Ireland training + Mick Byrne

[Naitch]

Im off college this week and am planning on going to see Ireland train tomorrow but does anybody know if its still Malahide they are training also great to see Mick Byrne back who will almost certainly bring back the fun , team spirted banter which the team had before Kerr took over

[NeilMcD]

WHILE it's too early to be evaluating Steve Staunton's success as Ireland manager, we can at least say that he's done enough to make Jason McAteer a happy man. McAteer, in town to publicise his latest Football Aid charity venture, is ecstatic that Staunton has brought back old stalwarts like Tony Hickey and Mick Byrne to the Ireland set-up. It's beginning to feel like old times again. Throw in a fresh round of Harry's Challenge and a couple of gruff northern English accents and you could nearly swear that Big Jack had never gone away.

No sooner was he settled into his swivel chair than Staunton began to dismantle the fabric built by Brian Kerr and set about replacing it with the structures, so tried and trusted, of a decade ago. The entire edifice was dusted and anything that carried Kerr's fingerprints was marked for instant removal, a policy no doubt that will endear Staunton to his new employers, who couldn't wait for the chance to usher the previous manager to the door.

Perhaps the team's performance on Wednesday will inform us better, but as of now it's difficult to see anything about Staunton's first eight weeks that isn't regressive. Even the hiring of Bobby Robson in a role that has yet to be clearly defined hardly seems the most forward-looking, as venerable and likeable as the former England manager is.

Harking back to old times is rarely a recipe for future success. "We're Ireland and we don't get beat," was Staunton's familiar mantra as an on-pitch leader. If management really is as simple as that, we're surely on the cusp of another golden age.

In truth, it's anything but. That old terrace chant about how impossible it was to beat the Irish was always more problematic than anyone cared to admit. For if it was true that there was a fair chance you wouldn't beat them, it was an equally good bet you wouldn't lose to Ireland either. For all the drumbeating and open-top bus rides of the 1990s, is it really worth getting worked up about a major finals record that says 16 games played and only two won, one of them against the pitiful challenge of Saudi Arabia?

Even without the caveman style of football, do we really hanker for a return to the days when Ireland - to borrow Niall Quinn's memorable phrase - were Ragarse Rovers and thoroughly happy in their skin? Should we not aspire to something a little nobler, a game-plan based on something more than trying to bore and frustrate the opposition into making catastrophic errors in critical places?

The key word in all this is passion and it is a much abused word. The consensus is that under Kerr, the Irish players felt their passion for playing for Ireland was diluted and Staunton has made it a central plank of his reign to bring it back. No one is more enthusiastic than McAteer. "Passion," he said, "is vital at international level and certainly it is in our team. We weren't graced with a lot of world-class players, we had two or three, but the passion we showed on the pitch got us results."

One of the charges made against Kerr was that he overcooked it with video analysis and while that is unquestionably true, McAteer's description of the use of video technology under Mick McCarthy would be hilarious if it wasn't so disturbing. "With Mick we used to watch videos while we were eating and stuff," he said. "You are taking it in but it's not a pleasure to watch it. Otherwise you are half falling asleep sometimes and it can have an adverse effect."

The blatant truth is that passion only got Ireland, as it does any team, so far. Have we forgotten that under McCarthy Ireland took three campaigns to qualify for a major finals and then mainly because of the single-mindedness of Roy Keane, who clearly despised and mistrusted the kind of passion that existed among his team-mates? In any case, is it not strange that a manager should make so much of the job of instilling passion in his team? Should we not assume that as a given and work upwards from there?

For all his faults, Keane espoused a new, more confident vision of how Irish football might proceed and, in Kerr, he saw much to admire. The pity about Kerr is that he couldn't translate what were impressive and forward-looking ideas into a successful day-to-day running of the team, but virtually throwing out the entire blueprint with the manager seems a hopelessly retrograde step.

If McAteer is to be believed, the rehiring of Hickey and the omnipresent Byrne, whose role will be as nothing more than a 'character' and masseur of pampered egos, is only the beginning. Staunton, he says, will bring training back to Clonshaugh, where the facilities were described by Keane a few years ago as "abysmal."

Staunton will also restore the team to their traditional base at Dublin Airport. Why? Were there not enough distractions at Portmarnock? Was there too much cursed peace and sanctuary for the players' liking?

