Stephen Kenny

[Eirambler]

It occured to me earlier that we all - or nearly all - have our head in the sand re kenny, we are so desperate for him to succeed. It's only when he is bounced out that we'll realise what a mess his time in charge has been. We're kicking the can down the road as long as he is at the helm unfortunately.

I would suggest though that unless he pulls things together in short order this is his final campaign. I hope he manages it.

In fairness quite a few of us have been of that view since about the second game of the World Cup campaign.

I think in time his supporters will seek to frame his legacy around how many players he brought through, and there's merit in that to be fair. But, other than a short stint at the end of the last campaign - which may or may not have been more to do with Barry than Kenny - and the Scotland home game - which always felt like a bit of a one off derby game - it has largely been a complete mess.

[samhaydenjr]

It occured to me earlier that we all - or nearly all - have our head in the sand re kenny, we are so desperate for him to succeed. It's only when he is bounced out that we'll realise what a mess his time in charge has been. We're kicking the can down the road as long as he is at the helm unfortunately.

I would suggest though that unless he pulls things together in short order this is his final campaign. I hope he manages it.

To paraphrase Glengarry Glen Ross: "The good new is: You're Fired! The bad news is: you've one campaign to win your job back"

[tetsujin1979]

In fairness quite a few of us have been of that view since about the second game of the World Cup campaign.

I think in time his supporters will seek to frame his legacy around how many players he brought through, and there's merit in that to be fair. But, other than a short stint at the end of the last campaign - which may or may not have been more to do with Barry than Kenny - and the Scotland home game - which always felt like a bit of a one off derby game - it has largely been a complete mess.

I've been saying for a while now that the players he gave a debut to may very well be his legacy, but I'm hardly a supporter

[Eirambler]

It's true in some respects, but it's always felt to me like he brought through "his" players first and foremost. Mainly the ones he worked with and favoured at Under 21 level - O'Shea, Molumby, Knight, Parrott, Idah etc.

He was a lot slower to bring through the likes of Cullen, mostly ignoring him during the first NL campaign in favour of Arter or his absolutely off the wall notion that Hourihane could be a deep lying midfielder for us (which of course he tried again to similarly disastrous effect more recently against Armenia). Similarly McNamara as mentioned has been completely ignored despite two seasons of good form for Millwall that has brought EPL interest and most of our other right wing back options being the wrong side of 30. Also with Manning at left wing back, he's never been given a fair crack I don't think. He has also been slow to bring through Smallbone, who wasn't one of his preferred players at Under 21 level (when asked about him in a press conference once he chose to turn the conversation to another Southampton player at that time, Will Ferry, instead).

It just feels to me that, once he brought his own favourites in he shut the door a bit for others that have come along since - Evan Ferguson excepted. So, for me, any praise of his blooding of players will always be caveated by that to some extent.

[elatedscum]

It just feels to me that, once he brought his own favourites in he shut the door a bit for others that have come along since - Evan Ferguson excepted. So, for me, any praise of his blooding of players will always be caveated by that to some extent.

Andrew Omobamidele, Gavin Bazunu, Michael Obafemi and Nathan Collins say hello

[Eirambler]

I think there would have been grounds to dismiss him on the spot if he didn't bring those lads in - those four plus Ferguson are probably our five best prospects for the next 10 years!

[nigel-harps1954]

I think there would have been grounds to dismiss him on the spot if he didn't bring those lads in - those four plus Ferguson are probably our five best prospects for the next 10 years!

But it completely contradicts your previous statement.

[elatedscum]

I think there would have been grounds to dismiss him on the spot if he didn't bring those lads in - those four plus Ferguson are probably our five best prospects for the next 10 years!

i don't see the players who he hasn't called up really.


Smallbone did his cruciate as a 20 year old when he was probably on the cusp of a call up. Last season, he played 228 minutes across all comps (excluding u23s) and watching him play for ireland's 21s, he didn't really look right until June (it didn't help that Crawford played him on the right wing sometimes). Got a loan move and regular game time this summer and got his first call up in November.


Apart from him, from the 2000/2001 class, Conor Coventry is the only other person you could make a case for - but I don’t think he’s played enough until his loan move in January to be a viable contender. Certainly possible he’s called up in March and he has been called up as an injury replacement in the past.


The 2002 kids, Festy Ebosele got a call-up as a 19 year old (when he couldn’t get into Jim Crawford’s 21s team) - didn’t play but got his first call up and made the bench. Signed in Italy a few weeks later and stopped playing football.


Joe Hodge could have been called up in November, I would have called him up - I’d also probably not call him up for March, based on his lack of playing time. He’s a guy who had another incredibly serious injury and only made his first senior club appearance in October.


As for the 98/99 lads, I’d have called up McNamara by now, I’d also have used Connor Ronan (who is definitely in the list of ‘Kenny favourites from his 21s days’)


I agree that Cullen wasn’t used as quickly as he should have been - but in fairness, Harry Arter was a regular for the team that won the championship that season. If we’re going that old, there’s also the likes of Ogbene and McGrath to consider who were probably given call-ups and playing time over expectation.


So you’re talking about nitpicking a handful of players when probably close to 20 lads have been brought through

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

It went so bad for Kenny that his supporters can only point to him calling up some of our most promising players in decades as his only positive contribution.

Even McCarthy called up Parrott and Connolly and he was actually competing to qualify for a major tournament!

[tetsujin1979]

Nobody has said it's his only positive

[SkStu]

In addition to bringing through 20 or so players to the squad and team, I'll throw in the faith he shows in our players ability to play a better brand of football than we have under the last three managers as something that he should be proud of and that hopefully will endure when he goes. We have had a succession of managers tell us that we dont have the players to string more than two passes together which totally undermined our players and sucked the life out of the fan base (apart from the showing in 2016 and to be fair to MON his brand was direct but not dour). I'll never forgive Trappatoni for some of his comments and our showing in 2012 was nothing short of a disgrace. Instilling a bit of confidence in the squad and the fanbase that we actually can and should expect more is something that i think is a legacy for Kenny. Hopefully something that will be reflected in the decision that will be made about our next manager.

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

Nobody has said it's his only positive

I think even the hardcore Kennyites are struggling to come up with many. None that can be easily disproven anyway.

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

In addition to bringing through 20 or so players to the squad and team, I'll throw in the faith he shows in our players ability to play a better brand of football than we have under the last three managers as something that he should be proud of and that hopefully will endure when he goes. We have had a succession of managers tell us that we dont have the players to string more than two passes together which totally undermined our players and sucked the life out of the fan base (apart from the showing in 2016 and to be fair to MON his brand was direct but not dour). I'll never forgive Trappatoni for some of his comments and our showing in 2012 was nothing short of a disgrace. Instilling a bit of confidence in the squad and the fanbase that we actually can and should expect more is something that i think is a legacy for Kenny. Hopefully something that will be reflected in the decision that will be made about our next manager.

2 of the regular Kenny myths here in this post. Some of the dourest, dullest performances in our history have been under Kenny, especially when he didn't have a coach doing tactics for him. Kenny has stated that we shouldn't expect to compete with teams like Serbia and Portugal, basically throwing out players under a bus to try to defend his own miserable failings. Has he ever taken any personal responsibility for the rubbish served up under his reign?

[SkStu]

I love how reasonable and balanced you are. The forum needs more of this and less of the hyperbole and antics that we get from some.

[BOOMSHAKALAKA]

I love how reasonable and balanced you are. The forum needs more of this and less of the hyperbole and antics that we get from some.

I suppose your failure to engage with any points raised or answer any questions is to be expected at this stage.