Nations League B/C Promotion/Relegation Playoffs - March 2025

[tetsujin1979]

Record V Bulgaria
1859920785324057047

[Insidetherock]

Well, the Charlton years kicked off with a win in Bulgaria.. albeit, a Scottish win.. so maybe this might be a sign, that we've hit the bottom and will start to climb from here

They're beatable.. but we'll have to be on our game.. but they are beatable

I can see two pretty boring games coming up though

I see the poor Scots got stuck with Greece

[tetsujin1979]

Bloody hell Bulgaria lost 5-0 to the North last month,would be a disappointment to lose over 2 legs to them you’d feel……

Bulgaria beat them in Sofia in September, that was the North's only loss in the group
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024%E2%80%9325_UEFA_Nations_League_C#Group_3

[pineapple stu]

Bloody hell Bulgaria lost 5-0 to the North last month,would be a disappointment to lose over 2 legs to them you’d feel……
Strangely it's also Bulgaria's only defeat in the past 12 months, and they've only conceded twice this year outside of that game.

But that's the Nations League for you in a way. They were bottom of their Euro qualifying group before that, without a win in a group of Hungary, Serbia, Montenegro and Lithuania. They did draw at home to Hungary and home and away to Serbia though, so they're not without their moments.

[ifk101]

Let's not talk them up. They drew twice with Belarus, and lost 5-0 away to the North in their NL group. And judging by their 2024 results, they do not have a striker (6 goals in 10 games). Very beatable opposition.

[CraftyToePoke]

They've lost once in their last twelve with three wins. Previous to that they lost six from eight. They are draw merchants.

[MylesNotMiley]

Since the 90s, is there another nation in Europe who have fallen as much as ourselves & Bulgaria?

[Diggs246]

It's a great draw
They aren't complete minos, but v beatable. Think of the confidence boast. If we beat them.

We will have beaten Finland twice who these players lost twice too and beaten Bulgaria who we couldnt beat last time.

[ifk101]

Last time we played Bulgaria, we started with a front line of Ronan Curtis, James Collins and Daryl Horgan. No disrespect to these players, but our options are considerably stronger now than then. And looking at the current Bulgaria squad, the bulk of their players are pulled from their domestic league which is ranked 28th in Europe. The LOI is ranked 32nd for reference. Nothing is a gimme in international football but we have to be backing ourselves here.

[zero]

happy out, flights booked, roll on 2025!

[Diggs246]

happy out, flights booked, roll on 2025!

You've booked already! Fair ,play

[Eirambler]

It's a decent draw. It would be disappointing not to get the better of them over two legs. Maybe they're better than I'm giving them credit for but I honestly couldn't name a single current Bulgarian player - maybe they have some younger talent coming through?


Since the 90s, is there another nation in Europe who have fallen as much as ourselves & Bulgaria?

Hungary collapsed from the late 80s onwards and have only recovered recently. Bulgaria went higher than us (World Cup Semi Final) and have fallen further and for longer I'd say. Norway haven't qualified for anything since Euro 2000. Scotland went from France 98 to Euro 2020 without qualifying for anything. Wales of course famously didn't qualify for anything from 1958 to 2016.

But Greece must have had one of the biggest and swiftest ever collapses - they won Euro 2004, qualified for Euro 2008, WC 2010, Euro 2012 and WC 2014, then collapsed to 1 win in 10 games in a soft Euro 2016 qualification group and haven't qualified for anything since. Obviously they're on the way back now.

I think the point is that loads of countries of similar size to us go through lean spells, but eventually come back from them. Bulgaria's fall seems longer and deeper than most though. This playoff might give us a hint as to whether we're on a Bulgaria trajectory (I don't think we are) or something on a smaller scale.

