Printable View
The teams will not be merging - your, perfectly legitimate, political aspiration isn't a good reason for it to happen either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixer82
By way of a tip - and, I believe most enlightened thinkers in the Republic Of Ireland know this already - you ain't going to "unite" anything with attitudes like those espoused earlier by KK - the attitude that demonises everything about the very people you claim to wish to be "united" with.
well the border is no longer physically there. the realationship between the two states has never been better!Quote:
Originally Posted by jinxy lilywhite
Self-determination was not the express will of the majority until after the British gerrymandered the border to ensure more Loyalists than Republicans/nationalists were within the borders
nobody ever mentioned not consulting the players/assocation we want to merge with. that would be ludicrous and unjust.
and yes you are right, Northern Ireland is a state within the country of Great Britain. unfortunately. In the words of Tony Benn: an artificial state....
que angry coments from my northern cousins :eek:
Because as an all Ireland team we stand a greater chance of qualification and seeing Irish Men play on the international stage more often (hopefully). It would be a positive step in the direction of peace and reconciliation for the people living in Ireland. That's my 2 cents!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
So No link exists?Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
Heh.
Who is "we"?:confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by antrimgreen
Seeking the destruction of an International team, representing the fourth oldest Association in the world - a proud Association - and it's passionate supporters a team is the way to peace and reconciliation is it? Fcuk me - you're deluded.
How's about respecting choices, and diversity - live and let live?
Would that not be more helpful?
I reckon that our chances would increase as one team. Look back over the years at the two respective teams and hypothesise a combined team. Surely we'd be better?Quote:
Originally Posted by Gather round
I'm wholly aware that you're diametrically opposed to such a thing happening and without prompting your '**** stirrer' tag, I'm sure you can see the possible sporting advantages of having one team, GR?
Actually, he's not right.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixer82
Northern Ireland is an integral part of the United Kingdom - consisting of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
Don't be silly AB - if you cannot find numerous links to British Citizenship laws online, I'm not going to teach you.:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy
Look in certain respects, and I'm sure their soccer team is the tip of the iceberg, these people only really want to say 'No', 'Never' or 'Not Interested', such is the general siege mentality.
However it would be funny if Britain were to abandon them, which would be the logical thing to do, given what a drain they've been on their resources ever since its creation....
It would be better to scrap the FAI and the IFA.
They certainly have not done much for the development of football on the Island of Ireland.
Certain individuals have their own fiefdoms in the respective FAs and will have to have their fiefdoms prized from their granite grip.
It will probably happen but to say when would be an ambitious statement.
Is it? I've lived in England for over 20 years and I can honestly say my friends, peers colleagues etc, none of them give a flying Fcuk and couldn't care less about the north. You're deluded if you think otherwise!Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
It's because there's hundreds and you seem so sure of yourself....Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
:rolleyes:
If it's all about increasing chances, many Northern Ireland fans would be chomping at the bit for an "All UK" team - we're not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Predator
Me and you and all the other people gathered on this small island. It's not a case of live and let live, it's a case of let's live together. I understand your mentality, it fears change which for me is a sign of insecurity. To protect the proud Assocaiation, sure we can keep the name you have IFA no problem ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
Whether your friends, peers, colleagues "give a fcuk" or not, is immaterial.Quote:
Originally Posted by livehead1
Conversely, I have plenty of friends, peers, and colleagues who are English, and they do "give a fcuk" about "the North". Ditto - immaterial.
It might be "funny", but it won't be happening.Quote:
Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy
The people of Northern Ireland have won, and ring-fenced, the right to self determination - I refer you to the Belfast Agreement 1998.
I have no fear of change, and feel absolutely secure.Quote:
Originally Posted by antrimgreen
Yes - I have an ability to read the laws of the land.:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy
Surely self-determination goes both ways though? What if the Scots or English want independence?Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
That's a good point, well made.Quote:
Originally Posted by boovidge
Don't see that happening anytime soon, to be perfectly blunt.
An FAI/IFA merger will never happen simply because it will entail one set of blazers having to get off the gravy train. How likely would you vote for something which had a 50:50 chance you could lose your job in a merger?
yep that wouldnt surprise me in the least. I certainly don't think the FAI have the ability to see the bigger picture...Quote:
Originally Posted by newrynyuk
It's only because no-one's ever asked them! Just their 'colonial gene' that stops most English people, ditching Scotland & Wales, not to mention the North, who've all been a net drain on their resources for generations (with the exception of North Sea oil, which was robbed from the Scots by the Brit. establishment in London)!Quote:
Originally Posted by boovidge
It's one of the reasons why we should want Scotland to vote for independence and would actually make me favourably disposed towards England if they ditched their other lame ducks.