Memories best consigned to the dustbin of Irish football history

Worst of all, McAteer also spoke about the return of the 'I had a Macedonia' t-shirt which was traditionally awarded to the worst player in training and was introduced after Ireland's disastrous 3-2 defeat in Skopje in 1997. The joke was as funny to McCarthy's players as it was offensive to the Macedonians and you can only imagine the smile on their faces when Goran Stavreski's last minute goal in 1999 put paid to Ireland's automatic qualification hopes for Euro 2000.

The problem for Staunton in looking to the past is that he inevitably invokes memories like that which are best consigned to the dustbin of Irish football history. His crude and reductionist handling of the complex issue of non-Irish born players is another black mark. That Staunton chose to tackle it in such a brusque, forthright manner was in keeping with his character, but that doesn't change the fact that there was a more subtle path.

Right now, though, Staunton's reign seems to have as much subtlety as a Mick McCarthy punt into Row Z. Ultimately, of course, we will pander to the clichés and tell ourselves it is a results business and judge him on that basis. It worked for Jack Charlton. But is three steps back the way to take one step forward?

[NY Hoop]

Byrne is a complete embarrassment. No wonder Kerr ditched him. Is he qualified to be a physiotherapist? Isnt Ciaran Murray already there? What is his purpose? To boost "team spirit" and "banter". Do me a favour.:rolleyes:

Is he gonna be genuflecting? Is he gonna hop on Stan when we score a goal? To complete the look he should put on a leprechaun suit..........

KOH

[onenilgameover]

Great to see Mick is back and I think they are still out in malahide...went out to watch them bout a year ago and theres no hassle....

[NeilMcD]

Damien Duff can already sense a more relaxed air about the Republic of Ireland following the appointment of Steve Staunton as manager.

Six weeks after his official unveiling as successor to Brian Kerr, it was finally down to business today for Staunton and his band of 22 brothers in arms.

It is testament to Staunton that all reported in for duty to play their role in his regime, seen very much as a new broom sweeping clean, ahead of Wednesday's Lansdowne Road friendly with Sweden.

Evidence of that was witnessed last night as Staunton allowed his players a drink over dinner following the 16th eircom/FAI Annual International Awards ceremony.

There are also a few familiar faces back in town, characters who served under Jack Charlton and Mick McCarthy, but axed upon Kerr's arrival. One is security officer Tony Hickey, and another is Mick Byrne.

Staunton opted to keep Byrne's return secret until today, with Duff one of those happy to see him back, even if he was given a very rude awakening this morning.

"Flying in yesterday there was just this feeling of excitement, no other word for it," explained Duff when asked for his feelings on the forthcoming Staunton era.

"I haven't really had any time to take it all in, but I'm just so looking forward to it.

"There are a few new faces around in the backroom staff we used to work with a few years ago, so hopefully it will bring back the team spirit and togetherness we once had.

"There was definitely something missing at the end of Brian's reign, I think we all know that, but these familiar faces we were all so close to are back, and that can only help.

"Outside the team you wouldn't really see these guys, but the likes of myself and a few others were close to them.

"Seeing Mick again was a big shock. The first I knew he was back was when he sneaked into my room, jumped onto my bed and started kissing me. It was a nice way to wake up!

"He is a special man and you can't help but love him."

It is that kind of camaraderie that had disappeared towards the end of Kerr's tenure, one that came to an end in October after he failed to steer the Republic towards this summer's World Cup finals.

It will certainly be required to compensate for Staunton's lack of managerial experience, but then Chelsea star Duff does not see that as any kind of problem.

"I'm not worried about that, and I'm sure the rest of the players aren't either," said Duff, who turns 27 on Thursday.

Duff was one of seven players put up for interview as a continental style has now been adopted, allowing the media to interview whomever they pleased, another major change under Staunton.

"You have no need to look any further than Stuart Pearce, who is doing well at Manchester City in what his first job," added Duff.

"Just give Steve a chance. He has been there, done it. No disrespect to Brian, but he probably didn't know the ins and outs of every day life in the English game.

"Whereas Steve knows what footballers are like, what goes on, and I think he will be good.

"Hopefully he can get us back qualifying for major tournaments, and getting that winning mentality back. That is all we care about.

"We all just need to stick together for once - players, staff, fans and the media - and hopefully we can go in the right direction.

"It certainly felt that way last night. There was more of a relaxed atmosphere.

