Irish UK Club Football Bangwagon Jumpers -Irish Footballs Number 1 enemy

[bohsRap]

and the attitude expressed earlier about money going out of the country into a foreign economy is similar to the attitude of dev and the earlier governments! keep irish, be irish, buy irish, move on lads that attitude was outdated 60 years ago, we live in a multi-national society. a global economy, a global society, foreign investment, multi-national companies.....



I wouldn't entirely agree. I think the "buy Irish" attitude is still prevalent today and it has helped make Ireland what it is. We normally try and invest in all things Irish, foreign investment only occurs when no Irish product is available. If you cannot see Irish football expanding into a potentially successful and maintainable league then you mustn't be with the times at all.

[pete]

But what does annoy me a little bit is the massive exposure they get in the Irish media. RTE will give one Championship result - the Sunderland one. The Times or Independent will give one Championship match report - The Sunderland one.

Sunderland paid Irish journalists for junkets to Sunderland at the start of the season & got articles written on that basis. I was particularly disappointed that the Irish Times fell for that as I expected better standards. With the blatant promotion of Sunderland as an oirish club I expect the mascot will be a leprechaun soon. :rolleyes:

For what its worth while Keane has clearly done a good job the Championship is relatively poor standard (inability to pass & long ball) so any team can string results together & get promoted. Mick McCarthy got them promoted a few years ago with worse team but as few funds to improve they got relegated next season. Keane will need 2 seasons in the Premiership to be rated.

Sunderlands success or otherwise has no affect on the LOI as its a completely different market. The type of person who latches onto Sunderland because a few irish players there is not likely to watch live LOI football.

[gustavo]

It's very dissapointing for me as an eircom League fan to see the minimum amount of coverage the league gets and now a 2nd tier English team is starting to get more and more coverage because they are "Irish" now , not Sunderlands fault but frustrating nonetheless.

[pete]

It's very dissapointing for me as an eircom League fan to see the minimum amount of coverage the league gets and now a 2nd tier English team is starting to get more and more coverage because they are "Irish" now , not Sunderlands fault but frustrating nonetheless.

There is a certain amount of interest but IMO it is largely media driven. i.e. the media has given them the exposure to drive the interest.

[paudie]

There is a certain amount of interest but IMO it is largely media driven. i.e. the media has given them the exposure to drive the interest.

I agree.

I've no problem with articles about the Irish angle in Sunderland provided they are balanced with articles on interesting developments in domestic football eg. new owners and potential developments at Dundalk,Wexford, St PAts. New stadium at Athlone etc.

Certainly the Irish Times doesn't seem t ohave taken any interest in these matters.

[Réiteoir]

The kind of people who are being sucked in by the Sunderland hype will never support an Irish club so they are irrelevant. We need to focus on those who have a slight affinity to local clubs, who might go to the odd game, and make them more open to the notion of coming to games more often.
The LOI has nothing to offer daytrippers, unless they're English football fans on a weekend away looking for a reminder of how it used to be before the plastic seats and plastic people took over and ruined their game.
I've met loads of Brits who think the LOI is great because they can stand at games here and even switch ends at half-time.

Aye - I've managed to get two English friends interested in the eL - purely on the basis of watching the Bohs - Drogs game at the start of this year over the Internet.

They loved the atmosphere, the "honest" football (tackles flying in, etc.), and the fact it seems like a more "personal" experience.

Shame is - they plumped for following Drogheda :D (although one is a Leeds fan who is a big fan of Gary Kelly)

I'll be bringing them to a couple of games this season - and one of them wants to get a hold of a Drogs jersey...

[Kildare Lad]

Niall Quinn is just doing his job, he never said "dont go to league of ireland games", he is just trying to attract more fans and money to Sunderland AFC.

Its up to the people themselves what they choose to do, and its a pity the FAI or alot clubs in Ireland dont put this much effort into attracting new fans.And the ones that do just dont seem to get much success.

But you cannot seriously blame Niall Quinn for trying to steal fans.

[Billy Lord]

How very bitter you must be.
Not a bit, actually. I just hate that plastic, post-Fever Pitch, Premiership experience. Used to love going to Old Trafford, for example, but it's one of the dullest places on earth now, especially one time (v Real Madrid in 2000) when I was stuck on the third tier and surrounded by drunken paddies who hadn't a clue. It was almost as bad as being in Rathbane.:eek:

[OneRedArmy]

I dont think its Niall Quinn and Sunderland attracting potential customers away from the league it seems to be the attitude of the "fans " of the LOI that will keep people away. The attitudes of some on here sum it all up.Convenient.

And patently untrue.

Open your eyes and recognise the event junkie-ism that we as a nation specialise in.

True football fans watch matches in person on a regular basis, not on a barstool with a pint in one and and a tray of hot nuts in the other.

End of.

