2day FM + Bertie

I think there are two separate issues here.

First, Bertie, as a citizen, is entitled to support whoever he wants. And he's just as open to criticism for that choice as anybody else is. As a citizen, I'd much rather he supported his local side or closest eL side rather than a foreign team, just like I'd rather everybody did.

Secondly, a Taoiseach is aware that basically everything he says and does will be scrutinised. That comes with the territory of being Taoiseach. The eL, like it or not (and some posting here clearly don't), is the national league, and has been for many, many years. It is a part of our history, our culture, our tradition, and our identity. And these are things that a Taoiseach should be trying to promote, not ignore.

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Originally Posted by jbyrne

well, if its confined to the eircom lge section only from now on that would be a godsend

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This is an Eircom League site , well I thought it was anyway .

Who cares really? His job is to lead the country and whatever he does in his own time (providing it's legal) doesn't bother me. It makes no difference whatsoever to me whether it's him I hear on the radio or some other joker spoofing on about how great "we" are getting on in the Premier League this season.

As far as I'm concerned they're both brainwashed spoofers who have managed to convince themselves and be convinced by the media that they are cheering on "their club." I say fair play to them. I hope you have a good time supporting "your" club.

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Originally Posted by Ciaran

And players from England's third tier can stumble in here and be the league's best player.

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What are the names of these players?

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Originally Posted by Ciaran

Michael Keane. Colin Healy, Joseph Ndo, Neale Fenn, heck Mansaram doesn't even have that honor. He was in the 5th tier and was probably bohs best player this year. ¬_¬

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Colin Healy hardly stumbled in from the third division. He played for Celtic and won caps for Ireland and may be a regular now if injuries hadn't ruined him. Neale Fenn played for Tottenham at one point and Joseph Ndo got caps for Cameroon. These are hardly s**ty 3rd division calibre players. What about Kevin Doyle "stumbling in" to the English Premier League and being one of the top goalscorers?

What English team did Ndo play for? Colin Healy almost went to a World Cup and has played Champions League and when, oh when, was Mansaram one of the League's best payers?

By yor earning support theory, if we were all around in the 70s, you'd support England beacuse of their greater pedigree and Ireland's inability to compete with the World's best?

And given your loyalty to Bayern Munich, if they went into a Forest-style freefall, you would obviously find a better team, more worthy of your support?

The LOI not being worthy yet, but you're happy enough to allow others to put in the hard work to make it a success by which time you'll gladly jump on the band wagon?

Or have i picked you up wrong?

Actually, I'm glad Bertie doesn't support a LoI team; I'd hate it if he had a saving grace.

I agree, in theory, with the idea that we as Irish men/women should be supporting a local team. However, the way you would usually begin to support a local team ie by going along with your pals, father, grandfather etc., has not been the case for a large majority of people in this country. I began supporting Spurs in 1986 when my da brought me along to my first game whilst over visiting my gran for Christmas in London. I have supported them ever since though for me the love of the national team supercedes this.

When Rovers played for a while in the RDS, on my bus route, I went along for a bit with the brother, but I never developed an affinity with the club nor the LOI. I do respect fans of the LOI and I have been glad of late to see the progress being made both in the calibre of player on show and the end 'product'. I don't subscribe to the notion that you have to attend LOI football regularly to fully understand the game and feel that the attitude towards 'barstoolers' is counter-productive.

Live and let live I say, and I hope the domestic game continues to thrive. Those pointing to the youth support are correct as they are fans of the future. As any football fan knows, you can't change your club once your hooked.

Well, most people anyway.

I must admit I used to support Man Utd when I was younger. At some stage I realised I was'nt from Manchester so I stopped supporting them. Im from Kerry where there is no team in the LOI so I just follow the league. This thing about supporting the nearest team does'nt wash. A kerryman is hardly going to support a cork team (although i did last suday in the RDS).