"We were allowed to have a pint, and that is kind of relaxing in itself!"

Duff, one of the more senior players in the wake of the retirements of Roy Keane, Kenny Cunningham and Matt Holland, admits to a greater sense of responsibility with Staunton blooding several youngsters.

However, more importantly, he feels he owes it to himself to show the Irish public they have yet to see the best of him, despite 57 caps to his credit.

"I'm nowhere near my peak," said a straight-talking Duff.

"I've had a couple of injuries over the past couple of months, and I tried to play through them.

"I'm now back pain free. I've been working hard to get back to 100 per cent fitness and sharpness. Hopefully I'll be there Wednesday.

"Although I'm not back in the Chelsea team, I've had an awful lot more lows in my career. I've been there, done that, so it doesn't matter.

"I will still give 100 per cent every day."

Robbie Keane, meanwhile, would appear to be the front runner to take over the captaincy from Cunningham, edging out Shay Given, Kevin Kilbane and Richard Dunne.

[gspain]

Byrne is an embarrassment and a backwards step. I don't think he is allowed treat players as a physio.

[NeilMcD]

Duff seems to like him though lol

[bluemovie]

Mick Byrne is a nice man, but I don't think he's a qualified physio. When I heard he was back, Harry's Challenge sprung to mind. The Indo obviously made the same connection. How will it go down with Mourinho, Ferguson or Benitez if Duff, O'Shea or Finnan sustain an injury while on international duty and are not attended to by a trained physio. Maybe Tommy Tiernan or Hector would have been a better choice.

[Stuttgart88]

Presumably there are qualified physios in the camp too.

Duff didn't try too hard to disguise how he felt about Kerr's methods & the mood they resulted in.

[beautifulrock]

SS's choice to bring him back, lets see what happens before we jump to the negative conclusion. The Indo on Sun piece was a bit cutting seeing as we havent even had a game with the new management team in charge. Must be the shortest honeymoon since Julie Roberts and her first husbands(or was that the second). That paper is getting worse than the Sun every week.

[NeilMcD]

Duff was one of seven players put up for interview as a continental style has now been adopted, allowing the media to interview whomever they pleased, another major change under Staunton.

"You have no need to look any further than Stuart Pearce, who is doing well at Manchester City in what his first job," added Duff. "Just give Steve a chance. He has been there, done it. No disrespect to Brian, but he probably didn’t know the ins and outs of every day life in the English game.

"Whereas Steve knows what footballers are like, what goes on, and I think he will be good.Hopefully he can get us back qualifying for major tournaments, and getting that winning mentality back. That is all we care about. We all just need to stick together for once — players, staff, fans and the media — and hopefully we can go in the right direction.

"It certainly felt that way last night. There was more of a relaxed atmosphere. We were allowed to have a pint, and that is kind of relaxing in itself!"

[wws]

a few pints and a bit a jiggery pokery with Mick Byrne in the mornings
should have the germans quaking in their ledherhosen!

[Stuttgart88]

It's easy to thake the p1ss but when you hear Duff saying he was full of excitement about coming over then that's surely a good start.

[NeilMcD]

Yeah I agree, team spirit is a huge thing in football and it appears the team spirit was not there for some reason at the end of teh last campaign. If Mick Byrne was the physio i would have a problem wit it, however if he is there just as a motivator and glorified cheerleader well then there is no harm to it really.

[wws]

its not a "good start". its bog standard what you'd expect him to say, he even praised the last management team who he loved "to bits" when they had the job, its what footballers do - now it WOULD be front page news if he came out and said "ah feck this lads, stan hasnt a fcking clue.....and that mick byrnes a pervo"

[Jerry The Saint]

Give some credit to Staunton, Brendan O'Carroll also auditioned for the Mick Byrne role but did not meet the new manager's rigorous party-hardy standards. Apparently his player-fondling left a lot to be desired as well.

[zinedineontour]

why are some people so negative in regards to staunton bringing back mick byrne ? If the players are happy to see him back is that not a good start already and if it helps team spirit then im all for it .. certainly not an ambarrased ..

[joema]

Give some credit to Staunton, Brendan O'Carroll also auditioned for the Mick Byrne role but did not meet the new manager's rigorous party-hardy standards. Apparently his player-fondling left a lot to be desired as well.


a few pints and a bit a jiggery pokery with Mick Byrne in the mornings
should have the germans quaking in their ledherhosen!

