Ireland v Chile, 24/05/06

[Drumcondra_Blue]

Yeah, I couldn't argue with most of that but it doesn't take away from the fact that he's better than O'Shea, Miller and anyone else that can play in that position atm.


Not really. Most sections of the crowd at least tried to get something going, even the west side of the north terrace. I was over the opposite side of the north terrace and I'd try sing the first line of whatever the rest of the crowd were trying to get going and I was just embarassing myself. Compared to the Sweden match when I sang a line and everyone else would join in. :)

I don't know mate, but in the South Terrace there was buggar all noise all night!

My mate also watched it on TV and it was one of the first things he noticed about the match - the lack of noise. And he watches nearly every game....

[Stuttgart88]

Were there the "IRA/SinnFein" add-ons? If so, bloody disgraceful. Idiots.

[Drumcondra_Blue]

Were there the "IRA/SinnFein" add-ons? If so, bloody disgraceful. Idiots.

Aye mate, I couldn't believe it either.

It was a group of kids, probably none of which were older than 10/11 and the worst thing about it was there was parents/minders singing with them :(

But I'm not one to tar proper fans with the same brush, as a whole the fans were fine :)

[Jerry The Saint]

Surprised to hear some people booing at the end of the game (not at all surprised to see half the crowd leave before the end, as usual, though - and yeah, the extra 6 minutes was bizarre, any chance of a betting scam? Would anyone ever offer odds on the length of a game:confused: :eek: ).

Don't forget - this is only the first game Staunton has lost in his entire managerial career at all levels. The run had to end some time I suppose.

Kilbane should probably be first choice left back and we now know he can cover center-half if we have an injury crisis. It seems some people just have a mental block and can't see any good in him no matter how he plays. I believe there's a rule that Killer must play in every competitive international so, having gone from winger to central midfielder, we can see that his progression will continue to full back and on to centre-half over the next two or three qualifying campaigns..

McGeady looked sharp and flashy when he came on but for all his nice touches he didn't really get any great results and towards the end the Chilean defence seemed to get more of a handle on him. Hopefully he will continue to progress but at the moment I'd have Andy Reid in ahead of him.

[wws]

rubbish game

two rubbish teams

anyone got Ian Dowie or Brian Kerr's number?

[reder]

The atmosphere in Lansdowne is always poor except for the odd qualifier. You cant compare it to the likes of an away game (where you see very few Celtic jerseys in my experience). Its to do with the real fans been spread around the ground and diluted by no-mark fans (like the Celtic fans you described).

You always get sections of idiots putting that into the fields of athenry, its embarrassing alright. I never sing the fields of athenry myself, there is something tacky about it at home games, it doesnt sound right, yet at anfield "the fields of anfield road" is one of the best sung songs and sound great. Personally I would ban celtic jerseys from ireland games. I dont get Celtic fans, why can supporters of every other club avoid wearing their club shirt yet they cant?

[drinkfeckarse]

[QUOTE=drinkfeckarse]

The result ultimately means nothing and it's all about what you learn and take from the match.

QUOTE]

This may be true, but I don't think Roy Keane (or Fr Jack for that matter) would agree & perhaps that is the main problem or rather challenge for Stan.

In the latter qualifiers the will to win was not as evident as in recent years, and the displays characterised by a lack of ambition, creativity and general nervousness.

The winning character we want needs to be displayed in all our games both competitive and friendly if it is to become embedded in our culture again. We may still lose, but not hopefully so meekly.

That's a good point and not something that I would really disagree with. A winning mentality breeds success, I just think that in the circumstances i.e. end of season friendly with players a little out of sync from not playing and one eye on their summer holidays means I can dilute it a little.

The result IMO in a game of this nature counts for nothing but the nature of the performance always does. In that way it was disappointing but like I said earlier, if it was in a competitive game I'd be more worried.

[Drumcondra_Blue]

The atmosphere in Lansdowne is always poor except for the odd qualifier. You cant compare it to the likes of an away game (where you see very few Celtic jerseys in my experience). Its to do with the real fans been spread around the ground and diluted by no-mark fans (like the Celtic fans you described).

You always get sections of idiots putting that into the fields of athenry, its embarrassing alright. I never sing the fields of athenry myself, there is something tacky about it at home games, it doesnt sound right, yet at anfield "the fields of anfield road" is one of the best sung songs and sound great. Personally I would ban celtic jerseys from ireland games. I dont get Celtic fans, why can supporters of every other club avoid wearing their club shirt yet they cant?