I recently moved to south dublin so I was thinking of following Shamrock Rovers next season and going to a few of their games. Not so sure now as they are'nt playing their home games on this side of the city.

Anyway as regards Bertie ahern he is entitled to do what he wants in his spare time and support who he wants but as leader of the country he should be a role model and supporting foreign teams is not the model i want to see!

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Originally Posted by Ciaran

Michael Keane. Colin Healy, Joseph Ndo, Neale Fenn, heck Mansaram doesn't even have that honor. He was in the 5th tier and was probably bohs best player this year. ¬_¬

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None of them are league best players.

You can look at the other way. How bad are English clubs that they release potential which is then matured within the league. I could mention a certain Kevin Doyle but sure after training for a few weeks with a real club he was transformed.

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Originally Posted by Ciaran

I support the way it is now and probably won't always. Compare it to music, Timbaland is big at the moment. If I'm a big Timbaland fan and suddenly he goes down in a couple of years and I replace him with Kanye West, does that make me a glory hunter for not sticking with the same guy through thick and thin?

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Are you serious? You claim you support Bayern but yet say you probably won't always support them. This is hilarious, what sort of fan are you? Support them for now and then feck off in a few years:D.

btw, how exactly do you support them? Jersies? Season ticket? Have you ever been over to a game even? How many times? or do you support them by watching them on telly or just looking up the result online like most football "supporters" in this country?

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Originally Posted by Ciaran

You're obliged to support your country as it represents the land you live in.

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I hope not. I live in England. :D

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Originally Posted by Ciaran

No offence, but what age are most people around here?

I'm a soccer fan first, patriot second. I don't know what you're problem is, I support the team that I believe play the most attractive game and why shouldn't I?
And yes it is "glory hunting", now pray do tell what's wrong with that? I'm not from Munich, I don't have any loyalties to the club or their players, I support the way it is now and probably won't always. Compare it to music, Timbaland is big at the moment. If I'm a big Timbaland fan and suddenly he goes down in a couple of years and I replace him with Kanye West, does that make me a glory hunter for not sticking with the same guy through thick and thin? -_-
The whole one club support is such an old fashioned notion.

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You're not a fan, regardless of whether you describe yourself as one.

You're a consumer.

As long as you accept that then there's no problem with your views. Just don't expect to get any respect or validation in places like this for them.

You're posting in a forum where most members would view "dropping their team" in a similar way to dropping their family, eg unthinkable.

Unfortunately you just don't get what supporting a football team is all about and I pity you for that. You're missing out bigtime.

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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

You're not a fan, regardless of whether you describe yourself as one.

You're a consumer.

As long as you accept that then there's no problem with your views. Just don't expect to get any respect or validation in places like this for them.

You're posting in a forum where most members would view "dropping their team" in a similar way to dropping their family, eg unthinkable.

Unfortunately you just don't get what supporting a football team is all about and I pity you for that. You're missing out bigtime.

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Supporting a football team can mean many things to many people. Who put you in charge of telling everyone how to live their lives?

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Originally Posted by Ciaran

Well like I said that view of supporting a team is old fashioned. A team to me is a collection of players. In 10 years time the team you support will have a whole new set of players. So what exactly are you supporting? It isn't the players, it's just some romantic image of the club's flag and what they stand for. :rolleyes:

It's silly and dated.

And I've been to the Allianz Arena 3 times, the San Siro twice. Ironically I've never been to an Eircom League game. >_>

Sorry if that sucks to you but thats what young people are doing, on an average day I'll see people wearing Barca, Ac Milan, Brazil, Argentina and whatnot shirts. I don't think I've ever seen anyone wearing a Cork City shirt, heck you don't even see people wearing EPL shirts anymore.
We're Irish, we're the best so why shouldn't we support the best sports teams even if they're not our own. ^_^

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Ok Bertie.....