[CollegeTillIDie]

The people Quinn is trying to attract to follow Sunderland wore Newcastle and Blackburn shirts in the mid 1990's when those teams were challenging for the title. They are fickle and will abandon the Black Cats once they start losing again , which they will once they are promoted.

As regards Mary Hannigan in the Irish Times buying into the hype, this is the self same newspaper , which was once the paper of record, that has not covered an Eircom League of Ireland First Division League game in over a decade.

Message to Malachy Logan Irish Times Sports Editor '' What country do you think you are living in pal? ''

[pete]

As regards Mary Hannigan in the Irish Times buying into the hype, this is the self same newspaper , which was once the paper of record, that has not covered an Eircom League of Ireland First Division League game in over a decade.

The only non-tv or internet she has written was on Sunderland after the media junket. I expect she will get a daily Sunderland column soon.

[gustavo]

The people Quinn is trying to attract to follow Sunderland wore Newcastle and Blackburn shirts in the mid 1990's when those teams were challenging for the title. They are fickle and will abandon the Black Cats once they start losing again , which they will once they are promoted.

As regards Mary Hannigan in the Irish Times buying into the hype, this is the self same newspaper , which was once the paper of record, that has not covered an Eircom League of Ireland First Division League game in over a decade.

Message to Malachy Logan Irish Times Sports Editor '' What country do you think you are living in pal? ''

It's a lot more convienent for these papers to copy and paste reports about English games from English papers than to actually go to the trouble of having to report on a game here :mad:

[Paddyfield]

From today's Sun Biz Post.....

http://www.thepost.ie/post/pages/p/story.aspx-qqqt=IRELAND-qqqs=news-qqqid=22789-qqqx=1.asp

Sunderland owners on track for promotion windfall

15 April 2007 By Ian Kehoe

The Niall Quinn-led consortium of Irish investors which owns Sunderland FC is in line for a windfall of almost €90 million if the club secures promotion to the Premiership in the coming weeks.

The Niall Quinn-led consortium of Irish investors which owns Sunderland FC is in line for a windfall of almost €90 million if the club secures promotion to the Premiership in the coming weeks.

The bulk of the money will come from television rights and sponsorship revenue, according to the sports consultancy department at Deloitte.

The team is currently in one of the automatic promotion spots in the Championship.

It has also emerged that the Irish shareholders have just agreed a new share rights issue and an eight-figure sum will be made available to the club’s manager, Roy Keane, to spend on strengthening his team regardless of whether it is promoted.





All the original shareholders, which include publicans Charlie Chawke and Louis Fitzgerald, subscribed to the new issue.

The consortium bought the club last July in a deal that valued Sunderland at €70 million. However, stockbroker Brewin Dolphin estimates the club would be worth between €190 million and €200 million if it secures promotion.

Speaking to The Sunday Business Post, Chawke said the consortium planned to reinvest any additional revenues back into the club, if it secured promotion.

‘‘If and when we get promoted, we don’t intend going back down again,” said Chawke.

‘‘The investors are here for the long haul. We have a four-year plan, and we are already way ahead of where we thought we would be.”

[galwayhoop]

I wouldn't entirely agree. I think the "buy Irish" attitude is still prevalent today and it has helped make Ireland what it is. We normally try and invest in all things Irish, foreign investment only occurs when no Irish product is available. .
please give me an example!
go down grafton st, shop street or any major shopping street and count the irish stores. more likely you will find very few with most being major british or multi-national stores.
turn on your tv and see how many irish shows are on during the prime times of 7 - 10 o'clock
flick through the nearest paper and see how many foreign property adverts there are
go to your supermarket and see how many irish products are the main sellers
check the brands on your clothes and how many are irish
listen to your radio and how many artists are irish
where is your tv/radio made
fact is there are few irish products available anymore - you really have to look hard for them, we have become an educated society who are no longer capable of competing with foreign manufacturing in terms of price and production levels.
the reason ireland is 'what it is' has nothing to do with us trying to invest in all things irish but more to do with our joining the EEC (EU) and embracing overseas investors and companies into our country. prior to this successive governments trien to keep all spending in the country and placed burdens on imported products. fact is if we kept up the irish only policies we would never have had the celtic tiger.



If you cannot see Irish football expanding into a potentially successful and maintainable league then you mustn't be with the times at all.
i can and i am ;)

[galwayhoop]

Mick Wallace and Garrett Kelleher might disagree, as might the combined owner-members of several clubs.

i applaud wallace and kelleher, i wish there were more like them, these are the 'sugar daddy' types i spoke of in my earlier post.


It's not a question of patriotism or xenophobia. It's a matter of engagement with the sport where you live. Your reducing everything to some quack-modern version of a globalised economy is, quite frankly, depressing. If you think football is all about money, then I suggest that you take a short cut and simply follow the stock markets instead.


professional football, by it's very defination, is indeed all about money. if you think it is not then you are deluded. not from the supporters but at management and board level and also at playing level. yes the supporters have an unwavering attachment to their team, usually due to geograpical reasons or sometimes other reasons. but in 99% of cases football clubs are run as businesses and have to be in order to survive. unfortunately like most things in modern society the romance and culture are being replaced by balance sheets and profit margins!

