Roche criticises Thomas Davis letter

[s-side hoop]

Irish Times 18.04.07

Roche criticises Thomas Davis letter
Emmet Malone Soccer correspondent

Wed, Apr 18, 2007

Tallaght Stadium controversy:Shamrock Rovers chairman Jonathan Roche has described as "a disgrace" a letter sent earlier this month by his counterpart at Thomas Davis, Christopher O'Donnell, to members of the GAA club in relation to the issue of access to the stadium proposed for Tallaght.

Roche also says that an item of supporting documentation, which accompanied the letter, is "riddled with factual inaccuracies".

In the letter, dated April 7th, O'Donnell encourages members to make an election issue of the club's fight to win access to the stadium and provides detailed instruction to members on how the issue should be raised with politicians during the forthcoming election campaign.

He also suggests they should not support local Fianna Fail TD Conor Lenihan, a Minister for State at the Department of Foreign Affairs, because he has recently signalled to club officials his support for the line taken by John O'Donoghue, that Government funding for the project be conditional upon it being used solely for soccer. O'Donnell says the politician has been informed he will not be welcome at the club until the GAA is accommodated at the stadium.

Lenihan said last night that while he was aware of the letter's content he found it both "surprising and ironic" that he first heard about it last Thursday night while attending a charity fund-raiser at the club. "I was being treated to drinks by senior members of the club and talking to a couple of former players who were special guests at the function when somebody approached me solemnly and presented me with a copy of the letter. Given how welcome I was made to feel on the night, I haven't really bothered to pursue the matter."

While O'Donnell clearly suggests to members in the letter that Thomas Davis and GAA other clubs in the area have been warned their stand on Tallaght might preclude them from receiving funds under the Government's Sports Capital Programme, Lenihan points out that one reason he believes he was made so welcome at the function was the news the club had just been allocated some €200,000 under the scheme.

"There seems to have been a suggestion that they couldn't benefit from Sports Capital Programme funding but as a result of the type of representations made by me, amongst others, the club received €200,000 only last week and I have been instrumental in obtaining over €600,000 in funding for Thomas Davis over the last few years. It is a matter of deep regret that we should have such a deep division between supporters of two sporting codes, and people on both sides of this debate have gone too far in what they have said at times. It would still be a concern of mine, however, that if Thomas Davis are successful in having the stadium opened then it may be the case that other clubs will take cases to have facilities already funded and built opened up too."

Within Rovers, meanwhile, there is disquiet over what the club's officials see as the latest attempt to undermine their attempts to get into the Tallaght development. In O'Donnell's letter he states on a number of occasions that Thomas Davis did not want to do this and that they did not intend either to dispute their neighbour's status as "anchor tenants" at the stadium.

However, Rovers' club secretary Noel Byrne points to a letter written in September 2005 by another Thomas Davis official, David Kennedy, to Dublin County Board chief executive John Costello as evidence that the club's public position cannot be readily taken at face value. In that letter Kennedy notes that in communications with South Dublin County Council, which is to complete the stadium, Thomas Davis have accepted the facility will also be used for soccer. "Tactically," he writes, "I think that has to be right for now. I'm confident (however) that in any bout with Rovers," he concludes, "that the GAA will be the last man standing."

Byrne believes the lack of any attempt by Thomas Davis to build trust between the two clubs in the aftermath of that letter becoming public calls into doubt anything that the GAA outfit might say now. "We continue to take advice on the situation while watching with amazement the activities of Thomas Davis and nothing they have done to date would suggest to us that they want to forge a long-term relationship with Shamrock Rovers" he says.

On this occasion a number of documents are attached to the letter including a circular from Costello to members of the GAA's central council in which a brief synopsis of the Tallaght stadium story to date is provided. Roche says this document is "riddled with factual inaccuracies" and that the overall tone of the new letter is similar to Kennedy's.

