Election 2007

[pete]

Looks like all parties gearing up for the election which seems due in next 6 months...

Will it set new lows for nastiness?

With economic polices very similar will their be personal attacks in the US/UK style?

[Macy]

With economic polices very similar will their be personal attacks in the US/UK style?
Well McDowells been at it for months with his attacks on Bruton and Gormley, and all the slump coalition stuff, and his monthly calling people Nazi's tatic.

All the FG posters that the Government got their nickers in a twist only stated Government failures, which aren't negative campaigning in my view. Here's the Governments record, here's our policies, make up your minds.

FG/Labour could start by going through the last National Development Plan - plenty of committments not met in that one, on many of the areas they had a big fan fare about yesterday.

[WeAreRovers]

FG/Labour could start by going through the last National Development Plan - plenty of committments not met in that one, on many of the areas they had a big fan fare about yesterday.

Surely even Labour supporters don't believe that there'll be a FG/Labour coalition after the election?

It'll be FF/Lab without Rabbitte and some others from the DL tendency that took Labour over.


KOH

[Macy]

Surely even Labour supporters don't believe that there'll be a FG/Labour coalition after the election?
Still there to be won, if they go on the attack on the right issues. God knows there's enough to attack the current Government on...


It'll be FF/Lab without Rabbitte and some others from the DL tendency that took Labour over.
imo that'll be the end of the Labour Party, which may be no bad thing. Get a truely left wing alternative in the making, even if it was some form of grand coalition. Obviously, I'd be a traditional labour voter (not member btw), but going in with FF at this stage would be the final kick up the arse I'd need to ditch them in - no doubt my heart lies further to the left, but feel anyone but FF is the priority at this election.

[pete]

I thought the FG posters a bit selective until saw the crime figures reported this week which basically showed significant increase in majority of categories. crime isn't a major issue with me but did prove the figures not selective...

FG/Labour coalition is possible although Labour the clear weak link.

PDs are unpredicatable as Nationwide polls mean nothing to them when comes to predicting their seat tally. I am sure they will play the "FF cannot be trusted on their own..." line as it was very successful last time.

[BohsPartisan]

But Macy going into coalition with FG isn't much different. The Labour Party unfortunately has long abandoned the left wing policies of its founders. The DL coup merely accelerated this process.

[WeAreRovers]

imo that'll be the end of the Labour Party, which may be no bad thing. Get a truely left wing alternative in the making, even if it was some form of grand coalition. Obviously, I'd be a traditional labour voter (not member btw), but going in with FF at this stage would be the final kick up the arse I'd need to ditch them in - no doubt my heart lies further to the left, but feel anyone but FF is the priority at this election.

As an ex-member of the Labour Party I totally see where you're coming from but these days I'm staunchly anyone but FG/PD. I actually think that a FF/Lab coalition would be best for the country.

There's a myth in Labour that the Dick Spring/Albert government damaged them when in reality it was the unelected FG/Lab government that took over that did the real electoral damage to Labour.

KOH

[Macy]

But Macy going into coalition with FG isn't much different.
They fulfil the most pressing critea of not being FF.


I actually think that a FF/Lab coalition would be best for the country.
In theory it may be, but not without clearing a hell of a lot of the deadwood out FF, including the corrupt leader. That will not happen after this election - Labour just wouldn't have the pulling power. 18 out of the last 20 years is too long for a party to be in power, so FG the least worst alternative to FF.


There's a myth in Labour that the Dick Spring/Albert government damaged them when in reality it was the unelected FG/Lab government that took over that did the real electoral damage to Labour.
That is certainly one argument, however ignores that the "Spring Tide" was on the back of attacking FF corruption. Before my time though, I was too busy believing things could only get better, so this is the first time they have the chance to sell me out.

The problem with Irish Politics is FF trying to be all things to all men, and as a result stands for nothing and has no principles. It has a signifcant minority that would be in a "labour" party in any other state, with the majority on the right of centre. On top of the Civil War, Dev is to blame for fooking up the party system too.

[Lionel Ritchie]

The problem with Irish Politics is FF trying to be all things to all men, and as a result stands for nothing and has no principles.