[dcfcsteve]

The Niall Quinn-led consortium of Irish investors which owns Sunderland FC is in line for a windfall of almost €90 million if the club secures promotion to the Premiership in the coming weeks.

The consortium bought the club last July in a deal that valued Sunderland at €70 million. However, stockbroker Brewin Dolphin estimates the club would be worth between €190 million and €200 million if it secures promotion.



That, ladies and gentlemen, are why these guys are involved in Sunderland.

They're business people involved in a business venture. Irish football would bleed them dry of resources, so would be a rubbish business investment. And as they ahev no connection to Irish football personally, they can hardly be expexcted to squander their cash on us as a rich man's folly.

If it was English hotels or houses or holiday companies they wede invested in we wouldn't be batting an eyelid. Can I remind you all again that no-one owes Irish football a favour.

Irish football's Number 1 enemy is not Niall Quiin - a man with a job to do and who is doing it well. Irish football's number 1 enemy is the Irish people, who turn their backs on football here and therefore make it part of Niall Quinn's job to target them for his club.

We need to stop throwing a jealous hissy fit because we're unloved, deal with the reality of the situation, and work to change it. Niall Quinn owes us nothing, those Irish investors own us nothing, and they've all done nothing wrong. It's time EL supporters grew up and realised that.

[BohDiddley]

That, ladies and gentlemen, are why these guys are involved in Sunderland.

They're business people involved in a business venture. Irish football would bleed them dry of resources, so would be a rubbish business investment. And as they ahev no connection to Irish football personally, they can hardly be expexcted to squander their cash on us as a rich man's folly.

If it was English hotels or houses or holiday companies they wede invested in we wouldn't be batting an eyelid. Can I remind you all again that no-one owes Irish football a favour.

Irish football's Number 1 enemy is not Niall Quiin - a man with a job to do and who is doing it well. Irish football's number 1 enemy is the Irish people, who turn their backs on football here and therefore make it part of Niall Quinn's job to target them for his club.

We need to stop throwing a jealous hissy fit because we're unloved, deal with the reality of the situation, and work to change it. Niall Quinn owes us nothing, those Irish investors own us nothing, and they've all done nothing wrong. It's time EL supporters grew up and realised that.
That establishes that they're in it for the money, which wasn't exactly a state secret.
Let's agree that Quinny might not be Irish football's number one enemy, and not get too exercised over whether he's number 14 or 15. The fact remains that he and his partners have an active, intensively hyped campaign to draw investment, sponsorship and support out of Ireland, and therefore out of Irish football. The fact that they are doing it for money rather than pathological hatred of the game doesn't alter the fact that it is against the interests of Irish football for this to happen.

[Macy]

How very bitter you must be.
What's bitter about that? Are you suggesting that English Football hasn't been completely ruined and sanitised? The League of Ireland is the CBGB of the punk football that supporters of the new supporters clubs in England love.

[Fingal hoop]

A lot like Celtic -- or Celtic wannabes.

Celtic represent part of the Irish diaspora in Scotland - whether you like it or not there is a connection there

[gspain]

I actually see the Sunderland hype as a positive thing for Irish football. Our football fans are fickle and will come and support our domestic league IF we get the marketing etc right.

I was in Dublin airport on Saturday night just after 10pm picking up some family members. There were plenty of Sunderland and Reading jerseys in evidence. Now I'd be happy to bet that 95% of them have never even heard of Roker Park, Elm Park, Robin Friday or Charlie Hurley.

There is a massive market out there for football in this country. Better facilities will certainly help. Better hype would also make a huge difference. However success in Europe in particular would I believe be the catalyst.

[NY Hoop]

How very bitter you must be.

Rubbish. He's spot on there. There were about 20 english lads in with us in turners x friday and they loved it cos it wasnt sanitised.

BTW for our learned cark friend Niall Quinn is a member of our club and also helped the club out 2 years ago when we went down so your thread title is a joke. What has traitor ever done for your club?

It's business at the end of the day he's involved in nothing to do with a perceived love of some non entity english club.


KOH

[BohsPartisan]

The kind of people who are being sucked in by the Sunderland hype will never support an Irish club so they are irrelevant. We need to focus on those who have a slight affinity to local clubs, who might go to the odd game, and make them more open to the notion of coming to games more often.

