Four Nations Tournament

[TheBoss]

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2008/0411/fournations.html

Looks like it has been accepted

[Pike B]

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2008/0411/fournations.html

Looks like it has been accepted
Sounds good. Would be a great way of determining just who the best nation is, and save us mindnumbing debates, such as the 'O'Neill Backs United Ireland' thread which is currently raging, uncontrolably next door!!! :D

[Supreme feet]

Grand. Some nice, cheap away trips! And the possibility of seeing Darron Gibson scoring a thirty-yarder at Windsor Park! Oh, that'd make my decade.

[Shedender81]

I don't see the point of playing in this meaningless mini tournament . Honestly are going to be expected to fork up €50 or more for games against Wales / Scotland / N.Ire . Also I wonder what Trap will learn or how many players will show up for these games.

These are just glorified friendly games that will produce second rate games ,

On plus side if we win .. is it the same as a triple crown (another meaningless trophy)


Maybe Pat Fenlons U-23s would get more out of this or a mixture of B and U 23...

[Dr. Ogba]

This:

games in each campaign to be played in the same country and moved between the nations on a rotational tournament-by-tournament basis.


Followed by this:


Two matches will be played on each match-day, under the plans supported by each of the four national associations

would make me wonder what stadia we would use? or would 2 games be played in Lansdowne on the same day?

[jbyrne]

cant see the point in having all the games in the one country. surely that would lead to low attendances. scot v wales in cp would hardly attract a big crowd

[jmurphyc]

I agree that it's quite pointless. There's not much can to be learned from these games. We'd be better off playing a variety of teams with different styles, however, at least it's a senior tournament that we have a chance of winning. ;)

Predictions: Gibson gets the winner against Northern Ireland, McGeady gets the winner against Scotland and Rhys O'Jones gets the winner against Wales.

[Pike B]

cant see the point in having all the games in the one country. surely that would lead to low attendances. scot v wales in cp would hardly attract a big crowd
Also it would be an ugly, ugly game.. Darren Fletcher marking Jason Koumas anyone?

[OwlsFan]

http://www.fai.ie/start.php

Useful idea and something to look forward to when all 4 teams don't qualify for a championship. Otherwise, not of much relevance.

[WexCar]

would make me wonder what stadia we would use? or would 2 games be played in Lansdowne on the same day?


cant see the point in having all the games in the one country. surely that would lead to low attendances. scot v wales in cp would hardly attract a big crowd

well, 2 games in the same stadium on same day wud help with low attendances. the GAA do this regularly for low profile games.

Personally i wudn't be in favour of the idea of the tournament.

[stiffler]

I have a feeling that Trap won't be in favour in such tournaments. If we are looking to progress I feel playing against the same teams all the time wont help us in preparation for qualification campaigns.

[Razors left peg]

Its better than playing some of the meaningless friendlies we play now,there would be a bit of a compeditive edge to these games that would be a perfect place to blood new players or try new tactics.Its much better than playing a glamour friendly against a Brazil team for example that would be strolling around the pitch hardly getting out of second gear. Alot of players dont care about international friendlies anymore so something like this will be much more productive for us compared to end of season tours to the USA

[Drumcondra 69er]

Its better than playing some of the meaningless friendlies we play now,there would be a bit of a compeditive edge to these games that would be a perfect place to blood new players or try new tactics.Its much better than playing a glamour friendly against a Brazil team for example that would be strolling around the pitch hardly getting out of second gear. Alot of players dont care about international friendlies anymore so something like this will be much more productive for us compared to end of season tours to the USA

.....is the correct answer! Unsure about the idea of playing it in one country though but undoubtedly better then some of the crap friendlies we've seen in recent years that we've had to shell out for.

[Bottle of Tonic]

Ya 100% in agreement for reasons Razors outlined above.