That's it in a nutshell. Put us in and we'll do whatever the hell enough of ye want and feck the consequences. An administrative brokerage house touting for custom.

If they'd only fuse with Fine Gael -with whom they have virtually no material difference -it'd allow for a proper re-allignment of the political landscape where the electorate would get to choose between something more than different brands of bread.

[rebs23]

First time in a long time I haven't a clue who to vote for.

Labour - the thought of Rabbite, yapping on all day long and getting even more coverage becasue he is a minister is frightening.

FF - 5 More years of the bundering, bluff that is Bertie is just too much.

FG - Enda Kenny and his whispy haircuts to go with his whispy populist ideas about an airport for all the Dublin constituencies, a prison for every village is just pathetic.

PD's - I nearly would only for McDowell and his meandering pontificating nonsense about crime and making even more laws to criminalise every second person.

After that who have you but the (admittedly entertaining) Joe Higgins one man show and his bunch of loony lefties (and yes just look at Bohspartisan posts)

Greens - Good intentions, crap policies and too many beards and sandals and general hippydom.

Sinn Fein - well after their retirement fund (Belfast Bank robbery) is run out may just be desperate enough to cosy up to Bertie.

I'm saying a FF/SF alliance to break down after a year with another election after that with FF/Labour.

[BohsPartisan]

After that who have you but the (admittedly entertaining) Joe Higgins one man show and his bunch of loony lefties (and yes just look at Bohspartisan posts)



What the ones where I use facts to back up my arguements against foundationless rhetoric?

If you can't stand the heat, put your hands over your ears and make loud noises... (http://www.foot.ie/showthread.php?t=44152)

lalalalalalalala (http://www.foot.ie/showthread.php?t=37390)

Plus, hopefully we'll be a two person show in the Dail after the elections.

[rebs23]

What the ones where I use facts to back up my arguements against foundationless rhetoric?

.

You would n't know what a fact is if it jumped up and bit you on your beret.:p

[BohsPartisan]

You would n't know what a fact is if it jumped up and bit you on your beret.:p

You obviously don't if you think they have teeth! :p

[crc]

If they'd only fuse with Fine Gael -with whom they have virtually no material difference -it'd allow for a proper re-allignment of the political landscape where the electorate would get to choose between something more than different brands of bread.
The electorate already have four other parties to choose from apart from FF/FG.! If you don't like either of those brands of bread, vote for something different, nothing will change otherwise.

That said, I'm completely unsure of who I would vote for in 2007. I'm leaning towards the Greens. I know they have a lunatic fringe, but they'd never in a month of Sundays get more than about 10 seats so they'd be put straight by the major party if they got into a coalition. I'd like the Greens to be in the next coalition so that new legislation will have at least an eye on environmental issues.

[rebs23]

You obviously don't if you think they have teeth! :p

Touche!:)

[pete]

Aside from the fringe parties who have little or no manifestos suitable for the real world here how I see the main parties campaigning.

FF - Times are good, don't risk change by voting for someone else.

FG - FF been there too long & we can spend your money better.

Labour - We promise not to go into coalition with FF...or do we...

PDs - You can't trust FF on its own , need us to keep them honest otherwise they'll go into coalition with the left meaning taxes will rise.

SF - We want to build an Ireland of Equals.

Others - I promise hospitial/no incinerator/no dump (select as appropriate).

I think its going to come down to very personalised campaign.

[Risteard]

I think its going to come down to very personalised campaign.

Probably.
That means there'll be no beating Bertie. The man cannot be beaten in the popularity stakes.:o :confused:

[BohsPartisan]

Aside from the fringe parties who have little or no manifestos suitable for the real world here how I see the main parties campaigning.



Seeing as how the main parties' manifestos are rarely suibtable for the real world thats harsh!

[Lionel Ritchie]

The electorate already have four other parties to choose from apart from FF/FG.! If you don't like either of those brands of bread, vote for something different, nothing will change otherwise.