Spot on. I find that us EL supporters have a rep for moaning. Now don't get me wrong, the moaning is often justified but we really should just forget about what the UK multinationals are doing and promote the unique charms of our own league. Look at us as a microbrewery. The Microbrewerys are never going to compete with the big bland multinationals like Diagio but they market to the more discerning beer drinker, the connosuir, the person who likes to actually taste the malt and the hops. Our target market should not be the Luke Skywatchers. The best we can get out of them is tuning in to Setanta for the odd big game. Lets find our own Market of football Connosuirs and target them. Lets be a little gem of a league with a small - but bigger than we have now - following of people who want to taste the ingredients that make this league great.

[dcfcsteve]

Luke Skywatchers.

Like it :D

Shame that look was one of the good guys.

[BohsPartisan]

Like it :D



Borrowed that from the Forza Drogs fanzine.

[osarusan]

The LOI has nothing to offer daytrippers, unless they're English football fans on a weekend away looking for a reminder of how it used to be before the plastic seats and plastic people took over and ruined their game.
I've met loads of Brits who think the LOI is great because they can stand at games here and even switch ends at half-time.

Ruined the game??



I just hate that plastic, post-Fever Pitch, Premiership experience.

Fair enough, I also hate what Sky and the premiership has done to English football, particularily the instillment of the idea that football only began with the invention of the Premiership. But not all English fans are premiership fans, and by the size of the crowds even at lower league lames, not everybody agrees with you.


What's bitter about that? Are you suggesting that English Football hasn't been completely ruined and sanitised?
Sanitised yes, ruined no. Explain how it has been ruined....


Rubbish. He's spot on there. There were about 20 english lads in with us in turners x friday and they loved it cos it wasnt sanitised.

Fair enough. There would have been 70,000 or so at Old Trafford yesterday who didnt seem so bothered. Must they all be less discerning or intelligent football fans?


Look at us as a microbrewery. The Microbrewerys are never going to compete with the big bland multinationals like Diagio but they market to the more discerning beer drinker, the connosuir, the person who likes to actually taste the malt and the hops.

But doesnt the analogy fall down when we realise that the premiership, despite all the hype and cr@p that surrounds it, is still a far better product, and the "more discerning beer drinker" can see that. You are suggesting that people who appreciate real football will value the eL higher than the premiership. They won't.



Don't get me wrong, I can see that supporting a eL club, with freedom to move around, the opportunity to actually get involved, the opportunity to get to know the players, the fact that is can be enjoyed on a more personal level......these are all good things, and great reasons to support eL.

But to say that English football has been destroyed is, in my opinion, false.

And to say that Quinn is our no.1 enemy, given the very existence of the cronies at the FAI and within the media, is ludicrous.

[WeAreRovers]

But to say that English football has been destroyed is, in my opinion, false.


And those of us who've attended Premiership (and even Championship) games in recent years would disagree with you. As would most of my English mates who watch their Premiership teams week-in-week-out.

OT will always be filled by Irish, Japanese and Home Counties goons so that proves nothing.

One Manc mate went to OT last week for the Roma game and said it was the first decent atmosphere in over 10 years.

KOH

[galwayhoop]

And those of us who've attended Premiership (and even Championship) games in recent years would disagree with you. As would most of my English mates who watch their Premiership teams week-in-week-out.

OT will always be filled by Irish, Japanese and Home Counties goons so that proves nothing.

One Manc mate went to OT last week for the Roma game and said it was the first decent atmosphere in over 10 years.

KOH

i think osarusan is saying that while the atmosphere may not be what the people (who used to go prior to sky) are in favour of it doesn't neccesserily mean the thing is 'ruined' merely changed. t

he football is not weakened anyhow just the atmosphere. however it is not just english football but a worldwide thing where the PC brigade have watered down atmospheres and this has co-incided with the 'family theme' to football as opposed to the 18-35 y/o male only of years before.

[jebus]

Haven't bothered reading through this garbage heap of a thread, but all I'll say that anyone who thinks Niall Quinn is the scourge of League of Ireland is talking out their arse.

Who is Quinn trying to get over to Sunderland's side? Irish fans who support Man Ure, Liverpool and Celtic I presume, why would he go after the few thousand that go out to LoI games when he can tap into the couple of million in this country that support English football?

How is Niall Quinn going to achieve this? By pushing Roy Keane onto us. Shouldn't you people be asking why Ireland has such a hang-up on Roy Keane? Or if he is the scourge of Irish football when you consider that he dwarves every team and individual in the game over here?

Plus why shouldn't Niall Quinn tap into this market? If people are going to jump from supporting Rovers/Bohs/Cork/Kilkenny(oh wait :o ) to Sunderland, purely because Keane manages them and they are in the Premiership than do you really want these people supporting your club?

[galwayhoop]

Haven't bothered reading through this garbage heap of a thread, but all I'll say that anyone who thinks Niall Quinn is the scourge of League of Ireland is talking out their arse.

Who is Quinn trying to get over to Sunderland's side? Irish fans who support Man Ure, Liverpool and Celtic I presume, why would he go after the few thousand that go out to LoI games when he can tap into the couple of million in this country that support English football?