I fully agree mate. At N. Ireland matches we have basically eradicated the problem in the last few years and now you really do see the very odd one or two Rangers tops, which is good to see people wearing the national shirt to national games.

I also agree with the true supporters travelling to away matches, as you will always inevitably get hangers-on at home matches, no matter what country is playing.

[Slash/ED]

Just like to mention that I'm not trying to stir up any trouble, I know alot of people here are big fans of the EL and there's nothing wrong with that. I personally feel that even the fourth tier of English football if vastly superior to the EL and players get paid more there than here and hence the better players will move abroad. Good luck to Byrne but I don't think anyone could really put forth a strong argument that the next step in his career is anything except to get on with an English club.

I can only assume you're on a wind up here, you're factually wrong on the money front and your opinion is pathetically misguided otherwise anyway. Byrne did turn down a half million move to the Swedish champions over christmas you know.

[drinkfeckarse]

IByrne did turn down a half million move to the Swedish champions over christmas you know.

Was the offer actually accepted Slash??

[youngirish]

I'm ecstatic we got beaten because after a meaningless result against Sweden it seemed O'Shea's (numerous) sins in an Ireland jersey had all been forgiven (even though he was average against Sweden) and the 5 minute memory brigade were calling for him to be a mainstay of our midfield for our upcoming qualifiers. Now finally we might get him out before the important games begin and he does real damage though I fear Stan is too much of a gobs**te to drop him if he's getting his game for united.

And please no silly we have no-one better comments - Kavanagh, S Reid, A Reid, J O'Brien, Ireland and even Owen Garvan should all be given the go ahead in central midfield before that donkey again surely none of them could be as consistently s**t no matter how inexperienced they are.

Question:
Name one good O'Shea performance in an Ireland shirt I can't think of a single one in 5 years since his debut.

[Hither green]

Just realised that Doyle was given man of the match!

Apart from being embarrased that we awarded it to ourselves, he never got the opportunity!

Between Duff, Dunne & Kilbane for me.

Yes I wondered that. Not that Doyle didn’t play well, but he was on the losing side. For me it had to be Given, if it hadn’t been for him it would have been a lot worse.

I guess it’s only right that Staunton precides over one of our best performances in a while followed by one of our worst. Didn't mean anything though, best time to lose and if they needed bringing down to earth.....


Whats disappointing for me is that we are still no wiser on what our best team is. If Stan chooses a 4-4-2 formation for the qualifiers, there are, in my opinion, four positions up for grabs:

Given

Finnan-O'Brien-Dunne-?????
?????-Reid-?????-Duff
Keane-?????


Couldn’t agree more and yesterday did nothing to answer those questions. I’m normally a defender of friendlies but with the exception of a couple of good individual performances that was largely meaningless. Thought the biggest problems was the centre of midfield, we lost our shape too often and it makes it difficult to judge the rest of the performance.

[Slash/ED]

Was the offer actually accepted Slash??

Initially no but it ultimately was and the player himself turned the move down

[John83]

...Breen didn't play terribly but why the hell is he in there?
...
Kilbane was far and away our worst player today.
Who would you have played? With so many options injured, it was him or O'Shea.

Kilbane did quite well. Frankly, there was far too much competition for our worst player on the pitch. Kelly was very poor, and Harte hasn't improved at all (shock :rolleyes:). Miller and O'Shea were anonymous at best, and I thought Reid gave away a lot of the ball. Kavanagh did well enough when he came on. I've been an O'Shea apologist, but I think I'd rather see Kavanagh start against Holland now.

McGeady looks promising, but he seems to be a poor passer and not much at crossing the ball. Still, he's young yet, and it's nice to have a player with a little penetration.

Doyle did fine, but was starved of service, ditto Robbie, while Byrne played well enough to justify his callup.

Henderson looked suspect. I though he was beaten on any number of narrow wides.


One more thing - where did the ref come up with six extra minutes at the end? Was it just because we were playing at home and were down a goal? I thought there would have been two or at the very most three minutes added on.
You really are clueless, aren't you? 30 seconds a sub. Given there'd been 11 subs made at that point (and another during it)...