That said, I'm completely unsure of who I would vote for in 2007. I'm leaning towards the Greens. I know they have a lunatic fringe, but they'd never in a month of Sundays get more than about 10 seats so they'd be put straight by the major party if they got into a coalition. I'd like the Greens to be in the next coalition so that new legislation will have at least an eye on environmental issues.

The electorate could have forty different parties to vote for and it wouldn't alter a jot the fact that, in the prevailing (and sadly enduring) irish political landscape, none of them could be in government unless that government had either Fianna Fáil or Fine Gael as it's "anchor tenant". That boils down to there being nothing on offer to the irish electorate but a right-ist/center-right-ist administration. I'm not claiming the left could do better. Just stating there isn't a left leaning option on offer in any practical sense.

a couple of other thoughts ...the PDs have made less than 10 seats count for a whole lot of leverage and, while I often find myself at odds with them, fair play to them for doing so ...The greens should ape them to as great an extent possible in that regard.

[Student Mullet]

I'm leaning towards the Greens. I know they have a lunatic fringe, but they'd never in a month of Sundays get more than about 10 seats so they'd be put straight by the major party if they got into a coalition. I'd like the Greens to be in the next coalition so that new legislation will have at least an eye on environmental issues.That's my poinion too. I voted green last time and probably will again but a lot of their policies are completly loony.

[BohsPartisan]

That's my poinion too. I voted green last time and probably will again but a lot of their policies are completly loony.

Out of curiosity, which ones?


I'm not claiming the left could do better. Just stating there isn't a left leaning option on offer in any practical sense.

I think it would make a difference. If you look at the increased votes for the Shinners, the Green's and in a more modest way, the SP (We don't have the resources to run candidates in more than 4 or 5 constituencies) you see that there is a section of the electorate groping in the dark for an alternative to the status quo. Problem is that as soon as the Shinners or the Green's go into coalition with right wing parties they become part of that self same status quo, increasing the alienation of those people who were looking for an alternative.
A mass left force, a broad party that had roots in the working class and had an open and democratic structure to allow different strands of leftism to co-exist and debate their positions could have an impact. I'm not saying it would come to power overnight but at least in the interim it would be a viable and effective opposition in contrast with the theatre that exists at the moment. In time it could prove itself to be not "the same as the rest" and coax some of those non-voters out of their apathy.

[Macy]

I voted green last time and probably will again but a lot of their policies are completly loony.
Actually my problem with the Green's is not their policies - most of them are completely sensible imo - it's their candidate in my constituency that's completely loony.

[bennocelt]

.

There's a myth in Labour that the Dick Spring/Albert government damaged them when in reality it was the unelected FG/Lab government that took over that did the real electoral damage to Labour.

KOH

thats simply not true
you can even look at the figures Labour got before and after they went into power with that shower
they lost a lot of support after that

and they are doing the same thing by throwin in their lot with FG, have they no fcuking shame!

[WeAreRovers]

thats simply not true
you can even look at the figures Labour got before and after they went into power with that shower
they lost a lot of support after that


Sorry mate, that maybe the perception but the SBP and eminent political scientists disagree. That misperception has cost Labour dearly since and is costing them to this day. Witness Rabbitte's current flip-flopping which is going to lose lots of votes.

http://www.sbpost.ie/post/pages/p/story.aspx-qqqt=NEWS+FEATURES-qqqs=news-qqqid=20388-qqqx=1.asp

KOH

[pete]

Moderator: If anyone is referring to parties policies could they please post a link to them if can find...

I suggested SF don't have any real world polices because I have look before & can never find any policies for SF on their website. Its all just generalities & no specifics or even suggestions how to pay for expenditure. I wouldn't need speciific figures but even a general suggestion would be good...

[Dr.Nightdub]

Of all the parties, I'd say SF are the ones least worried about how to actually pay for their policies. After all, a few more Northern Bank jobs and they could dangle an electoral carrot of high spending and goodies for everyone that'd make the FF manifesto of 1977 look distinctly stingy. And all done without raising taxes.

Sometimes democracy is a curse cos you feel morally obliged to vote for someone, anyone. Too many people fought too long for us to have votes to go throwing the right away. But sweet jesus, looking at what's on offer, I could almost put up with a couple of years of dictatorship, absolute monarchy, or whatever, if it meant I didn't actually HAVE to vote for any of this lot.