How is Niall Quinn going to achieve this? By pushing Roy Keane onto us. Shouldn't you people be asking why Ireland has such a hang-up on Roy Keane? Or if he is the scourge of Irish football when you consider that he dwarves every team and individual in the game over here?

Plus why shouldn't Niall Quinn tap into this market? If people are going to jump from supporting Rovers/Bohs/Cork/Kilkenny(oh wait :o ) to Sunderland, purely because Keane manages them and they are in the Premiership than do you really want these people supporting your club?

for once jebus you are talking sense!

[citizenerased]

Quinn has no moral or national obligation to resue the eircom league, I think you will find that that falls on the FAI, who obviously dont give two shiites about promoting or investing in the league.....

Sunderland are only doing what United Liverpool, Arsenal and Celtic did years ago.AND what the failed Dublin Dons initiative tried also...people in this country are obsessed with the premiership and English football...Believe me the problems are rooted much deeper than 'Sundireland'

The first thing we have to dolike any other small successful domestic league, is hang on to young players..

[stampp]

Interesting thread, lads, and a lively debate.

Hello from a Sunderland supporter, by the way (and a special hi to anyone from Tullamore - lived there seven years).

Of course Quinn is not an 'enemy' of football in Ireland - what he is is a legend to Sunderland supporters, and he himself has simply said he fell in love with the club and was moved to come back to rescue it. It's all about Sunderland, that's all.

His aim - and he's worked hard at it these last few months, going to pubs and clubs in the area to meet the fans - is to bring Sunderland fans back to the stadium. If in addition some fans from Ireland want to come too, then that's great - but in all honesty it's never going to be a major focus - the 40,000 in the stadium are nearly all going to be local fans.

Regarding the question earlier about how fans here regard the Irish interest, I think 99% of fans think it's great - the more the merrier. I've met a few Norwegians who fly over for the odd game. There were 200 Trinidad & Tobago fans up for the Wolves game (we have 3 T&T players in the squad) and they had a great time - their carnival 'dancers' were especially welcome!!! Most Sunderland folk are very easy to get on with - it's a friendly part of the world, and I always think there's a pretty easy rapport between people there and people from The Republic, and more than a few can trace Irish relatives as quite a lot of families came over to the North East for work during the famines. I can't verify it, but I remember my dad telling me that back in the 30's, during some elections, the Sunderland labour party adopted green as their colour rather than the normal red - just to try to capture the catholic vote. Politicians never change, eh?

What's happening at our club is astonishing just now - we've never in my lifetime (and I started watching them in the 50s) had everything in place - stadium, chairman, manager, board - it's what Niall has called 'a magic carpet ride'. We're loving it - and it's a big carpet if you want a ride...

[jebus]

We're loving it - and it's a big carpet if you want a ride...

Are you coming on to us? :p

Cheers for coming on anyway stampp, all the best with your club anyway, you'll find most of us don't begrudge Sunderland a bit of success and hopefully you'll be joined in the Premier by Sheffield Wednesday next season

[stampp]

Are you coming on to us? :p

Cheers for coming on anyway stampp, all the best with your club anyway, you'll find most of us don't begrudge Sunderland a bit of success and hopefully you'll be joined in the Premier by Sheffield Wednesday next season

:) Not so sure about Wednesday - the late form team for the play-offs may just be Stoke. We're just trying to breath normally until after Saturday... the fat lady is still in the wings, gargling...

[dcfcsteve]

Interesting thread, lads, and a lively debate.

Hello from a Sunderland supporter, by the way (and a special hi to anyone from Tullamore - lived there seven years).

Of course Quinn is not an 'enemy' of football in Ireland - what he is is a legend to Sunderland supporters, and he himself has simply said he fell in love with the club and was moved to come back to rescue it. It's all about Sunderland, that's all.

His aim - and he's worked hard at it these last few months, going to pubs and clubs in the area to meet the fans - is to bring Sunderland fans back to the stadium. If in addition some fans from Ireland want to come too, then that's great - but in all honesty it's never going to be a major focus - the 40,000 in the stadium are nearly all going to be local fans.

Regarding the question earlier about how fans here regard the Irish interest, I think 99% of fans think it's great - the more the merrier. I've met a few Norwegians who fly over for the odd game. There were 200 Trinidad & Tobago fans up for the Wolves game (we have 3 T&T players in the squad) and they had a great time - their carnival 'dancers' were especially welcome!!! Most Sunderland folk are very easy to get on with - it's a friendly part of the world, and I always think there's a pretty easy rapport between people there and people from The Republic, and more than a few can trace Irish relatives as quite a lot of families came over to the North East for work during the famines. I can't verify it, but I remember my dad telling me that back in the 30's, during some elections, the Sunderland labour party adopted green as their colour rather than the normal red - just to try to capture the catholic vote. Politicians never change, eh?

