Hull City owners to take majority stake in Dundalk?

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Originally Posted by Kiki Balboa

some people are just delighted to have them gone.

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Nobody's delighted to see Dundalk in big trouble. But it was inevitable given the way they've been run the last few years. Even this year - €20k/week on wages. Ridiculous stuff. Blatant financial mismanagement that (a) impacts the rest of the league and (b) is basic stuff that should have been learned 20 years ago, in the aftermath of Shels/Bohs/Cork/Derry/Rovers/Dublin City, etc, etc.

But no - instead, despite numerous people predicting this in the past few years, Dundalk have gone full speed ahead into the wall, to bring further disrepute on the league. People get a bit ****ed off about it. And as redobit has said, Dundalk fans even now seem ill-equipped to react (unlike, in fairness to them, fans at the likes of Rovers and Cork, who had something set up - which is bloody hard, to be clear)

You say at the end "I guess that is lessons learnt" - but the frustration is that is seems there's been no lessons learned at all.

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Originally Posted by joey B

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soc...medium=twitter

Your answer is there,they didn’t even bother checking due to a “loophole “,another episode from the FAI of the laughing stock genre……

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Even with this farcical 'loophole' it still doesn't clear up that 10 months after Dundalk's Premier Division license was awarded the club is on the verge of going out of business based on the same financial accounts and budget submitted for this season by the STATSports regime?

We know STATSports did not put one cent of their own money into the club so after Dundalk losing 500k in 2022 and losing a further whopping 1.2m in 2023 how on earth were Dundalk awarded a Premier Division license for 2024 based on these rotten financials and Dundalk submitting an identical budget for the 2024 season without any additional source of income or financial injections?

The setup on the FAI's licensing system is exposed now that any financial due diligence on new owners is conducted by the previous owners. STATSports who were burning through cash could not have believed their luck the FAI awarded Dundalk a Premier Division license on November 22nd 2023 on rotten financials and fantasy spending projections and they instantly flipped the club to Ainscough with the sale completed a week later knowing Ainscough had empty pockets

Full investigation and audit is required into FAI licensing, STATSports and Brian Ainscough

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Originally Posted by total hoofball

Even with this farcical 'loophole' it still doesn't clear up that 10 months after Dundalk's Premier Division license was awarded the club is on the verge of going out of business based on the same financial accounts and budget submitted for this season by the STATSports regime?

We know STATSports did not put one cent of their own money into the club so after Dundalk losing 500k in 2022 and losing a further whopping 1.2m in 2023 how on earth were Dundalk awarded a Premier Division license for 2024 based on these rotten financials and Dundalk submitting an identical budget for the 2024 season without any additional source of income or financial injections?

The setup on the FAI's licensing system is exposed now that any financial due diligence on new owners is conducted by the previous owners. STATSports who were burning through cash could not have believed their luck the FAI awarded Dundalk a Premier Division license on November 15th 2023 on rotten financials and fantasy spending projections and they instantly flipped the club to Ainscough with the sale completed less than 2 weeks later knowing Ainscough had empty pockets

Full investigation and audit is required into FAI licensing, STATSports and Brian Ainscough

https://www.leagueofireland.ie/news/...ion-confirmed/

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That link is for the 2020 season

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Nobody's delighted to see Dundalk in big trouble. But it was inevitable given the way they've been run the last few years. Even this year - €20k/week on wages. Ridiculous stuff. Blatant financial mismanagement that (a) impacts the rest of the league and (b) is basic stuff that should have been learned 20 years ago, in the aftermath of Shels/Bohs/Cork/Derry/Rovers/Dublin City, etc, etc.

But no - instead, despite numerous people predicting this in the past few years, Dundalk have gone full speed ahead into the wall, to bring further disrepute on the league. People get a bit ****ed off about it. And as redobit has said, Dundalk fans even now seem ill-equipped to react (unlike, in fairness to them, fans at the likes of Rovers and Cork, who had something set up - which is bloody hard, to be clear)

You say at the end "I guess that is lessons learnt" - but the frustration is that is seems there's been no lessons learned at all.

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'Lessons learned' was in reference to not being personally aware of the hardship other supporters have went through in the League - not about football administration.

Anyways... You are complaining about Dundalk fans... I guess you are going to start complaining about Pats and Derry for inflating wages and being relient on a Billionare owner? Surely there fan bases should be organising too? Or is your ire just for Dundalk?

The 1903 has already been established and has raised 20k in a week to keep the show on the road. In a way, the crisis is happening so fast - and to say there is no fan organising is just weird - there are , but it was bypassed.