FF: slithery, sleeven, corrupt, vacuous, populist, Golden Circle filth. They have my da ("Papa Doc" copyright WAR) driven to despair that there hasn't been a revolution on account of what they've got up to for the guts of the last two decades. Not just the Celtic bloody Tiger era but more importantly, the majority of the suffocating crap that went before it.

FG: FF Lite, but with more big farmers hankering after the civil war which neatly put paid to all that uppity burning of big houses. Would probably even give up being the main partner in a coalition once they got to run the cops. But they're led by Enda Kenny, politics' answer to Daniel O'Donnell, so no chance of topping the charts for them. Now, he's realised he's out of a job when they lose, so he's gearing up for a bit of old-fashioned immigrant-bashing. If they're the "alternative", just bring on the full-blown one-party state why dontcha?

Labour: lost the last vestiges of respect for them since Rabbitte meekly gave up his crown as Devastating Wit of the Left to Joe Higgins. Even prepared to blather nonsense about "Irish workers being undercut by foreigh workers" which, for a party with its name, is about as breathtakingly hypocritical as you can get. Now pure political sluts, determined to get into bed with anyone who'll flash a set of Merc keys while riding them and calling them darling.

PDs: most reactionary tossers of the lot and no question that in proportional representations terms, they get preference number 666, the number of the beast. But at least they're naked about it so they're easier to hate, no figuring out needed. Absolute dead certs for being first up against the wall come the great day.

SF: barely even have any practical day-to-day relevance up north given the the political vacuum up there, so how they can expect to be meaningful down here, in the tiny republican overflow carpark, is beyond me. Get loads of votes purely cos they're none of the above. Can actually see them splitting down the road, as the southern element get too fond of having an elected presence with a chamber in which to make speeches, while the nordie element flap around in outer space.

Greens: sorry, since our green wheelie bin got nicked, environmental thinking doesn't really penetrate this house much, except for when it's time to go down the bottle bank. All very NICE and so on, but not what people really vote about at elections, is it? When the word (environ)"mental" turns up more in your manifesto than in anyone else's, it's gotta have some kind of effect on voters - it's subliminal code for "We are green, we are white, we are not so much dynamite but more so daft as brushes". But they also benefit from being none of the above although more so for the pacifist wing of the protest vote who aren't really down with guns and bullets and stuff, y'know?

BohsPartisan's lot: not sure if they run a candidate out my way but if they did, would definitely get my vote, if only for Chairman Joe's comedy interludes. Not quite the Bill Hicks of Irish politics, but at least he can rip the p1ss out of the rest like no-one else and give you a warm glow for being more or less on the same side and watching the other lot wilt a bit.

Independents: hate them, they just encourage the notion that we're all atomised and that there's no joined-up bits. Mé féinism gone mad. The fact that Michael Lowry is a sitting TD proves two things: criminals shouldn't be allowed run and Tipperary people shouldn't be allowed vote.

I think the election is going to be very very nasty and mighty painful to listen to. FF make my skin crawl just by virtue of the fact that they're still in existence. They rest are gonna wallow in a slurry of immigration, crime and clientalism. It's gonna be ugly and the outcome is gonna be uglier cos two out of the spoofer, the slut and the rabid dog scumbag are gonna be the main people governing us for the next five years.

[BohsPartisan]

BohsPartisan's lot: not sure if they run a candidate out my way but if they did, would definitely get my vote.



In all likelihood we'll have 4 candidates. Joe in Dub West, Clare D in Dub North, Mick Murphy out Tallaght way and Mick Barry in Cork (North Central I think).


Independents: hate them, they just encourage the notion that we're all atomised and that there's no joined-up bits. Mé féinism gone mad. The fact that Michael Lowry is a sitting TD proves two things: criminals shouldn't be allowed run and Tipperary people shouldn't be allowed vote.

Think your being a bit harsh putting them all in one basket. Remember the people of Tipp also returned Seamus Healy who is a decent enough sort.