What's happening at our club is astonishing just now - we've never in my lifetime (and I started watching them in the 50s) had everything in place - stadium, chairman, manager, board - it's what Niall has called 'a magic carpet ride'. We're loving it - and it's a big carpet if you want a ride...

Cheers Staamp. I spent 3 years living in Newcastle, used to do voluntary work at a youth club in the centre of Sunderland, and have been to your Stadium quite a few times (incl for the game against Norwich in December). My next door neighbour in Derry also used to be former Sunderland player John 'Jobby' Crossan. So I have a positive view of the club.

But I guess you're missing the point here. It's not about how welcoming the Makems are, and to be fair you'll find that talk of Norwegians and Trinidadians going to watch you will be viewed as a negative thing by many on here.

The point is this. Irish football is a great product, but one that is over-whelmed by the wall-to-wall hype and media coverage of the English game on our doorstep. That has held-back our game significantly. You would doubtless be disappointed or even baffled to meet Sunderland people who support Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal. Because there is a good local product on their doorstep that they can actually have a genuien affinity and identification with instead.

Likewise - we are disappointed by the short-term borrowed interest a number of Irish people have in Sunderland AFC. Just because you now have an Irish Manager and Irish owner. Meanwhile - there are 22 senior clubs in the Eircom League - all with Irish owners, managers, players, locations, addresses, tax bills etc etc etc. But the giddy goons who are atrtracted to Sunderland like moths round a bright light will never see what is under their nose. They're intoxicated by the hype and glamour of English football, and for them borrowed interest and reflecting in the glory of a team from a place you couldn't even locate on a map is of more interest than supporting your own.

So no-one here has a problem with Suinderland or its fans. Some clearly have a problem with Quinn - but it is not a view I subscribe to. The one thing you'll find that unites the vast majority on us here is disdain for the fools in Ireland who chase after the bright green light of Sunderland now. Just like they chased after the bright green light of Leeds under O'Leary, or Man U etc in the past. They'll be gone form your club once that green light dims or is switched off - and they'll be busy fluttering after whatever the new bright thing with a tenuous Irish connection is instead.

Enjoy it whilst it lasts - but think for a moment how much it would annoy you as a football fan if you were in our shoes. The English don't all chase off following German, French or Scottish clubs. Anyone Irish with a genuine interest in the game shouldn't either.

[jebus]

:) Not so sure about Wednesday - the late form team for the play-offs may just be Stoke. We're just trying to breath normally until after Saturday... the fat lady is still in the wings, gargling...

I don't know, two of our last three games are at home against Coventry and Norwich, and we should take 6 points there, and the decider for us will be at Birmingham, and we could do Sunderland a big favour there I reckon :)

[charliesboots]

I don't know, two of our last three games are at home against Coventry and Norwich, and we should take 6 points there, and the decider for us will be at Birmingham, and we could do Sunderland a big favour there I reckon :)

There are other sections on this forum to discuss overseas football!!

[stampp]

Cheers Staamp. I spent 3 years living in Newcastle, used to do voluntary work at a youth club in the centre of Sunderland, and have been to your Stadium quite a few times (incl for the game against Norwich in December). My next door neighbour in Derry also used to be former Sunderland player John 'Jobby' Crossan. So I have a positive view of the club.

......

Enjoy it whilst it lasts - but think for a moment how much it would annoy you as a football fan if you were in our shoes. The English don't all chase off following German, French or Scottish clubs. Anyone Irish with a genuine interest in the game shouldn't either.

The thing is though Steve - this thread is about Niall. And it's hardly Niall's fault that some Irish businessmen want to invest in this business, because Niall has gone back to the club he loves and started to make it successful again. Start a thread about the businessmen instead? And even then - it's a global economy, and other EPL teams are being bought out by Americans, Russians, Israelis... why should you expect Irish business people not to be interested too? This is the reality today.

PS - I watched Crossan play!

[jebus]

There are other sections on this forum to discuss overseas football!!

jesus can we not have two or three posts without someone jumping up and down?

[charliesboots]

The thing is though Steve - this thread is about Niall. And it's hardly Niall's fault that some Irish businessmen want to invest in this business, because Niall has gone back to the club he loves and started to make it successful again. Start a thread about the businessmen instead? And even then - it's a global economy, and other EPL teams are being bought out by Americans, Russians, Israelis... why should you expect Irish business people not to be interested to? This is the reality today.

PS - I watched Crossan play!

I think the thread should be titled

Irish Bandwagoners - Irish Footballs Number 1 enemy

One (long) question for you Stampp;

If Southampton were bought out by group of businessmen from the North East, appointed a manager from the North East and started to do well, would you be p!ssed off if thousands of people from the North East started to support Southampton and travel in their thousands to the south coast to see them every week when, alternatively they could be supporting their local team?