[Eirambler]

By the way.. another thing making the play offs so important

If Norn Iron are still considered "part of the bid".. then they'll be in Path B next time

Only two of the "bid Nations" get automatic qualification

England will qualify through groups, so us, Scotland, Wales.. you'd imagine one of Scotland and Wales would qualify.. leaving us in by default

But, if Norn Iron are in the mix..then as a Path B team, they'd automatically be ranked higher than us, should we drop to Path C..

Then we'd need two of Scotland, Wales, Norn Iron to qualify direct for us to pick up a default spot

March's games will be so so important for us for the next half a decade

This is important, but as I understand it not in respect of the north. They're understood to be accepting that they are no longer involved as far as automatic qualification goes. However, we do need to stay in B to compete with Scotland and Wales as, in the not unlikely event that none of the three qualify automatically, the Nations League ranking next time might be used to allocate the two automatic qualification places. That said, Scotland and Wales may well be in the A division anyway, so it may not be seen as a fair way to allocate the places and they may use performance in the qualification groups, or a mini playoff instead.

[Fixer82]

Record V Bulgaria
1859920785324057047

Didn’t Aidan O’Brien score against them too to secure a 1-1 draw? From a Callum O’Dowda cross? Or did I imagine that?

[Fixer82]

Didn’t Aidan O’Brien score against them too to secure a 1-1 draw? From a Callum O’Dowda cross? Or did I imagine that?

Just realised that was against Poland. Expected O’Brien to kick on a bit tbh. He played very well in a couple of games for us

[Eirambler]

Just looking through the Bulgaria squad it's incredible that they now haven't got a single player contracted to a club in a Top 5 European league (for contrast we have called up 16 in the last year, even in our current state). Was reading a few articles about what's gone wrong in Bulgarian football and their situation makes our current issues look small in comparison. We really need to be putting them away in March, no excuses here.

[Fixer82]

Just looking through the Bulgaria squad it's incredible that they now haven't got a single player contracted to a club in a Top 5 European league (for contrast we have called up 16 in the last year, even in our current state). Was reading a few articles about what's gone wrong in Bulgarian football and their situation makes our current issues look small in comparison. We really need to be putting them away in March, no excuses here.

Remember them in ‘94. Lethal!

[SkStu]

Remember them in ‘94. Lethal!

Yordan Letchkov (sp) was one of my favourite players of that tournament! Class! They played some great stuff too, all round. A lot of fun watching them in that tournament.

[samhaydenjr]

Remember them in ‘94. Lethal!


Yordan Letchkov (sp) was one of my favourite players of that tournament! Class! They played some great stuff too, all round. A lot of fun watching them in that tournament.
Of course, Stoichkov was the star but, boy, could he moan... at the ref, his opponents, his teammates - at one point, against Sweden I think, he fell over and lost the ball - when he got up he was scowling and muttering and Jimmy Magee said "Sometimes, I think, he even hates himself"

[Eirambler]

Seemingly Boris Mihaylov, who was the goalkeeper in that team, went on to become a John Delaney type figure in the Bulgarian football association and is blamed for a lot of their more recent troubles.

[pineapple stu]

The keeper with the toupee of course (allegedly!)

[seanfhear]

The keeper with the toupee of course (allegedly!)Can you really trust a man that won't show you his real scalp ? !

[elatedscum]

Seemingly Boris Mihaylov, who was the goalkeeper in that team, went on to become a John Delaney type figure in the Bulgarian football association and is blamed for a lot of their more recent troubles.


The keeper with the toupee of course (allegedly!)

His son Nickolay was a good keeper, at least in his early 20s. He was bald by 21, so I strongly suspect, on a windy day, the toupee might not have fallen far from the tree…

Back in 2008, I befriended a lad from Bulgaria who I asked about Valeri Bojinov and Nickolai Mihaylov - and he ended up ranting about Boris and corruption in the football association and the country at large. He was also shocked to see our attendances at a friendly - I think it was around 43,000 in Croke Park against Serbia. I think he said their most recent friendly had about 3,000 people at it (against Finland maybe?)

