Norn Iron rubbish part 23452346526

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Originally Posted by Not Brazil

So they were born in Northern Ireland, and left?

What year were they born?

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Not going to discuss the nuances of my family history on a public MB. If it's really that fascinating PM me and I'll respond tomorrow night.

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Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

Not going to discuss the nuances of my family history on a public MB. If it's really that fascinating PM me and I'll respond tomorrow night.

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That's fair enough BB...I think you were right in slagging them about their "Dual Nationality" though.;)

If they read the British Citizenship laws, they'll have a fit.:D

The Republic Of Ireland affords me "Dual Nationality" as a birthright....kinda messes up your arguement a bit.:D

PM me a link, with relevant legislative dates and we'll see.

But they neither want to be or are 'British' AFAIK. ;)

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Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

Aye, but yer average unionist would want to be :rolleyes: 100% Brit !

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I met the average Unionist. He sends his regards.

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Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

PM me a link, with relevant legislative dates and we'll see.

But they neither want to be or are 'British' AFAIK. ;)

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You can google it all.

What they want to be, and what they are, might be two different things.

How they "identify" is an entirely different matter - and I uphold and respect their right to identify as solely "Irish".

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Originally Posted by The Fly

Here's a question for you JohnB;
If England chooses to have it's own anthem, which is gathering momentum there, with 'Land of Hope and Glory' or 'Jerusalem' being the two preferred candidates, would you still expect Northern Ireland to use GSTQ as it's 'official anthem'?

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In the absence of anything else I don't think we have a choice. For lots of reasons, I dislike GSTQ. In fact I dislike national anthems in general and I stand and stare at my shoes when GSTQ is played at NI games. But for me it's a case of fairness. I have stood in Dublin for the SS and I think it's fair to expect that gesture to be reciprocated in Belfast. And also GSTQ means a lot to some in NI, in the same way that the SS means a lot to some in NI and the RoI. In an all-Ireland set up, I don't think those feelings should just be dismissed.

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Originally Posted by Gather round

Not so. You've responded to the NI supporters telling you thanks, but we're not interested in joining your football team- by just repeating it, over and over and over again. It's not an argument, just a cliched slogan.



Who's bitter? I'm relieved you didn't make it, no more. If you're going to repeat the same sneers as above, you can hardly be surprised when they're occasionally returned.



Don't be daft. How would either of us know what the typical fan in Africa or Asia or wherever thinks? Even if you did, you (and they notionally) are getting carried away by righteous indignation. Not conceding one dodgy goal didn't mean you'd have won overall, as I explained; conceding it doesn't make you particularly deserving. You lost unluckily, best get over it.



Guilty as charged, son (I assume you're an adult male, apologies if not). Only coming down to your level.



Spare us the pseudo-science, Dr Freud. It's got fcuk all to do with schizophrenia (which is distinct from multiple personality disorder). You're just a bigot who won't accept unionists as equally Irish. I'd change my psychiatrist if I were you.

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Fair enough GR keep going. Your pedantic, weak and frankly juvenile diatribe has amazed and amused me all day. I've often been hesitant to subscribe fully to the notion that NI is infected by a siege mentality. You sir have somewhat eroded that hesitation. Thank god for some rational NI posters like NB. And you're relieved we didn't make it to the WC? Add deplorable pettiness to the list above.

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Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

As for your colleague from Larne;wasn't me who came on an 'opposing' MB shouting the odds and accusing me of trolling. You know nothing about me, or my experiences, yet you claim everything I say is unsubstantiated.
Well you're wrong. I make a point of talking to and asking people, of all religions and persuasions. You should try it sometime.

Admit still get fired up by all this, but have my own personal reasons.
If people are willing to move on as HS and you (without the conciliatory tone) suggest, then all well and good.
I sincerely hope so. And that all those who've died unnecessarily in Ireland under British interference, wasn't in vain.
Just accept that people have different experiences before saying their images and stereotypes are wrong;have spoken to certain Northern politicians and believe me, as HS says, they are very very clear in what they stand for. And don't currently see it any other way.

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you've likely already pidgeon holed me, and no doubt wrongly, but now it's in your head you will fight to make it right.
do you still think your little "walk and talk" sessions are actually representative of almost 2 million people and will still purport them to be so to everyone? even when you are shown to be incorrect you still persist holding on to what on the surface appear to be, at the least, pretty uninformed views and make unwarranted, disparaging remarks. isn't that trolling?
i should try gathering my views the way you do sometime? no thanks, i prefer to try using facts over the coloured bitterness of wherever your opinions came from.
i've met a builder from ardee, maybe everyone in ardee is a builder?
i've met a junkie in dublin, maybe all dubliners are junkies?
i've met a ukrainian who was a chef, maybe all ukrainians are chefs?
i've met a protestant bigot in northern ireland, maybe all protestants in northern ireland are bigots?
no matter, there doesn't seem any point telling you things aren't all as you see them because you will probably revert back to the view you wish were reality anyway and continue spouting garbage.
open your eyes sometime ardeebhoy and stop letting others fill your head full of prejudice.