Give Staunton a break will ye
He hasnt even managed a game yet!!!
And the players are happy

Also wws they were allowed one pint - whats the harm in that???

[silentbob]

FFS, I cant believe how negative some of the comments on this thread has been, and we havent even played a match under our new manager yet!! Seems to me that some people want Stan to fail as Ireland manager so that they can say "I told you so". This is a DISGRACE and I cannot understand why people wont give things a chance before coming on here and shouting their mouths off.

With regard to Mick Byrne you can safely assume that there will be a fully qualified physio in the Ireland set up at all times.( The FAI would find it difficult to get insurance for their players if this was not the case.) So, whilst we do not know exacly what his role will be within the backroom staff lets just wait and see instead of slagging him off.

Really looking forward to the match on Wednesday night and the beginning of a new era for Ireland, Its a pity others dont feel the same.

Best wishes to Stan, his backroom staff and players in their new campaign.

[livehead1]

"Just give Steve a chance. He has been there, done it. No disrespect to Brian, but he probably didn't know the ins and outs of every day life in the English game.

Does that kill hardcore EL fans to read that? And from our main man. I think duff has just explained most things i've said about our setup, or tried to say.

[Emmet]

Does that kill hardcore EL fans to read that? And from our main man. I think duff has just explained most things i've said about our setup, or tried to say.

I get the feeling that Duff was being polite there - I think there might have been other more fundamental issues there which he didn't want to talk about publicly

[Forever Dreamin]

If memory serves me right Mick was bag man rather than physio. He also has always had a great relationship with all the players. If he helps unify the team great. Lets just get behind Stan and the team, negative comments will acheive nothing and regardless of what anyone thinks or wants Stans the man for the next two years.

[twoenz]

At the minute Mick has more big tournament experience than some of the players. I don't think that it's fair to knock him, or Staunton.

A ball has not been kicked. I for one am very excited by the new reign. Can't wait for Landsdowne on Weds.

[Qwerty]

If memory serves me right Mick was bag man rather than physio. He also has always had a great relationship with all the players. If he helps unify the team great. Lets just get behind Stan and the team, negative comments will acheive nothing and regardless of what anyone thinks or wants Stans the man for the next two years.

Charlie O'Leary was the bag man for years, I'm not sure who has done the job recently. Mick Byrne has been the physio since before Charlton and would one of the gobsh1tes knocking him please provide some evidence as to his professional shortcomings as it appears to be mostly character attacks - if you can do that from your barstools. I don't recall any lawsuits brought against the FAI or Mick Byrne in over 20 years of service for Ireland.

[Donal81]

"We all just need to stick together for once - players, staff, fans and the media - and hopefully we can go in the right direction."

I'm not sure what Duff means here. Let him be under no illusions - Ireland didn't qualify for the World Cup because a lot of players didn't give us big performances, Duff included. He came in for some ridiculous criticism on this forum and he's our most gifted player but a lot of the players just weren't there. It had nothing to do with the fans, who turned up faithfully to every game in Lansdowne and shelled out to travel around Europe supporting their millionaire heroes who sometimes played as if they were heavily hungover. And it had absolutely nothing to do with the media.

All this Mick Byrne talk is making me a bit uneasy - Niall Quinn's horrible description of the Charlton team in its boozy decline makes me fairly cynical of the merits of that era. Let me clarify that; I don't think that heavy drinking and little analysis of opponents helps to build a better team.

[geysir]

So what makes you think that Mick Byrne's call up is the harbinger of a drink sodden squad?

[Donal81]

So what makes you think that Mick Byrne's call up is the harbinger of a drink sodden squad?

I didn't say that. It's all the talk of bringing back the old way of doing things.

[brine3]

Yeah, they're all happy now because they don't have to watch Brian Kerr's DVDs. They can go out for a drink, sleep in and skip their breakfasts. Then there's Niall Quinn going on about the good old days under Jack, and how we should forget all this passing and 'put em under pressure'.

Say what you want about Brian Kerr, but he brought a lot of professionalism to the Ireland setup, both the senior team and the youth setup.