Thinking back to that time, you used to have 7 and 8 team groups to qualify for a tournament unlike our new poxy 4 team groups. 14 games… we’ll have 6 to qualify for a World Cup

Those were the days… https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Euro_2008_qualifying

[elatedscum]

Those were the days… https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Euro_2008_qualifying

David Healy scored as many goals in one qualifying campaign as anyone had scored in their entire Northern Ireland career (at the time) - that’d be like Evan Ferguson scoring 68 goals in the qualifiers next autumn.

[seanfhear]

David Healy scored as many goals in one qualifying campaign as anyone had scored in their entire Northern Ireland career (at the time) - that’d be like Evan Ferguson scoring 68 goals in the qualifiers next autumn.Over to you Evan !

[nigel-harps1954]

happy out, flights booked, roll on 2025!

Considered doing the same but getting to Plovdiv is the guts of a full day of travel for me. No direct flights from Ireland in March either.

[Eirambler]

FIFA apparently released their World Cup draw regulations last night/this morning which has confirmed it. Makes things a bit easier in terms of fitting in match dates as we (and the other Nations League playoff teams) can't play qualifiers in March. There will probably be teams with four qualifiers played (in the March and June windows) before we even start in September.

Apparently an about turn has been done on this and the draw has been opened up again, adding a small possibility that we could still get a five team group and have two qualifiers in June.

[geysir]

Can you really trust a man that won't show you his real scalp ? !
In this regard and only this regard would I offer some solace with Bulgarians. Post Chernobyl fall out, large enough parts of Bulgaria were ‘toxified’ by radiation fall-out. It became a thing, sudden total hair loss (total alopecia) among many young men. Another footballer from the same area was Stillian Petrov, a heathy young man stricken with acute leukemia, that being a major disease effect of the post-Chernobyl disaster.

Bulgaria’s gov. (i.e. Kremlin approved) put the lid on the reports they themselves commissioned post Chernobil, but somehow the original reports themselves were leaked out.
In football terms, Bulgaria are where they should be in the rankings, I’d bet the garden shed that Ireland will be too good for them.

[Stuttgart88]

Seems like there’s now a small chance of us being in a 5 team group - with England / Switzerland - due to a change FIFA has just made to the qualifying procedure.

https://x.com/dalejohnsonespn/status/1862819412740321353?s=46&t=akaljSe4ydrwumxbzBxdHQ

[tetsujin1979]

Bulgarian manager has stepped down - https://www.bfunion.bg/news/50798/0
he was double jobbing as manager of Bulgarian league side Cherno More, and the other clubs were not happy about this
(translated using Google translate)

Today, March 4, the head coach of the Bulgarian national team, Ilian Iliev, submitted his resignation electronically. It will be considered at a meeting of the Executive Committee of the Bulgarian Football Union, which will be held next week.

[elatedscum]

Szmodics getting surgery on the ankle. Injuries starting to mount:

Coleman, Omobamidele, McGrath, Ebosele, Szmodics, Ogbene, McAteer

[tetsujin1979]

Disappointed with that, he'd been named as a sub a few times recently for Ipswich

[tetsujin1979]

Dan McDonnell saying Josh Honohan is in the provisional squad, full squad to be announced on Thursday

[elatedscum]

Interested to see what the squad will be, you'd imagine a larger squad considering that Molumby and Scales are suspended for Game 1:

Goalkeeper: Kelleher, Travers and either O'Leary or Bazunu

Right back: Doherty. No real depth in the position with Coleman, Ebosele, McNamara. Josh Key and Jon Gallagher are probably the best actual right-backs, but likely we pick an extra centre-half I guess.

Centre-back: Collins, O'Shea and O'Brien shoo-ins. Scales only at risk because of the suspension for Game 1. Omobamidele injured (McNally and Clarke-Salter too). So you need 1-2 more. Beyond that, not sure: Shane Duffy was recalled recently and seems to be playing well for Norwich. Luton are bottom of the league, which doesn't do McGuinness any favours. John Egan has been in and out of Hull. Cashin has yet to play for Brighton. Garcia-McNulty and Jimmy Dunne might be outside chances.