[NeilMcD]

Yeah suprised people were suprised at the 6 mins of injury time. The subs on the Ireland team add up to 3 mins on their own.

I thought it was a poor game and Miller and O Shea were lost in midfield and never got a hold of the ball. Reid is not a right winger also and we cannot play 3 at the back. If Staunton takes all those points from the game I will be happy. He should also take that Kilbane is better far away from the opposition goal and as close to our goal.

Kilbane is an honest hard working play who is physical pacey strong and knows how to win a tackle. I think left back is the spot for him.

Team V Germany will be


Given


Finnan O Brien Dunne Kilbane

Carr Kavanagh Reid Duff


Keane Doyle/Morrison

[Slash/ED]

Yeah suprised people were suprised at the 6 mins of injury time. The subs on the Ireland team add up to 3 mins on their own.


Yeah, but surely this shouldn't be the case? Most of the subs were made in one go and hardly took up 3 minutes to make.

But that is the rule and hence the injury time.

[youngirish]

You really are clueless, aren't you? 30 seconds a sub. Given there'd been 11 subs made at that point (and another during it)...
Don't be foolish. Many friendly internationals have more subs than that and refs don't add on ridiculous amounts of time. In some games an entirely different team comes out for the second half on both sides yet I never remember watching a game with 11 extra mins. It's a friendly these rules are (and should be) let slide.

[NeilMcD]

Why do people give a damn how many minutes there were at the end it was a friendly and 6 minutes suited us.

[Stuttgart88]

yesterday did nothing to answer those questions. I’m normally a defender of friendlies but with the exception of a couple of good individual performances that was largely meaningless.
I don't know about that.

I thought we learnt for sure that Kelly is way down the pecking order, Miller isn't strong enough, O'Shea just hasn't got it as a CM, that KK is an option at left back, Steven Reid is best suited to a central job, McGeady has promise...

At least Staunton now knows (at least I hope he does) that certain options are eliminated to fill the spaces in that XI detailed above.

It's a pity we still haven't had a chance to look at Lawrence. A further look at Joey O'Brien and a first look at Owen Garvan & Paddy McCarthy would be useful but I suspect the qualifying campaign will be well underway before this happens.

[monutdfc]

There is NO RULE that says 30 seconds per substitution. FACT!

[Stuttgart88]

Thought the biggest problems was the centre of midfield, we lost our shape too often and it makes it difficult to judge the rest of the performance.
I should have added that I agree totally with that part!

[el punter]

I think the atmosphere at Lansdowne ebbs and flows with the occassion...if we had been playing Italy needing a win to qualify for the world cup there would have been an amazing atmosphere.

But we were playing a team where I'm sure the vast majority of Ireland fans did not know any of the oppositions players (except maybe the chap who was at Liverpool), in a game with no immediate consequence, and fielding a bunch of half-interested players.

[John83]

Don't be foolish. Many friendly internationals have more subs than that and refs don't add on ridiculous amounts of time. In some games an entirely different team comes out for the second half on both sides yet I never remember watching a game with 11 extra mins. It's a friendly these rules are (and should be) let slide. It's foolish to suggest that it's unreasonable to stick to the normal guidelines now? Yes, it would have been nice to just see it blown up with no injury time, but to be shocked or angry at it?

Oh, and there was a max of six subs last night.

[NY Hoop]

Byrne looked good, kind of a poor man's Niall Quinn, but honestly, and no disrespect to anyone here, but if you're playing in Ireland do you really deserve to get a game for the international team?

Why wouldnt you ffs? You might be surprised that the international team is called IRELAND:rolleyes:

Go back to the barstool. Jason Byrne has been the top scorer in the league for the last 3 seasons and has scored in Europe and fyi the league here is on a par with the championship/league 1 in your beloved ingerland.

Atmosphere appalling again last night but why are we shocked? For 90% of the crowd this is the only live football they see.

KOH

[John83]

There is NO RULE that says 30 seconds per substitution. FACT!
No one said there was. It's a rule of thumb.

Much like the rule of thumb that says that people who use "FACT!" to make a point are often idiots.

[Dublin12]

fyi the league here is on a par with the championship/league 1 in your beloved ingerland.



KOH

LOL,now that made me laugh:D ,no disrespect to the EL but it is nowhere near the standard of the Championship in England.