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Originally Posted by Not Brazil

You can google it all.

What they want to be, and what they are, might be two different things.

How they "identify" is an entirely different matter - and I uphold and respect their right to identify as solely "Irish".

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But you know I won't look at any link re. Brit.citizenship !
Though in a wider context, maybe....
And I'm sure they'd respect your right to be British, though would be more confused about any 'Irish' bit....
:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

But you know I won't look at any link re. Brit.citizenship !
Though in a wider context, maybe....
And I'm sure they'd respect your right to be British, though would be more confused about any 'Irish' bit....
:rolleyes:

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Another bizarre interjection.

It would pay you to understand what you're talking about re: British Citizenship.

And..the Constitution of Ireland, affords me the birthright to be an Irish Citizen.

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Originally Posted by JohnB

In the absence of anything else I don't think we have a choice. For lots of reasons, I dislike GSTQ. In fact I dislike national anthems in general and I stand and stare at my shoes when GSTQ is played at NI games. But for me it's a case of fairness. I have stood in Dublin for the SS and I think it's fair to expect that gesture to be reciprocated in Belfast. And also GSTQ means a lot to some in NI, in the same way that the SS means a lot to some in NI and the RoI. In an all-Ireland set up, I don't think those feelings should just be dismissed.

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There is a certain rationale in what you say JohnB. Your point about fairness is one that I understand, i.e; you want there to be/think there should be, an anthem that caters for the Unionist people from Northern Ireland who attend Irish rugby matches. This is, crucially, different from an anthem that represents NI as a whole, and it represents a catch-22 situation for the IRFU.

It is my view that using GSTQ to represent the Irish rugby team is no way appropriate. Obviously, the IRFU also know this, certainly strategically and probably by a majority belief within the organisation. If the IRFU did allow GSTQ to played before a match at Ravenhill, there would be an uproar in the Republic and the team would haemorrhage support. The IRFU is not going to go down that route, so, what should it do?
The fairest and most equitable way, would be, to just play Ireland's Call. I wouldn't have a problem with that. Alternatively, in the event that an official Northern Ireland anthem does come about, that would be then be used. This is the more likely outcome, in my view.

The central problem of course, as it pertains to NI, is that there is no collective Northern Ireland identity.
(but maybe the clock is ticking on that one........who knows)

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Originally Posted by The Fly

The fairest and most equitable way, would be, to just play Ireland's Call

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That's the answer for Rugby.

None of this one for the Unionists, one for the Nationalists ballicks...Ireland's Call (crap as it is), and get on with the game.

And..if Mary is in attendance in Dublin...no problem with the "Presidential Salute".

To Lamb,
If you dont engage with people how else do we find out their views....
May not agree with NB, but at least we get a view of sorts.
Whereas all you want to do is say I'm 'wrong' !

Obviously from the 'reasoned' line of argument !

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Originally Posted by Not Brazil

It would pay you to understand what you're talking about re: British Citizenship.

And..the Constitution of Ireland, affords me the birthright to be an Irish Citizen.

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Well, did ask you to send a link....am still waiting!
:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

Well, did ask you to send a link....am still waiting!
:rolleyes:

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Have you heard of google?

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Originally Posted by -lamb-

i've met a junkie in dublin, maybe all dubliners are junkies?

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You could have a point there: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEAyPcezEGA

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Originally Posted by Scooby Doo

Fair enough GR keep going. Your pedantic, weak and frankly juvenile diatribe has amazed and amused me all day. I've often been hesitant to subscribe fully to the notion that NI is infected by a siege mentality. You sir have somewhat eroded that hesitation. Thank god for some rational NI posters like NB. And you're relieved we didn't make it to the WC? Add deplorable pettiness to the list above

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Always glad to help, old boy ;)

I don't know whether this has been covered yet but you can't just decide to join up football federations willy nilly. FIFA has very strict criteria for this type of thing. All countries must be real countries (politically). That is everyone of more than 200 members. The only exceptions are the 4 'countries' of the UK who are allowed to remain as they are because they were the original countries who played soccer.

You cant just say an All-Ireland team works for the rugby so lets have one of those for the soccer too. It wouldn't be allowed until we have a united Ireland politically.

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Originally Posted by Shilts

IAll countries must be real countries (politically). That is everyone of more than 200 members. The only exceptions are the 4 'countries' of the UK who are allowed to remain as they are because they were the original countries who played soccer

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Not quite. Faeroes are a member of UEFA and FIFA while remaining an autonomous part of Denmark.

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Originally Posted by Gather round

Not quite. Faeroes are a member of UEFA and FIFA while remaining an autonomous part of Denmark.

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Not quite sure how that situation works - they have a form of home rule and are NOT in the EU, unlike Denmark. But I can see that different possibilities might be accepted by FIFA.
However, I dont know of any composite teams (as they call them in rowing) being allowed by FIFA