"They claim no Shamrock Rovers money went into what has been built so far but that's simply not true," he says. "The 400 club alone provided over €100,000 for the payment of professional fees and other items related to the project.

"Now, setting all of that aside, I have no problem whatsoever with junior gaelic or hockey or any other type of sporting contest being staged at this stadium as long as it doesn't require changes (an enlarged pitch) that substantially impact on and delay its delivery but that is precisely what Thomas Davis appear determined to achieve."

[harry crumb]

Thomas Davis are down on the canvas, Rovers with a nice shot there. Davis left themselves very vulnerable there Bob.

[Calcio Jack]

Well fair play to the IT in that they've moved what 'till now was seen as a sports story into the realm of a full blooded news story.... and more importantly have highlighted the fact that much of what TD said in thier letter and supoorting documnets to their members are in fact 'untruths' the most glaring one bein the fact that thy have actually received recently themselves a substantial grant from the Dept of Sports (ie John O'Donoghues dept) of €200,000.Hopefully there will be moreof this type of press coverage and the balance of public opinion will swing fully in Rovers favour

However the fact still remains that by pursuing the legal route TD can still cause substantial delays to the Tallaght project , so we have to hope that (1) the Judicial Review is completed quickly or (2) The ordinary decent members of TD see that their club is being used in a selfish manner by a few and revolt against that continuing in order to protect the good name of heir club before it is damaged beyond repair.

To ensure that they need to quickly convince their executive commitee to drop the JD. To do so would not in any way be a cause of a loss of face but would be viewed by the majority of decent sports loving people as an act of sporting bravery which would be applauded by the vast vast majority of decent people in Tallaght and through ou the country no matter what their sports affilliation..... so the question is, has TD the moral courage to take that step or will they be lead into a morass of legal bills and confrontation...which ironicly will only serve to deny the people and especially the children of Tallaght the opporunity to have a super stadium delivered to their doorstep which will be avaialble for use by both Rovers and underage GAA teams.

[Row Z]

The Fact that TD has recently recieved €200k and are still objecting to the stadium is an outright disgrace.At least Mr Lenihan made sure that the Irish Times were aware of this. I wonder what the majority of Thomas Davis' members think of the issue?the lads who play on the 2nd/3rd team etc, surely they dont agree with the heirachy at their club and the hardline/neo nazi stance of Mr O'Donnell...

[OneRedArmy]

2 articles in the Indo also today, one balanced, one very pro-GAA (which probably counts as impartial in this country :rolleyes: ).

The PR war is obviously in full swing.

One of the Indo articles is highly amusing in that it puts forward the pro's and con's of each side (public money, Rathcoole etc.) and then finishes up by saying that the GAA are fearful of Tallaght turning into an Association Football stronghold.

They could've saved themselves the bother and just printed the last last line.

[srfc-1901]

I wonder what the majority of Thomas Davis' members think of the issue?the lads who play on the 2nd/3rd team etc, surely they dont agree with the heirachy at their club and the hardline/neo nazi stance of Mr O'Donnell...

Any Thomas davis player i`ve spoken to about it couldnt give a toss about the whole thing and dont really understand what all of the fuss is about

[passerrby]

if TD wish to make this a election issue then i hope rovers do likewise especially in tallagh

[hoops1]

Maybe this plays into our hands because as long as FF get back into power they will want to put TD in their place

[michaelguineys]

God i hate the GAA

[drummerboy]

There is a poll on the Evening herald website asking if Tallaght Stadium should be used for GAA. 60% in favour of it being used

You can vote below but you need to register

http://www.evening-herald.ie/sportsdesk/football/

[hoops1]

Give me five minutes i will fix that a couple of hundred no votes should do it

[Aberdonian Stu]

I didn't need to register and I voted.

Oh and in case you were wondering I voted No.

As someone that has been heavily involved in both the GAA and Association Football it sickens me to see Thomas Davis and by extension the County Board acting in such a manner.