Oh speaking of criminals, me and another chap (Shels fan as it happens) ran into Ray Burke last night while out on the campaign trail for Clare. Quite the comic interlude.

[Partizan]

My own constituency of Waterford is set for a battle royale with 4 seats up for grabs between the main parties; FF, FG, Lab, WP & SF. The 4 sitting TD's consist of Martin Cullen (FF) who happens to be one of the most useless ministers ever, his "able" sidekick Ollie Wilkinson(FF) who also happens to be one of the most useless TDs ever. (Either way these two will still get elected). FG is represented by John Deasy while Labour have veteran Brian O'Shea. Now this is where things get very interesting.

Waterford is divided demographically, socially, linguistically etc. into city and county. FF, Lab & and in particularly FG do substantially well in the county, however in the city its a different ball game and is evenly divided between Cullen who gets the builder/business vote, the Workers Party who traditionally get the urban working class and SF now muscling in on the WP & Lab county vote. FF & FG will have their candidates elected, however Labour are on very shaky ground.

O'Shea's star has waned and waiting in the wings is WP or SF who are on neck and neck. The WP have virtually no rural support while in the city they have 2 high profile city councillors. SF too are very active in the city, however the presence of a strong WP candidate has dented their hopes significantly of automatically taking the 4th seat. The best they can hope for is to get ahead of the WP, take their transfers and mount a strong challenge for the Labour one. For the last seat it will be down to the wire. If the WP pull ahead of SF, more than likely they will take the Lab seat. After that all bets are off and Dubya will declare Waterford part of the axis of evil.

Nationally, I think FF will lose up to 15 seats paving the way for a multicolour rainbow coalition. Earlier poster is right, if Rabbitte doesnt nail his colours firmly to the mast, Labour will be crucified up and down the country. As for SF the momentum has gone out of their sails but they will gain perhaps another one or two and hold what they have, while I can see the Greens gaining substantially. I hope they do. The SP could end up with 2 (Claire Daly) perhaps 3 if they play their cards right. We could also see more Independents and hopefully a WP man thrown in.

FF hopefully will be turfed out along with the PDs. Good riddance.

[jebus]

The Greens will be getting my vote once again, simply because I don't have any trust left in any of the other parties to look after anything but themselves. I also think the Green's are the only party who seriously consider, and would bring about changes in, animal welfare, state pensions, the enviroment in general and immigration, all of which are the key election issues for me.

To check out their policies go to http://www.greenparty.ie and look around

[pete]

Given the lack of respect for parties across the political divide what coner of the electorate is not being catered for? If you have to create a new party what area of the spectrum would you target?

Green Party seem to have no transport policy... (http://www.greenparty.ie/en/policies/transport) :confused:

[jebus]

Given the lack of respect for parties across the political divide what coner of the electorate is not being catered for? If you have to create a new party what area of the spectrum would you target?

Green Party seem to have no transport policy... (http://www.greenparty.ie/en/policies/transport) :confused:


Well spotted, I'm a member on the site so I'll let them know about the mistake. They'll probably update it when they announce their full Election '07 policy anyway I reckon.

[BohsPartisan]

Given the lack of respect for parties across the political divide what coner of the electorate is not being catered for? If you have to create a new party what area of the spectrum would you target?



There is quite clearly a vacume on the left Pete.

Partizan

Are the WP running a candidate in Louth? I'm fishing for someone to vote for.

[rebs23]

Given the lack of respect for parties across the political divide what coner of the electorate is not being catered for? If you have to create a new party what area of the spectrum would you target?


I honestly believe there is room for a party that campaigns on Regional issues such as implementation of the National Spatial Strategy (or a complete review of it more importantly), decentralisation of not only government departments but also government spending, tax breaks for regional development similar to those that were available to the IFSC and the Dublin Docklands Development Authority, the break up of Dublin Port to free up lands in Dublin Docklands for development and move port activities to the likes of Arklow, Drogheda, Dundalk and Rosslare, Atlantic Corridor Motorway/Dual Carriageway, more spending on buses in Dublin with Bus Corridors, national broadcasting to fulfill its remit on regional reporting and become a National broadcaster, Extension of all the City Boundaries, centralisation of cultural activities etc, etc.