Left-back: Robbie Brady + one of Manning, O'Dowda or Honohan

Deep midfielders: Cullen, Smallbone, Knight and Taylor (you could argue that Cullen is the only true deep midfielder). Molumby when he returns from suspension. Lawal hasn't done enough or played enough unfortunately. I'd like Connell at some point to see a squad but this probably isn't the time.

Attacking midfielders: Azaz gets in. McGrath injured. Moran a contender, thought he did well when he came on against England. John Joe Patrick Finn would give you something different. Connor Ronan (happy birthday Connor!) is in a similar boat to Luca Connell. Alan Browne just back from a leg break. Mark Sykes, Tyler Goodrham also names worth mentioning.

Wingers: All injuries here - Ogbene, Ebosele, McAteer. Mikey Johnston the only first choice winger available. You'd imagine Vata and Callum Robinson probably gets call-ups in the circumstances. Beyond that not much obvious. Sinclair Armstrong could do a job on the right wing if you want a replacement for the power and pace that Ogbene and Ebosele provide. Connolly in and out of Millwall's side, Harness is maybe another option, along with Farrugia.

Strikers: No idea who starts but has to be Parrott, Ferguson, Idah and Cannon in the squad.

[Razors left peg]

Vata might be in with a good shout of call up. No u21s squad this time so he might get a look

[tetsujin1979]

Vata might be in with a good shout of call up. No u21s squad this time so he might get a look

A few Albanian football twitter accounts are saying he was approached by the Albanian FA, and turned it down because he expects to be in the Ireland squad

[~YTM~]

Vata might be in with a good shout of call up. No u21s squad this time so he might get a look

U21s are playing but he's justified a call up to the seniors. Even without all the injuries I think he's shown enough to get a call up.

[Razors left peg]

U21s are playing but he's justified a call up to the seniors. Even without all the injuries I think he's shown enough to get a call up.

Are they? I didn't see anything listed until September.

Hes on the fringess I'd say, wouldn't be controversial if he was in or out. I'd like to see him in, but he's still a sub plenty at Watford

[pineapple stu]

He's dropped away a little bit since those explosive first couple of goals - hasn't started the last three games, and only one league goal (and no assists) this year. December alone was two goals and three assists

But with injuries as they are (as elated notes), Albania interested, and he's showing plenty of promise at a decent level, I think you have to call him up

[Razors left peg]

Yeah I'd rather have him over Callum Robinson even though I know Robinson is having a better season. If it came down to Vata or Moran I'd go with Moran

[MylesNotMiley]

Are they? I didn't see anything listed until September.

Hes on the fringess I'd say, wouldn't be controversial if he was in or out. I'd like to see him in, but he's still a sub plenty at Watford

The U21's have friendlies against Scotland & Hungary in Spain.
https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/international-soccer/ireland-u21s-take-on-scotland-and-hungary-in-spain-friendlies-ahead-of-euro-2027-qualifiers/a965452766.html

[Eirambler]

The injuries to wingers have come at a good time in a sense, as it gives Vata a clear path to a cap that will tie him for three years, and the only way he'd switch after that is if his career tails off and he doesn't even get to four Ireland caps - which seems unlikely right now. But it would be madness not to call him up and cap him given the injuries and his multiple eligibility situation.

I see Kenny is on the long list. I think that's a bit of a compensation call from HH after how badly his LoI comments went down (obviously he's not currently in Ireland but he's certainly not being shortlisted based on his Celtic form). Honohan I get as genuinely meriting consideration, but Kenny looked out of his depth with the 21s, let alone the seniors.