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Originally Posted by Ciaran

So what exactly are you supporting? It isn't the players, it's just some romantic image of the club's flag and what they stand for

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If you'd seen the Longford Town players graft towards the end of the season you'd revise that opinion. But go on, dismiss me cos it's 'only' Longford Town. You wouldn't be the first.

If I was supporting players, I'd have spent a lot of time last season watching our alumni at Shamrock Rovers or Drogheda — both contenders. But I didn't, cos I support Longford Town.

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Originally Posted by DaveyCakes

Supporting a football team can mean many things to many people. Who put you in charge of telling everyone how to live their lives?

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I just gave my view on what I understand the term supporter to mean, which last time I checked was my prerogative.

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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

I just gave my view on what I understand the term supporter to mean, which last time I checked was my prerogative.

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You weren't giving your opinion, you were lecturing....

..and "Unfortunately you just don't get what supporting a football team is all about and I pity you for that"

...you condescending %^$£!

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Originally Posted by Ciaran

Well like I said that view of supporting a team is old fashioned. A team to me is a collection of players. In 10 years time the team you support will have a whole new set of players. So what exactly are you supporting? It isn't the players, it's just some romantic image of the club's flag and what they stand for. :rolleyes:

It's silly and dated.

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You could say the same thing for the national team, why do you support them? The players change, the managers change, and the team goes uphill and downhill once in a while. Are you supporting a romantic image of the flag and what it stands for?

Given your desire to support the best, why don't you support Brazil/Argentina/Italy? In fact Italy is best, you'll be able to see them live in Ireland in the near future.

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Originally Posted by Ciaran

I'm a soccer fan first, patriot second. I don't know what you're problem is, I support the team that I believe play the most attractive game and why shouldn't I?

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Because it doesn't make any sense.

You support the Irish team because you are Irish right? You feel an allegiance to the team that represents the same country you do, right?

I feel the same about the national team. But I also feel the same about Limerick. The national allegiance I feel to the Irish team is reflected in the regional allegiance I feel with the Limerick team.

Why is it that you have allegiance on one level, but so no reason for allegiance on another level? Allegiances exist on every level, from club allegiance in the county league, club allegiance in the national league, to national allegiance on the international level. Why do you only adhere to one kind?

If you are satisfied with just choosing the very best club to support, regardless of the fact that you have no allegiance to them, even though these allegiances exist, why not do it at a national level?

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Originally Posted by DaveyCakes

You weren't giving your opinion, you were lecturing....

..and "Unfortunately you just don't get what supporting a football team is all about and I pity you for that"

...you condescending %^$£!

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ooooh.......touch a raw nerve there did I?:eek::rolleyes:

Come out with posts like he has on a football SUPPORTERS forum and you're going to get ridiculed.

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Originally Posted by shanman2

Bertie Ahern can support who ever he wants to. Fair play to him for voicing his opinion. I support FC Barcelona I travel over at least 6-7 times a year with the possy I live in clare I cant stand the Eircom League and the fans. If your looking for a reason why people won't follow the LOI then you have it. ITS YOUR KIND! Get over yourself.

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Shaman

You're missing the entire point.
If I can give a GAA analogy, you don't see fans here worshipping the Australian Rules Football League cause it's professional and because they always beat us at the Compromise Rules do you?
You don't see Clare people supporting Kilkenny cause they win the Liam Mc Carthy Cup more often do you? Or supporting Kerry instead of Clare because they win more Munster titles and All -Ireland? No you don't and that is the way things should be. A lot of foreign soccer supporters here are bandwaggoners and Gloryhunters. The fact that you support Barcelona rather than the English Premier League is the lesser of two evils. So some credit to you for taste !

People who feel as you do, about the League, are now in the media controlling the level of coverage. The Irish Times is full of stuff sent in by wire from The Guardian. If I want to read the Guardian I'll buy the bloody thing. For one thing it's cheaper than the friggin' Irish Times.