All of the biggest problems that this country faces are down to a lack of proper planning. The congestion in Dublin is costing this country serious money and needs to tackled. Double digit House price inflation(unsustainable), longer commutes (lower quality of life), more carbon emissions, wage inflation (less competitive economy), etc, etc.

Why the spend all that money on a Port Tunnell when moving it would be far cheaper, create a huge land bank for development in Dublin, remove significant traffic congestion and boost the economy in other ports?

Why not have one Airport for the country in the Midlands somewhere (only an hour from Dublin by rail and similar distances to Cork, Limerick, Galway and Waterford?

Why build a National Stadium in Dublin? Far cheaper, plenty of land available in the Midlands somewhere? More accessible again for everyone.

The National Childrens Hospital? Don't get me started.

Notice the common thread here Bertie and his backyard!

Dublin is our capital but why does everything have to be located there? It doesn't need to be and it doesn't make financial sense to have everything located in one small area, geographically locked by the sea on one side.

Dublin would be a far more "liveable" and dare I say it better city for it.

[Partizan]

They are indeed. Peter Short who is based in Dundalk.

[BohsPartisan]

Rebs23, if you're thinking of founding a Cork seperatist movement you have my full support! :D

[pete]

Rebs23, if you're thinking of founding a Cork seperatist movement you have my full support! :D

I think he is talking about a Dublin Separtist movement - separate it from the rest of the country! :p

I don't think irish people will vote for left or right parties as we seem to like the left & right of centre parties.

Politics has changed quiet a good deal in the last 15 years as almost nothing to fight for on social issues such as divorce, abortion etc...

[BohsPartisan]

I don't think irish people will vote for left or right parties as we seem to like the left & right of centre parties.



Thats all we've got Pete. Its like saying people don't want any different type of washing powder because they buy whats there. If there was something genuinely better on the market they might buy it.

[WeAreRovers]

Thats all we've got Pete. Its like saying people don't want any different type of washing powder because they buy whats there. If there was something genuinely better on the market they might buy it.

You wha? The market dictates whether it's politics or washing powder, as the Jam put it "The public gets what the public wants." To suggest otherwise is patronising guff.

KOH

[BohsPartisan]

You wha? The market dictates whether it's politics or washing powder, as the Jam put it "The public gets what the public wants." To suggest otherwise is patronising guff.

KOH


The same song also inverts that line to "the public wants what the public gets", which was kind of my point.
If the "market" dictated everything, "marketing" and advertising would not be necessary. People are paid vast sums of money to convince people they want or need things. That goes for politics as well as washing powder.



We talk and we talk until my head explodes
I turn on the news and my body froze
The braying sheep on my TV screen
Make this boy shout, make this boy scream!

Going underground, I'm going underground!


Keep On Harpin'

[Calcio Jack]

[QUOTE=BohsPartisan;611735]The same song also inverts that line to "the public wants what the public gets", which was kind of my point.

Totally agree...indeed was surprised to see WAR use the line in the manner he did.

My own view is that I was extremely narked when Spring went in with FF, and Rabittes recent dithering is also anoying... I'll still give Labour my number but that will now be more based on the quality of their local candidate (Alex White) ....and my tenner is on us having a FF/Lab coalition in place after the election. If that comes to pass then I'll never again listen to anyone who moans about houseprices/the health system/congestion/inflation/childcare as by putting Bertie back in we are giving him and his cronies carte blanche to run the country for the benefit of the likes of the Bailey Brothers etc

[WeAreRovers]

Totally agree...indeed was surprised to see WAR use the line in the manner he did.