The theory of 'learning against different opposition' is a good theory, but when most of your friendlies end up with with one or both teams (usually at least the away team in Dublin) just tapping about, not a whole lot is learned. If its a summer trip abroad - USA, eastern europe etc - you get a whole wad of sick notes and have no-hopers from league 1 and 2 getting called up.

This format gives us a decent chance of getting at least a half strength line-up on the park, greater prospects of decent game what with the local rivalry, and a few cheap close trips for international footie fans who might only get to 5 or 6 games a year in ordinary circumstances.

Thumbs up from me.

[irishfan86]

I see the argument for more away friendlies, but I've really lost faith in them ever since our results after the Denmark friendly. They literally mean nothing.

As some have said, at least this will be a tournament we have a chance at winning.

I like the competitive edge this will bring to the equation.

[theworm2345]

Damn that seems far away :(
http://sports.yahoo.com/sow/news?slug=reu-nations&prov=reuters&type=lgns

The good news is that would likely be when I could study abroad in Ireland, so a quick pop over to Scotland would be easy in February and/or March :)

[Razors left peg]

It seems kind of degrading for our lads to have to play 3 woeful sides like this, it'd be more fitting if they treated it like Munster treat the Magners League and just throw out some Eircom league players for it.

More attention seeking with comments like that:rolleyes:

[Newryrep]

Hope it is strangled at birth - the equivalent of two bald men fighting over a comb

[tetsujin1979]

It seems kind of degrading for our lads to have to play 3 woeful sides like this, it'd be more fitting if they treated it like Munster treat the Magners League and just throw out some Eircom league players for it.
If you really think that all 3 are "woeful" then it shows what you really know about international football
Scotland are in the top 20 in world, and just beat France. Twice.
The North are ranked higher than we are, and have a solid home record in recent qualifying series
Wales do blow hot and cold, but they're a strong side at home
Munster are second in the Magniers League at the moment, with a game in hand over Leinster. If they really treated it like you think they do, they'd be last from constantly playing their youth teams
Would playing eircom League players in these games really be such a bad thing?

[Cymro]

It seems kind of degrading for our lads to have to play 3 woeful sides like this, it'd be more fitting if they treated it like Munster treat the Magners League and just throw out some Eircom league players for it.

Ciaran, honestly, you are literally worth less than the piece of mud I wiped on my 'Welcome' mat as I came in through my front door about an hour ago.

Not only have you managed to insult Scotland, NI and our good selves with that post: but I doubt half the Irish members here would be too pleased either, since you've managed to stick in a nice little dig about the Eircom league too.

I'm neither for nor against this idea at the moment, I don't think it will be a roaring success without England (which pains me to say) but I think it's worth a try, just for one year at least.

[kingdomkerry]

How do we know if we'll like it if we don't try it!!

[Qwerty]

This is a bad idea. It's is meaningless as a competition.

Yes the Norn Iron game will be about bragging rights but without the chance to humble Ingurland it is pretty much a yawn.

I'm sure Scotland and Wales fans would relish playing Ireland as little as we relish playing them.

[Norn Iron]

I personally find it very hard to get excited about this. For varying reasons I have little interest in playing the 3 teams (and England if they became interested).

Wales- we may get a repeat of the 2 high scoring 2006 WCQ's but more likely a repeat of the drab 0-0 friendly last february when nobody could be arsed.:(

Scotland- Playing them in August anyway, a win their and I wouldnt want to play them again for a long time.

Republic- Like Qwerty said a chance for bragging rights but also a much bigger chance of the knuckle draggers rearing their ugly heads.:(

England- 1-0 Healy or another 0-4 at Wembley. Its a tough one!:cool:

[HolylandsMan]

If some sort of meaning gets attached to the games then they have to be more useful than the sham that passes for friendlies.

From a fans point of view, the qualifying groups take care of the long haul trips and this competition gives us the cheap flights to glasgow or cardiff for a weekend on the tear. I fail to see the disadvantage!

