Anger at 'lazy' Roma remarks

[Ringo]

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/anger-at-lazy-roma-remarks-1254883.html


Probably the most annoying thing for Romanians is that (Romas) don't have this willingness to work as ordinary citizens. Now I cannot say none of them are working, but I can say the vast majority don't want to work."

There are currently an estimated 3,000 Roma living in Ireland, about 90 per cent of whom have travelled here from Romania.


I agree totally with the Romanians. The Roma are here just to beg. Christmas day they called to our house. Its an industry for them. The government needs to sort it out. Children begging on the streets again, at every major traffic lights junction. Two guys i work with are from Romania, good hard workers, the Roma are making it hard for Romanians to get work.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roma_people

[CollegeTillIDie]

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/anger-at-lazy-roma-remarks-1254883.html




I agree totally with the Romanians. The Roma are here just to beg. Christmas day they called to our house. Its an industry for them. The government needs to sort it out. Children begging on the streets again, at every major traffic lights junction. Two guys i work with are from Romania, good hard workers, the Roma are making it hard for Romanians to get work.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roma_people


The Roma seem to have devolved into a begging culture. There are a lot of them in Bulgaria and also in places like Slovakia, the Czech Republic and Hungary. And as happens a lot when people are perceived to be parasitic that can begin to become a stereotype and lead to prejudice and all that ensues from that.

[jebus]

Oddly enough myself and a few mates in Cork used to have a decent bit of banter going with the Romas who used to beg outside the Brog etc. after a night out. One of them even game me a euro to phone my mate after I lost my phone one time, goes to show what different experiences can bring to a person's opinion I guess

[Ringo]

Oddly enough myself and a few mates in Cork used to have a decent bit of banter going with the Romas who used to beg outside the Brog etc. after a night out. One of them even game me a euro to phone my mate after I lost my phone one time, goes to show what different experiences can bring to a person's opinion I guess

They were begging & their great because they gave you an euro:confused:

Their like a plague in Dublin. What about all the scams, they pull?

[jebus]

They were begging & their great because they gave you an euro:confused:

Their like a plague in Dublin. What about all the scams, they pull?

They've never pulled any on me, and helped me out of a tight spot, what's not to understand about why I don't dislike them? I never said they were great either, more of that lovely Foot syndrome of making out a person said something they never did

[Saint Tom]

they seem to have two purposes in life - steal and beg. I have not heard of a single one who actually works and it seems to be perfectly accepted in their culture that you dont need to work. I know that generally it is not right to tar a whole group of people with the same brush but in this case I cant justiy why I would not do this. And their numbers in Ireland must have multiplied ten fold in the last year. Does anyone know if the majority are EU citizens and entitled to reside here? or as I thought, are their exclusions applicable for citizens of Bulgaria and Romania?

[Schumi]

Does anyone know if the majority are EU citizens and entitled to reside here? or as I thought, are their exclusions applicable for citizens of Bulgaria and Romania?
Romanians and Bulgarians can live here if they want but they need a work permit to work as far as I know.

[inexile]

the scams they pull are, (1) they approach you at the bank machine after you have entered your pin no, from the left hand side and hassle you begging for money etc and while you turn to your left to tell them to go away etc they are withdrawing money from your account (2) they sell roses to drunken people, using the roses as a diversion so they or an accomplice can pick your pocket.

there are many variations of both of these acts, they are very good at it and very hard to catch in the act.

as for the begging unfortunately its not against the law in the country but i would be of the belief that if one of them approaches me on the street beggin its my right to smack them one! i dont think the guards would mind too much and i think if we were all to take that approach they would not be hanging around too much!!

also the other problem is the "do-gooders" in this country giving them money when they are begging, ask yourself are these people homeless? are they begging so they will have money to eat etc? no they are travelling into town from their suburban houses to beg during the day and steal at night.

they are a plague on this country and the sooner this country does something to sort them out it will get worse, rant over!!

[jebus]

(1) they approach you at the bank machine after you have entered your pin no, from the left hand side and hassle you begging for money etc and while you turn to your left to tell them to go away etc they are withdrawing money from your account

Would you not hear the buttons being pressed? Sense the arm drapped across you pressing the buttons? Or just not spend 2 minutes telling the beggar no?


as for the begging unfortunately its not against the law in the country but i would be of the belief that if one of them approaches me on the street beggin its my right to smack them one! i dont think the guards would mind too much and i think if we were all to take that approach they would not be hanging around too much!!