Anyways, I leave the website here.

Nobody knows anyone else's time and effort into the sport at the different levels - and at times like this , it all feels like it was for nothing.

It's an emotional time - and seeing people put the boot into something that I personally do love, will only wind myself up.

Just listening to LMFM, Sinn Fein TD Ruairí Ó Murchú seemed to suggest a phoenix club won't be straight forward. I think we can write off next year at the very least

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

You say at the end "I guess that is lessons learnt" - but the frustration is that is seems there's been no lessons learned at all.

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I know it is hard for you - but please read the post before you jump on your high horse to quote it.

Honestly, you pollute the place by looking for arguments that were not made.

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Nobody's delighted to see Dundalk in big trouble. But it was inevitable given the way they've been run the last few years. Even this year - €20k/week on wages. Ridiculous stuff. Blatant financial mismanagement that (a) impacts the rest of the league and (b) is basic stuff that should have been learned 20 years ago, in the aftermath of Shels/Bohs/Cork/Derry/Rovers/Dublin City, etc, etc.

But no - instead, despite numerous people predicting this in the past few years, Dundalk have gone full speed ahead into the wall, to bring further disrepute on the league. People get a bit ****ed off about it. And as redobit has said, Dundalk fans even now seem ill-equipped to react (unlike, in fairness to them, fans at the likes of Rovers and Cork, who had something set up - which is bloody hard, to be clear)

You say at the end "I guess that is lessons learnt" - but the frustration is that is seems there's been no lessons learned at all.

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This is key and why many people have little sympathy for Dundalk. By the time Rovers went into Examinership, the 400 Club had raised enough cash to see the club through the process. In fact it was the fans who pushed for Examinership and crucially had a plan as well as money.

In contrast Dundalk fans have done sweet FA to save their club despite warnings from all and sundry.

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Originally Posted by Kiki Balboa

Anyways... You are complaining about Dundalk fans... I guess you are going to start complaining about Pats and Derry for inflating wages and being relient on a Billionare owner? Surely there fan bases should be organising too? Or is your ire just for Dundalk?

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Do you not think there's a difference between someone putting money into a club and not putting money into a club? Because the latter is what was happening at Dundalk for ages.

Pat's and Derry are big enough clubs to have supporters' groups anyway (and probably do?)

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Originally Posted by joey B

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soc...medium=twitter

Your answer is there,they didn’t even bother checking due to a “loophole “,another episode from the FAI of the laughing stock genre……

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That’s an absolute disgrace from the FAI.

The absolute cheek to utter this comment also when they literally did not check a new owner at a club which appears to be resulting in the death of the second most successful club in the country

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There are a range of other leagues across the contingent that don’t have the same rigour when it comes to the transfer of a club.

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Do you not think there's a difference between someone putting money into a club and not putting money into a club? Because the latter is what was happening at Dundalk for ages.

Pat's and Derry are big enough clubs to have supporters' groups anyway (and probably do?)

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Correct, Pats have the Patron Saints which has around 200 members donating monthly into a fund that is controlled by supporters that are voted in, decisions on spends are also voted on by members. The stand behind the goal had to be taken down in 2013, with the deteriorating wooden boards replaced with metal ones, the cost of that stand was paid for by the Patron Saints, hence the name ‘the Patrons stand’. Other more recent projects include renovating the home dressing room last year among many other things. There’s also money kept aside for a doomsday situation like the one that’s happening in Dundalk at the minute

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Originally Posted by 2 Year Contract

Correct, Pats have the Patron Saints which has around 200 members donating monthly into a fund that is controlled by supporters that are voted in, decisions on spends are also voted on by members. The stand behind the goal had to be taken down in 2013, with the deteriorating wooden boards replaced with metal ones, the cost of that stand was paid for by the Patron Saints, hence the name ‘the Patrons stand’. Other more recent projects include renovating the home dressing room last year among many other things. There’s also money kept aside for a doomsday situation like the one that’s happening in Dundalk at the minute

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Id never consider us a club that could sustain a fan owned model. The Patrons is great but it’s going over a decade and the number of members has stayed relatively low. It’s a fantastic scheme to help the club out but that’s where it ends.

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Originally Posted by Kiki Balboa

Plenty of people delighted Dundalk is gone.

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Think the vast, vast majority of LOI fans will be extremely disappointed

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Do you not think there's a difference between someone putting money into a club and not putting money into a club? Because the latter is what was happening at Dundalk for ages.

