LOI in Europe 2022

[oriel]

The frustration from some posters over Shamrock Rover's conference league campaign so far is somewhat justified. There's a feeling that they are just going out for a run around, knowing they'l get beaten, and it's handy money anyway. That's not going to capture the imagination of the wider public. To that, SRFC fans would rightly say "So what. Winning the league gets us back there". But if they are as toothless and hapless in next years EL/ECL group stages, should they get there, being just happy to take the cheque and lose, it will hardly be a surprise if people aren't praising them from the rooftops for their anaemic displays. Dundalk EL 2016 were 10 times more fun to watch, and they really tried. Maybe that is apples and oranges by comparison but they shoud have had more ambition this year than "Ah well, sure we were going to lose anyway." as happened away to Molde. It's distasteful that some posters are accusing each other of being egregious embeciles, and it would be nice to be fair and frank on here without personal jibes being involved.

This is 100% the point, even the Dundalk 2020 EL group stage team really tried, back to my point 'Had a Go', that night in Vienna Oct 2020, lost 4-3, I think we were the only club that night to score more than 2 and not get a result, and yes fully aware lost all 6 games, but again we had a go.

My u10 team this am lost 5-1 and I told them they were great for the last 5 as they had a go and got a goal back, they tried harder than Rovers have in the group stage !

[pineapple stu]

I remember in 1994, Ray Treacy took a lot of stick after losing 7-0 to Gornik Zabrze in the European Cup - fans shouting stuff like "Are you going to win the league so we can get embarrassed in Europe again?" It feels like this season's results are quite comparable, but the viewpoint is the polar opposite.

I get that Europe has changed a lot since then and it's important to win the league so you can get an easy run to the groups, pick up another €3m and use that to consistently qualify - but against that I think Rovers fans are being excessively defensive of Bradley and his team selections. Granted Derry have improved a bit, but I don't think the title race should be quite so close at this stage. And given Rovers' crowds and recent Euro funds, they really should have built a squad capable of competing on two fronts at this stage.

I think that discussion can happen without Rovers fans calling people bitter and twisted and without CSAD questioning "you're [sic] brain size or knowledge in general".

[sbgawa]

I think the bitter and twisted comments are mostly reacting to some ridiculous OTT stuff. The league would have been over sooner if we hadn't been without our 3 most creative players Burke Byrne and mandroiu for most of the season.
That's what has led to Bradley playing weaker teams in Europe and I'm not being over defensive of him by saying he is doing the right thing I actually believe it is in the long term interest of the club. Before he named the team away to molde I qas calling for a team of 19s to play. Other fans might not care about the long term benefit to the club of making groups two years in a row (hopefully) and might prefer we weren't prioritising the league and that's fir enough. Different perspectives from different fans, there is no need for the hysterics on display though.

[ontheotherhand]

This is 100% the point, even the Dundalk 2020 EL group stage team really tried, back to my point 'Had a Go', that night in Vienna Oct 2020, lost 4-3, I think we were the only club that night to score more than 2 and not get a result, and yes fully aware lost all 6 games, but again we had a go.

My u10 team this am lost 5-1 and I told them they were great for the last 5 as they had a go and got a goal back, they tried harder than Rovers have in the group stage !

You're keeping it civil oriel, fair play. I'm not sure bringing up the 2020 Dundalk team is helpful though. You weren't competing for the league so it's not apples for apples. In fact you got smashed in the league at home 4-0 by a team with half your budget that year while you focused on your game with KI. The cup isn't the league in terms of level of effort. Especially not when you win your semi 11-0. You also lost all your games so it wasn't exactly a roaring success. Others keep mentioning the MON rovers team as if they actually came close to winning the group. They were comfortably beaten by Spurs reserves in reality.

If we weren't competing for the league we'd go out hell for leather away from home. As it is we've priorities elsewhere and still managed to be competitive in our home group games, something which is being overlooked here as it doesn't fit the narrative. We drew with the top team in the group and played well against arguably the strongest team on paper this week. We played our game and created enough chances. The talk of needing a striker is fair and maybe Gaffney would have made the difference but we really need to get points against Drogs and he is better suited to that than other options. Our worst results aren't as bad as the 4-0 you took off us in Oriel in 2020. You'd swear we were going down 9-0 reading this thread. We're poor away from home all the same, no question and it needs to be fixed.

If we'd gotten the win against Djurgardens we might be looking at things differently but as it is, we've taken a fairly ruthless approach to focus on the league. Agree or not it doesn't bother me much. As I said earlier, I want the league not a moral victory or two in Europe.

To your earlier question on whether or not Jack has shown his class in the groups, the answer is no sadly. He's barely showed his class in the league and that is part of the issue. He hasn't been the same since the back and covid issues he got in 2020. Ironically the best example of him struggling was in the cup you won. He was anonymous that day and hasn't really gotten close to his best level since. He's had a few good assists and passages of play when he gets enough time on the ball but he either needs more time to get back there or.......well he's still a good loi player, just not a lad you'd coast to a league with or who might help you punch above your weight in Europe.

[oriel]

But surely this was completely diff, we played the u19's / B team / tea lady managed team and lost 4-0 indeed, but that was a one off game to ensure team was fresh for EL play off. We are talking about 3-4 consistent not having a go displays now by Rovers in group stage.

Ps the A team put the record straight with a 4-2 win v Rovers 3 months later in the cup final, easily the better team after 90 mins and most of ET.

And finally I want Rovers to do much better in the group stage, it reflects better on our league for better performances, not just results.