The domestic League gets pi** poor coverage in it's own printed press. Incidentally we are the only League in Europe where this is the case. You don't see the English media full of Spanish football where English football is squeezed into a few column inches whenever the paper concerned can be arsed to cover it. We are under siege in this League from the cross channel product and as I said earlier the printed media has done the League no favours.

I have been to countries in Central and Eastern Europe where the domestic League games are poorly attended and in terms of population size the attendances are around 50% of the level here in some cases. I have attended League games in Romania
Their papers are full of the local league games , which is how it should be. I feel like asking the sports editors of the newspaper of this country which country they think they are living in.

Ex British PM Tony Blair supported Newcastle United .... Not AC Milan !
Our Prime Minister ( An Taoiseach) follows Manchester United ! Forgive me if I consider that pathetic but I do.

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Originally Posted by kingdomkerry

I must admit I used to support Man Utd when I was younger. At some stage I realised I was'nt from Manchester so I stopped supporting them. Im from Kerry where there is no team in the LOI so I just follow the league. This thing about supporting the nearest team does'nt wash. A kerryman is hardly going to support a cork team (although i did last suday in the RDS).

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yeah similar for me too. I used to support celtic, but then realised that supporting a scottish team (albeit with an irish heritage) wasnt really the thing to do. And i also live in a town with no EL teams or even Leinster senior league teams.............but i have made the effort to see EL games...........and do actively coach in my locality................i hate barstoolers........and people who jump on the bandwagon..........but then again thats the irish for you
Unless you have a strong connection I find it really stupid to shell out money to watch a foreign club week in, week out

and as for Bertie....he doesnt strike me as a man who knows a lot about sport...........sure he goes to the games......but then he is a politican

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Originally Posted by kingdomkerry

I must admit I used to support Man Utd when I was younger. At some stage I realised I was'nt from Manchester so I stopped supporting them. Im from Kerry where there is no team in the LOI so I just follow the league. This thing about supporting the nearest team does'nt wash. A kerryman is hardly going to support a cork team (although i did last suday in the RDS).

I recently moved to south dublin so I was thinking of following Shamrock Rovers next season and going to a few of their games. Not so sure now as they are'nt playing their home games on this side of the city.

Anyway as regards Bertie ahern he is entitled to do what he wants in his spare time and support who he wants but as leader of the country he should be a role model and supporting foreign teams is not the model i want to see!

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Same Situation. Im Born and bread in Mayo . However i had a choice to follow Sligo or Galway and i picked wisely ;) 12 years later i travel an hour down the road to every home game and wonder why i spent my child years following a foreign league. Well the answer is I was brain washed!!! My advise to any one who dosent have a Local Eircom side is to give the nearest club your support. Just because their not in the same county is a poor excuse!! Its not GAA .Its 100 times worse to follow a Brit team in my eyes

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Originally Posted by Ciaran

Well like I said that view of supporting a team is old fashioned. A team to me is a collection of players. In 10 years time the team you support will have a whole new set of players. So what exactly are you supporting? It isn't the players, it's just some romantic image of the club's flag and what they stand for. :rolleyes:

It's silly and dated.

And I've been to the Allianz Arena 3 times, the San Siro twice. Ironically I've never been to an Eircom League game. >_>

Sorry if that sucks to you but thats what young people are doing, on an average day I'll see people wearing Barca, Ac Milan, Brazil, Argentina and whatnot shirts. I don't think I've ever seen anyone wearing a Cork City shirt, heck you don't even see people wearing EPL shirts anymore.
We're Irish, we're the best so why shouldn't we support the best sports teams even if they're not our own. ^_^

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Lads I really think this Guy is about 14 or else he is seriously deluded. I would suggest we ignore him from now on as i think he is looking for attention (ADD)
Ive never read such excreament

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Originally Posted by hogey

This country makes me sick. Where else would you get the leader of a country spouting on national radio about a foreign league. Disgusting.