To prove that Weller patronises and looks down on the working class in the exact same way that socialists do. ;)

KOH

[bennocelt]

Sorry mate, that maybe the perception but the SBP and eminent political scientists disagree. That misperception has cost Labour dearly since and is costing them to this day. Witness Rabbitte's current flip-flopping which is going to lose lots of votes.

http://www.sbpost.ie/post/pages/p/story.aspx-qqqt=NEWS+FEATURES-qqqs=news-qqqid=20388-qqqx=1.asp

KOH


come off it
im talking about the average man on the street, that article was talking about Polls done, funny how they never ask the right people!!!!!!!
there was a strong sense of anger among traditional labour voters when they went into power with FF, i know casue my family were involved with labour at the time, and so were a lot of people i knew, but that fuc ked it all up for them
perception? i dont think so, as i felt it and so did a lot of people i knew!
and i wont be voting for labour this time around
SF will be getting my vote

[bennocelt]

Sometimes democracy is a curse cos you feel morally obliged to vote for someone, anyone. Too many people fought too long for us to have votes to go throwing the right away. But sweet jesus, looking at what's on offer, I could almost put up with a couple of years of dictatorship, absolute monarchy, or whatever, if it meant I didn't actually HAVE to vote for any of this lot.

.

man that was brilliant
POTM

[pete]

Sometimes democracy is a curse cos you feel morally obliged to vote for someone, anyone. Too many people fought too long for us to have votes to go throwing the right away. But sweet jesus, looking at what's on offer, I could almost put up with a couple of years of dictatorship, absolute monarchy, or whatever, if it meant I didn't actually HAVE to vote for any of this lot...

Sounds like the South Park Douche and Turd episode :D

[kingdom hoop]

Sometimes democracy is a curse cos you feel morally obliged to vote for someone, anyone. Too many people fought too long for us to have votes to go throwing the right away. But sweet jesus, looking at what's on offer, I could almost put up with a couple of years of dictatorship, absolute monarchy, or whatever, if it meant I didn't actually HAVE to vote for any of this lot.



for a while now i have been thinking that political democracy should be confined to being the success of the 20th century but that the 21st century is time for a new revolt. president bush is the most obvious black sheep of democracy and perhaps global warming democracy's biggest catastrophe. politically i would align myself towards a meritocracy(a la singapore for eg). surely the most important organisation is the state and as such needs to be lead by capable people who are more than just your average bertie or george. at this stage in history the autocratic one man band is not going to re-emerge, so its now time to ditch political democracy and welcome a new era where we can choose between the best(most suitable) our society has to offer.

i propose....dr.nightdub as our new leader with me being his right hand man.

foot.ie - brothers in arms, let us unite

[SÓC]

FF will lose some seats, as will the PDs, FG will gain a few as will Labour but at the end of the day the make up of the next Dáil wont be dramatically different to this one.

I'd really really hope for a FF/Lab government simply because they'll get things done. Even Rabbitte has seen the writting on the wall from as far back as six months ago. I do always laugh at the "Not good for Democracy to have one party in power for so long" line. Surely what is good for democracy is that the people get to put in power exactly who they voted for?

I'm a card carrying member of FF and I do think Macy makes a good point about the membership. There are a lot (maybe even more than most people believe) of left leaning folk in FF who are totally fed up with the PDs and seeking assurances that FF will make a priority of changing partners after the election.

[strangeirish]

Sometimes democracy is a curse cos you feel morally obliged to vote for someone, anyone. Too many people fought too long for us to have votes to go throwing the right away. But sweet jesus, looking at what's on offer, I could almost put up with a couple of years of dictatorship, absolute monarchy, or whatever, if it meant I didn't actually HAVE to vote for any of this lot.

Ah man, come over and live in the US and we'll have a right craic Dr.Nightdub. We can enjoy having our phones tapped, watch Fox News 24 hours a day, have your private information sold and if we are lucky, we might even get drafted into the military.
*strangeirish, we're watching you! (Dept. of Homeland Security)*
:D

[pete]

While a lot of people don't like McDowell i like him sometimes as he says what he means & just gets on with things without discussing things to death & seeking consultation on everything...

Maybe I am the only one...

[kingdom hoop]

i would agree pete that mcdowell tells it straight up which is refreshing, the unfortunate thing is that what he thinks is usually not what people want and he is too headstrong to admit that he is even 5% wrong, an ideal barrister in other words but not such a good politician.

[Soper]

My opinion doesn't matter, but I want whichever party/ies that will ban fur farming to get in.The last votes was a bit childish, with each member sticking to the party line.