[monutdfc]

people from The Republic
Sorry, I'm not normally nationalistic at all, but that really gets me.
Bloody Mark Lawrenson

[charliesboots]

jesus can we not have two or three posts without someone jumping up and down?

No :p

[dcfcsteve]

The thing is though Steve - this thread is about Niall. And it's hardly Niall's fault that some Irish businessmen want to invest in this business, because Niall has gone back to the club he loves and started to make it successful again. Start a thread about the businessmen instead? And even then - it's a global economy, and other EPL teams are being bought out by Americans, Russians, Israelis... why should you expect Irish business people not to be interested too? This is the reality today.

PS - I watched Crossan play!

Agreed. Like I said - it's the starry-eyed Irish people who are at fault here. The magpies of European football (no Geordie pun intended). Quinn is just doing his job, and doing it well.

As for Crossan - he runs a sports shop in Derry, technically does a bit of scouting for you still (though not much), and is a big Derry City fan and match commentator. Did he get his ban from English football when he was at Sunderland btw ?

[stampp]

I think the thread should be titled

Irish Bandwagoners - Irish Footballs Number 1 enemy

One (long) question for you Stampp;

If Southampton were bought out by group of businessmen from the North East, appointed a manager from the North East and started to do well, would you be p!ssed off if thousands of people from the North East started to support Southampton and travel in their thousands to the south coast to see them every week when, alternatively they could be supporting their local team?

First part - no, not at all. My club has been managed by English, Scots and Irish. Do I care? Nope - as long as they're good - and Roy is starting to look very, very good. So why should I care if a Mackem manages Southampton? In fact Southampton is managed at the moment by a former Sunderland player who is still held in high regard by some of us more 'mature' SAFC supporters. So what?

Second part (and I know where you're coming from) - it would just never happen because of the history of this club. We've been going since around the 1880's, so a lot of fathers, grandfathers and great-grandfathers have been supporting the team. A few on the periphery my defect to the mags up the road in lean times, or get some fun going along to support a minor local team like Darlington or Hartlepool, but basically it's about whether we are successful or not - local people will go if we are successful, and not go if we are rubbish, but few defect.

I understand your frustration about Irish support crossing over to see us, or Man Utd, or Celtic, just as I'm sure in the North East that the directors of Hartlepool and Darlington are frustrated that thousands of potential fans from those towns travel to see Sunderland or Newcastle instead. It's simply human nature - the attraction of the bigger clubs for some. It's a fact of life - an open market. And getting back to the thread title - nowt to do with Niall, who is doing his job - well - as Chairman of Sunderland.

[charliesboots]

First part - no, not at all. My club has been managed by English, Scots and Irish. Do I care? Nope - as long as they're good - and Roy is starting to look very, very good. So why should I care if a Mackem manages Southampton? In fact Southampton is managed at the moment by a former Sunderland player who is still held in high regard by some of us more 'mature' SAFC supporters. So what?

Second part (and I know where you're coming from) - it would just never happen because of the history of this club. We've been going since around the 1880's, so a lot of fathers, grandfathers and great-grandfathers have been supporting the team. A few on the periphery my defect to the mags up the road in lean times, or get some fun going along to support a minor local team like Darlington or Hartlepool, but basically it's about whether we are successful or not - local people will go if we are successful, and not go if we are rubbish, but few defect.

I understand your frustration about Irish support crossing over to see us, or Man Utd, or Celtic, just as I'm sure in the North East that the directors of Hartlepool and Darlington are frustrated that thousands of potential fans from those towns travel to see Sunderland or Newcastle instead. It's simply human nature - the attraction of the bigger clubs for some. It's a fact of life - an open market. And getting back to the thread title - nowt to do with Niall, who is doing his job - well - as Chairman of Sunderland.

You misunderstood my first part - the bandwagoners I refer to are the Irish people who have suddenly become Sunderland fans.

On the second part, I realise that the scenario I put to you is hypothetical but even so would it p!ss you off if it happened?

[stampp]

You misunderstood my first part - the bandwagoners I refer to are the Irish people who have suddenly become Sunderland fans.

On the second part, I realise that the scenario I put to you is hypothetical but even so would it p!ss you off if it happened?

If it happened - yes of course. Sunderland is an old working class area and the football club is very much part of the 'family' - you don't choose your family. But do the Irish clubs have that history of generation after generation of support to cement fan's roots and loyalty? I think not. If you then add in the 'big club' attraction it's easy to see how it happens. What's the solution in a free market? It's the same question for Darlington - make the club more successful, make the matchday experience more affordable and more fun... But you can't force people to support their local team, and you can't rail against people like Niall for working for other teams if that's what they want to do - especially if they have long and deep associations with those teams.

Anyway - I'm becoming a board hog! I'll bugger off and so some work! Good craic.

[NY Hoop]

But do the Irish clubs have that history of generation after generation of support to cement fan's roots and loyalty? I think not.