Pat's and Derry are big enough clubs to have supporters' groups anyway (and probably do?)

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Derry don't really, though you could argue the club was essentially saved by a small group of fans. There was a supporters trust setup in 2009 to take over things, but a group of wealthy fans ended up doing that anyway. One of them then became very wealthy indeed. The supporters trust fizzled out after that.
I don't think it's really the same situation as an outside investor running the show, like Dundalk. There's also money being spent on the likes of the new stand, the academy and all.
In saying that, there is a lot of work needed to be done off the field if we're to get to a point where we're balancing the books without relying on donations or European money.

Knowing what this situation is like, I wouldn't wish it on any club. At the same time, there's a significant cohort of Dundalk fans who were absolutely obnoxious over the years, lads with short memories who forgot 2012 and loved the "you let your club die" ****e.

While I don't want to see Dundalk go to the wall, I can't help but have a bit of schadenfreude thinking of those types.

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Originally Posted by D24Saint

Id never consider us a club that could sustain a fan owned model. The Patrons is great but it’s going over a decade and the number of members has stayed relatively low. It’s a fantastic scheme to help the club out but that’s where it ends.

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Id agree with you in its current guise. But then again if people feel the club is already doing fine without them putting money into a fund then they’re unlikely to do so. If it ever came to the fans having to run the club I think you’d have a lot more people putting the hand in the pocket. Not that I can see that happening any time soon. IMO if Kelleher is to leave in the future, it’ll be sold to another private investor rather than fan ownership stuff

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Originally Posted by D24Saint

Id never consider us a club that could sustain a fan owned model. The Patrons is great but it’s going over a decade and the number of members has stayed relatively low. It’s a fantastic scheme to help the club out but that’s where it ends.

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If we do move away from being fan owned, I'd like to see something like this in place

I'm of the opinion that Kelliher at Pats, Doherty at Derry,and even Wilson at Rovers invested on the basis of wanting nothing in return for their investment, although maybe that's naivety on my part- dundalk appear( from the outside anyway) to have been the target of a number of snakeoil salesmen looking for a quick buck - Shels also were in danger of these kinds of people with the Turks but maybe that's resolved now?

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Originally Posted by thebronze14

Think the vast, vast majority of LOI fans will be extremely disappointed

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Rivalry has its limits. Disliking a club and moaning about them doesn’t mean you want to see them out of existence.

I don't think any genuine LOI fan would want Dundalk to be in the current situation and hopefully they pull out of it. It's bad for the league and if they do under now it will have negative affects on other clubs too affecting the league table and loss of gate receipts for example.
Being critical of how the club was run in last few years is fair comment though.

A number of years back myself and Ezekiel met up before games with a view to putting a fan group together for that rainy day time (he then had bigger things to deal with, ironically as do i currently). One of the things noted was how complacent fans had become and that the way the Trust was absorbed in to the club left a gap that needed to be filled. The people who formed the Trust were exceptional and this collapse would have happened to the club without them years ago so it is understanible why they became part of the club admin (I dout finances mind), they were a steadying hand during the successful periods and indeed stepped down during mad bills time as he was uncontrollable in every way. The lack of a subsequent Trust is in many ways due to the cream of those most dedicated fans not being there to drive thing on as they had. Too many others were all talk and no action, to the extent that contributing financially was a way not to give time and effort. The 1903 was formed but in its early days nearly ate itself from the inside out, I think there was a woman only supporters group formed out of disillusioned officers of the original supporters group.

So yes there should have been a contingency. Yes fans have some blame in this on level but this level only. We had no say in how the club was run or who it was sold to, we had to take things in good faith that previous owners and the FAI had due diligence done. Ive made no secret of how self proclaimed best fans in the league at Dundalk had me rolling eyes, I ve also done the careful what you wish for stuff. No fan deserves their club to go out of business and any gloating by other fans is ultimately ironic in LoI.

I do wonder where the likes of EYG was with his foresight in warning us about the charlatan that is BA - a chap that I originally thought tha he might be the person to sort out the off field issues, break cliques etc. My opinion on P6 differed for this very reason, they walked because it was demanded and imo if we had had more patience and waited out Bills days I dont think this would be happening now. I could have taken relegation if it was needed in a 2 steps back 3 forward way. If the club folds I wont be following a phoenix club as that wont be my club any longer! Id go to games but there wont be the gut wrenching or euphoric moments and emotional attachment.

In advance of results being expunged and Derry win the league, Rovers and Sligo qualify for Europe I will say you are welcome. To Waterford apologies, its like a play-off result without the play-off......