by all means give him a chance but playing at international level is a whole different world to playing the likes of colchester in the championshipQuote:
Originally Posted by FarBeag
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by all means give him a chance but playing at international level is a whole different world to playing the likes of colchester in the championshipQuote:
Originally Posted by FarBeag
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrne
Yes i know but its not a position i feel comfortable with KK or JOS in. Give the chap a fair chance and if he fails so be it. We can go looking for another left back somewhere else as we have an abundance of them knocking on our door.
Then what's the point of calling up any Championship players?Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrne
Wes Hoolahan,Liam Lawrence and Paddy Kenny should be in the squad.Jay Tabb should be given a chance,a very exciting player
Have to say i agree with that entire list with the exceptions of and Kavanagh, Treacy and O'DonovanQuote:
Originally Posted by Ciaran
Quote:
Originally Posted by backtowalsall
Let’s make the list a bit smaller then. Liam Miller (can’t make a struggling Sunderland team) Steven Quinn (in and out of a Struggling Sheff utd team) Darren Gibson who I rate by the way can’t make a struggling Wolves team same as Darren Potter.Daryl Murphy is a makeshift mid-field player because Keane sees him having a good attitude.So i guess this moves Tabb and Rowlands quite away up that list.
I agree totally with the general jist of Far Beag's original post. Obviously you can't populate the whole squad with championship players but I think Stan totally overdid it with his "building for the future" pretensions. Plenty of those listed have done a lot more at club level than some of those capped by Stan and given game time in crucial games.
By the way I think Jay Tabb is a lovely footballer, very skillful. Unfortunately he's even more of a midget than the rest of our midgets. Given the chance I personally think he could be as effective at a mid-ranking club as David Bentley who has got a lot of accolades this season.
side issue but a fair few of the websites have nationality: English for some of these younger players....
L Lawrence on the Stoke website, Jayy Tabb on Soccer Base.....
Both were born in England but have been called up to either U21 or senior squads.
Actually you gave it a pretty good bash. I did not think you meant it quite as literally as many intended.
I do think Tabb is worth a look. Stan was unbelievable in ignoring Lawrence.
Its hard to think anything Stan did was unbelievable at this pointQuote:
Originally Posted by Paddy Garcia
I wonder was Tardelli, Trapp or Brady watchin Sunderland reserves play ManUtd last night - there were three Irish on show - Harte, Mc Shane and Miller. It was quite embarrassing as not one of them played well`(well maybe Mc Shane played ok?). To think they are all recognised Ireland caps is sad to say the least.
The Saint has played at CB, RB and Midfield for Preston this season, yes Preston aren't doing too well this season.Quote:
Originally Posted by paul_oshea
St Ledger has been playing well and the rumours are that Everton has asked to be kept informed of any bids for him.
I think if we don't get this lad tied to us we could lose him as he is eligible for England and NI too as he has yet to be capped for us.
Given the chance (no pun intended) St Ledger would do well under the coaching of Trapp as St Ledger's game is based on bringing to ball out from the back, is very comfortable on the ball, has pace, reads the game well and is good in the air and on the deck.
Has to be worth a shout! so what players do you think will be in the squad for the training camp in Portugal
Did you watch it?Quote:
Originally Posted by BigmanCas
Yip - as did Roy Keane, he was in the small crowd. It was on ManUtd TV. No players of note playing except the Irish lads. Sunderland got a penalty in the last minute for a deliberate hand ball and Harte put it away to win the game 1-0. It sent shudders up my spine when I seen him step up to take it!! Spain - WC 2002 all over again. Trapp will have to plan without these three on last nights' performance.Quote:
Originally Posted by eirebhoy
I lie - I suppose Carlos Edwards made his return for Sunderland - Good player.
Roy O'Donovan played too , he is also IrishQuote:
Originally Posted by BigmanCas
Yip - augers well.Quote:
Originally Posted by gustavo
And yet you will still find a fair few Ian Harte supporters on here despite the fact that 6 years ago in Korea he was a liability defensively (lacking pace and positional sense) and I don't think he has improved since.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigmanCas
http://foot.ie/showthread.php?t=870
can a player come back onto the pitch to take a penalty? my memory is that harte had gone off by the time we won that second pen :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by BigmanCas
You are correct - he was taken off in the 82 min and replaced with David Connolly (my god!!!!). Forgive me - I had convinced myself down through the years that Robbie demanded the ball from Harte. There you go - he had to hit it so. ah well - I always used that situation to portray Keane's lionheart - it didn't happen. Thanks for pointing that out JB.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrne
no problem!
to be honest i dont ever think that anyone said that harte was the real deal but after irwins premature retiremant we didnt have a whole lot of choice. given our recent qualifying disasters i would be reluctant to give anyone who helped us qualify with that team a hard time. also, it is a well known fact that harte played through a lot of pain in that world cup. had injections that effectively numbed his foot to allow him play through the pain.... cant fault a man for effort and committment!