Then they wouldn't have to worry about carrying them in a GB football team either!
;)
Actually there's very strong support up here ins Scotland for independence from London. Scotland already contributes more to the UK than they get back, due to oil, and soon enough half the UK will be powered by Scottish renewables. Financially it makes sense for Scotland to secede, and stop financially supporting the British occupation of Afghanistan and Iraq, the dole money for unemployed miners in Merthyr Tydfil, and transport infrastructure in East Anglia. There's also still a very strong Scottish identity, with a referendum on independence schedules for next year or the year after. Especially if the conservatives (spit!) get voted in down South, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see an independent Scotland by the time London host the Olympics
English nationalism is growing too. Due to percieved injustices re: devolution and other factors. The British establishment is hostile to English national identity.
I'm not saying the union is going to fall apart anytime soon but the cracks are definitely there.
Not according to opinion polls; there are surges up and down but support for an independent Scotland hovers at around 30-40%. Recently there's been a drop in support, which is put down to prevailing economic conditions. And votes for the SNP don't correlate with a wish for independence. Overall, it's a very difficult issue to gauge, but rarely do opinion polls indicate a majority of Scots to be in favour of independence, although that may of course change.Quote:
Originally Posted by peadar1987
Renewables will most certainly not contribute anything like 50% of the UK's energy requirements, not within the next few decades anyway. Look out though for another controversial development in the NE of Scotland, pushed through by the Scottish government.Quote:
Scotland already contributes more to the UK than they get back, due to oil, and soon enough half the UK will be powered by Scottish renewables.
Emotional issues notwithstanding, there is little reason for Scotland to break away from the rest of the UK. Scotland is unlikely to just walk away with (dwindling) oil reserves. Many financial commentators predict a long period of adjustment for Scotland, resulting in reduced public services. Recent bail-outs of Scottish companies demonstrate the benefit of being part of the UK. etcQuote:
Financially it makes sense for Scotland to secede
No ****, Shirlock.:DQuote:
Originally Posted by boovidge
And...I'll be fighting any notion to destroy the autonomy of, each , the FAW, SFA, FA, and IFA.
Even though, we'd be world beaters together.:)
I'd say 30-40% is very strong support. All it takes is one major incident to push that to a majority. There is some serious hatred for the Tories up here, you'll hear it every time you go into a pub, so a Conservative victory in the next election could be the thing that sparks off Scottish independence.Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnB
Well the Scottish government have made a commitment to achieve 50% of domestic generation from renewables by 2020, and the overall UK target is 15% in the same time period, with further commitments to renewables planned. Due to several accidents of geography, Scotland has immensely more potential for marine renewables such as wave and tidal stream technology, as well as both onshore and offshore wind.Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnB
It's a little-known fact that we only have enough uranium for about another 50 years (In the absence of commercial breeder reactors, anyway), nuclear fusion is still decades, maybe even centuries away, and fossil fuels will last us maybe another 100 years, on a commercial scale anyway. We're going to have to go renewable at some point soon, and when that happens, all of Europe is going to be buying energy from two places: The Atlantic seaboards of Ireland, Scotland, France, Spain and Portugal (Wind, wave and tidal); and Southern Spain, Italy, and the Middle East (solar thermal and PV technology
The Pentland Firth? Or the Aberdeen offshore wind farm? Pentland Firth shouldn't be too controversial, as any turbines installed would be underwater. Any wind turbines are always going to be controversial though.Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnB
I'm no economist, I'm an engineer, specialising in sustainable energy, hence the rant earlier! Presently, the Scottish economy is highly dependent on the whims of OPEC, and also with the large financial sector, on the cycle of booms and recessions. I really do think that renewable energy, and related technologies will come to dominate the Scottish economy over the next 20 to 40 years, giving the country a more stable financial base from which to build.Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnB
It's ' 'Sherlock ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
You'd hardly be 'world beaters' though, as it'd be mainly 'Ingleland'....
What about the IFA & the FAI ??