[monutdfc]

Yeah, but surely this shouldn't be the case? Most of the subs were made in one go and hardly took up 3 minutes to make.

But that is the rule and hence the injury time.
eh, I think someone did say it was a rule

[monutdfc]

Don't be foolish. Many friendly internationals have more subs than that and refs don't add on ridiculous amounts of time. In some games an entirely different team comes out for the second half on both sides yet I never remember watching a game with 11 extra mins. It's a friendly these rules are (and should be) let slide.
and here's someone else who said it was a rule (but reckoned it is and should be let slide)

[Paddy Garcia]

It's a pity we still haven't had a chance to look at Lawrence. A further look at Joey O'Brien and a first look at Owen Garvan & Paddy McCarthy would be useful but I suspect the qualifying campaign will be well underway before this happens.

Totally agree, I thought Lawrence should have had a run against Sweden. It's another midfield option we should have explored.

[Real ale Madrid]

LOL,now that made me laugh:D ,no disrespect to the EL but it is nowhere near the standard of the Championship in England.

Ah yes - sure the eL is like the unibond league. I mean how the hell did Jason Byrne get a run last night - how the hell did Gamble get in the squad. In fact why the hell does anyone bother to support the eL - sure it will never get anywhere. I think I'm going to give up supporting Cork City and take my money to the far superior league that is the Coca Fcukin Cola Championship.
To all eL fans : just give it up there no point anymore.

Sorry for the rant - I just thought one moronic post should follow another.

[NY Hoop]

LOL,now that made me laugh:D ,no disrespect to the EL but it is nowhere near the standard of the Championship in England.

Yeah but thats just your opinion. I'm basing mine on actually watching games in the 3 leagues I've mentioned.

KOH

[Raheny Red]

Went to the game last night the amount of little scumbags who attend these games is unreal :mad: . Anyway, as said before, terrible game, terrible atmosphere.

And for the barstoolers - without the eL there would be no national team so be grateful. What's the next game you'll be at? Why not head to Malahide and Pats in the cup, that will have passion and a great atmosphere!

[pete]

Byrne certainly held his own against a "star studded" team of Premiership players & a few Championship players so idiotic arguments here.

To lose at home to 64th ranked team in the world must be a new record in modern times. Worst performance i have seen in Lansdowne & because almost all players played poorly Staunton has to take the blame.

I did not see Ireland play 3-4-3 last night as looked like 4-4-2 to me all game.

You cannot afford to experiement in international football as so few games. Friendlies are to be used to prepare for competitive games & to try out a few different players.

Its quiet clear now that the players were on the beer or lying on the beach in Portugal as most of them couldn't be bothered last night. FFS Steven Reid couldn't even pass the ball further than 10 yards. :rolleyes:

[Stuttgart88]

Fairly predictably the expert pundits are now concluding that 4-4-2 is Ireland's best formation, but what I would like to know is how does Ireland producing a really poor performance playing 3-4-3 followed by 4-4-2 prove that playing 4-4-2 is better than 4-3-3/4-5-1?
Well said.

Anyway, I'm all for trying new ideas but only if the personnel available suit the idea. In my mind, trying Kelly was a big enough decision without trying to create a new position for him. Finnan has all the attributes required to play as part of a back 3, but not Kelly. Likewise I was disappointed to see Reid on the right of midfield. Kerr's mistake against Italy was not trying a new shape, it was deploying inapproriate personnel in doing so. Same mistake last night too.

[Dublin12]

Ah yes - sure the eL is like the unibond league. I mean how the hell did Jason Byrne get a run last night - how the hell did Gamble get in the squad. In fact why the hell does anyone bother to support the eL - sure it will never get anywhere. I think I'm going to give up supporting Cork City and take my money to the far superior league that is the Coca Fcukin Cola Championship.
To all eL fans : just give it up there no point anymore.

Sorry for the rant - I just thought one moronic post should follow another.

Very good,but you haven't actually told me how the standard of football and the product that you are paying for is actually better than the Championship in England.The EL does nothing whatsoever to attract people to go and support it,if you go once you need to be attracted back again and this doesn't happen in Ireland,the facilities aren't up to it,the standard of football isn't great and you just don't get value for money imo,if this improves I will start to go again.