In a way the FAI have their man. Stan probably isn't going to complain when the Genesis Report is eventually flushed down the toilet for good. I have a feeling that we're staring down the barrel of another 1996-1998 period in Irish football. Stan even nearly said himself that he's planning for the 2010 World Cup. Well, in 2010 our four best players (Given, Finnan, Duff, Keane) will be 34, 34, 31 and 30. We should be planning for now.

There's a air of defeatism and "we're only in it for the craic" wafting over the Irish camp and I don't like the smell of it.

(Just getting my hopes down so that when we do eventually win it will be a pleasant surprise.)

[Dodge]

Does that kill hardcore EL fans to read that? And from our main man. I think duff has just explained most things i've said about our setup, or tried to say.
Not really, Roy Keane couldn't praise Kerr enough. Some players don't get on with managers, some do. No big deal.

[Dodge]

Mick Byrne has been the physio since before Charlton and would one of the gobsh1tes knocking him please provide some evidence as to his professional shortcomings
He's not a qualified physiotherapist. Need more proof?

[klein4]

agree totally with the above post. the fai got their man alrite.god forbid any of the players would look at themselves and how much they contributed in the last campaign.

[geysir]

He's not a qualified physiotherapist. Need more proof?
Okay he doesn't have a diploma in his back pocket.
Is that it?

[Schumi]

He's not a qualified physiotherapist.
Thus making him the perfect team physio in the new FAI way of doing things. :D

[Stuttgart88]

Okay he doesn't have a diploma in his back pocket.
Is that it?
Sensitive issue for you Geysir? :)

I don't think Staunton is being defeatist. I think he's being realistic about our chances and about when some of the promising youngsters will be at their peak. I don't doubt for a second that he's going to try as hard as anyone to qualify for 2008.

I think Roy Keane's praise for Kerr was mainly to put the knife into Mick & the "old ways". Carr publicly supported Kerr when he retired but word has it Carr was one of those most unhappy with Kerr's ways.

It seems that Staunton is bringing in a more relaxed mood to the squad. If the players are happy that's good for us. Duff has been more outspoken than most about the loss of team-spirit. Remember all the talk of a bust-up when the team bus broke down in Killiney a few years ago? Team spirit alone doesn't win anything, but any team that wins things has got to have it. Bobby Robson's presence will ensure that the necessary degree of professionalism will remain, I've no fears on that front.

To the best of my knowledge, nowhere has Staunton said we'll resort to primitive long-ball crap football. I'd ignore anything Niall Quinn says - nice enough bloke but not exactly an intellectual authority.

[gspain]

Mick Byrne is not a qualified physio and was not allowed handle a number of squad players in the past. He is the ultimate "hanger on". I can't imagine his role will involve anything other than improving team morale.

I believe from a GAA source that he is no longer welcome at a certain Dublin GAA club as well.

[colster]

agree totally with the above post. the fai got their man alrite.god forbid any of the players would look at themselves and how much they contributed in the last campaign.

I think the players have looked at their own contribution. Witness Duff's interviews over the last couple of days. Witness the countless players interviews supporting Kerr before + after he was sacked saying performances were not good enough.

I can't see the problem with Mick Byrne etc coming back. The players and management team are all comfortable with them. It just means that there may be a better atmostphere around the camp and better starting point to prepare for matches.
As a physio (qualified or not) you would think Byrne would know the dangers of drinking close to a game.
Anyway in the whole scheme of things these lads coming back is not going to have much effect on performance on the pitch.

Finally, there are a lot of people here who seem to be intent on denegrating anything that Staunton or the FAI do. Staunton doesn't deserve it. Give the man a chance for goodness sake.
I think he's made a pretty good start.

[Dodge]

A good percentage of the squad won't know Mick Byrne so may not be as comfortable with him as you think. The whole thing makes me think of David Brent but I can't think why

[paul_oshea]

ya he was involved with galway as well for a while when john omahony was in charge.

stuttgart you are usually the voice of reason but...


I think he's being realistic about our chances and about when some of the promising youngsters will be at their peak. I don't doubt for a second that he's going to try as hard as anyone to qualify for 2008.


....as stated above our 4 main players will be hitting or in their thirties, for 2 of them they're peak would be around 26 - 29, especially for wingers/strikers. euro 2008 would be that time, plus take into account that we could possibly be 5th seeds by then, or at best probably 3rd if we dont qualify for euro 2008, so how can people be saying that the one to aim for is 2010, that is non-sensical and illogical given the possibilities. Even if 2 or 3 more players brake in, and that is a big if, as we have seen manys a time before. great aspirations for young players, only for nothing to come from it.