And you would be the same guy who would cry about how violent the Romas are when they beat seven shades of **** out of you for smacking one of them?


also the other problem is the "do-gooders" in this country giving them money when they are begging, ask yourself are these people homeless? are they begging so they will have money to eat etc? no they are travelling into town from their suburban houses to beg during the day and steal at night.

Go down to Cork, plenty of Irish people begging down there, a few of whom have houses and draw the dole, not just the Romas who do this I'm afraid


they are a plague on this country and the sooner this country does something to sort them out it will get worse, rant over!!

So from your points you want them kicked out for being begging and stealing? How about other foreigners who beg and steal? How about Irish people who beg and steal?

Cue people calling me a bleeding heart liberal

[Sheridan]

the scams they pull are, (1) they approach you at the bank machine after you have entered your pin no, from the left hand side and hassle you begging for money etc and while you turn to your left to tell them to go away etc they are withdrawing money from your account
If you're enough of a gobdaw to fall for that you deserve everything you get. Call it a stupidity tax.

[Ringo]

Cue people calling me a bleeding heart liberalyour a a bleeding heart liberal
:)


If you're enough of a gobdaw to fall for that you deserve everything you get. Call it a stupidity tax.

If only it was that simple. They prey on vulnerable people for their scams. Old people or people with kids etc.

[ramsfan]

say a little girl of about 6-7 begging outside opera house before christmas, about 100 yards away was her relation prob father, every so often hed come up and empty pot, a disgrace using kids like that you feel sorry for kids but if you give them something its only going straight into fathers pockets:mad:

[Sheridan]

If only it was that simple. They prey on vulnerable people for their scams. Old people or people with kids etc.
They're well on their way to integrating into our culture then, I wonder if they have their own Fianna Fáil cumann yet?

[inexile]

Would you not hear the buttons being pressed? Sense the arm drapped across you pressing the buttons? Or just not spend 2 minutes telling the beggar no?

they are very good at this and very quick, they only have to press one button cos they wait until you have entered your pin.



And you would be the same guy who would cry about how violent the Romas are when they beat seven shades of **** out of you for smacking one of them?

no, i wouldnt complain at all live by the sword, die by the sword.



Go down to Cork, plenty of Irish people begging down there, a few of whom have houses and draw the dole, not just the Romas who do this I'm afraid

Come up to Dublin, mainly Roma Gypsies begging here, not denying there is dishonest Irish either, it just appears to me that we are getting the worst of these people into this country

So from your points you want them kicked out for being begging and stealing? How about other foreigners who beg and steal? How about Irish people who beg and steal?

As i said before begging is not against the law anymore, but yes any person that comes into this country to steal and rob people I certainly dont want them here, there is enough Iirsh people here to do that

Cue people calling me a bleeding heart liberal

and i wouldnt dream of calling you names

[GavinZac]

Roma gypsies have been doing this for centuries. Having worked in a supermarket, I can tell you there is no quicker way to make room on the shelves than to turn a blind eye to them for a minute. they wear those baggy shawls for a reason.

I'm all for an open market and they have every right to live here as EU citizens, but damn it when its blatantly obvious that virtually every one of them just wants to leech from society, it really is a case of "theres always one that'll ruin it for the rest". and now some judge has made it legal for them to actually actively approach you for money on the streets, where in the past they could just shake their tins.

jebus, they were probably different people but outside the brog one night i had a tenner for a cab snatched from my hand by one of them and they pelted it down the road. yes, they are human and one of them gave you a euro but, as a whole, ireland would be better off excluding gypsies from residency some how, or cracking down on them and making it less attractive here so they feck off back to france and germany where they've plagued since the middle ages.

[Block G Raptor]

apparently there are upwards of 9,000 Roma in Ireland now and only around 200 have applied for pps numbers

[Dodge]

apparently there are upwards of 9,000 Roma in Ireland now and only around 200 have applied for pps numbers

Source?

[Block G Raptor]

Source?

More Hearsay really, One of the Security People on the Luas told Me:o

[jebus]

jebus, they were probably different people but outside the brog one night i had a tenner for a cab snatched from my hand by one of them and they pelted it down the road. yes, they are human and one of them gave you a euro but, as a whole, ireland would be better off excluding gypsies from residency some how, or cracking down on them and making it less attractive here so they feck off back to france and germany where they've plagued since the middle ages.