[NeilMcD]

Well said Stuttgart, but people are going over the top here. Its an end of season friendly lets enjoy the World Cup and the EL Season and look forward to the qualifiers in the Autumn.

[NY Hoop]

Try reading the actual posts. Nobody said it was better than the championship. Again the standard ON THE PITCH is on a par with championship/league 1.

The facilities are bad and there is not much advertisement but people in the game are working very hard to improve all the time.

It's a bug and live football is miles better than shouting at a tv screen.

KOH

[NeilMcD]

Lads why do people constantly post wind ups having a go against the Eircom League. Its pretty obvious that the standard of the league has improved a huge amount of the last 5 years.

EL performances in Europe have improved through Shels and Cork City .

I would agree that the standard is in about the same as the Championship in England. The performance of Kevin Doyle over in England is evidence of this.

The facilities are lacking but at the end of the day its not a night at the opera either. You go to the game you shout your lungs out and you go home again. You dont need a comfy chair etc.

Great strides have been made and it should be good to watch out good the EL sides do in Europe this year.


Saying that I though Byrne looked limited last night in his first touch etc but was certainly good in the air and his size and presence disrupted the Chilean back four. If we are looking for a big man amongst our strikers I would have him ahead of Alan Lee and Doherty but behind Keane, Doyle and Morrison.

[Dodge]

Why do people give a damn how many minutes there were at the end it was a friendly and 6 minutes suited us.
Yeah and we DOMINATED those 6 minutes. In your f*cking face Chile!!!!!

[Real ale Madrid]

Very good,but you haven't actually told me how the standard of football and the product that you are paying for is actually better than the Championship in England.The EL does nothing whatsoever to attract people to go and support it,if you go once you need to be attracted back again and this doesn't happen in Ireland,the facilities aren't up to it,the standard of football isn't great and you just don't get value for money imo,if this improves I will start to go again.

thanks - unfortunately I'm not going to get drawn into the debate of the haves and have nots of the Coca Cola c'ship v the eircom league. Comments like "the eL does nothing whatsoever to attract people" tells me you know sweet FA about the eL. I have nothing against the Championship and watch loads of games, But saying the eL is "nowhere near" is blatently untrue and didnt warrent the intelligent reply i think you were looking for. The comment got what it deserved - sarcasm and derision.

44,000 at the game last night - wonder what the combined attendence will be for the 16 FAI cup games on over the weekend? Unfortunately peoples perception is one thing due to listening to twits like Naill Quinn tell us what a player Reading made out of Kevin Doyle!!! (what a joke) and the reality is somewhat different.

[Dublin12]

Try reading the actual posts. Nobody said it was better than the championship. Again the standard ON THE PITCH is on a par with championship/league 1.

The facilities are bad and there is not much advertisement but people in the game are working very hard to improve all the time.

It's a bug and live football is miles better than shouting at a tv screen.

KOH

Cmon lad open your mincers,the standard on the pitch is nowhere near the English Championship,be realistic.Anyway, one thing I agree with you about is that going live(I go over to Elland Rd alot) is much better than shouting at the screen .So, thats the last I'll say on it as it's going a bit off topic for the thread title

[NeilMcD]

Doyle goes from Cork City and is the best player in the Championship, how is the standard that different if he was able to make the transition or jump (sic) look so easy. The evidence points that the top teams in the EL are at the level of the teams in the Championship in my view.

[John83]

I did not see Ireland play 3-4-3 last night as looked like 4-4-2 to me all game. It looked like a 4-3-3 to me, but with Duff fairly wide. Reid wasn't playing right wing, he was the right hand side of three. Hard to be sure though!

Certainly wasn't playing as a 3-4-3. Kilbane was clearly at left back the entire game up to when Harte came on.


44,000 at the game last night - wonder what the combined attendence will be for the 16 FAI cup games on over the weekend? 41200 was announced at the game, and that may have been ticket sales rather than actual crowd.

As for the combined FAI Cup attendances, I'll guess 9000. We should have a competition. :D


Unfortunately peoples perception is one thing due to listening to twits like Naill Quinn tell us what a player Reading made out of Kevin Doyle!!! (what a joke) and the reality is somewhat different. Yeah, that's just laughable.

[Donal81]

That was an awful game. We should really be beating Chile at home, no doubt about it. However, there are more positives than negatives, I reckon.