[colster]

A good percentage of the squad won't know Mick Byrne so may not be as comfortable with him as you think. The whole thing makes me think of David Brent but I can't think why

Look Staunton knows him. Kelly knows him. A lot of the squad know him. Whats the problem?
Is Mick Byrne going to play or coach? He's not even physio. He seems to be a general dogs body. He's nothing to do with the football side of things.
FFS we'll be discussing whether or not the tea lady or washing powder should have been changed next.
This whole thread strikes me as people using anything to have a go at Staunton.
Give the man a chance.

[klein4]

I think if you read thru the thread you will find it was more a case of people using anything as a stick to beat brian kerr with. altho your right. it wont make an arse of a differance.

[Stuttgart88]

I don't think that's a fair summary Klein. The only thing people were using as a stick to beat Kerr with were Duff's quotes. I thought the message from Duff was pretty clear.

I hope Kerr's professionalism remains but if team spirit was a problem under Kerr then I hope it improves. I don't think that's an unreasonable stance.

[NeilMcD]

Yes the only criticism of Kerr could be the quotes of Damien Duff. I just posted the articles up without adding anything to them. I think Duffs quotes say it for themselves, team morale wa not as it should be during the last few weeks of the last campaign. Now if we could find out the reason for that we woudl be doing well.

[NY Hoop]

Charlie O'Leary was the bag man for years, I'm not sure who has done the job recently. Mick Byrne has been the physio since before Charlton and would one of the gobsh1tes knocking him please provide some evidence as to his professional shortcomings as it appears to be mostly character attacks - if you can do that from your barstools. I don't recall any lawsuits brought against the FAI or Mick Byrne in over 20 years of service for Ireland.

So to question Byrne's right to be back means that I'm a "gobsh1te" or even worse a "barstooler":rolleyes:

Again the guy is an embarrassment and is not a qualified physio. I am a 1000% behind Stan and was always fully supportive of the previous managers.

Granted the idiot is not playing but if his role is to "lift the spirits" then that is a complete smokescreen.

Remember him lifting the Sam when he was with Galway in 98. Thought he was a Dub "through and through".

KOH

[geysir]

Sensitive issue for you Geysir? :).
Not at all, quite the opposite. I like the idea of Mick Byrne's return."Is that it" was meant as 'is that the only thing of substance against his recall to the squad'.
Any chance of Billy Lord being ressurected?

[Hither green]

WHILE it's too early to be evaluating Steve Staunton's success as Ireland manager, we can at least say that he's done enough to make Jason McAteer a happy man. McAteer, in town to publicise his latest Football Aid charity venture, is ecstatic that Staunton has brought back old stalwarts like Tony Hickey and Mick Byrne to the Ireland set-up.........
............Right now, though, Staunton's reign seems to have as much subtlety as a Mick McCarthy punt into Row Z. Ultimately, of course, we will pander to the clichés and tell ourselves it is a results business and judge him on that basis. It worked for Jack Charlton. But is three steps back the way to take one step forward?

What a steaming pile of cr@p. He drowns out some quite good points with the sound of a large axe being ground. And he can't even count, it was 3 wins in 16 games wasn't it? Okay, so out of the 2 he's counted he's including Saudi Arabia, which means he's some how forgotten either the memorable result against england or the memorable result against Italy. But let's not let facts get in the way!

[NeilMcD]

Juat to make sure that wa not me saying that.

[geysir]

Juat to make sure that wa not me saying that.
Guilt by association:)

[Qwerty]

So to question Byrne's right to be back means that I'm a "gobsh1te" or even worse a "barstooler":rolleyes:

Again the guy is an embarrassment and is not a qualified physio. I am a 1000% behind Stan and was always fully supportive of the previous managers.

Granted the idiot is not playing but if his role is to "lift the spirits" then that is a complete smokescreen.

Remember him lifting the Sam when he was with Galway in 98. Thought he was a Dub "through and through".

KOH

Can you prove he is not a qualified physio? Every article on Bryne describes him as a physio, I am supoposed to simply take the word of posters to this forum?

[Dodge]

how can you prove somebody's not qualified?

"here look, this is one of the diplomas he hasn't got..."

Its common knowledge

[Qwerty]

'common knowledge' like in urban legend?