Sounds like Abankwah might sneak in as well, maybe ahead of Jimmy Dunne with a few injuries at the back. Big step up for him in a short space of time, he only became a regular starter for the Under 21s in the autumn.

[CraftyToePoke]

I see Kenny is on the long list

Where are you seeing the long list ?
Honohan mentioned too, but where is it.

[Eirambler]

Just media reports. Sneyd reporting on Kenny being on it. The long list itself is never published.

[Acornvilla]

What are peoples thoughts on strength/depth/form of the squad Vs last year?

I feel like things are on a bit of an upswing at club level, and there are decent options in decent form in most positions, central midfield is the never ending black hole, and left back ofc, some talk Honohan from Rovers might actually make it in to the squad, him and Matt Doherty in the best form he's been in for years are people who can hypothetically play LB/LWB and defend/go forward to varying extents. We have a shiny new Right back option, maybe it's not his best position, but O' Brien's doing a fine job at Everton. We have some strikers and attacking midfielders scoring some goals, Evan is about as fit as he's been in a year. On the other hand Ogbene is still a huge loss and Festy seemed to be coming good but hasn't played any football, Scales has also had a tough period.

I want to feel positive, but I'm not sure if I should :D

[Razors left peg]

What are peoples thoughts on strength/depth/form of the squad Vs last year?

I feel like things are on a bit of an upswing at club level, and there are decent options in decent form in most positions, central midfield is the never ending black hole, and left back ofc, some talk Honohan from Rovers might actually make it in to the squad, him and Matt Doherty in the best form he's been in for years are people who can hypothetically play LB/LWB and defend/go forward to varying extents. We have a shiny new Right back option, maybe it's not his best position, but O' Brien's doing a fine job at Everton. We have some strikers and attacking midfielders scoring some goals, Evan is about as fit as he's been in a year. On the other hand Ogbene is still a huge loss and Festy seemed to be coming good but hasn't played any football, Scales has also had a tough period.

I want to feel positive, but I'm not sure if I should :D

I think overall it should be fairly positive in terms of a step forward from last year. We have players performing well in European competition and it feels like we have more options through the whole squad.

It feels like an age since we last played, and considering the disaster the game was after the sending off in Wembley there was no positivity to take forward.

Our goalkeeper situation is kind of weird. Bazunu playing but not playing great by all accounts, and Kelleher who once again isnt playing but looks good when he does. Travers really would be the guy in most other eras for us so theres good depth there.

In defense I think this has been comfortably Collins best season in football so far and I think building around him at the back or even as the hybrid midfielder that he started the England game is the way to go. O'Brien, Doherty and O'Shea all been good and there is even the emergence of Abankwah who has been excellent for Watford. I think Scales has gone backwards and we still dont have a reliable left back which is a big concern, you'd love to see Cirkin being added.

In midfield I think Azaz has been by far the biggest postiive. Moran has been good for Stoke too, and Patrick Finn might give us something physically that we've been missing. Watched a bit of Finn a couple of times and it looks like there is a player in him, but it might be too soon for him just yet though. Cullen has been his usual solid self, as has Knight.

Up front, Parrott I think has been the standout. Hes been very good for AZ all season and even playing well in Europe. For me he'd be 1st name picked. Idah has been great and terrible. Shows flashes at times where you think he could be a really good top level striker, and then frustrates the hell out of you. You'd have to say his performances in Champions league show that he can be a good weapon for us. Ferguson continues to be the biggest frustration. Firmly believe hes our best player, but theres little evidence for it right now with the lack of game time. Cannon has gone backwards since his move to Sheffield, not even in squad today. Armstrong could put his hand up, but I dont think he gets enough goals. Vata is another whos not necessarily banging down the door but worth a look.

I think the options through the whole squad are improving slowing but surely, but until we see that translate to results no one will be too excited.

[Eirambler]

Depth is improving, definitely. Were it not for a string of injuries in some of our better stocked positions we would likely have needed to leave out some squad regulars this time around. Injuries to Omobamidele, Ebosele, Ogbene and Szmodics among others mean that probably won't be necessary now.