What we really need is a defined formation, approach and first 11. Obviously, injuries prevent any team from fielding the same team constantly but we need to figure out the general shape that best suits us for the Euro qualifiers.

Kerr didn't really use the numerous friendlies to experiment with new players, instead choosing them to boost morale, maybe, by beating decent teams in meaningless games. As a result, we carried our obvious problems in midfield and upfront into the games that mattered, where we paid dearly for them. We never found out over the friendlies whether or not McGeady was an option on the wing or how Steven Reid could play in the centre.

At least Stan tried a few things last night and hopefully he keeps it up. We have to figure out by September what our team will look like. Charlton's team had its strength in its consistency - we generally knew our first 11 and they knew each other. At the moment, who is our right full? Who's our right winger? Who is our central midfield pairing? Who is left-full? Who should partner Dunne in defence? Who should play upfront with Keane? Is Doyle up to it? These are questions that need answers quickly. While last night was brutal, hopefully Stan was trying to answer those questions, it certainly seemed like it.

[monutdfc]

It was 3-4-3 for about the first 20 minutes or so, then Kilbane dropped back to play as an orthodox left-back.
Agree with whoever said it, it was a dumb experiment to go 3 at the back, we'd never play that formation v Germany. I felt sorry for Stephen Kelly making his debut in a defensive system that was unfamiliar to him and his team-mates. All our defenders have been raised on 4 at the back, play it every week, too risky to change the habits of a lifetime for international games.

[John83]

It was 3-4-3 for about the first 20 minutes or so, then Kilbane dropped back to play as an orthodox left-back.
Agree with whoever said it, it was a dumb experiment to go 3 at the back, we'd never play that formation v Germany. I felt sorry for Stephen Kelly making his debut in a defensive system that was unfamiliar to him and his team-mates. All our defenders have been raised on 4 at the back, play it every week, too risky to change the habits of a lifetime for international games.
Fair enough. He wasn't exactly fantastic after switching to a pure right back role either though.

[youngirish]

Doyle goes from Cork City and is the best player in the Championship, how is the standard that different if he was able to make the transition or jump (sic) look so easy. The evidence points that the top teams in the EL are at the level of the teams in the Championship in my view.
Yeah and how many failed Championship, League 1 and even League 2 players have gone the other way and been a success? Why does everything on this forum have to revert to an EL is better than Championship/League 1 debate? Its pure delusional nonsense to suggest that it's better than the Championship and I have seen plenty of matches in both.

When the EL pushers come out with comments stating otherwise it really does show how biased and unrealistic their opinions are.

The fact is Jason Byrne was in the squad not on merit but only as a lame gesture. The majority of our best players get snatched by Premiership or Championship clubs when they are young so to suggest that what's left behind is better is absolute s**te. Take into account the number of foreign Internationals, former Internationals and former or up and coming (on loan) Premiership players that play in the Championship and any reasonable person must be able to see that your argument is pure b*llox. Finally look at the number of players that couldn't make the grade in England (many in lower leagues than the Championship) but have come back to the EL and been a success and that should drive the final nail into the coffin for your argument.

I expect a backlash from the EL lovers here but you haven't a leg to stand on so I don't give a balls. Turn another few threads into the EL is better than the Championship also while your at it.

[Shelsman]

Well, here's my tuppence worth on how we played and what who we should play vs Germany:

HOW WE PLAYED (IMO)
Given -Good
--
Kelly -Poor
Breen -Shakey
Dunne -Shakey
Kilbane -OK
--
Miller -Poor
S Reid -Poor, underhit passes all night
O'Shea -Poor, though did have a couple of good passes, will never be a dominant midfielder
Duff -Good, but doesn't cross soon enough
--
Keane -OK
Doyle -Good

Subs:
Harte -OK
Kavanagh -OK
McGeady -Very good, again doesn't cross soon enough
Jason Byrne -Good headers
Andy Reid -can see his class straight away

What we learnt:
-Kelly's not ready yet.
-Breen is on the way out -he's not getting better so it's time to blood a new lad e.g. Paddy McCarthy ( Leicester ).
-Steven Reid is best in Centre midfield
-Duff has no right foot, when he drags the ball back he refuses to cross with his right foot -this needs to be remedied / practised. I also think he is at his most effective when up front as he was at the World Cup in Japan.
-Kevin Doyle is a very good prospect and it's between him and Morrison as to who partners Keane.
-Jason Byrne is worth another look