[carloz]

I fail to see the positives of this to be honest. We know everything about Scotland, Wales and the Norths games. We know what they can offer, we know they style they play etc. Our problem in recent campaigns has been away games in Eastern Europe in places such as Macedonia, Albania, Croatia etc. Playing in this 4 Nations tournament will not help this whatsoever and instead we will be playing in our own little bubble

[carloz]

It seems kind of degrading for our lads to have to play 3 woeful sides like this
In fairness thats a pretty ignorant point. At the moment we are battling it out with Wales to see who is the worst of the 4 teams. Scotland and N. Ireland are deservadly better than us at the moment

[as_i_say]

Did the FA in England make any comment on this at all? Too good for the rest of us are they:D

[Hibernian]

Ciaran, honestly, you are literally worth less than the piece of mud I wiped on my 'Welcome' mat as I came in through my front door about an hour ago.

Not only have you managed to insult Scotland, NI and our good selves with that post: but I doubt half the Irish members here would be too pleased either, since you've managed to stick in a nice little dig about the Eircom league too.

I'm neither for nor against this idea at the moment, I don't think it will be a roaring success without England (which pains me to say) but I think it's worth a try, just for one year at least.

Agree with you on those comments in every way

[Cymro]

I actually thought someone was going to give me grief over those comments because I was very tired and irritated when I posted them and had probably overstepped the mark a bit.

[Supreme feet]

I've agreed with the idea since it was mentioned. Under Kerr, we won our friendlies against Norway, Australia, Czech Rep, Croatia, Holland and Portugal. We drew with Brazil. Oh, and we beat China and Canada too. What did we learn, and how much did we benefit from these results in the long-term?

International friendlies are mostly a waste of time, but they have to be done for the sake of getting the squad together. I remember under Charlton, we beat Brazil, Holland and Germany in friendlies, but failed to beat Egypt, Norway and Liechtenstein when it mattered. The main aim of friendlies is to get the squad together, work on tactics and set-pieces in training, with the actual match as an afterthought. We might unearth the odd decent player in the process. Maybe.

To those who think we would be better served playing a friendly in Eastern Europe - do you think Georgia are any more clued in about how to approach our match in September after playing Northern Ireland? The opposition hardly ever matters in friendlies. It's like taking a penalty in training and then taking one under pressure in a competitive match - very different psychologically. The same midfield duo - Kilbane and Kavanagh - dominated against Brazil but almost got ripped apart against Cyprus in the following qualifiers. Remember, we beat Russia 2-0 in Lansdowne in 2002, six months before getting hammered 4-2 in Moscow.

At least with the 4-nations concept, it would give some interest, pride and - at the very least - entertainment to the matches - there's nothing like local rivalry in sport.

[stiofain]

I've agreed with the idea since it was mentioned. Under Kerr, we won our friendlies against Norway, Australia, Czech Rep, Croatia, Holland and Portugal. We drew with Brazil. Oh, and we beat China and Canada too. What did we learn, and how much did we benefit from these results in the long-term?

International friendlies are mostly a waste of time, but they have to be done for the sake of getting the squad together. I remember under Charlton, we beat Brazil, Holland and Germany in friendlies, but failed to beat Egypt, Norway and Liechtenstein when it mattered. The main aim of friendlies is to get the squad together, work on tactics and set-pieces in training, with the actual match as an afterthought. We might unearth the odd decent player in the process. Maybe.

To those who think we would be better served playing a friendly in Eastern Europe - do you think Georgia are any more clued in about how to approach our match in September after playing Northern Ireland? The opposition hardly ever matters in friendlies. It's like taking a penalty in training and then taking one under pressure in a competitive match - very different psychologically. The same midfield duo - Kilbane and Kavanagh - dominated against Brazil but almost got ripped apart against Cyprus in the following qualifiers. Remember, we beat Russia 2-0 in Lansdowne in 2002, six months before getting hammered 4-2 in Moscow.

At least with the 4-nations concept, it would give some interest, pride and - at the very least - entertainment to the matches - there's nothing like local rivalry in sport.