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Absolutely, that is the state of the nation. The lowest common denominator are pandered to by Leinster House, it's all about celebrity.

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Originally Posted by shanman2

Bertie Ahern can support who ever he wants to. Fair play to him for voicing his opinion. I support FC Barcelona I travel over at least 6-7 times a year with the possy I live in clare I cant stand the Eircom League and the fans. If your looking for a reason why people won't follow the LOI then you have it. ITS YOUR KIND! Get over yourself.

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Cant stand the fans of the Eircom league!!!

I feel like a leper. Im just a normal feen that goes to a game every other week. I hate Dublin teams and sneer at Waterford.

Your living in a dream world.

BTW it must be tough to go all the way to the west coast of Spain to watch the best team on the planet a few weekend every year.:D

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Originally Posted by harry crumb

BTW it must be tough to go all the way to the west coast of Spain to watch the best team on the planet a few weekend every year.:D

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Just hope you aren't a travel or estate agent! :D

Sorry if that sucks to you but thats what young people are doing, on an average day I'll see people wearing Barca, Ac Milan, Brazil, Argentina and whatnot shirts. I don't think I've ever seen anyone wearing a Cork City shirt, heck you don't even see people wearing EPL shirts anymore.
We're Irish, we're the best so why shouldn't we support the best sports teams even if they're not our own. ^_^[/QUOTE]

Well it depends on where you are because anytime I am in Cork I see lots of different people wearing Cork City shirts, jackets etc, indeed I would say that they are probably the most worn club merchandise in the City and that takes Man u, Liverpool etc in to account as well.
You sir are a consumer and not a fan you will probably change allegiance in another year or so to some other club (and you are entitled to do so).
However the last sentence is just so pathetic. so leave us to have a go at Bertie, God knows he deserves it.

The band-wagonning debate isn't only about Irish football. The English game also is dying on its feet because of the consumerism that sees fans choosing to follow ManU, Celtic, Chelsea and Barcelona in preference to their own.
The G14, with global brands, huge investment and obscene player wages, are practising a form of sporting cannabilism. It's not about 'consumer choice', the creed of the airhead. It's about sustainability, heritage, and real supporters enjoying real football.

Millwall fan Rod Liddle puts it in stark terms in his Sunday Times column today:

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Mind you, we in the media should share a little of the blame with our unrelenting obsession with the Premier League at the expense of everything else. Page after page of speculative preview of big club fixtures in the morning national dailies and scarcely a mention of what’s taking place in that vast black hole below Derby County. In my club’s local paper, The Evening Standard, you will trawl through five pages of guff about Cesc Fabregas’s groin strain or Jermain Defoe’s existential anguish, before finding five lines, next to the stuff about horses, telling you Millwall, Orient, Barnet, Palace et al are also playing this weekend and hope to win. Oh, and that Luton Town have gone out of business.

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Rod Little is that the guy.............

http:www.youtube.com/watch?v=Prep4trYNj4

Tune in to about 8 minutes

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Originally Posted by osarusan

I think there are two separate issues here.

First, Bertie, as a citizen, is entitled to support whoever he wants. And he's just as open to criticism for that choice as anybody else is. As a citizen, I'd much rather he supported his local side or closest eL side rather than a foreign team, just like I'd rather everybody did.

Secondly, a Taoiseach is aware that basically everything he says and does will be scrutinised. That comes with the territory of being Taoiseach. The eL, like it or not (and some posting here clearly don't), is the national league, and has been for many, many years. It is a part of our history, our culture, our tradition, and our identity. And these are things that a Taoiseach should be trying to promote, not ignore.

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Fair play great post.

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Originally Posted by kingdomkerry

Rod Little is that the guy.............

http:www.youtube.com/watch?v=Prep4trYNj4

Tune in to about 8 minutes

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That's the guy! :D
Liddle does tend to get up the noses of those who can only see as far as ManU and the rest of them. Which is a very good thing.
What his leaving his wife has to do with, only Dunphy, it seems, can tell.