It's 'Engerland' ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy
Er, all states are artificial. Unlesss you think they emerged fully-formed from the promordial soup, like.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixer 82
Ha ha. Reality suggests otherwise; at a stroke you'd be cutting Irish involvement by 50%, while the likelihood of the replacement team qualifying would barely increase, if at all. Remind me the last time that the merged Yugoslavia had two teams in the World Cup finals?Quote:
Originally Posted by Antrim Green
See immediately above.Quote:
Originally Posted by Predator
I'd prefer IFA to be reformed with better administration and more accountability to fans. FAI can take their own advice from their own fans etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Seanfhear
Er, so what? NB wasn't commenting on what your mates in Nottingham think, always assuming he knows all of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Livehead
Who fears change? I'm sure all the NI supporters on this thread (and most generally) would agree that the IFA needs to be improved as I suggested above.Quote:
Originally Posted by Antrim Green
The Scots may well vote for it at some point in the future. I imagine that will have effects on England, Wales and NI, but it's all a bit hypothetical right now?Quote:
Originally Posted by boovidge
Agreed it won't happen, although it won't be "simply" for the reason you suggest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Newrynyuk
Were that so, they'd be likely to do what you want? I think they see the bigger picture only too well, pandering to trolls on the internet and elsewhere isn't part of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixer 82
Not sure about your economics there, Peadar. Scotland doesn't 'own' all the oil- the infrastructure, investment and expertise to extract comes from the rest of the country and beyond. See link below- if the oil revenues are allocated per capita across Britain as a whole, as opposed to just in Scotland (and what would then stop Aberdeen declaring independence in its stead ;)), there's a big fat deficit for the Scottish government.Quote:
Originally Posted by peadar 1987
http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publicati.../06/18101733/9
There's more likelihood of Scotland winning Euro 2012. A link on William Hill's site (undated, but from 2008) suggests odds of 150/1 against. Out of curiosity I've emailed them to ask for an update.Quote:
I wouldn't be at all surprised to see an independent Scotland by the time London host the Olympics
How do you mean 'Irish involvement'? Management wise?Quote:
Originally Posted by Gather round
I assume you're talking about Slovenia and Serbia, who have both qualified for South Africa? Fair point.
RE Yugoslavia teams though, from Wiki:
Arguably, the Yugoslavia teams were stronger as one and the same could arguably be said for the Soviet Union teams, though Russia and Ukraine have done fairly well recently, albeit that they have massive populations compared to us. I still think our chances would be better as one, the 'reality' does not state otherwise. That is of course, not to say that we won't be able to do well independently of each other - we've both qualified for World Cups in the past.Quote:
The national team participated in eight World Cups, four Euros, and won the Olympic Games football tournament in the 1960 (they also finished second three times and third once). The under-21 team won the inaugural UEFA U-21 Championship in 1978.
The Yugoslav under-20 team won the FIFA World Youth Championship 1987.
'Irish involvement'? surely that would be everybody involved. And i would imagine the best players would be picked, regardless of what part of the island they're from....Pick the best 23 out of the whole pool
I understand it's all hypothetical but it's not exactly in the realms of fantasy that Scots independence would throw up serious questions about Northern Ireland's future. I only mentioned it because NB seemed to be saying that N.I were part of the UK whether the rest of the union wanted them or not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gather round
Aye, but that'd be far too logical for them Fixer.
If it works for cricket, hockey and rugby(League & Union) amongst others, we should at least try it.
Though given the amount of stubborn paranoia on show form certain quarters, maybe it should be just tried for either friendly games or competitive ones.
Personally I'd prefer the latter. The North will probably never qualify for a finals again, unless it's :rolleyes: 32 teams, whilst we have our own major problems in this respect, not withstanding the incompetence of the FIFA muppets and cheating Frenchmen!
A combined team should just be enough to squeak us over the line....
Quote:
Originally Posted by boovidge
Apart from certain types of 'Ingleland' & Rangers fans plus their mates in the BNP, there's no great enthusiam for them in mainland Britain as numerous polls have reported over the last few decades.
Though to be fair to the North, it's fallen off the relative news agenda with the lessening of the Troubles and greater outrages involving the British state elsewhere....but it should be noted that the parallel agendas still exist there.
But why should England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland get special dispensation? And it should not be the case of "well it's always been this way". Look at the Czech Republic/Slovakia, Yugoslavia etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
I live in Connecticut. If set up the CFA and get if approved by FIFA, can I create my Connecticut team to compete in Concacaf?
Just seen that opinion polls consistently show only around 1/4 of the public in Britain think N.I should be in the UK.Quote:
Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy
Metrostars, the reason why the UK has 4 teams is that the game was invented there and the first international fixtures were between England, Scotland, Ireland and Wales. I think it's fair enough personally.
Spot on peader, exactly what i think, i think this COULD trigger NI seceding also, which would leave them no choice really but to unify.Quote:
Originally Posted by peadar1987
Well, they wouldn't have to unify, be pretty daft not to though
That was the point way up thread I made to NB, way over his head, about London or Yorkshire or Cork starting their own teams....which are as logical as a certain other side!Quote:
Originally Posted by Metrostars
;)
As for the 'tradition' argument, have some miniscule sympathy.
But ultimately you can really only allow one dispensation, which would have to be for the English as the oldest FA.
Perhaps there should be a combined Welsh/Scots/North team;a sort of 'GB rejects' team, for want of a better name.