[Fester]

There is a poll on the Evening herald website asking if Tallaght Stadium should be used for GAA. 60% in favour of it being used

You can vote below but you need to register

http://www.evening-herald.ie/sportsdesk/football/

This link has been passed on. We have all voted no.

The vote as it stands is 46.1 Yes and 53.9 No ;)

[dcfcsteve]

You can vote without being registered. I suspect you need to be registered to post a comment though.

Vote is narrowly in our favour at the mo. I'm gonna post a link on the DCFC site to this, and I suggest other supporters do the same with their clubs.

We need strong solidarity on this issue, and a clear message communicated via this poll.

[BohDiddley]

You can vote without being registered. I suspect you need to be registered to post a comment though.

Vote is narrowly in our favour at the mo. I'm gonna post a link on the DCFC site to this, and I suggest other supporters do the same with their clubs.

We need strong solidarity on this issue, and a clear message communicated via this poll.
Agreed.

[charliesboots]

Yeah I'd say the poll is gonna have a huge impact on the judicial review proceedings. :rolleyes:

[WeAreRovers]

The PR war is obviously in full swing.



Well done to Rovers PR department. ;)

"The Star has obtained a copy of the memo" :cool: :D

KOH

[Raheny Red]

Yes
44.4%
No
55.6%

[dcfcsteve]

Yeah I'd say the poll is gonna have a huge impact on the judicial review proceedings. :rolleyes:

Cynic.

It's a small link in the PR/publicity battle. Every link in a chain has a role to play.

56.5% 'no' now........ :)

[charliesboots]

Cynic.

It's a small link in the PR/publicity battle. Every link in a chain has a role to play.

56.5% 'no' now........ :)

I voted in it and voted no. I live in Tallaght and will be discussing it with policiticians on the door step. I just think people are getting carried away with the poll, particularly as its been run by the Herald who will prob fix the results to suit themselves anyway.

[dcfcsteve]

I voted in it and voted no. I live in Tallaght and will be discussing it with policiticians on the door step. I just think people are getting carried away with the poll, particularly as its been run by the Herald who will prob fix the results to suit themselves anyway.

Well - like most EL fans I'm annoyed at what is happening to Rovers over this, and it's the only opportunity I have to do anything or say anything about it. So fot hat alone, I value this poll.

I don't care how insignificant you think such a poll is - it still exists. The more skirmishes and battles you win, the more chance you have of winning the war. Simple as.

[charliesboots]

Well - like most EL fans I'm annoyed at what is happening to Rovers over this, and it's the only opportunity I have to do anything or say anything about it. So fot hat alone, I value this poll.

I don't care how insignificant you think such a poll is - it still exists. The more skirmishes and battles you win, the more chance you have of winning the war. Simple as.

Don't fancy a seven page "discussion" with you Steve so we'll leave it at that. Thanks.

[jebus]

just voted no and it now stands

Yes - 38.4%

No - 61.6%

[dcfcsteve]

Don't fancy a seven page "discussion" with you Steve so we'll leave it at that. Thanks.

Stroppy ! :) I said my bit in my last post - no need for a 7 page "discussion" at all.

[passerrby]

just voted will pass on info to other sports fans

[OneRedArmy]

I also love the way TD's have "banned" Conor Lenihan from their clubhouse for the position he's taken.

Old habits die hard.

Inclusive organisation my hole......

[Erstwhile Bóz]

It doesn't specify what level of GAA matches. What way do all the Rovers officials who keep stating their hearts' desire to see underage GAA matches played there vote?

Could it be that a poll in the effing Herald is not the best way to decide this? :eek:

[WeAreRovers]

I also love the way TD's have "banned" Conor Lenihan from their clubhouse for the position he's taken.

Old habits die hard.

Inclusive organisation my hole......

And he only found out he was banned while attending a function in TD's clubhouse to announce €200,000 in grant aid for them. :eek:

This was exactly the hypocrisy, arrogance and disdain towards democracy that we wanted to highlight by getting the TD memo into the public domain.