Why would you think that? Of course we do. Nobody has a problem with Sunderland FC at all just the muppets from here going to another country to "support" a foreign club and then having the temerity to slag off their own league without seeing the incredible hypocrisy.

http://www.safc.com/news/?page_id=11819 :D


KOH

[BohsPartisan]

But do the Irish clubs have that history of generation after generation of support to cement fan's roots and loyalty? I think not.

The likes of Bohs, Shamrock Rovers, St. Pats, Linfield, Glentoran would heve that. Not how I became a Bohs fan but I'd say the majority of our support would have that kind of thing. Other teams would have it to a lesser extent I suppose but wouldn't have been around for as long and/or have replaced other clubs in their area that have folded.

[BohDiddley]

If it happened - yes of course. Sunderland is an old working class area and the football club is very much part of the 'family' - you don't choose your family. But do the Irish clubs have that history of generation after generation of support to cement fan's roots and loyalty? I think not. If you then add in the 'big club' attraction it's easy to see how it happens. What's the solution in a free market? It's the same question for Darlington - make the club more successful, make the matchday experience more affordable and more fun... But you can't force people to support their local team, and you can't rail against people like Niall for working for other teams if that's what they want to do - especially if they have long and deep associations with those teams.

Anyway - I'm becoming a board hog! I'll bugger off and so some work! Good craic.
If the free market is going to have its way, we should get ahead of the bandwagon curve right now, save ourselves a few years' grief and northern English weather, and go follow David Beckham and his American buddies.

[stampp]

If the free market is going to have its way, we should get ahead of the bandwagon curve right now, save ourselves a few years' grief and northern English weather, and go follow David Beckham and his American buddies.

:) It's your choice. The beer's better in Sunderland, mind - and we have balti pies at half-time. ;)

[dcfcsteve]

But do the Irish clubs have that history of generation after generation of support to cement fan's roots and loyalty? I think not. If you then add in the 'big club' attraction it's easy to see how it happens. What's the solution in a free market? It's the same question for Darlington - make the club more successful, make the matchday experience more affordable and more fun... But you can't force people to support their local team, and you can't rail against people like Niall for working for other teams if that's what they want to do - especially if they have long and deep associations with those teams.

A rather naive question about Irish clubs there Stampp. Of course Irish teams have generational support. We're not Australia or America - competitive senior association football has been around in Ireland since the late 1800's. The island even gave the game key developmental things like penalties and corner kicks.

And your point about Darlington FC facing competition from Newcastle or Sunderland completely misses the point about the nature of that competition. People in the North-East of England by and large support teams in the north-east. Many will support the biggest/best team in the area at any one time, and many will also support their local club regardless of how they're doing. But few would consider supporting teams out of their area - particularly not unglamorous teams like Blackburn, Bolton, Reading etc, without having some sort of connection to those places/teams. And those who live in, say, Darlo, but support Newcastle - most wouldn't aggressively and dismissively look down their noses at Darlington. They'd actually like to see the team do well - because, even if it's not their first team it's still their local team.

In Ireland, the complete oppposite happens. People have wholesale turned their backs on Irish football. They sneer at the local league and their local teams, and treat anyone who follows them as either curiousities or in-breds. Instead - they pick a team in England or Scotland who is good at any point of time, or which has a very tenuous Irish connection. Most Irish Sunderland fans would genuinely struggle to pin-point the town on a map. Many will never visit your ground or your city. Few still would be able to relate to a town that's history and identity is thoroughly different to that of Irish towns (i.e. an English colliery town). Yet they still claim that they love your club. They still play out the pantomime of hating Newcastle - not because of local rivalry, but, well, because that's what Sunderland fans do, isn't it ? They will want anyone to beat the England International team - because they're Irish of course ! - but they fail to see how supporting an English league team over Irish ones at a club level is absurd.

So by-and-large when English people turn their back on their local team, they don't become anti that team and they don't stray too far from their area when selecting another club to support. They certainly don't go off and support Italian or Spanish teams - even if Madrid and Milan will always be more glamorous than Darlington and Sunderland. And that's because English people understabnd that football is all about identity.

There was a time in Ireland when we did have very big crowds, widespread generational support etc. But the 70's/80's saw that die. For a variety of reasons - but to some extent due to the saturation coverage of English football that started then. Now it is easy for an Irish person to follow Sunderland without having to leave their armchair ina different country.

So the goons you have off following Sunderland now are just big game hunters. They're not 'football fans'. They don't truely understand what the game is all about. And because it is impossible to be genuinely passionate about a club that you have absolutely no connection whatsoever to, they are not there for the long run. They'll drop you like a hot stone when results dip and there's another shnier club to swear undying allegiance to. So that's why I said to enjoy the sound of Irish accents round the Stadium of Light whilst you can. They'll all be gone within 5 years....