[ontheotherhand]

But surely this was completely diff, we played the u19's / B team / tea lady managed team and lost 4-0 indeed, but that was a one off game to ensure team was fresh for EL play off. We are talking about 3-4 consistent not having a go displays now by Rovers in group stage.

Ps the A team put the record straight with a 4-2 win v Rovers 3 months later in the cup final, easily the better team after 90 mins and most of ET.

Jaysus oriel I'm not reliving the cup with you! 😅

Do you really think we didn't have a go in the home games? I'd disagree with that. Away from home sure I'd agree but at home we've played well in both games. Points on the board as well which is more than Dundalk got in 2020 or we got in 2011.

What is "having a go" worth anyway? Is the 2020 Dundalk side lauded in song? I'd have almost forgotten you were in the groups to be honest. There were more striking stories coming out of Oriel that year than a few gutsy defeats.

Now the other Dundalk is a different story. They were brilliant and are rightly talked about as the best LoI side of all time. But it didn't last. We are attempting to build something that lasts. Maybe we are getting it wrong but it's odd that people don't see the reasoning at the very least.

[Kingswood Rover]

I thought we played some really good football against Molde but if you do not take your chances in Europe you have no hope. The 2022 Rovers are very average with perhaps only Andy Lyons out of the Squad playing consistently above average. The League has to be won end of and as we have a decent chance of doing that European Group Stages are secondary to that ambition. Am i pleased with this No but its right for the club in the here and now. Next Season's league will be a lot more competitive with Derry and possibly Dundalk and Pats having ever chance Rovers may then possibly finding themselves deciding to focus on European games and still get well beaten in all bar one or two. Getting that 2nd gold star on our jersey is this years priority folks.

[Shinkicker]

Oh Rovers definitely won?t be, Nope I have a loathe hatred for teams that accept mediocrity and have no ambition. And I wouldn?t hope if I was you, you?re going to be disappointed and arse will be fine.

Nope wrong and not for the first time.

You really must hate all teams in the league because at the moment they all only want to get to Europe for the money with fixtures close to home to keep expenses down and happy to go out after 2nd -3rd round. If they do make group stage happy to come last. You must be so frustrated.

[EatYerGreens]

Unless I'm missing somwthing, the problem Rovers face isn't with 'trying'. It's with the fact they're playing teams who are just a lot better than them. The higher you go in football the more that small margins become influential - and that's what you pay for from quality players. The difference between almost putting away a chance and actually doing so.

[A N Mouse]

No tactics just using Wikipedia, which maybe you being an old timer maybe haven?t heard of.

Yes they would have because they actually had a good manager.

What are you even talking about anymore, wise up for once on this forum.

I take that as you saying that two of, in your opinion, the best managers in the league wouldn't have prioritised winning the league over winning hearts and mind in the group stages, should they had to choose. Did I get that right? On the other hand, there was no objection to my earlier characterisation of your previous statement as 'rovers were muck in qualifying, why are they muck in the groups'. Take it you still standby both opinions?

Don't worry about my lack of tech savvy. I'll stick with altavista. Like back in the old days. Do you know, this wikipedia might be useful, will add a bookmark to lynx. Oh, thank you, bless your heart.

I'd also like to thank you for the advice. Now would you be be receptive to some? Seems others have suggested, hinted, implied, told, even hollered about worrying kwibbling from your account and the need to do something about it. I too think you should tone it down. Pause, take a breath before posting. I can't speak for others but it's tiresome. Don't become the type of poster that nobody wants to be seen arguing with.

Of course there room to discuss Bradley's competence, rover's poor showing or perceived lack of ambition or reasons for any of the above. Take your cue from others, and do it without pi$$ing in everyone's lemonade. Users on more modern platforms would be getting mental health advice with their reported posts. Should we be concerned? Everyone should have someone to talk to, and check themself regularly.

The other thing was this great documentary from 2010. Really enjoyable. Of course norway deal better with these things than we do. Link. Looks good after this time,must give it another watch.

[oriel]

Jaysus oriel I'm not reliving the cup with you! ��

Do you really think we didn't have a go in the home games? I'd disagree with that. Away from home sure I'd agree but at home we've played well in both games. Points on the board as well which is more than Dundalk got in 2020 or we got in 2011.

What is "having a go" worth anyway? Is the 2020 Dundalk side lauded in song? I'd have almost forgotten you were in the groups to be honest. There were more striking stories coming out of Oriel that year than a few gutsy defeats.

Now the other Dundalk is a different story. They were brilliant and are rightly talked about as the best LoI side of all time. But it didn't last. We are attempting to build something that lasts. Maybe we are getting it wrong but it's odd that people don't see the reasoning at the very least.

Singular term - POINT

[ontheotherhand]

Singular term - POINT

Well now that we've lost the league we can focus on getting a second.

[ger121]

Well with the shackles fully off I expect Rovers to really go for it tonight. Gent are bang average in the league and their only win in Europe in 6 games was in the reverse fixture. Away from home in general they seem to be poor.
Rovers have created chances in the group games, they just haven’t been clinical so far. They need to take them tonight.
I fancy them tonight and would not be surprised if they sneak a win. Having said that, I went for 1-1 in the UEFA prediction league.

[pateen]

Big money still at stake too

[EatYerGreens]

You'd assume the Rovers players are on some sort of bonus structure for European results. This is essentially their last game of the season and a cup final for them, so they should be going all out to get at least a draw. One game tonight has the potential to earn them massively more money than 36 games in the league did. So they'd be daft not to go all out for it tonight.