Good post

[eirebhoy]

I've agreed with the idea since it was mentioned. Under Kerr, we won our friendlies against Norway, Australia, Czech Rep, Croatia, Holland and Portugal. We drew with Brazil. Oh, and we beat China and Canada too. What did we learn, and how much did we benefit from these results in the long-term?
We had a good system for the most part, just lacked the creativity/players. Would our defence have been so good without having played together so much in friendlies? Doubt it. Anyway, that's more in to do with the importance of friendlies rather than your overall point.

[youngirish]

I actually thought someone was going to give me grief over those comments because I was very tired and irritated when I posted them and had probably overstepped the mark a bit.

They might have if it had been directed against anyone else other than Ciaran.

[carloz]

I've agreed with the idea since it was mentioned. Under Kerr, we won our friendlies against Norway, Australia, Czech Rep, Croatia, Holland and Portugal. We drew with Brazil. Oh, and we beat China and Canada too. What did we learn, and how much did we benefit from these results in the long-term?

International friendlies are mostly a waste of time, but they have to be done for the sake of getting the squad together. I remember under Charlton, we beat Brazil, Holland and Germany in friendlies, but failed to beat Egypt, Norway and Liechtenstein when it mattered. The main aim of friendlies is to get the squad together, work on tactics and set-pieces in training, with the actual match as an afterthought. We might unearth the odd decent player in the process. Maybe.

To those who think we would be better served playing a friendly in Eastern Europe - do you think Georgia are any more clued in about how to approach our match in September after playing Northern Ireland? The opposition hardly ever matters in friendlies. It's like taking a penalty in training and then taking one under pressure in a competitive match - very different psychologically. The same midfield duo - Kilbane and Kavanagh - dominated against Brazil but almost got ripped apart against Cyprus in the following qualifiers. Remember, we beat Russia 2-0 in Lansdowne in 2002, six months before getting hammered 4-2 in Moscow.

At least with the 4-nations concept, it would give some interest, pride and - at the very least - entertainment to the matches - there's nothing like local rivalry in sport.

Excellent post. Just one point though, did we not draw with Russia 1-1 six months after the 4-2 defeat in Moscow??

[shaneker]

I've agreed with the idea since it was mentioned. Under Kerr, we won our friendlies against Norway, Australia, Czech Rep, Croatia, Holland and Portugal. We drew with Brazil. Oh, and we beat China and Canada too. What did we learn, and how much did we benefit from these results in the long-term?

International friendlies are mostly a waste of time, but they have to be done for the sake of getting the squad together. I remember under Charlton, we beat Brazil, Holland and Germany in friendlies, but failed to beat Egypt, Norway and Liechtenstein when it mattered. The main aim of friendlies is to get the squad together, work on tactics and set-pieces in training, with the actual match as an afterthought. We might unearth the odd decent player in the process. Maybe.

To those who think we would be better served playing a friendly in Eastern Europe - do you think Georgia are any more clued in about how to approach our match in September after playing Northern Ireland? The opposition hardly ever matters in friendlies. It's like taking a penalty in training and then taking one under pressure in a competitive match - very different psychologically. The same midfield duo - Kilbane and Kavanagh - dominated against Brazil but almost got ripped apart against Cyprus in the following qualifiers. Remember, we beat Russia 2-0 in Lansdowne in 2002, six months before getting hammered 4-2 in Moscow.

At least with the 4-nations concept, it would give some interest, pride and - at the very least - entertainment to the matches - there's nothing like local rivalry in sport.

Agree 100%. Excellent.

[Lionel Ritchie]

I also think Supreme Feet makes some excellent points ...and I say that as someone who has questioned the merit of this tournament.

One picky thing -yes we "failed to beat Norway when it mattered" but that Norway team streaked through their qualifying group defeating everone in their group and taking four points from both Holland and England. They'll have been every bit as disappointed they couldn't beat an Irish side that had no prolific striker and was dying on it's feet ...more so as a draw was enough for us ultimately.