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Originally Posted by Ciaran

Well like I said that view of supporting a team is old fashioned. A team to me is a collection of players. In 10 years time the team you support will have a whole new set of players. So what exactly are you supporting? It isn't the players, it's just some romantic image of the club's flag and what they stand for. :rolleyes:

It's silly and dated.

And I've been to the Allianz Arena 3 times, the San Siro twice. Ironically I've never been to an Eircom League game. >_>

Sorry if that sucks to you but thats what young people are doing, on an average day I'll see people wearing Barca, Ac Milan, Brazil, Argentina and whatnot shirts. I don't think I've ever seen anyone wearing a Cork City shirt, heck you don't even see people wearing EPL shirts anymore.
We're Irish, we're the best so why shouldn't we support the best sports teams even if they're not our own. ^_^

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In a post just dripping with hilarity, that sentence just takes the Kimberly, Mikado, and Coconut Cream. Poor Ciaran, can we have a volunteer to break the news to him ? :D:D

the biggest turn off in relation to the Eircom League is the self absorb and obnoxious fans. "Our League is great and anyone that watches English soccer is evil"

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Originally Posted by woodie

the biggest turn off in relation to the Eircom League is the self absorb and obnoxious fans. "Our League is great and anyone that watches English soccer is evil"

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You've no problem listening to the ****e Sky constantly spout about how 'our league is the best in the world' though?

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Originally Posted by woodie

the biggest turn off in relation to the Eircom League is the self absorb and obnoxious fans. "Our League is great and anyone that watches English soccer is evil"

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Who said that?

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Originally Posted by woodie

the biggest turn off in relation to the Eircom League is the self absorb and obnoxious fans. "Our League is great and anyone that watches English soccer is evil"

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Convenient.

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Originally Posted by pixiehead

Same Situation. Im Born and bread in Mayo . However i had a choice to follow Sligo or Galway and i picked wisely ;) 12 years later i travel an hour down the road to every home game and wonder why i spent my child years following a foreign league. Well the answer is I was brain washed!!! My advise to any one who dosent have a Local Eircom side is to give the nearest club your support. Just because their not in the same county is a poor excuse!! Its not GAA .Its 100 times worse to follow a Brit team in my eyes

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What would you do — honest question — if a Mayo team entered the league?

I've always wondered that about people down the country. Not trying to be smart at all.

Sort of like when Donegal Celtic got back up and running in Belfast. Did that split the Cliftonville support to any extent, does anybody know? As far as I can gather Cliftonville became the 'pan-Belfast-nationalist' team by default. (Like Bohs becoming the Northside kingpins after Drumcondra's demise, I suppose.)

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Originally Posted by Erstwhile Bóz

What would you do — honest question — if a Mayo team entered the league?

I've always wondered that about people down the country. Not trying to be smart at all.

Sort of like when Donegal Celtic got back up and running in Belfast. Did that split the Cliftonville support to any extent, does anybody know? As far as I can gather Cliftonville became the 'pan-Belfast-nationalist' team by default. (Like Bohs becoming the Northside kingpins after Drumcondra's demise, I suppose.)

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Honest Answer. Id stay following United!! Ive followed them through thick and thin and there simply wouldnt be any reason for me to Follow a Mayo side with the Passion i have for the tribesmen. Also Mayo is ravaged by GAA, Premiership, One minded muck savages so an EL team wouldnt have a hope of getting a fan base :o

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Originally Posted by BohDiddley

That's the guy! :D
Liddle does tend to get up the noses of those who can only see as far as ManU and the rest of them. Which is a very good thing.
What his leaving his wife has to do with, only Dunphy, it seems, can tell.

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Yeah that was the one where dunphy told the whole world about his "young one". He also called niall quinn a "creep". You would'nt get that entertainment on Sky!!