There was once a time that the Irish were seen as parasites invading certain countries as well lads. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the sun shines from the Romas, I just take issue with people saying they should be beaten up for begging, and told my one euro story as a means of showing that they are not all bad.

As for getting rid of them, Italy has been trying for years to do the same with little success, so I don't think there's much chance of us doing it. That said I do see that it will be hard to integrate such a closed community into our society, but I'm sure people said the same of Irish travellers at one stage

[Block G Raptor]

The Conclusion that Roma are akin to Irish travelers is way wide of the mark, whilst some travelers may not be exactly what you'd call "Model Citizens" I think even they would baulk at the carry on of the Roma, The Roma are more akin to Organised Criminals than Travelers, In that they have one goal and purpose in life and that is to grab what they can from whom they can in any way legal or illegal that they can, This maybe their "culture" -and I use the term lightly- but can we really call being all the worst aspects of the human race a culture?

[Dodge]

More Hearsay really, One of the Security People on the Luas told Me:o

had a feeling it'd be that reliable...

[jebus]

The Conclusion that Roma are akin to Irish travelers is way wide of the mark

Never said they were akin to Irish Travellers, I said the view that we will not be able to intigrate them into our society is akin to the same idea that we couldn't 'settle the traveller'.

[Block G Raptor]

I think it would be a lot easier to "Settle a Traveller" as you put it than it would to get Roma Gypsies to resemble decent human beings, ffs most of the traveller culture is derived from Irish culture of the past that we "Settled" people have moved on from, we have absolutely nothing in common with the Roma

[jebus]

I think it would be a lot easier to "Settle a Traveller" as you put it than it would to get Roma Gypsies to resemble decent human beings, ffs most of the traveller culture is derived from Irish culture of the past that we "Settled" people have moved on from, we have absolutely nothing in common with the Roma

Except for the curse of humanity of course

[micls]

I think it would be a lot easier to "Settle a Traveller" as you put it than it would to get Roma Gypsies to resemble decent human beings, ffs most of the traveller culture is derived from Irish culture of the past that we "Settled" people have moved on from, we have absolutely nothing in common with the Roma

Define a decent human being?

[Block G Raptor]

Define a decent human being?

One who's purpose for existence goes beyond Begging and stealing for a start

[micls]

One who's purpose for existence goes beyond Begging and stealing for a start

Is someones purpose for existence simply what they do for money?

I know mine certainly isn't

I would challenge the claim that all Roma's steal.

So taking the begging. Does begging mean you are not a decent human being? If so why?

[Block G Raptor]

Is someones purpose for existence simply what they do for money?

I know mine certainly isn't

I would challenge the claim that all Roma's steal.

So taking the begging. Does begging mean you are not a decent human being? If so why?

Begging out of necessity certainly does not mean someone is not a decent human being, Begging, stealing, scamming, leeching and generally making a nuscence of your self as a way of life, in my opinion does not make a decent human being

Also I've been to Romania and seen how these so called Gypsies live there, believe me they are far from destitute in their own country

[micls]

Begging out of necessity certainly does not mean someone is not a decent human being, Begging, stealing, scamming, leeching and generally making a nuscence of you self as a way of life, in my opinion does not make a decent human being

Again I refute the claim that ALL Roma's steal, and scam.

You claimed it would be very difficult to turn them into decent human beings. SO by your definition choosing to beg means you are not a decent human being? Or am I picking you up wrong.

Do you feel the same about those who choose to be on the dole or live of social welfare payments?

Personally I think there is a lot more to being a decent human being that how you legally make your money.

[jebus]

One who's purpose for existence goes beyond Begging and stealing for a start

A lot of Irish people beg and steal in, say, London, should they all be treated as filth? Should they be kicked out of England at the earliest chance? Should we let them back into this country is they are sub-human? If not what should we do with them?

[Block G Raptor]

Personally I think there is a lot more to being a decent human being that how you legally make your money.
Well you've hit the nail on the head right there. of course how you legally make money does not define how decent you are, But if you illegally make it (refute all you want, it is overwhelmingly evident in this city that vast vast vast Majority of Roma would rob the eye out of your head quicker than look at you)then that defines what kind of person you are, talk to any European who has experience of these people in their own country and they will tell you they are nothing but parasites who take what they can get where they can get it and by any means neccessary, the fact that the majority of them are undocumented also means that they can operate with reletive impunity from the law unless they are caught red-handed

[micls]

Well you've hit the nail on the head right there. of course how you legally make money does not define how decent you are,
And as begging is legal then this culture of the Roma's does not define how decent they are.


