posted by elroy

I think Wolves may yet stay up. I fancy them to beat Burnley away in their next game. Pompey and Burnley are gone its a case of who will follow. I suspect if Wolves/Hull went down, the impact Doyle and Hunt have had in the EPL this year will enough to secure a move back to an EPL club.

Doyle doesnt score as many goals as he should, his finishing is not quite as high as you would expect. He is more of a creator than finisher, he set up a chance in the first half making a good run from the half way line, played the ball to the left and the ball was returned to him at the edge of the box. He has a decent bit of time and although got off an effort, didnt hit the target. A top finisher would at worst have tested the keeper.

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It was a poor ball played back to him, to be fair. He's on immense form at the moment - needs a partner up front instead of being isolated the way he is.

Alot of people go on about Doyle not scoring enough goals or not being a prolific goalscorer but he has scored 30% of Wolves' premier league goals so far this season. Rooney has scored c. 34% of United's premier league goals so it can be argued that it's all relative to the amount of chances a team are creating and how many goals as a team they are putting away. If he was playing for a bigger team, I'm sure he would have scored a hell of a lot more so far this season!!!

Doyle is a good player but he needs to move to a bigger club, Maybe Villa or Everton is the best he can hope for right now.

the 7th and 9th ranked teams in the country

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Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

the 7th and 9th ranked teams in the country

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as I said...

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Originally Posted by yapster

Doyle is a good player but he needs to move to a bigger club, Maybe Villa or Everton is the best he can hope for right now.

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Villa and Everton both have better options upfront, I'm afraid a yo-yo club is probably Doyles level now, he is a good player no question but too slow to be at an ambitious club. Back in the day he could have been at a top club but everyone wants strikers with pace now.
From an Irish point of view I think we have to hope Stokes gets the idiocy he has displayed out of his system in Scotland then come back and have another more successful crack at the EPL. That, and that Terry Dixon gets back to something close to the player he was going to be, cos there is not a lot of quality up front for us after Keane and DOyle.

I know as Irish supporters we are supposed to be over-critical of our players, but it is truly bizarre that anybody believes Doyle lacks pace.

It's like saying Richard Dunne lacks muscle or Steven Gerrard lacks a milk carton-shaped head.

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Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin

I know as Irish supporters we are supposed to be over-critical of our players, but it is truly bizarre that anybody believes Doyle lacks pace.

It's like saying Richard Dunne lacks muscle or Steven Gerrard lacks a milk carton-shaped head.

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Why is it bizarre? The guy is clearly faster than most mere mortals thats why hes a pro and we are on here. I'm not saying he is lame, I am saying he does not have the pace of most of the strikers at the higher end of the spectrum. Saha, Young, Agbonlahor, Donavan, Yakabu all have more pace than Doyle and they are just some of the strikers at the 2 clubs mentioned that he should move to. Even the kids coming through at those clubs have pace to burn Baxter, Delfouneso and Vaughan are all quicker than him and all can score goals too. Go further up and you have the likes of Defoe, Torres, Van Persie, Drogba, Tevez, Bellamy, Adebayor, Rooney, the list goes on, all have pace to burn there is little hope that Doyle (as good as he is, I am a fan remember) could compete with players like that. Before you mention the slower players at the bigger clubs, I do acknowledge there are slower players but they are, for the most part, different types of player - Crouch, Berbatov, Heskey etc.

I think you're dreaming with some of those comparisons. Doyle is just as quick as half of those. He's no Torres, but... who is?

And you say the slower players are different types of players, but what on earth do Defoe and Torres have in common? There are loads of different types of striker, and few of them rely on blistering, Agbonlahor-type pace.

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Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin

I think you're dreaming with some of those comparisons. Doyle is just as quick as half of those. He's no Torres, but... who is?

And you say the slower players are different types of players, but what on earth do Defoe and Torres have in common? There are loads of different types of striker, and few of them rely on blistering, Agbonlahor-type pace.

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You are losing me CD - Torres and Defore for starters have plenty in common, both are very skillful, great close control, quick (both of mind and of foot) and can make a goal out of nothing - not to mention their finishing ability. Doyle as quick as Saha? Agbonlahor? Young? or Yakabu? have you seen Baxter play? or Vaughan? all would leave Doyle in their wake. Fair enough they don't rely on their pace but they have it plus all the other skills required to be a striker, Doyle has all the skills but lacks the pace unfortunately. The fact they dont rely on their pace is what makes them good players same as the fact Doyle can cut it in the Premiership with less pace makes him such a good player. If he had their pace he would be at Chelsea.

Doyle outstripped Evra (I think) at the weekend when running from the right side of midfield to release Jarvis (who really should have shot first time instead of passing)
Evra is no slouch either.

It'd be interesting to see that measured. I've lost track of the number of players over whose pace I've seen arguments. Part of it is down to players' acceleration - some players are lightning fast over the first five yards, others have a short burst of pace to get free of a defender, still others are uncatchable if only they can get ten yards to get up to speed. Nearly as important as that is how fast they are with a ball at their feet - there are players who are very quick off the ball but can't control a ball well at pace. Anyone know of a stats site which takes a punt at players' pace from game footage? I'm sure an interested stato with a background in video processing could get an enormous amount of data on it.

have a look at football manager thay have speed stats for all the players so would give you a pretty decent indication i guess..