KOH

[Dodge]

"Now, setting all of that aside, I have no problem whatsoever with junior gaelic or hockey or any other type of sporting contest being staged at this stadium "
Rovers leaving themselves open to "sure why would you have objections, you've no fecking say in who uses the stadium anyway" type response there...

[pete]

I don't think making this an election favours Rovers as it just ensures it will drag on for longer which only benefits Thomas Davis. Now that the GAA heirarchy are supporting this is means all the GAA are Bas****s.

If Rovers want good PR they should concentrate on the pitch size issue especially with memory of the Croke Park football international fresh. Rovers should stress that they don't object to GAA games that can be played on football(soccer) size pitch as it will completely undermine the GAA. Rovers could also mention that the pitch may not be able to take many more than 40 games a year as its a current topic with Croke Park due to only a few football & rugby games been played there.

:mad:

[hoops1]

It shows that we are not against GAA games being played there, just the delaying tactic used by TD:rolleyes:
Making it an election issue plays into our hands imo, FF "should" be returned to power and are they going to give TD there way
if they are back in government?

[Dr.Nightdub]

Didn't some bigwig on the Dublin County Board come out with something about the need for a new (i.e. built from scratch i.e. not in Tallaght) govt-funded GAA stadium for south Dublin some time in the last week? Think it was either in last Saturday's I.Times or the previous Sunday's Tribune.

If so, it'd appear the bogballers are preparing their exit strategy already - no need for GAA in Rovers' stadiium if Thomas Davis have their own club ground around the corner and Dublin Co. Board have a separate ground for non-Croke Park matches.

[pete]

Didn't some bigwig on the Dublin County Board come out with something about the need for a new (i.e. built from scratch i.e. not in Tallaght) govt-funded GAA stadium for south Dublin some time in the last week? Think it was either in last Saturday's I.Times or the previous Sunday's Tribune.

Yeah, they were talking about maybe a roof too. :rolleyes:

[OneRedArmy]

Didn't some bigwig on the Dublin County Board come out with something about the need for a new (i.e. built from scratch i.e. not in Tallaght) govt-funded GAA stadium for south Dublin some time in the last week? Think it was either in last Saturday's I.Times or the previous Sunday's Tribune.

If so, it'd appear the bogballers are preparing their exit strategy already - no need for GAA in Rovers' stadiium if Thomas Davis have their own club ground around the corner and Dublin Co. Board have a separate ground for non-Croke Park matches.
New 20,000 capacity replacement for Parnell Park, I think it was in the Turbine.

[holidaysong]

Voted no and it is now 40% - 60%.

[jebus]

Making it an election issue plays into our hands imo, FF "should" be returned to power and are they going to give TD there way
if they are back in government?

If I have to endure another few years of Fianna Fail though I'll top myself, try pushing this issue with Labour/Fine Gael and see if you can get them to commit to backing Rovers in the same way FF have

[Jerry The Saint]

If Rovers want good PR they should concentrate on the pitch size issue especially with memory of the Croke Park football international fresh. Rovers should stress that they don't object to GAA games that can be played on football(soccer) size pitch as it will completely undermine the GAA.

The Croke Park example may be slightly misleading though as that is quite a large GAA pitch. Minimum adult pitch size is 130m x 80m.

How big is the Tallaght pitch under the existing plans?

Also, how much money are SRFC putting into the development and have Thomas Davis made any comment about matching this or coming up with extra funds to pay for changes to accomodate a larger pitch?

[Lim till i die]

Just voted "No"

17 times

I've seen some pointless polls in my life but.........

[s-side hoop]

If I have to endure another few years of Fianna Fail though I'll top myself, try pushing this issue with Labour/Fine Gael and see if you can get them to commit to backing Rovers in the same way FF have

FF are standing for common sense on this matter, Labour have always been pro Rovers on the Tallaght issue but a vote for them is a vote for FG/Rainbow Coalition, FG - well they would be gaa to the core so theres no point in asking them, in my constituency 2 of the 3 FG candidates are staunch gaa men one of them even started the gaa interference in tallaght. i would be doubtful fg would give their support.