But if you illegally make it (refute all you want, it is overwhelmingly evident in this city that vast vast vast Majority of Roma would rob the eye out of your head quicker than look at you)
Overwhelmingly evident to who? You? How many ROmas have you or people you know seen doing this? Is there any proof or just presumptions based on a stereotype.

I dont doubt there are many Romas who steal, scam etc. but Im certain there are many Irish worldwide that do the same.

However your claim was that it is very very difficult to make a Roma(implying any) into a decent human being.

There are varying statistics but it is estimated there are anywhere between 1700 and 3000 Romas in Ireland.

Are the vast vast vast majority of these thieves? Lets say 95% or between 1620(if theres 1700) and 1850(if 3000)?

[Ringo]

Source?

13,000 Romanians issued with just 110 work permits

http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/frontpage/2007/1117/1195251355745.html

No break down of what percentage are Roma.

[Lim till i die]

A lot of Irish people beg and steal in, say, London, should they all be treated as filth? Should they be kicked out of England at the earliest chance?

Yes to both tbh.


13,000 Romanians issued with just 110 work permits

http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/fro...251355745.html

No break down of what percentage are Roma.

Take 110 from 13,000 and multiply by 100/1 to get the percentage ;) :p

[BohsPartisan]

SO they beg. They are no worse than those Charity Muggers or the c*nts that come to my door asking to see my phone bill so they can "save me money". They're certainly not as bad as the "great and the good" who rip us off at every available opportunity. Why is it when you have a rich guy on the take and a poor guy on the take, the poor guy is the scapegoat for the ills of society?

[GavinZac]

A lot of Irish people beg and steal in, say, London, should they all be treated as filth? Should they be kicked out of England at the earliest chance? Should we let them back into this country is they are sub-human?As filth? No. Sub-human? No. As beggers and stealers? Yes. For feck sake,
If not what should we do with them?Put them in jail if/when they steal or harass someone.

To take a Fine Gael tactic here, I'll go with an anecdote. One day last march, all the daffodils along the public park near county hall on the lee fields were plucked from the ground. Odd?

The next day, the Roma's had replaced their plastic roses with daffodils, and were selling stolen public property on the Irish Cancer Society's Daffodil Day.

The thing is, its women and kids selling these things. The men are their 'security'; and more than likely the ones who put them out there in the first place.


SO they beg. They are no worse than those Charity Muggers or the c*nts that come to my door asking to see my phone bill so they can "save me money". They're certainly not as bad as the "great and the good" who rip us off at every available opportunity. Why is it when you have a rich guy on the take and a poor guy on the take, the poor guy is the scapegoat for the ills of society?I pay my taxes and donate to charity so that my money at leas has a chance to go to those who can't work to keep themselves living decent lives. Why would I give my money to someone who had the money to get here via flights to and from Paris, and then the cheek to push their baby and a coffee cup in my face?

[BohsPartisan]

I pay my taxes and donate to charity so that my money at leas has a chance to go to those who can't work to keep themselves living decent lives. Why would I give my money to someone who had the money to get here via flights to and from Paris, and then the cheek to push their baby and a coffee cup in my face?

Did I tell you to give them money? However you do give money to Bertie Ahern and his ilk. Your tax money has subsidised Ryanair and the parasites that ripped off aer lingus and a whole host of other welfare programs to the rich. At least you have a choice about giving to beggars.

[GavinZac]

Did I tell you to give them money? However you do give money to Bertie Ahern and his ilk. Your tax money has subsidised Ryanair and the parasites that ripped off aer lingus and a whole host of other welfare programs to the rich. At least you have a choice about giving to beggars.
I have a choice about paying tax too. I can vote for who I want and if I don't like it I can try to find a better candidate who actually has the ability to get himself elected, I can stand myself, or I can leave and go work, legally, in any EU member state.

Kudos on the petty political dig ignoring how ridiculous your "poor guy takes on the rich guy" malarky is. For feck sake, if they picked up a guitar and played me a b'astardised version of BandAid I might be tempted to throw a euro their way. If someone makes no effort to stand on their own two feet they aren't some poor man hero, they're a leech and spitting in the faces of people who at least try.

[sullanefc]

Take 110 from 13,000 and multiply by 100/1 to get the percentage ;) :p

Where did you go to school?? Check your maths!!


If someone makes no effort to stand on their own two feet they aren't some poor man hero, they're a leech and spitting in the faces of people who at least try.

Spot on.