Connolly had been performing well in training during the World Cup, I remember telling my brother Connolly had come on, and he said "good, he's been banging them in in training"Quote:
Originally Posted by BigmanCas
Quote:
Originally Posted by OwlsFan
You still love Jason McAteer despite the fact he was crap many times for us, all because he scored the goal against Holland. Sure Harte has scored vital goals before maybe not as dramatic as that. To me Harte an McAteer are on the same level
ya they are both crap.
NO in fairness mcateer had some decent games for us. At least he never DIRECTLY caused goals for us....harte running backwards looking in front of us used always get in trouble.
Not quite true. The point I've been trying to make across various threads is that, as an example, Liam lawrence would have been a better choice at RHM than Andy Keogh against Germany. I'm all for giving promising kids a chance, though I think we shouldn't be unnecessarily diminishing our U21 team, but a Championship right sided midfielder is surely better than a Championnship forward at right midfield.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ciaran
Furthermore, I'd always go with the better player, not the player at the club in the higher division. There are championship players more than capable of playing well in a good international team, it's a question of looking at them on merit and judging on how they'd fare in a team dynamic. As said before, you don't want to populate the whole squad with Championship players but some Championship players are among our best 23 so if they're good enough, pick them.
Also, you can't say that to be good enough for Ireland means you're good enough for a top league team. If A causes B, it doesn't also mean that B causes A. Simple logical error!
Yeah when Beenhakker took over at Poland he picked players on merit and awful lot of the players he picked where from the Polish league, rather than players playing abroad etc. They qualified top of their group in some style due to the fact that they had a great team ethic.
I agree completelyQuote:
Originally Posted by Ciaran
There is a case for taking a punt on a young player and calling him up. But not in every squad, and certainly not 3 or 4 of them.
If we are to do that we should be doing it in positions where we are weak (I don't think midfield could be described as such given the earlier list).
The classic example of this working is Johnny Evans for the north. He hadn't made his full league debut when he was called up, but was thrown in at the deep end and on the back of his international performances his career has flourished. Without that chance at international level i would suggest he would not be in the Premier League right now.
The positions we are undoubtably weakest in right now are at full back, left back particularly. So rather than calling up untried midfielders, would it not be better to call up an untried left back and see how he gets on??
Stephen O'Halloran would have fitted the bill perfectly, and once fit I would love to see him get his chance.
Actually, what you're saying is that you agree with me, and disagree with Ciaran:) Pick the players on their merit, not on where their club is in the league table.Quote:
Originally Posted by backtowalsall
Also, you don't think our midfield is weak? I'll put this to you: when was the last time you were happy with the performance of our midfield pairing? Off the top of my head I'd say Keane & Kilbane in Paris in October '04 (I think). We've been shyte in central midfield in almost every competitive game since, and most of the friendlies.
it means that Not B OR A is always true! ah predicate logic....Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
Thought Potter and Kilbane were decent against Ecuador. Not world beating, but solid.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
Potter & Reid in Denmark were decent, and Gibson did well too when he came on. That's why I added the rider though! I thought it's been obvious for ages that we're lacking a properly competive central midfield. If CM is holding its own then our lack of cover at CB isn't as exposed etc. etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tetsujin1979
nevermind!
What Ciaran wrote was
'If Carsley, Ireland, S.Reid, Andy Reid or whoever is playing better then they (the rawer talent) DON'T deserve a place in the squad and that's the case'
That statement doesn't need much correction, it's basically saying pick your best players.
decent midfield performances
Carsley & Reid v Germany
Carsley & Reid & the Monaghan lad V Czech Rep.
Joey O'Brien MOTM 2night for Bolton Wanderers in Europe. Hes only about 21, Ireland's best prospect along with Long.
Where was he playing? RB or CMF?Quote:
Originally Posted by finnpark
CMFQuote:
Originally Posted by Irish_Praha
Hes really come on this season. The last time he played for Ireland he was just back from injury and was really rusty. Hes getting better with every game.
i watched, thought he was good, but i dont think i would go to far as to say he was the best. They all did well, nothing spectacular.
the thing is they probably could have won it had they sent out their best side....
Statements of the obvious don't need much correction. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
But you've done Ciaran a favour there; he was coming out with some awful silly stuff. (For one thing he equated being deserving of a squad place with what league a player plays in.) Anyway, the important point is that we've max 15 players who are genuine Premiership players, so the next ten in line are either struggling in the Premiership or showing well in the Championship.
But we shouldn't be infatuated with what league someone plays in. Be realistic: Talent is talent, and is obvious. Necessity is necessity, and forces your arm. Garvan might be in with a shout as he looks like a natural. Delaney or Ledger might be in with a shout because of necessity. We just have to accept that after our top bunch there isn't much difference between the rest so just sit back, relax and wait for Trap to weave his magic. Nah, screw that, Rowlands for Ireland!
Kerr and Macari thought he was Bolton's best player too. They showed 5 or 6 clips of him winning possession. They say he put in tremendous effort.
Well said that man.Quote:
Originally Posted by kingdom hoop
Correct on those CM performances Geysir, but it's pretty sad when you can count good midfield performances in the last few years on the fingers of one hand.