My starting XI vs Holland:
Subs in parenthesis

GK Given
--
RB Carr
CB Dunne ( Paddy McCarthy )
CB O'Brien
LB Finnan
--
RW Duff
CM Steven Reid ( Kavanagh )
CM Andy Reid
LW McGeady
--
CF Keane
CF Doyle

I had thought of having Harte on the left side of midfield, after all, what do we want from that position ( if we put Duff up front )? Someone who can put in a good cross? I would think Harte can do that, as for all ye who criticize his defending then we needn't worry. He's also a good header of the ball so could nip in for a goal, then there's his free kicks too...........
Mind you I'd create a paradox in having Harte on the left wing and two smallies up front ( Duffer or Keane won't win any headers, neither will McGeady, Andy Reid or Steven Reid if they get forward! ). The fact is that Duff is at his most devastating for Ireland up front ( I've seen him marked out of a game too many times on the wing ) and we need our best players in their most effective positions. The other alternative is to have Duff on the RW and McGeady on the LW, then they can pull the ball back and cross on their strong foot and also cut inside and shoot on their strong foot too ( remember Kennedy's goal vs Yugoslavia? )

[ifk101]

Yeah and how many failed Championship, League 1 and even League 2 players have gone the other way and been a success? Why does everything on this forum have to revert to an EL is better than Championship/League 1 debate? Its pure delusional nonsense to suggest that it's better than the Championship and I have seen plenty of matches in both.

When the EL pushers come out with comments stating otherwise it really does show how biased and unrelaisitc their opinions are.

The fact is Jason Byrne was in the squad not on merit but only as a lame gesture. The majority of our best players get snatched by Premiership or Championship clubs when they are young so to suggest that what's left is better is absolute s**te. Take into account the number of foreign Intenationals, former Internationals and former or up and coming (on loan) Premiership players that play in the Championship and any reasonable person must be able to see that your argument is pure b*llox. Finally look at the number of players that couldn't make the grade in England (many in lower leagues than the Championship) but have come back to the EL and been a success and that should drive the final nail into the coffin for your argument.

I expect a backlash from the EL lovers here but you haven't a leg to stand on so I don't give a balls. Turn another few threads into the EL is better than the Championship also while your at it.


At the end of the day if people want Ireland to be regularly qualifying for the World Cup and the European Championship we need a strong League of Ireland. The dogs on the street know this. So I can't for the life of me understand why:
1. People in Dublin 12 travel over to see Leeds United on a regular basis and claim to be fans of Irish football.
2. People believe that LOI players shouldn't be considered for the national team.
3. People, Irish "football fans", mock the standard of league football in Ireland without ever attending a LOI match.
4. People benchmark British league football as the standard for the Irish national team.
5. People are experts in highlighting the failings of the International team but are unable to point out where Tolka Park is on a map.

[Real ale Madrid]

Yeah and how many failed Championship, League 1 and even League 2 players have gone the other way and been a success? Why does everything on this forum have to revert to an EL is better than Championship/League 1 debate? Its pure delusional nonsense to suggest that it's better than the Championship and I have seen plenty of matches in both.

When the EL pushers come out with comments stating otherwise it really does show how biased and unrelaisitc their opinions are.

The fact is Jason Byrne was in the squad not on merit but only as a lame gesture. The majority of our best players get snatched by Premiership or Championship clubs when they are young so to suggest that what's left is better is absolute s**te. Take into account the number of foreign Intenationals, former Internationals and former or up and coming (on loan) Premiership players that play in the Championship and any reasonable person must be able to see that your argument is pure b*llox. Finally look at the number of players that couldn't make the grade in England (many in lower leagues than the Championship) but have come back to the EL and been a success and that should drive the final nail into the coffin for your argument.

I expect a backlash from the EL lovers here but you haven't a leg to stand on so I don't give a balls. Turn another few threads into the EL is better than the Championship also while your at it.

No one said it was better - i was merely reacting to the stupid comment that the eL was "nowhere near" the CCC. Which is incorrect. And you really shouldent refer to people as "eL lovers" i dont consider myself an eL lover. Just a football fan that supports his local team thats all - if half the poeple that went last night supported thier local team i.e. had a real interest in irish football - then we wouldnt be having this debate.