[BohsPartisan]

I have a choice about paying tax too. I can vote for who I want and if I don't like it I can try to find a better candidate who actually has the ability to get himself elected, I can stand myself, or I can leave and go work, legally, in any EU member state.



How likely is any of that happening other than the last bit though? And at the end of it all are you saying you willfully get ripped off by politicians and billionaires? You have to pay tax, its the law. My point is that the begging of the Roma is only a drop in the ocean compared to what rich people on the take are getting out of us.

[Block G Raptor]

My point is that the begging of the Roma is only a drop in the ocean compared to what rich people on the take are getting out of us.

I think your missing the Point BP, it's not the begging as such that people have the problem with, its more to do with the fact that the Roma came all this way to Ireland with the intension of begging, it has little to do with how much they are getting, and more to do with how little they contribute. I for one am sick and tired of hearing do gooders like Pavee Point et al telling us what a wonderful multi cultural society Ireland is becoming, I dont see any evidence to back up their claims, all I see is ghetto's and leeches. can anyone on here give me any redeeming feature about these people?

rant over

[Magicme]

They keep their houses spotlessly clean, are talented welders and artisans, my fathers Goddaugher is a delightful young girl, they are very generous people desipte having feck all.

Whats the value of any society other than to live and let live.

If I arrived in a country and wasnt allowed work for years, was marginalised and ghettoised like these people have, I dont think I would be overly keen to start earning money and paying taxes to the people that have shat on me for 6 years.

That said, I know a few Roma lads who are working hard and contributing to society.

[Block G Raptor]

are talented welders and artisans, .

Then why don't they sell their wares instead of shoving a paper cup in my face and lifting my wallet on the LUAS

[BohsPartisan]

I think your missing the Point BP, it's not the begging as such that people have the problem with, its more to do with the fact that the Roma came all this way to Ireland with the intension of begging, it has little to do with how much they are getting, and more to do with how little they contribute. I for one am sick and tired of hearing do gooders like Pavee Point et al telling us what a wonderful multi cultural society Ireland is becoming, I dont see any evidence to back up their claims, all I see is ghetto's and leeches. can anyone on here give me any redeeming feature about these people?

rant over

I think they came all the way to Ireland with the intention of escaping persecution, not the famed generosity of the gullible gael.
Anyway, you could say the same of the Milesians!

[jebus]

Then why don't they sell their wares instead of shoving a paper cup in my face and lifting my wallet on the LUAS

So if they came to your door selling their wares you wouldn't come on here complaining about them calling to your door and bothering you? Plus you're generalising again, oh and there's another Irish forum where this type of nonsense, and your other thread would be more suited too as well, let's just call it S.Front

[Magicme]

Then why don't they sell their wares instead of shoving a paper cup in my face and lifting my wallet on the LUAS

Because our government have repressed their people by consigning them to the dung heap of society so they cant be bothered anymore.

I worked with the first group of Roma who came to Ireland on the container at Wexford and 9 years on I can see how they have become victims of our goverments "caring", bordering on racism, stance on asylum seekers.

[monutdfc]

It was Mary Harney who revoked asylum seekers' right to work

[Magicme]

You would think that no Irish person had ever robbed or begged on the streets to hear some of you. Go back to your history of when the Irish moved to the likes of New York and the hassle some caused there. Prostitution, gangs, drunken lazy louts, etc. You cant paint everyone with the same brush.

[Block G Raptor]

Because our government have repressed their people by consigning them to the dung heap of society so they cant be bothered anymore.

.
in that case explain to me why they involve themselves in the same activity in Romainia, Bulgaria and what ever other countries they Migrate to, I suppose it the governments of those countries fault too :rolleyes:

And to and answer your question, Jebus. Yes I would be interested in buying some artisan wares from them as I collect ethnic sculpture(usually when abroad)
but would much rather they set up a stall in a market or a shop than going door to door

[Magicme]

Shock horror! Imagine that Gypsies being mistreated by other goverments....no no it would never happen. I suggest you read up on some of the problems the Roma have faced in many countries including their own to enlighten you.

We are not the first and will not be the last to allienate them and push them into a sub-class but I had hoped that us "kind caring fun" Irish might rise above that and give the poor feckers a chance. Some hope when B***cks Bertie & Co are in charge.

I could tell you personal stories from the Roma I know showing how they were treated in the post-communisim regime but I know will be wasting my time as you have your mind made up.

Go listen to Michael Franti and try to learn some compassion.