But depth is generally good, we just need a small group of our better players to take the next step at club level that will lead to them becoming our key men. Collins is definitely getting there, hopefully Kelleher next year, and if Ferguson can get going again then we're not in bad shape. We badly need a genuine EPL quality centre midfielder but no sign of one on the horizon unfortunately.

[Rayzor]

Sounds like Abankwah might sneak in as well, maybe ahead of Jimmy Dunne with a few injuries at the back. Big step up for him in a short space of time, he only became a regular starter for the Under 21s in the autumn.

I watch a lot of QPR, Dunne has only played a hand full of games in the last few years at centre back, he's definitely a right back these days. Worth a look considering our options at right back.

[SkStu]

I think overall it should be fairly positive in terms of a step forward from last year. We have players performing well in European competition and it feels like we have more options through the whole squad.

It feels like an age since we last played, and considering the disaster the game was after the sending off in Wembley there was no positivity to take forward.

Our goalkeeper situation is kind of weird. Bazunu playing but not playing great by all accounts, and Kelleher who once again isnt playing but looks good when he does. Travers really would be the guy in most other eras for us so theres good depth there.

In defense I think this has been comfortably Collins best season in football so far and I think building around him at the back or even as the hybrid midfielder that he started the England game is the way to go. O'Brien, Doherty and O'Shea all been good and there is even the emergence of Abankwah who has been excellent for Watford. I think Scales has gone backwards and we still dont have a reliable left back which is a big concern, you'd love to see Cirkin being added.

In midfield I think Azaz has been by far the biggest postiive. Moran has been good for Stoke too, and Patrick Finn might give us something physically that we've been missing. Watched a bit of Finn a couple of times and it looks like there is a player in him, but it might be too soon for him just yet though. Cullen has been his usual solid self, as has Knight.

Up front, Parrott I think has been the standout. Hes been very good for AZ all season and even playing well in Europe. For me he'd be 1st name picked. Idah has been great and terrible. Shows flashes at times where you think he could be a really good top level striker, and then frustrates the hell out of you. You'd have to say his performances in Champions league show that he can be a good weapon for us. Ferguson continues to be the biggest frustration. Firmly believe hes our best player, but theres little evidence for it right now with the lack of game time. Cannon has gone backwards since his move to Sheffield, not even in squad today. Armstrong could put his hand up, but I dont think he gets enough goals. Vata is another whos not necessarily banging down the door but worth a look.

I think the options through the whole squad are improving slowing but surely, but until we see that translate to results no one will be too excited.

Agreed overall, though reports about Abankwah are mixed bag really. He has blown hot and cold - but deserves his call up if he gets it. Looking forward to Vata coming on board (as long as rumours of him possibly accepting a call up to the Albania U21s is untrue) - shows some depth coming through in the wider areas. I think it would also be good to call out Molumby in midfield who is having a great season by all accounts. I just love Azaz, guy oozes class but need to find a system that he can play in for us. O'Brien at Everton has now come good (oh ye of little faith!) and he is now a serviceable RB who offers us something on set pieces too. And Manning has played his way into being a serviceable premier league LB/LWB.

In terms of the strikers, I think i'd still have Ferguson and Parrott in there ahead of Idah. Cannon has gone really quiet since his move.

[Razors left peg]

I dont think theres anyone that has been out of the squad previous or new guys who are banging down the door for a call up, like Szmodics was previously. Vata, Abankwah and Finn would be nice additions, but also I dont think any of them could have major gripes about not making the cut either. I think just to nip any Albania talk in the bud I'd give the nod to Vata but he has a lot to do to become a guaranteed regular.

I think that theres not a huge amount of lads on outside looking in is a good thing though. It shows that we've already brought the likes of Azaz and Moran into the squad already and the best of the previous u21 in general have already had their look