[Row Z]

I think there something in Mondays Herald and Dublin County Board confirmed that GAA HQ are going ahead with a 20,000 seater stadium at Abbotstown??? Adamstown?? not 100% on the location,just read it in passing...

[Dodge]

What Brennan actually said was they wanted the Govt to build a 20,000 stadium at Abbotstown and allow the GAA to run it. Said they need it it for club, college, schools games as well as "commuter counties" like Laois, Kildare etc. Said something along the lines of "Obviously it makes sense for us to allow other sports be played there from time to time" but he gave the definite impression it was to be a GAA ground first and foremost

[khoop]

The Croke Park example may be slightly misleading though as that is quite a large GAA pitch. Minimum adult pitch size is 130m x 80m

Thomas Davis want 140 x 85 in Tallaght. That's a massive 160 x 93 when run-off on the sidelines and behind the posts is included.

Would anybody want to watch a soccer match from behind the goal, when the goal is about 30 metres away???

[khoop]

What Brennan actually said was they wanted the Govt to build a 20,000 stadium at Abbotstown and allow the GAA to run it

Yep - that's another stadium they want to annex. Their astonishing arrogance clearly knows no bounds.

[passinginterest]

Read about the Abbotstown plans too, meant to mention it here and totally forgot.

GAA seemed adamant that it would be their stadium and new home base for Dublin county board.

Suggested that other codes might be accomodate if they asked very, very, very, lick those boots, nicely.

It's a faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar ce!!

[TonyD]

20,000 seater stadium is a good idea (ideal size for FAI cup finals for example). Should be open to all sports, but under no circumstances should the GAA be allowed to run it.

[pete]

I am open to correction but I think the GAA got 29,000 at Croke Park for last weekends Football League Final. They got 21,000 for double header hurling semi final at Limerick or Thurles. How many 20,000 crowd games do they think they will get? Have Dublin GAA ever filled Parnell Park?

:rolleyes:

[Réiteoir]

Lads:

http://www.anfearrua.com/db.asp?a=topicdisplay&tid=326372&xpos=50

This is a right read - ignorant GAH muckswimmers branding all Ultras as "Hooligans" and the reason why no-one wants to go to eL matches.


I can understand loyalists dressed in orange, but loyalists dressed in green are beyond contempt.
Bohs were set up by the British Army afaik. Open to correction on this but I think they were initially set up as a hobby for the occupying forces at the turn of the century.
hooligans taking the high road, priceless
But yea, keep kidding yourself that they've no use for it. Just like it'd be "useless" for soccer if it was extended. You just don't want to share, admit it, it's obvious.

[CollegeTillIDie]

I voted NO and I maintain that none of the Eircom League of Ireland fans based in the greater Dublin area who voted NO, should attend any games under the auspices of either the Dublin County Board, or the GAA itself from now on until they back off over Tallaght Stadium.

In other words No soccer fans in Croker for GAA matches this summer....

[gspain]

I love the hooligans thing. Last weekend a GAA game was abandoned after a massive free for all involving players and spectators in Tyrone. In Derry a referee was manhandled and the visiting team locked in their dressingroom for 50 minutes after the game for their own safety.

They do however do a good job of covering things up and watering them down.

[Lim till i die]

I am open to correction but I think the GAA got 29,000 at Croke Park for last weekends Football League Final. They got 21,000 for double header hurling semi final at Limerick or Thurles. Have Dublin GAA ever filled Parnell Park?


Was in Thurles

How often does the Eircom League get 20000+ for anything, let alone fairly meaningless games??

Being flippant about their support when it dwarfs our leagues is a bit silly really


How many 20,000 crowd games do they think they will get?

Dozens during the summer in all fairness